City of Tampa
January 28, 2016
6:00 p.m. Session

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[ SOUNDING GAVEL ]
06:04:35 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Good afternoon.
We're going to call this evening meeting to order.
Roll call.
06:04:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
Here.
06:04:43 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Here.
06:04:45 >> Capin?
06:04:46 >>HARRY COHEN:
Here.
06:04:50 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
Here.
06:04:51 >> Montelione?
Reddick?
06:04:53 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Here.
Anyone going to speak on items 1 through 3 please
stand to be sworn.
[Oath administered]

06:05:02 >> -- open the public hearings.
06:05:02 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion by Mr. Suarez, seconded by
Mr. Miranda.
All in favor of the motion, aye.
All right.
We go to item number 1.
06:05:18 >> Gloria Moreda, Land Development.
This is AB2-16-02, concerns property at 6312 North
Armenia Avenue involving La Pequena Columbia
Restaurant.
The site is currently approved for alcohol
beverage sales.
It was approved in 2013 for a restaurant, beer,
wine, liquor, on-premise consumption only.
The request today is really keeping the same size.
It's currently approved for 5,283 square feet
inside.
No outside area.
47 parking spaces are provided.
They are asking for an extension of their hours.
The current proposal or the current approved AB
sales is Monday through Saturday from 7 a.m. to
11 p.m.
Sunday from 11 a.m. to 11 p.m.
They are now asking for Sunday 11 a.m. to 1 a.m.,

Monday through Wednesday, 7 a.m. to 10 p.m., and
then Thursday through Saturday 7 a.m. to 3 a.m.
There are waivers associated with the request that
were approved in the original petition.
They reduced the distance separation from other
establishment from 250 to 185 feet.
And the residential distance separation from 250
to 133 feet.
They reduced the required parking from 71 to 43.
The drive aisle dimensions from 24 to 12,
reduction in the loading and unloading from 1 to
0.
They are maneuvering into the Armenia Avenue
right-of-way as well as access to Fern and Jean
Street.
They are in a mixed use corridor village.
The nearest AB sales location is La Pequena
Express at 6202 North Armenia Avenue and the
nearest residential is at 2510 West Fern Street,
which is zoned RS-60.
I have an aerial that shows the location.
It is in the shopping center, the restaurant in
question is on the north side of that shopping
center.
They do have access to Jean Street and they have

parking in the back.
A photograph of the existing center from view of
Armenia.
This is the back of the shopping center and then
some of the residential areas off of Jean Street.
06:08:17 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
All right.
Petitioner.
06:08:24 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
Oh, I did want to say there were
some minor site plan modifications that were
needed.
They actually did revise the site plan
accordingly, so I'll have that ready for Council
at second reading, if Council approves.
06:08:35 >>HARRY COHEN:
Gloria, just to be clear, there are
no waivers that we're approving associated with
this that are different from the first time
around.
06:08:42 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
They are asking for exactly the
same.
06:08:46 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Petitioner?
06:08:47 >> Good evening.
Jonathon Baker with The Tiller Law Group in Tampa
for La Pequena Colombia.
Ms. Moreda summed it up pretty well.

Like you said, no extra waivers.
Just the extension of hours.
Just to recap, it's Sunday from 11 a.m. to 1 a.m.
Monday through Wednesday, 7 a.m. to 10 p.m., and
Thursday through Saturday 7 a.m. to 3 a.m.
If you're not familiar with the location, La
Pequena is a bakery and a restaurant.
It's Colombian food.
They offer genuine Colombian cuisine, full
breakfast, lunch and dinner options as well as an
extensive and unique bakery section.
I have some pictures that show some of the menu
items.
dinners.
The restaurant has been in place since 2001 with
no complaints.
As Ms. Moreda stated alcohol license granted in
2013.
There's been no complaints.
And like she said, we received the staff report
and had the civil engineer make the requested
changes already.
I do have a full-size copy here as well.
06:10:27 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
Mr. Suarez.

06:10:29 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Yes, thank you.
Mr. Baker, did you represent the applicant the
first time in 2013 when they came before?
06:10:35 >> No, sir.
06:10:38 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
I'm curious as to why the hours
weren't tried to be done at that time when we did
the first rezoning.
Do you have any idea why that is?
06:10:46 >> I do not.
Sorry.
06:10:48 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Yeah, I wasn't sure if you had been
the person that was representing the applicant
before.
06:10:52 >> No, I'm not sure who did it back then.
06:10:57 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Mr. Miranda.
06:10:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I'm not speaking on behalf of the petitioner, but
I've been there many times.
They have a great operation.
That's the one you walk in.
You see the cooler there with the desserts and all
that.
You want to eat them before you have dinner.
It's a nice run restaurant.
The real manager there is the wife.

