Tampa City Council
Thursday, February 18, 2016
9:00 a.m. Session
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09:03:52 [Sounding gavel]
09:03:54 >> Good morning.
09:03:55 We are going to call this meeting to order.
09:03:57 I am going to yield to Councilman Suarez.
09:03:59 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
09:04:01 It's my pleasure to introduce Bishop Tom Scott, called to
09:04:05 ministry in August 1971 under the ministry of reverend G.H.
09:04:09 William at the Community Church of God in Macon, Georgia.
09:04:14 He earned a B.A. in criminal justice and a minor in
09:04:18 sociology, attended theological seminary with a B.A., also
09:04:25 Doctor of Divinity by the School of Ministry in 1995 and
09:04:34 Florida Metropolitan University.
09:04:35 I had no idea you were a Bishop and a doctor.
09:04:38 That's something you don't see very often.
09:04:40 Bishop Scott was elected to the Hillsborough County
09:04:42 commission and elected two additional terms.
09:04:44 He served as chairman of the Board of County Commissioners
09:04:46 from November 97 through November of 199.
09:04:49 And he was reelected to Florida in November 2002 and 2003
09:04:57 and elected to the Tampa City Council in March 2007 and
09:05:00 served as chairman as well.
09:05:02 Bishop Scott became pastor of 22nd street of God in
09:05:05 April 1980 and the 34thth street church of God
09:05:12 where he served over 30 years.
09:05:14 Let's welcome back the Bishop Tom DeSoto.
09:05:17 Please stand for the invocation and remain standing for the
09:05:20 pledge of allegiance.
09:05:21 >> Bishop Tom Scott: It's always my pleasure to be here.
09:05:28 Thank you, Councilman Suarez, for inviting me.
09:05:37 It's good to be here.
09:05:38 Thank you for this privilege.
09:05:39 Shall we pray?
09:05:42 We are always reminded of the fact that you are a great God.
09:05:46 As we come in your presence, we pause to recognize you and
09:05:49 to thank you for the blessings of this day.
09:05:54 The blessings of the day and your grace upon us but for our
09:05:58 great nation, our great country.
09:05:59 We thank you for America today for which she stands for.
09:06:03 Justice and equality, for all of its citizens.
09:06:06 We pray you continue to bless our great nation.
09:06:09 Bless those that represent this country, this state, and
09:06:13 this city.
09:06:14 We pray now for this City Council.
09:06:16 We pray for each of them as they deliberate today on those
09:06:21 issues that are so important to our community.
09:06:23 We pray that you will give them wisdom and knowledge and
09:06:26 insight as they make decisions that are best for our
09:06:30 community.
09:06:30 We pray not only for them but for our mayor today.
09:06:33 Bless him as he leads this city of ours.
09:06:36 Thank you now.
09:06:36 We ask that you bless the men and women in uniform who fight
09:06:40 for democracy around the world and those who protect us here
09:06:43 at home.
09:06:45 Please cover them, bless them and bless their families.
09:06:49 We ask all these things in your name, we pray.
09:06:51 Amen.
09:06:52 (Pledge of Allegiance)
09:06:56 Roll call.
09:07:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:07:19 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.
09:07:21 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.
09:07:22 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: Here.
09:07:24 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.
09:07:30 Clerk, we have a memorandum off from Yolie Capin, she will
09:07:33 be absent from this meeting, and she wanted it to be
09:07:36 reflected in the record.
09:07:43 Thank you.
09:07:44 Approval of adoption of the minutes.
09:07:45 >> So moved.
09:07:47 >>FRANK REDDICK: We have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
09:07:49 Second by Mr. Suarez.
09:07:50 All in favor say aye.
09:07:51 Opposed?
09:07:52 All right.
09:07:53 Approval of the agenda.
09:07:55 Addendum to the agenda.
09:07:57 >> So moved.
09:07:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: I have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
09:07:59 Second by Mr. Suarez.
09:08:00 All in favor say aye.
09:08:02 Opposed?
09:08:03 All right.
09:08:04 Let me just state for the record for everybody to know that
09:08:08 today we are trying the new order for the agenda, and if you
09:08:16 have a copy, there's going to be times when we stop and go
09:08:22 to a particular item so that we can get it done.