The guy thinks he runs it, but the wife runs the
register.
The northern part, there is a little lounge area.
06:11:24 >> Yes, sir.
06:11:25 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any other questions from Council?
Anyone in the audience wishing to speak on item
number 1?
06:11:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
Move to close.
06:11:32 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion by Mr. Miranda, seconded
by Mr. Cohen.
All in favor of the motion, aye.
Mr. Miranda, would you like to read number 1?
06:11:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
Thank you very much.
Chairman, move file AB2-16-02, an ordinance
presented for first reading consideration,
ordinance 2013-149 approving special use permit
S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, restaurant
consumption on premises only and making lawful the
sale of beverages regardless of alcoholic content,
beer, wine and liquor, on that certain lot, plot
or tract of land located at 6312 North Armenia
Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly
described in section 3, that all ordinances or
parts of ordinances in conflict are repealed.
Providing an effective date.

06:12:16 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion by Mr. Miranda.
Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
Any discussion?
All in favor?
Opposed?
06:12:22 >>THE CLERK:
Motion carried with Capin absent at
vote.
Second reading and adoption on February 18 at
9:30 a.m.
06:12:29 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Thank you, sir.
06:12:30 >> Thank you.
06:12:31 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Item number 2.
06:12:33 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
Gloria Moreda, Land Development.
This is concerning AB2-16-03, property at 18002
Highwoods Preserve Parkway.
It is a planned development district.
The proposal before you is for AB sales, large
venue beer and wine, on-premise consumption only.
The property is developed with the Muvico Movie
Theater.
And they are requesting to allow for 83,603 square
feet inside area.
There is no outside area.
The entire building would be approved for AB sales
with this approval.

They have 985 off-street parking spaces.
They are asking for consistency with chapter 14.
The property is within the mixed use land use
corridor village, which requires a distance
separation of 250 feet from residential and other
AB establishments.
If you all are familiar with this site, Bruce B.
Downs, the movie theater is tucked back.
There is really surrounded by nothing, except the
movie theater.
Here is a picture of the movie theater.
There is a sort of mixed-use office development
across the street.
A view from Bruce B. Downs.
You can hardly see it really.
And this is a residential apartment complex down
the road.
But they are asking for the large venue request.
There are some very minor changes to the site plan
that need to be corrected.
Other than that, staff finds this consistent.
06:14:31 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
All right.
Petitioner?
06:14:38 >> Thank you.

Good evening.
Clayton Bricklemyer, 400 North Ashley Drive, Suite
1100.
I've been sworn.
One correction from Gloria's, Carmike Theaters, in
case you can't tell from the handout, actually
purchased this from Muvico.
Still the Starlight 20 but now operated by Carmike
Theaters.
I'll give you a quick spiel.
We've had all positive feedback.
I don't feel that I need to drone on.
Just briefly, and I know you all have been
introduced to the concept, but movie theaters in
general have had to do some things to compete with
your couch and Netflix.
06:15:16 >>HARRY COHEN:
The couch is big competition.
06:15:19 >> Right, I know.
I know mine is.
They improved their food and done better seats and
added 3D.
It needs to be more of a night-out experience to
be competitive.
One of those factors has been alcohol.
I know that this group has approved a number of

other theaters to do this sort of sales.
We're only asking for beer and wine in this
request.
This is not trying to establish a bar.
We actually pulled numbers today, and I wrote down
less than 5% of concession sales at Carmike's 39
nationwide theaters.
No, that was the one in Florida.
17 theaters in Florida with wet zonings.
It makes up less than 5% of their concession
sales.
So it's not a bar.
The usual M.O. here is that someone will come.
They will have a glass of wine.
They will take it to their seat.
They will drink it, and then they will go home at
the end of the movie.
It's not like a baseball game where there is a
break and you get up and go.
You generally want to stay and watch the movie.
I've spoken to some folks in Tampa, really got not
a lot of interest in the deal.
The folks that I have spoken to, the general
consensus was we want this here.
Everybody else gets to have it.

South Tampa has it; Pasco County has it;
University area has it; all those theaters have
the ability, and one of the guys who is here
tonight from Carmike was telling me that somebody
came up to him the other day and said, you know,
why don't we have a MacGuffin's like AMC?
I want that.
I don't want to have to drive to Veterans to have
that experience.
If you look at the packet, there obviously are
concerns about movie theater wet zonings.
The alcohol control plan is in the packet I handed
you.
I can walk through it as much or as little as
you'd like.
The general gist of it is, everyone is ID'd.
There are theater sweeps.
There are cameras in the concession area.
The concession area, the cash registers that are
selling alcohol will have -- everybody will be 21
and up there.
I think those are probably the highlights.
And you may have some questions about that.
And there are operations people here from Carmike
that can speak to the particulars of how they do

it.
Real quick, the corporate sheet, Carmike is the
fourth largest exhibitor in the country.
They do have almost 40 of these nationwide, so
they've had practice.
17 of them in Florida.
Their record is impeccable.
Having served on those for a while.
To circle back to the staff report, staff finds
this consistent.
We're not asking for any waivers at all, and we
think we meet all the standards in 27129.
You'll see the site plan changes, there's some
weirdness about the address.
I don't know why.
For some reason, property appraiser has it one
way.
Various maps have it another way.
That is a change we're happy to make between
readings.
We would like your support, and we're here for
questions.
06:18:29 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
Ms. Montelione.
06:18:33 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bricklemyer.
I distinctly remember this hearing the last time
around.
We had a packed house, and there were a lot of
parents concerned about minors, because this
particular movie theater draws a very young crowd,
people dropping their kids off to go have a fun,
safe time at the movies and then circle around and
pick them up.
Now, whether or not those children actually stay
at the movie theater after they are dropped off is
questionable.
But that was a lot of the concern.
And what was expressed then from what I recollect
was they would prefer to have a separate area for
the alcohol beverage.
We just have the interior site plan.
This is the parking out front.
So what's the interior plan for the beverage
sales?
06:19:36 >> So what I've been told, and you guys jump in if
I'm getting it wrong.
The interior site plan is not a completed process
at the moment, but in general, their business
model is that they are selling at the concession

counter.
So it's one long counter like you would see, and
it would be there.
Now, it is going to be dedicated registers manned
by 21-year-old people taking and checking IDs.
06:20:07 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
Staffed by 21-year-old people.
We had a conversation earlier about gender-neutral
language.
Staffed by 21-year-olds.
Studio Movie Grill, which is at University Square
Mall, opened up and they have the bar area
separate.
It's up front right after you enter the space.
MacGuffin's you mentioned is another separate
space.
My concern is that you're going to have one
counter with lots of people lined up and there's
opportunity to err.
I know that underage drinking happens even in bars
where they are not supposed to even be in the
premises, and people who are serving see their
friends, and they will serve their friends even
though they are not supposed to.
So my personal preference would be reflective of
what the comments were of the community at large

is to have a separate area.
Now, I know all the people who sent in the
e-mails, and I respect them, and they're right.
People will drive, like Ms. Carothers, over the
Pasco County line to go to another movie theater
that offers beverage service.
But I would be more comfortable if we were shown a
floor plan that showed a separate area, not having
alcohol sales at the same counter that you're
selling all your other soft drinks and popcorn.
06:22:05 >> Instead of me conferring with the client now,
is that something that you would be okay with us
sort of producing between now and second reading?
Is that a better way to handle?
06:22:15 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
Yes, I would be okay with that.
06:22:18 >> Let us go to the drawing board and see --
06:22:20 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
I also had to laugh at item
number 3, there will be no open spaces within
theater auditorium allowing for patron standing or
dancing during film showing.
06:22:31 >> Apparently that was at issue at some Carmike
Theaters.
06:22:34 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
I'm showing my age.
I guess no midnight showings of rocky horror
theater show.

06:22:45 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
Thank you very much.
I frequent AMC theaters out of convenience, and
they have their MacGuffin's there.
And you can't miss it.
It's either right at the entrance at Westshore.
You have to pass the bar.
At veterans, you have to pass the bar.
That's a full liquor establishment there.
I never see kids congregating.
I don't know, because I was a teenager not long
ago.
I don't know, I don't see the issue with it.
06:23:14 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Mr. Suarez.
06:23:15 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Mr. Bricklemyer, let me ask you a
quick question.
Is it Carmike?
06:23:27 >> Carmike.
06:23:28 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Other Carmike theaters have this
concept already in terms of serving beer and wine?
06:23:35 >> Yes.
06:23:35 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Do they have a process in terms of
inventory control, in terms of people actually
getting it who are of age, they have like bands or
colored cups?
What is it that they use.

What is their process?
06:23:55 >> I actually had them bring cups.
06:23:58 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Is that filled with alcohol at this
time?
06:23:59 >> No, I'm sorry.
Paper cup for nonalcoholic.
That's your beer glass.
That's your wine glass.
It's going to be clear.
That's for the monitoring after the fact.
Monitoring from the cameras.
The monitoring from the sweeping through the
theaters, all that sort of stuff.
06:24:26 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
There will be a check for every
single time you go ahead and purchase.
So if I come back a second time, and obviously
they are going to have training, they'll make sure
when somebody is oversold and you can't sell them
anymore, that type of thing, but in terms of when
they go, they'll be carded each and every time.
06:24:49 >> They will.
That and the training are both in that alcohol
control.
06:24:53 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Really, for us, the process of how
you control the alcohol is really the biggest

issue.
I think what you mentioned with Ms. Mons is not a
bad idea to give us a floor plan and the way this
is set up.
I think we all have a little bit of apprehension
not having it separate.
Obviously the first time this came before us, this
particular location, there was a lot more
discussion about how people can avoid having
teenagers get the alcohol.
And now with our subsequent hearings that we've
had, and you pointed out MacGuffin, and that's a
different setup, obviously, hard liquor, too, not
that you can't get drunk on beer and wine, but at
the same time, there is a different type of
control.
We just want to make sure that the controls are
going to be in place so we feel comfortable going
forward with these types of decisions.
Thank you.
Thank you, chair.
06:25:52 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Can't get drunk off of beer and
wine?
06:25:57 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Oh, absolutely.
Don't deny -- in years past, done that before.