09:08:26 And we just want to reflect that on the record that this is
09:08:30 just temporary until we feel comfortable that we want to
09:08:33 make some permanent changes.
09:08:35 >> Speak a little louder.
09:08:38 Can't hear you back here.
09:08:40 >>FRANK REDDICK: Oh, okay.
09:08:40 What we are doing is we are making some temporary changes to
09:08:44 the agenda, and hopefully that you have a chance to review
09:08:48 it, temporary, and if the council feels comfortable that we
09:08:53 want to make it permanent, we would do that.
09:08:55 But just for today we are trying it.
09:08:59 And just to make sure that's what we want to have do.
09:09:04 So some changes that as we go forward today there will be
09:09:08 times that we stop to do like second readings and some other
09:09:12 things like at a time certain of the hopefully everything
09:09:15 goes smooth and we have no problems.
09:09:18 At this time, we have public comments.
09:09:21 And it's going to be 30 minutes time set.
09:09:25 Public comments.
09:09:27 All right.
09:09:27 Anyone wishing to speak at this time, please come forward.
09:09:30 You have three minutes.
09:09:33 State your name and address for the record.
09:09:56 >> Joe Robinson: Is the Elmo working?
09:10:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Before you start the clock, Mr. Robinson
09:10:03 is here on an item that is not set for a public hearing.
09:10:08 And the speaker waiver form does not apply strictly by your
09:10:14 rules.
09:10:14 It's council's discretion.
09:10:16 Otherwise it's three minutes.
09:10:17 >> Joe Robinson.
09:10:21 I'm here to talk about the roadway construction improvement
09:10:27 agreement.
09:10:27 You have the documents.
09:10:30 I might go past the three minutes.
09:10:33 In the agreement it states shall engage in constructing in
09:10:37 such improvement, and it states that provider shall comply
09:10:42 with the City of Tampa ordinance minority and women
09:10:45 businesses.
09:10:46 I'm here today that that has not occurred on this
09:10:49 procurement by NTP.
09:10:52 I attended the meeting, as you can see that.
09:10:55 I was a minority business.
09:11:04 I have everything highlighted in yellow.
09:11:10 And then on January 26th, I had access, that they
09:11:17 responded to my questions.
09:11:20 And then all hell broke loose and said a question was raised
09:11:24 regarding NVB 10 and 24, because this may be left blank, and
09:11:37 the project when it's awarded.
09:11:38 Sorry for the confusion.
09:11:39 That is an absolute disagreement with the city's ordinance.
09:11:49 And he wrote back on the 29th in response and conferred
09:11:53 that the form must be submitted, with the RFQ.
09:11:59 And he goes on and says what they are supposed to do was not
09:12:02 done.
09:12:04 The vendors then turned in their proposals on the 8th.
09:12:07 I had met with the attorney over there, asking for a public
09:12:14 records request.
09:12:17 They said they were going to give it to the legal
09:12:20 department.
09:12:20 That was February 2nd.
09:12:21 February 9th I still haven't gotten the protest -- they
09:12:26 already had the proposals in.
09:12:32 I asked and they said state and local ordinance, they
09:12:36 complied with ordinance, which they did not.
09:12:39 The proof is in the submittals.
09:12:41 The submittals from David Nelson, and the NB 20 got that.
09:12:48 The problem is that the rest of the lenders failed to
09:12:51 submit -- vendors failed to submit NB 20.
09:12:57 NB 25 filled out the 22nd.
09:13:00 They didn't have any form.
09:13:05 They didn't have any form.
09:13:06 And correcting didn't have any forms.
09:13:10 The ordinance was violated.
09:13:11 And what they need to do to clean up, they should -- you get
09:13:19 rid of the points.
09:13:21 They should send everybody to interview.
09:13:25 But they did not give anyone an opportunity because of the
09:13:28 error that was made by NTP.
09:13:32 And I'm asking the City Council to ask staff to get that
09:13:34 report to them and that they allow all five firms to come
09:13:38 forward with an oral interview and that will solve the
09:13:40 problem.
09:13:41 >>: Any questions from council?
09:13:50 Let me just ask that Gregory Hart ...
09:13:59 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Do you need a formal motion?