06:26:06 >>HARRY COHEN:
Thank you very much.
Two quick points.
First of all, if I remember correctly, the first
time around, Councilwoman Capin and I actually
voted for this.
I would say that from my point of view I'm fine
with it.
I respect Councilwoman Montelione's concerns and
what Councilman Suarez said, but I think a little
closer to Councilman Maniscalco's view.
I think the clear cups are fine.
And I'm in support of the application.
06:26:38 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Ms. Montelione.
06:26:40 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
Again, I'm not against having
the beer and wine at the theater.
I'm for that because I do enjoy a beverage when I
go to the place closest to my home.
It is a concern.
Behind the same counter is really my consternation
point because with even the different cups, you
know, if you're somebody behind the counter and
you want to serve one of your friends, it's pretty
easy to pick up a paper cup rather than a plastic
cup and fill that cup.
So having that distinct separation, I mean, as you

pointed out, the MacGuffin's concept, it is a
separate area.
So there isn't the chance that you can slip a cup
under a different tap than the beer and wine.
Or the Pepsi and mountain DEW.
06:27:49 >>MARTIN SHELBY:
Just a reminder, Council, this is
a new application.
It has to be based on competent, substantial
evidence --
But I would recommend, Council, that you raise
your issues in the form of questions to the people
who are offering testimony.
06:28:20 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
I'll stick to what I said the
first time.
06:28:23 >> We'll take time to try to get you operationally
comfortable.
06:28:31 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Would there be a limitation on
the number of beer and wine drinks that you can
request?
06:28:36 >> You'll notice that there is not one on the
alcohol control plan.
06:28:40 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Correct.
06:28:40 >> I actually asked that question beforehand.
I think that is something that could be discussed.
Not a happy face back there.

We will address that question, I think, along with
the operational thing.
How about that?
Let me have that discussion with them and we'll be
back at second hearing with an answer, operational
separation or not and a number or not.
06:29:08 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Only position you put me in is
you asked me to make a decision tonight without
having --
06:29:15 >> That's true.
What is in the alcohol control plan is that no one
is going to be served that is over-served, and
there's going to be specific training to make sure
that no one is over-served.
I guess if I were making a general argument, it's
that three beers on me and three beers on my wife
look different.
So I don't have an answer right this second to
that, but I guess I would argue.
06:29:41 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Well, that's an area you just
used.
If your wife is a nondrinker and order alcohol,
suit your flavor, does that mean you get more.
Minimum of two, that means you get two more, plus
you can order yours for you.

Order hers for you.
06:30:01 >> I see your point.
I'm not sure how I would legislate against that.
We could talk about a limit per person.
I'm not sure, unless you have an idea, I don't
know that I have an idea.
06:30:16 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Well, I hope, I think we had a
discussion about this before.
That was one of the issues I raised about the
limitation.
Any limitation on how many drinks a person can go
back and forth and receive?
That is my concern.
If I support it today, I won't support it at
second reading if you haven't put a limitation on
there.
My second question, item 10, you said alcohol
would be sold no later than a half hour before the
end of the last movie.
What time is the last movie on average?
06:30:53 >> Latest showing is a midnight movie, and that's
Friday and Saturday they will have a midnight
movie.
Sales stop at 11:30.
30 minutes --

06:31:14 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Before the last movie.
06:31:16 >> End or beginning, actually?
Oh, the end.
06:31:28 >>FRANK REDDICK:
If it's the end and the movie is
starting at 11:30 --
06:31:34 >> If the movie starts at 12 and it's the end of
the movie, then if the movie ends in two hours,
it's 1:30.
Sorry.
06:31:39 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Well, I'm going to suggest that
between first and second reading that you have
some discussion with your client and see about the
limitation on the number of drinks a person can
receive.
Like to have it documented before it has my
support.
06:32:02 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
Please help me here with the
limitation of drinks.
We do this with what other permit do we limit the
drinks?
06:32:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY:
That is a question you can ask
staff.
They would have that information based on --
06:32:18 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
Staff?
I have not heard that in five years I've been

here.
06:32:28 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
I have not either.
06:32:31 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
This is the first I've heard limit
of drinks on an establishment we're looking at
permitting.
I understand.
06:32:37 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Only difference, this is -- we're
not talking about a bar or a lounge.
We're talking about a movie theater.
That's why the question is being raised.
06:32:47 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
We're talking about a movie
theater, a restaurant, you know, children go into
restaurants.
06:32:55 >>FRANK REDDICK:
No, no.
We're specifically talking about this particular
item here, a movie theater, correct?
06:33:01 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
I don't recall.
I'd have to research the petitions that came
before you relating to AMC theaters, but I don't
remember there being a limitation on drinks.
06:33:13 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
If I may, I think the difference
between some of the other things we've done, this
is considered a large venue.
We would treat it the same way we do any large
venue.

The difference most large venues we deal with are
nightclubs, other types of bars so we're more used
to that.
Most of those types of operations and you can
correct me if I'm wrong, have certain limitations,
not limitations, but how service is done by virtue
of state statutes and other requirements that they
may have in terms of serving.
And that also goes back to the requirements for
their insurance and all these other things.
So there is going to be some idea of control from
other factors, not necessarily from us.
And I think that when we talk about it, the
difference is that we haven't done a lot of large
venues and we pretty much know at the bar and we
pretty much know those bartenders are trained.
That's one of the reasons why one of the first
questions, would they be tips trained, which is
tolerance for alcohol, they go to a training to
make sure they know when not to serve someone.
Again, I based it based on what he has told us,
that they are going to have that kind of training
there.
And he said it publicly, he's put it on the
record, and that's kind of the way I was looking

at it and going forward from there.
06:34:41 >>SHAUN AMARNANI:
I would need to research this a
little more.
I would venture from terminology of alcohol, this
would fall under operations.
And we wouldn't be able to limit the drinks to a
certain number.
06:34:52 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
We would not.
Because Westshore, did we limit drinks at
Westshore theater?
06:35:01 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
I don't recall.
I'd have to research it, but I don't recall that
being part of the conditions.
06:35:06 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Well, if you recall, they
volunteered to do it.
06:35:11 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
My recollection is that they did
have a similar security or operational plan.
06:35:17 >>FRANK REDDICK:
They volunteered to put a limit.
06:35:20 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
I'll have to look it up.
06:35:22 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Yes, because we had a discussion
about it.
Mr. Maniscalco.
06:35:24 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
Recently, we approved liquor
sales for Raymond James Stadium, and they on their
policy I think had for liquor, it was a two-drink

limit, something like that.
But they brought their proposed rules.
Maybe that's something to look at between now and
second reading going by that kind of policy, even
though you're doing just beer and wine.
So working with that.
06:35:49 >> We will research the issue before the second
reading.
06:35:56 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Can I make one more point to
Ms. Capin's point?
The applicant brought to us the alcohol control
plan.
So the discussion was broad forward by them, and
that's why the discussion item opened up.
But I agree with you, which is we don't typically
look at how you're served.
We base our land use on them as being
professionals at the service of alcohol or --
06:36:24 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
I understand.
But I just heard our attorney tell us that we
cannot limit the drinks.
06:36:29 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
No, no.
I don't think any of us are saying that.
06:36:32 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
We're saying, guess what, we want
to you limit the drinks.

And that to me is not acceptable.
It's not acceptable at this term.
06:36:41 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
I think you're pointing to a
different direction.
The question was, and I can follow -- and anybody
else will tell me if I'm wrong about this, which
is, not to control it, but that some members might
not want to vote in favor of it without knowing
what the alcohol control plan is in the way that
it's served.
It doesn't mean that they are required to do it.
It's just whether or not they'll vote for it.
I perceive based on what they told us that they'll
do a professional way of dealing with it, and
that's good enough for me.
I think we can go forward and whoever wants to
vote for it, vote against it.
Thank you, chair.
06:37:22 >>FRANK REDDICK:
All right.
Anyone in the audience wish to speak on item
number 2?
Anyone in the audience wish to speak on item
number 2?
06:37:29 >> Move to close.
06:37:30 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion by Mr. Cohen, seconded by

Mr. Maniscalco.
All in favor of the motion, aye.
Opposed?
All right, Mr. Suarez.
06:37:37 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Thank you, chair.
I move an ordinance being presented for first
reading consideration.
An ordinance approving a special use permit S-2
for alcoholic beverage sales -- large venue,
consumption on premises only, and making lawful
the sale of beer and wine at or from that certain
lot, plot, or tract of land located at 18002
Highwoods Preserve, Tampa, Florida, as more
particularly described in section 2; that all
ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict are
repealed; providing an effective date.
06:38:06 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Got a motion by Mr. Suarez.
Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
All in favor of the motion, aye.
Opposed?
All right.
06:38:13 >>THE CLERK:
Motion carried unanimously.
Second reading and adoption will be on
February 18th at 9:30 a.m.
06:38:18 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Item number 3.