09:14:03 I'll make that motion.
09:14:04 But in addition, have the legal department also come up with
09:14:07 a report to make sure that all parts of the requirement
09:14:11 through NVP have been followed and explain what it is.
09:14:19 >>FRANK REDDICK: Got a motion from Mr. Suarez.
09:14:21 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion from Mr -- oh, all right.
09:14:26 Sorry.
09:14:28 (Laughter)
09:14:29 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.
09:14:31 Opposed.
09:14:32 >>THE CLERK: February 25thth.
09:14:39 That's your workshop.
09:14:40 >>FRANK REDDICK:Yes, sir.
09:14:41 >> Kevin O'Neill.
09:14:44 I'm a Executive Committee member out of Hillsborough,
09:14:48 marijuana decriminalization, item 6 on your agenda.
09:14:52 We are not advocating.
09:14:56 We believe we want people in Tampa to be free from being
09:15:00 incarcerated, from being harassed by policing agencies,
09:15:03 whether city, state or federal.
09:15:05 I think you guys have a role to play in being the leadership
09:15:08 in the State of Florida.
09:15:09 There's been a handful of cities that have gone the distance
09:15:12 with decriminalizing pot in their own cities.
09:15:15 You guys have an opportunity to be on the same leadership
09:15:18 list in the State of Florida.
09:15:18 The people of this country, I believe, are sick and tired of
09:15:21 having their parents, their loved ones, their grandparents,
09:15:26 people sick with cancer and need to have pot in order to
09:15:29 deal with whatever digestive issues, chemotherapy drugs
09:15:33 produce.
09:15:35 Also have children, helping them to grow to be the adults
09:15:40 they are.
09:15:40 The last thing we want is to have them put in the cage for
09:15:43 years to go through a totally incompetent justice system,
09:15:46 and to have, you know, 95% of the cases pleaded out when we
09:15:51 don't even know what the hell they are doing but they are
09:15:54 copping a plea, and sitting in a cage in a state prison or a
09:15:58 local jail for months and years all because this process we
09:16:02 have in our system that's somewhat out of control.
09:16:08 We have an opportunity to stop that flow of people going
09:16:10 into a cage, our people, your children, our children, and
09:16:14 hope to God addiction doesn't hit any of our families in
09:16:17 this room, but I'm not here to say that addiction doesn't
09:16:20 exist.
09:16:21 It does.
09:16:21 Part of the punishment of addiction is the drug use itself.
09:16:26 We are not here advocating people to be abusing drugs.
09:16:29 We are advocating our government to get out of our lives,
09:16:32 provide some sanity for us so we can at least conduct our
09:16:36 legal business here, whether hits going to work or running a
09:16:40 business, and have our entire lives taken off rail because
09:16:43 of pot.
09:16:45 So the details of this potential ordinance you are
09:16:48 considering, it's up to you.
09:16:52 It's street to grow a plant and pack it and put it in a pipe
09:16:59 and smoke it, or is it going to be legal to do further
09:17:02 processing like make it into a pill form or adding
09:17:05 pesticides.
09:17:08 In the spirit of what I think you guys are willing to listen
09:17:11 to is we need to keep our people in Tampa out of cages, keep
09:17:15 our people of Tampa protected from being abused by the
09:17:19 judicial system, which is probably understaffed and out of
09:17:22 control, one way or another, and keep people of Tampa free
09:17:27 which is what we want to be here in America.
09:17:29 So thank you for your time.
09:17:34 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.
09:17:35 [ Applause ]
09:17:36 >> Good morning.
09:17:41 My name is Rick Fernandez, 2906 North Elmore Avenue, Tampa
09:17:47 33602, in the Tampa Heights area.
09:17:50 I'm the president of the Tampa Heights Civic Association,
09:17:54 newly elected, and I'm wearing my issue on my lapel, stop
09:18:00 TBX.
09:18:02 I'm here really as a reminder to the council of the meeting
09:18:04 that was held here last June.
09:18:07 At that point I believe you were constituted as the CRA, if
09:18:11 I remember correctly.
09:18:15 Numbers of people appeared before you then in opposition to
09:18:18 TBX.