06:38:21 >>GLORIA MOREDA:
Gloria Moreda, Land Development.
This is item AB2-16-04.
It involves property at 4116 Boy Scout Boulevard,
suites 1 and 2.
The applicant is Corona Cigar Company.
They are asking for a large venue beer, line,
liquor, on premise consumption only.
The establishment is 5,059-square-feet inside
area.
1,071 square feet outside area, for a total of
6,130 square feet for a total AB sales area.
This is a large development.
It's a planned development district, part of the
met life development.
I have the aerial here that shows the property.
In terms of the existing alcohol beverage sales
when met life developers came in, they actually
designated pretty much the entire PBA for COP-R.
It was back in 2008.
The effect of the alcohol beverage sales will be
basically to exclude this part of that original AB
sales and establish a new large venue designation
for this area.
There's over 2,541 parking spaces on-site.
Their request is asking for hours of operation

that are consistent with chapter 14.
There is a distance separation waiver being
requested from 250 square feet to 50 to other AB
sales establishments.
The proposal is for a cigar bar lounge.
The occupant load being projected is 442 persons.
They do have substantial parking in the overall
development and are complying with that
requirement.
There are some minor site plan modifications that
are needed.
The others, there are two other AB establishments
also within the 250 feet, but in terms of waivers,
this is a mixed-use corridor, and it is the other
AB establishment distance separation, 250 is the
one provision that they are asking for an
exception of.
If you have questions, I'm available.
06:41:01 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
06:41:04 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
Is this the Davidoff store
on Boy Scout?
It is.
Okay.
06:41:14 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Petitioner?
06:41:20 >> Jonathon Baker with The Tiller Law Group in

Tampa.
15310 Amberly Drive, Suite 180.
To touch on Gloria's point, we did actually
receive the staff report with the recommended
changes that we had.
Our civil engineer update those as well as the
previous one.
I'm not sure if the most recent one is here, but I
do have copies.
Like Gloria said, it's for a cigar bar and lounge.
The owner has three other stars throughout the
state.
It's mostly for cigar sales.
Alcohol accounts for about 30% of the sales.
Remaining 70% is from the sale of cigars.
They don't offer any kind of happy hour.
Indoor/outdoor smoking is fine.
They are requesting for the -- I'm sorry, the
hours just to be to code.
Like Gloria said, the only waiver is -- I believe
there are three restaurants within 250 feet that
also serve alcohol.
They have cigars ranging from anywhere from
$2.50 to $300, as Councilman Maniscalco pointed
out.

They have a luxury global brand.
Several selections of Scotches, cognacs, bourbons
is what they will stock.
They are an established cigar lounge.
Three other locations -- in downtown Orlando, Sand
Lake, and Lake Mary.
They attract typically a high-end clientele.
Come from all over the county to experience the
unique atmosphere they offer.
Recent reviews, Steve Harvey and George Lopez
appeared at the Orlando location recently.
We're in Forbes magazine as best of the web and
top five Internet cigar retailer as well as Cigar
Aficionado Magazine wrote that Corona Cigar
Company has the largest, best stocked cigar shops
in America.
Our client is excited to bring his cigar lounge to
the Tampa area, and we're hoping for your support.
06:43:22 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any questions from Council?
Anyone in the audience wishing to speak on item
number 3?
06:43:30 >> Move to close.
06:43:31 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion from Mr. Miranda.
Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
All in favor of the motion, aye.

Opposed?
All right.
Ms. Capin, care to read item number 3?
06:43:42 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
I will.
Thank you.
An ordinance being presented for first reading
consideration.
An ordinance approving a special use permit S-2
for alcoholic beverage sales, large venue,
consumption on premises only and making lawful the
sale of beverages regardless of alcoholic content,
beer, wine, liquor, on that certain lot, plot, or
tract of land located at 4116 Boyscout Boulevard,
suite 1 & 2, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly
described in section 2, that all ordinances or
parts of ordinances in conflict are repealed.
Providing an effective date.
06:44:39 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Got a motion from Ms. Capin.
Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
All those in favor of the motion say aye.
Opposed?
06:44:48 >>THE CLERK:
Motion carried unanimously.
Second reading and adoption will be on
February 18th at 9:30 a.m.
06:44:53 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Thank you.

06:44:54 >> Thank you.
06:44:56 >>FRANK REDDICK:
All right.
Information and reports, Mr. Miranda?
06:45:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
No, sir.
06:45:02 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Mr. Suarez?
06:45:04 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
No, sir.
06:45:04 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Ms. Capin?
06:45:06 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
None, sir.
06:45:08 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Mr. Cohen.
06:45:09 >>HARRY COHEN:
I do have one item I'd like to
bring up.
I'm not really sure whether or not I should make
this motion in the form of a resolution or ask for
a letter to be written under the Chairman's
signature.
So I'll describe what I'd like to ask Council for
and perhaps whatever your pleasure is.
We received the presentation not too long ago on
the ferry proposal between St. Petersburg and
Tampa.
Mayor Kriseman has met with Mayor Buckhorn, but
there has not been as of yet any movement toward
any kind of joint agreement in terms of going
forward with the project.
And I would like Council to encourage the Mayor to

work with Mayor Kriseman to come up with a plan to
actually get this ferry proposal started.
There are a lot of people in the area that would
really like this form of transportation to be an
alternative.
And you know, before anything would be done
between the City of Tampa and the city of
St. Petersburg, obviously we would need to know
the cost and we would have to pass on the
expenditure of whatever funds were necessary.
But I would like us to encourage the Mayor to work
with the city of St. Petersburg to make this a
reality.
06:46:26 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Got a motion from Mr. Cohen.
06:46:32 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
Second.
06:46:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I understand what Mr. Cohen just
presented, however, being very conservative with
money, especially my own and taxpayers' money,
which we all are, I have never seen a pro forma
given to us by the company.
All I seen was a gentleman come up and say they
would handle the operational cost of the operation
of the ferries.
And I would assume, then, if that's all they want

to do, that the physical vessels themselves and
the boating docks and whatever goes along with it,
it's our responsibility.
It was not an exploratory thing where everything
has come up.
I don't know this company.
I think it has three letters in the name, if I
recall.
I never saw a profit-and-loss from them.
Let me say this.
When I look at something nationwide, and I know a
lot of people are behind this and I'm not against
this concept, but the people of the United States
are getting sick and tired of financing private
enterprise with their money.
And what's wrong with Hartline creating their own
vessels on the bay.
If we're going to take a risk, let's take the
whole risk, but I don't think that I want to
supplement income for a company and all they are
going to handle is the operational cost of that
company when the investment of the vessel, which I
guess large investments.
I don't know how much, but I guess it's in the
millions, what happens if they walk away.

If it's so good, take so many people off the road,
I've never been told how many people would be
taken off the road.
I'm not against it, Mr. Cohen, but I don't know
enough to tell this Mayor or any other Mayor what
he or she should do.
It is a troublesome thing, and this is only the
beginning.
When you start these kind of conversations,
Mr. Chairman, the greatest thing we have in front
of us today to do is to have a transit system that
works for all of us.
And when you start breaking apart that this sector
wants to do this, this one wants to build a
stadium, nothing is going to pass.
The people are just sick and tired of spending
money, especially myself, and seeing no progress.
The roads in this city are clogged.
Yes, they are.
I can't get in and out of my house on Lake Avenue
or MacDill for a long time.
It's backed up four blocks, like the rest of the
city.
That's good.
That's progress.

People are staying here.
All my grandkids that I know of are going to live
here.
One is already out of college and living here.
So what I'm saying is, our own population will
increase by over 400,000 in this county in the
next 25 years.
The preponderance of these people will move to the
City of Tampa.
Why?
I'll tell you why, because we have adequate water
and adequate sewer capacity and we're not Flint,
Michigan.
And these are the things that are coming about
that the public -- and that's why these
individuals that are running for office, much
higher office than what we're talking about, for
president, have the great debate among themselves.
I've never seen an individual running for
president tell the TV I'm not going to debate.
I'm going to have my own thing.
The public loves that.
What I'm saying is, I don't have enough
knowledge -- and I'm not against what Mr. Cohen
made the motion on -- to ask the Mayor to do

something. I just can't do it.
06:49:57 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Ms. Capin.
06:49:58 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
I don't mind asking the Mayor.
But that's beside the point.
Listen, you know, I was late to City Council
because I went to St. Joseph's Hospital where my
mother-in-law is, and it took me one hour and 15
minutes.
I tried to avoid traffic, and there was no
avoiding it.
We have an expressway that cost I don't know how
much money and it's clogged.
All transportation is subsidized by public money.
All public transportation is subsidized.
None of it stands on its own.
I understand the thought of a private as opposed
to all public, but I feel that the public is not
moving on it, so at least we have something to go
on, something to look at besides being on the
Howard Frankland bumper to bumper or being on the
expressway.
An hour and 15 minutes from St. Joseph's Hospital
is insane.
Granted, I couldn't have taken a boat there.
I think we need to explore.

We need to ask him to explore every venue that we
can possibly transportation-wise.
That's all.
Thank you.
06:51:26 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Mr. Maniscalco.
06:51:27 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
I look at it as this.
I'm sorry that our Mayor didn't jump on this
before Mayor Kriseman did, because really, I think
it would benefit Tampa.
If you look at this proposed ferry project, should
it go from south county to MacDill Air Force Base
and be helpful to the people that work from south
county at the Air Force Base, I remember being in
college, taking classes at the HCC campus on the
Air Force Base and having to go through that gate
was always a disaster.
It was always backed up.
If you can have this ferry service where the folks
who have to drive all the way to the Air Force
Base, go through the gate with the congested
traffic, give them an alternative method and ease
some of that congestion, I would support it.
If it's something that would connect downtown
Tampa and downtown St. Pete and people would use
it instead of crossing the Howard Frankland

bridge, I would support it.
Looking at the numbers, light rail is very, very
expensive.
We talk about it, but it's in the hundreds of
millions of dollars.
The ferry project is something around, you know,
it could come out to costing $25 million.
It's very minimal.
It's the least amount in comparison to increasing
the bus service and whatnot.
So it's something that I would support.
I think it would be beneficial, and I do encourage
the Mayor to look at this more seriously.
06:52:43 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Ms. Montelione.
06:52:46 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
I support this effort with the
ferry.
I mean, we need as many options for transportation
as possible.
And at the MPO, ferry service has been included in
the plans that we've been looking at for years.
I mean, even before either of the proposals came
forward that was an option, because we have that
big body of water that separates our counties, and
it's fairly obvious that having a ferry would be a
logical step for us.