09:18:19 As a group you voted unanimously to support our position and
09:18:22 to oppose TBX and to make recommendations to the MPO.
09:18:26 I want to remind you that that happened, and also advise
09:18:30 what's happened since.
09:18:32 The movement has grown.
09:18:34 We have appeared by the hundreds in front of the MPO on
09:18:38 multiple occasions.
09:18:39 We have signed petitions in the thousands opposing TBX.
09:18:46 We have had PERK announce that PBX is one of the 12 worse
09:18:55 road construction boondoggles in the country.
09:18:58 That was just published within the last 30 days.
09:19:00 We have had one national transportation expert appear before
09:19:03 the Urban Land Institute here in Tampa, just last month,
09:19:09 identifying TBX as the worst project he's seen in his years
09:19:15 traveling the country.
09:19:16 We are not going away.
09:19:17 In fact the movement is certainly growing.
09:19:19 We will be more politically active, I believe, during the
09:19:23 course of this year.
09:19:24 I believe you will be hearing from all of us individually
09:19:28 from time to time, probably more from me than you care to.
09:19:31 But mostly what I am here to ask is that you not lose the
09:19:35 passion of your commitment back in June.
09:19:38 We still need your help.
09:19:40 We need your help not just here in the form of a unanimous
09:19:43 vote, that you were kind enough to give us back in June, but
09:19:46 also for those of you who also sit on the MPO board.
09:19:51 We need your support there.
09:19:53 That's important to not necessarily carry over from one
09:19:57 constituted group to the next between June and August of
09:20:00 last year.
09:20:00 We would certainly like to see that happen.
09:20:02 And we want that support to grow to the other members of the
09:20:05 MPO board.
09:20:06 This is an important issue not just for Tampa Heights but
09:20:09 for all of the historic communities in the core area.
09:20:14 For Tampa as a whole and for the Tampa region as a whole.
09:20:17 You hope you don't forget we are the heart of this
09:20:20 community.
09:20:21 We are why Tampa is what it is.
09:20:23 It's not about Wesley chapel, as much as I love Wesley
09:20:26 chapel and my friends there.
09:20:28 When you think of Tampa you think of West Tampa, Ybor City,
09:20:31 Tampa Heights, Seminole Heights, the downtown core.
09:20:34 Protect us.
09:20:36 Help us.
09:20:37 Do your job and we'll help you.
09:20:39 Thank you.
09:20:43 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.
09:20:44 [ Applause ]
09:20:45 Next speaker.
09:20:45 >> Good morning, City Council.
09:20:48 My name is Christopher Cano.
09:20:52 I am the Executive Director of the central Florida chapter
09:20:54 for the national organization for the reform the marijuana
09:20:58 laws.
09:20:59 I come before you today not as someone with a title but a
09:21:09 father of a sick child and his only option is to help him
09:21:12 with his terminal dementia.
09:21:15 Many of you personally know my familiar reply and I'm asking
09:21:17 you today to think about if it was your family member that
09:21:20 you have to risk your freedom for every single day to make
09:21:23 sure that they can get treated so they can get better.
09:21:26 What would you do for your mom, your dad, your grandparent,
09:21:30 your son or daughter?
09:21:32 That's the question you have before you today when you
09:21:34 choose whether or not you are going to vote on civil
09:21:36 citations for possession because the criminal justice system
09:21:41 in this county we all know is overcrowded, we know that for
09:21:46 80 years cannabis prohibition is rooted in Jim crow in an
09:21:53 attack on the African-American and Latino community.
09:21:58 And I want you to understand that you do have a serious
09:22:03 decision to make today.
09:22:04 That decision is going to determine the leadership of this
09:22:06 city, and determine as the gentleman said the future freedom
09:22:10 of our citizens.
09:22:12 Now, I want everyone in this audience to stand up right now
09:22:17 and show City Council that we are not alone, that you guys
09:22:20 have a serious decision to make today, and that the people
09:22:23 are listening.
09:22:24 But please make the right decision.
09:22:28 Please decriminalize cannabis in the City of Tampa.
09:22:32 Thank you for your time.
09:22:34 [ Applause ]
09:22:46 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Powell, before you start, let me remind
09:22:48 the audience we have set 30 minutes aside for public
09:22:52 comments.
09:23:00 And when the next person gets up we shorten the time.
09:23:04 So I am going to ask you to hold your applause, and allow
09:23:10 the speaker or your representative to speak so we can move
09:23:12 this time slot.
09:23:16 >> My name is Al Powell, and the residents of 15th and
09:23:32 16th street in Ybor City, we need from you the cutting
09:23:37 down of a palm tree in our alleyway and we need a portion
09:23:40 our alleyway paved for the purpose of being able to park in
09:23:45 the rear of our homes.
09:23:46 And this is the only alternative that's left to us to
09:23:49 pursue.
09:23:51 The reasons for this request is as follows.
09:23:57 We can never be assured of having a parking space in close
09:24:00 proximity to our residents returning home from wherever.
09:24:03 This has been a continuous to be the norm that has us
09:24:09 frustrated dealing with this constant inconvenience.
09:24:16 Imagine returning home to find improper driveway has been
09:24:18 blocked by unknown vehicles, or that parking space outside
09:24:22 your home is now occupied by an unknown vehicle.
09:24:26 Now you have to find a parking space a block over or around
09:24:29 the corner.
09:24:30 Typically, that would be an abnormal occurrence for all of
09:24:35 you.
09:24:35 And if it happens to be an ongoing event I'm sure you all
09:24:41 would find this to be unacceptable and would see some form
09:24:44 or degree of remedy for that situation.
09:24:46 Allow me to respond, I am 61 years of age.
09:24:50 I was born and raised in Ybor City.
09:24:52 I witnessed first hand the changes.
09:24:57 Parking problems.
09:24:58 The parking problems experience is primarily due to the city
09:25:01 transforming Ybor into an area of public entertainment which
09:25:05 brings with it a constant influx of travelers and visitors
09:25:10 that hasn't always existed of the during the days of my
09:25:12 youth there was very little if any ongoing residential
09:25:15 parking to speak of.
09:25:16 This is the preliminary reason for me as tax paying citizens
09:25:20 that I believe the city has a obligation to the residents,
09:25:26 Forbe we do matter.
09:25:27 I believe that I who represent historic landmark home and
09:25:33 any other resident who experiences residential parking
09:25:36 issues deserves an equal amount or more attention and
09:25:39 consideration and to be made whole as many travelers and
09:25:44 visitors that frequent our city.
09:25:47 So again, I'm asking for some help for parking.
09:25:53 And right now the rear is our only alternative.
09:25:58 If you could help us out.
09:26:03 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Powell, what happened with the
09:26:06 gentleman from the transportation department that worked
09:26:09 with you pertaining to this issue?
09:26:11 What happened?
09:26:11 >> I let them know at the meeting of the issues, and there's
09:26:23 nothing that they can do.
09:26:24 It's a city street.
09:26:26 And I'm saying that we understand that.
09:26:29 It's been an inconvenience for us as a family to not be able
09:26:34 to come home and park.
09:26:35 And we have special events there like Gasparilla, it's just
09:26:40 impossible.
09:26:40 If you move, you lose.
09:26:42 So the only alternative appears to be the rear.
09:26:49 There's a condo to our west that has paved a portion of the
09:26:53 alleyway.
09:26:54 We would like to continue that for our property, the
09:27:01 approximate area of the alley and the property to be paved
09:27:04 as well as the palm tree that's in the way so we can
09:27:08 eventually try to do something in the rear to relieve our
09:27:13 frustration about the parking issue.
09:27:16 And that seems to be our only alternative.
09:27:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: I will talk with the transportation
09:27:28 department about the problem and see what remedies we can
09:27:31 come up with.
09:27:33 But it's been an ongoing problem for a long, long time.
09:27:36 And I can understand your frustration because you got
09:27:40 on-street parking in front of your residence, and I
09:27:43 understand if you go off and come back, there's another car
09:27:48 parked in front of your home?
09:27:50 >> There's residential signs there.
09:27:54 It's virtually ignored for whatever reason.
09:27:56 And they have from 4 p.m. to 6th p.m., but anybody can
09:28:01 park there anytime.
09:28:03 And even after 6 p.m. people still park, even though they
09:28:07 may get a ticket.