So having this pilot program and showing that the
folks in this area are not as tied to their cars
as people seem to purport, I think would be a
fabulous thing, because it's alternative
transportation.
It's not been done here before, and if this pilot
project actually works, then it opens up the talk
and the parameters to what people say about how
folks in Pinellas and Tampa, Hillsborough County
get around.
We will show that we're not as tied to our cars as
people say we are.
06:54:12 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Anyone else?
Well, let me say this.
I had a conversation with the Chief of Staff
around 5:15 or 5:20 this afternoon prior to coming
here.
And that discussion centered around the ferry.
And I shared some reservations and concerns I had
that I was not comfortable even moving forward
with that.
We're talking about investing taxpayer money on
something that is only going to be regional for a
few months out of the year and look at the bidding
process.

One company, person with a reputation in the city
dealing with choo-choo trains, rail, everything
you can think of, I look at the process --
Most of the other companies said they didn't have
a fair opportunity, and I have a lot of
reservations and concerns about investing that
$350,000 of taxpayer money with no guarantee that
this is even going to work or not.
What I wish I had done tonight and encouraged the
Mayor to do, get off his bucket and let's get
this -- here in the City of Tampa.
That's what somebody needs to be making a motion.
[Talking over one another]
06:55:53 >> We have a resolution sitting on the desk.
06:55:58 >>FRANK REDDICK:
That to me is more important than
investing $350,000 on a pilot program.
06:56:06 >>HARRY COHEN:
Let me say I didn't suggest that we
put a dollar figure.
I just simply am suggesting that we encourage the
Mayor to look at this and bring us a proposal that
we can actually evaluate.
We can vote it up or down depending on if we agree
with the terms that are worked out, but it seems
to me like there needs to be movement between the
cities of St. Petersburg and Tampa to come to some

kind of an agreement to move forward on this.
And I think by expressing of ours, we can indicate
that we would be supportive if the right deal
could be struck.
06:56:44 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Chair, if I could, just to
reiterate what you had said, I actually talked to
the Chief of Staff earlier today, same subject
matter.
I think that most of us --
06:56:54 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
I didn't talk to the Chief of
Staff.
06:56:56 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
You were busy in traffic.
That was the problem.
06:56:58 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
No, I was here.
I was told he wasn't coming.
06:57:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ:
Back to what I was saying, with the
problems that I saw and Mr. Miranda's points are
well taken, which is we don't have a number.
We don't have a contract.
We don't have know what this means.
What we know about is there's one company that
made a bid.
No one else had the time to make that bid.
The city of St. Pete is the one that opened it up.
That was not something that we were privy to.

So anything that comes through, I think we'll have
to do our due diligence to figure out whether or
not we want to go forward with it.
Because one of the things I brought up is, what is
the cost to us specifically when this goes
forward?
I think Mr. Miranda's thoughts are well taken,
because we don't know what it's going to cost us.
We don't know what the amount to do it is going to
be other than the operation of the facility.
There are lots of other costs that go along with
it, even on a pilot project.
I would like to see the numbers, too, but I don't
have any problem at all with writing a letter
saying if you're going to do it, let's get
something before us, and let's figure out what
that next step is.
06:58:04 >>HARRY COHEN:
That is all I'm asking.
Actually, I do think in the form of a letter would
be -- and under the chair's signature would be a
fine way to go about doing it.
So that's the motion.
06:58:14 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Any other comments?
Motion from Mr. Cohen.
Second by Ms. Capin, right?

06:58:23 >>YVONNE CAPIN:
I did.
06:58:24 >>FRANK REDDICK:
All in favor of the motion, aye.
Opposed?
06:58:27 >> Aye.
06:58:28 >>THE CLERK:
Motion carried with Miranda voting
no.
06:58:31 >>FRANK REDDICK:
All right.
Mr. Maniscalco?
06:58:35 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
No, I do not.
06:58:36 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Ms. Montelione?
06:58:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE:
No, sir.
06:58:39 >>FRANK REDDICK:
All right.
Motion to receive and file?
06:58:41 >> File all the documents.
06:58:42 >>FRANK REDDICK:
Motion by Mr. Miranda.
Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
All in favor of the motion, aye.
Opposed?
All right, we stand adjourned.
Thank you.
06:58:50 >> Have a fun Gasparilla, everybody.