09:28:09 But that does us no good.
09:28:13 So it's an ongoing issue.
09:28:16 >>: All right.
09:28:16 We'll see if we can -- all right, next speaker.
09:28:22 >> I'm Ed, Ed Tillou, Sulfur Spring.
09:28:26 We had a shooting recently and there aren't even pictures
09:28:29 being circulated as to what the individual looked like.
09:28:33 Okay, 9, 6 and 1.
09:28:36 Wow, $12 million for petroleum based fuels again.
09:28:40 I think last year it was eleven.
09:28:41 I guess people are using more and more -- the price went
09:28:45 down, and yet the bill has gone up.
09:28:48 Okay.
09:28:49 A lot of that is vehicles, but, you know, Chevy Volt, you
09:28:53 would have a lot fewer.
09:28:55 So, anyway, item 6.
09:28:57 I don't think the mayor should be saying pot is fine.
09:29:01 But anyway, that was really a pun.
09:29:05 About nitwit journalism.
09:29:07 You know, it caters to people who just read the headlines.
09:29:10 Itself was actually pot should be dealt with, with a fine.
09:29:15 But in any case, that's really a problem with TBF.
09:29:19 And I think TBT gets it from "Tampa Bay Times"
09:29:24 Item one.
09:29:25 Architectural Review Commission.
09:29:27 There's a real problem here with respecting to global
09:29:31 warming that's leading to climatic change, the streams and
09:29:34 such, which will maybe in 50 years flip the Gulf stream,
09:29:40 because once that methane starts coming up through the
09:29:45 Permaforce you have a serious problem.
09:29:48 But you have to really unscrew your heads, two stories on
09:29:55 the trump property, a huge monstrosity behind the library
09:29:59 and you are out of touch with the environment.
09:30:01 You are out of balance. This carbon dioxide is a product of
09:30:05 being out of balance with the environment.
09:30:06 Now, I feel bad for the man with the parking space.
09:30:12 Everybody in Ybor City should get it free from City Council.
09:30:20 But I think they lost their neighborhood to all these
09:30:25 special events.
09:30:26 Which brings into this next thing.
09:30:31 Here is a group of people that loves their neighborhood.
09:30:32 This was Lenni Lenape, which I got interested in. I'll pass
09:30:36 it around. Doing some research on the family. There was
09:30:36 this fellow Jan Tiebout. And he was grilled as a
09:30:46 schoolteacher to deal with this and to help, and he drank
09:30:53 beer with them.
09:30:54 I don't see any problem with after school drinking beer with
09:30:57 the people.
09:30:58 But the Dutch Reform Church had a bad feeling about that and
09:31:02 they brought him back to New York, and he became a farmer in
09:31:11 Brooklyn.
09:31:11 In any casae, here is another group that I'm hoping will be
09:31:13 interested in global warming. The Nanticoke Lenni-Lenape.
09:31:15 This is Pocahontas.
09:31:24 But Lenape, they sold the KANACHI branch Manhattan for $24
09:31:29 but it was a hunting ground.
09:31:31 Then thought the Dutch wanted hunting rights on Manhattan.
09:31:34 So, anyway, times change.
09:31:35 (Bell sounds)
09:31:37 But got to slow it down.
09:31:40 They are not changing in the right direction; they are
09:31:40 changing too fast.
09:31:42 >>THE CLERK: [Off microphone.]
09:31:57 >> Teresa Miller. I'm here representing the Hillsborough
09:31:58 County Anti-Drug Alliance today, and the many citizens of
09:31:59 Hillsborough County and throughout our state who are having
09:32:02 us uninformed, uneducated and unaware of the implication of
09:32:05 decriminalizing and legalizing marijuana.
09:32:08 The City of Tampa is considering decriminalization of
09:32:11 marijuana possession for adults.
09:32:13 Other cities including Dade County, Palm Beach, West Palm
09:32:16 Beach, Miami, Key West, Broward, have passed similar
09:32:20 ordinances that allow enforcement officers discretion to
09:32:23 issue a civil citation for possession of up to 20 grams of
09:32:27 marijuana.
09:32:28 That equates to 36 joints which in my opinion someone may be
09:32:34 trafficking instead of personal use.
09:32:36 Most penalties are $100 for the first offense.
09:32:38 Then it escalates up to $500 for the third offense.
09:32:42 Some of our two offenses before reverting back to the
09:32:47 criminal charges. Leon county has an excellent program with
09:32:50 prearrest divergent program for first time marijuana
09:32:53 possession violations, that includes assessment, substance
09:32:57 abuse treatment.
09:32:58 This is the type of approach HCADA is more in line with.
09:33:07 Our mission for HCADA is to promote healthy communities in
09:33:07 Hillsborough County, free of substance abuse, addiction and
09:33:12 substance abuse and addiction through education,
09:33:15 collaboration, and advocacy.
09:33:17 We have concerns about marijuana decriminalization.
09:33:21 Our chief concern is that children and young adults will get
09:33:24 the wrong message.
09:33:26 Many adolescents and college students feel that marijuana is
09:33:31 harmless and a medicine. This is a myth.
09:33:33 Research shows that marijuana -- that the brain continues to
09:33:35 grow until the age 25th.
09:33:37 Marijuana is extremely harmful in developing brains.
09:33:41 In Hillsborough County alone, one of five high school
09:33:44 students in Hillsborough County smokes pot -- has smoked pot
09:33:48 in the past 30 days.
09:33:49 Marijuana use has increased since in 2018 to 14 where all
09:33:56 other drugs have decreased.
09:33:58 Nearly four times as many Hillsborough County high school
09:34:00 students smoke pot than they do cigarettes.
09:34:02 This should be alarming.
09:34:04 Marijuana is a dangerous drug for adolescents.
09:34:07 Research shows that teens who use -- causes brain changes,
09:34:13 poor memory, and lower IQ.
09:34:14 This would have implications for lower grades and higher
09:34:18 dropout rates as Colorado was seeing.
09:34:20 In Monitoring the Future, 6% of college students smoke
09:34:28 daily.
09:34:29 This is the highest rate since 1980.
09:34:31 Our suggestion would be 20 grams of marijuana is far too
09:34:36 large.
09:34:36 We suggest 10 grams.
09:34:38 Allow them the options for first offense only.
09:34:41 Allow --
09:34:44 (Audience outbursts.)
09:34:48 >>FRANK REDDICK: I'm going to ask law enforcement to remove
09:34:51 you from this chambers.
09:34:55 You make additional outbursts, I am going to ask law
09:34:58 enforcement to remove you from this chamber and you will not
09:35:00 be allowed to come back in here.
09:35:05 So if you want to try me, do an outburst again.
09:35:10 You are going to respect the speaker regardless of your
09:35:16 position.
09:35:16 Thank you.
09:35:16 >> Thank you.
09:35:19 Allow officers to use discretion to give a citation or
09:35:21 arrest based on your best judgment.
09:35:25 Citations should require drug education classes, substance
09:35:29 abuse assessment and treatment.
09:35:30 If you have any further questions, please feel free to ask
09:35:34 me now.
09:35:36 I have a meeting at ten so I am not going to be able to stay
09:35:38 but all my information is not anecdotal.
09:35:40 It's based on research, facts and data.
09:35:45 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions by council?
09:35:46 All right.
09:35:46 Thank you.
09:35:46 >> Thank you very much.
09:35:47 I will send you a copy of this research.
09:35:49 >>: All right.
09:35:50 Next speaker.
09:35:50 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Before we go to our next speaker, are we
09:35:53 going to go to our 9:30 hearing?
09:36:01 >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes, we discussed that with our attorney
09:36:04 and clear what we have got.
09:36:06 >> Good morning.
09:36:12 My name is James Hatcher, Plant City, also former resident
09:36:16 of Temple Terrace for the first 13, 14 years of my life.
09:36:23 I am pleased to discuss the issue of cannabis in my
09:36:27 hometown.
09:36:28 In my previous testimony, I got statistics from the FBI in
09:36:40 the United States.
09:36:43 We did look at the number of arrests.
09:36:56 Information from the department of corrections of Florida
09:36:59 showed that drugs were also an issue in the state.
09:37:13 Using the Hillsborough crime map, 177 drug arrests happened
09:37:17 this past year.
09:37:18 744 drug arrests happened the previous three years.
09:37:26 Looking at this information from the FBI, that breaks down
09:37:31 by region, that over half of the arrests made for drug
09:37:38 violations are due to can cannabis possession only.
09:37:46 Now, a health care, minor in psychology, drug --
09:38:11 Based on these numbers, 100 for one day, and for a month
09:38:17 over a quarter million growing or possessing a piece of
09:38:30 plant.
09:38:30 That does not make sense.
09:38:33 As for other research out there that is towards cannabis, I
09:38:41 encourage members that look at how cannabis naturally
09:38:47 affects our bodies in healthy ways.
09:38:53 I am bipolar.
09:38:56 I take medication.
09:38:58 But I also use cannabis.
09:39:02 I also have a 3.9 G.P.A., graduated with honors from USF.
09:39:06 Took me nine years to get the degree.
09:39:09 I'm happy.
09:39:10 I'm thrilled.
09:39:10 And I thank you for considering this.
09:39:14 >>: We have five minutes left in public comments.
09:39:17 What is the pleasure of council?
09:39:18 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Since we recently decided to change the
09:39:27 rules, I think we need to test it out and see how it works
09:39:30 and come back for public comments.
09:39:32 >>HARRY COHEN: The order of business that we are
09:39:37 experimenting with would say that we are going to do the
09:39:40 additional public comment at the end of the meeting.
09:39:51 >>FRANK REDDICK: So what we are going to do, we have five
09:39:53 minutes left.
09:39:55 And I hate --
09:40:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry.
09:40:06 May I be recognized?
09:40:08 >>FRANK REDDICK:You are will be recognized.
09:40:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: In keeping with what council's intention
09:40:12 is and state law is to limit the discussions solely to items
09:40:15 that are going to be voted on, items that are legislative
09:40:19 that are going to be voted on and not set for public
09:40:22 hearing.
09:40:23 Items that council will be coming back to council, people
09:40:25 will have a future opportunity to speak.
09:40:27 Or can wait till the end of the meeting.
09:40:29 But things that are going to be voted on, for instance, on
09:40:33 the consent docket, limit those discussions so you can get
09:40:38 past that and be able to take T votes.
09:40:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: As you well know, I didn't attend those
09:40:44 meetings but let me say this.
09:40:46 Some time back, no one was heard till the end of the
09:40:52 meeting.
09:40:52 The cameras were shut off.
09:40:54 That was all changed.
09:40:57 Most people have a chance to see us one on one.
09:41:01 And I'm not here to convey council rules.
09:41:04 But you have people that may like or may not like the way I
09:41:09 vote but that's their prerogative.
09:41:10 However, I strongly feel that they should be heard since
09:41:14 they are here and they made an effort to come here, and they
09:41:17 didn't know about the changing of the rule.
09:41:22 Certainly it was not Headline News and they are not aware of
09:41:24 these facts.
09:41:25 So my feeling is that we hear them, and for them to come
09:41:29 back, for seven of us tore go to lunch and come back, they
09:41:35 may not have been transportation.
09:41:36 They have got to go home and come back.
09:41:38 They may not have the money to eat a meal.
09:41:40 I don't know. Buff what I am saying is I don't think it
09:41:42 would be in the best public interest to let them wait.
09:41:46 To cut the line off, continue as we were before just for
09:41:49 today's meeting.
09:41:51 That's just my suggestion.
09:41:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So I'll make the motion based on what he
09:41:56 just said which is to add an additional 30 minutes, and I
09:42:00 think the last person that's standing is Ms. Long at the end
09:42:03 of the line.
09:42:04 I think I counted 10 or 11 people in line.
09:42:09 >>FRANK REDDICK: Motion by Mr. Suarez.
09:42:11 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
09:42:13 All in favor? Opposed?
09:42:14 All right.
09:42:15 Ms. Long, you will be the last speaker in line.
09:42:19 And we will spend about 30 minutes and you have three
09:42:23 minutes.
09:42:26 Keep in mind we are extending by 30 minutes.
09:42:30 So she will be the last person in line.
09:42:34 Yes, sir.
09:42:34 >> My name is pastor Frank R. Williams, paradise missionary
09:42:38 Baptist church, 1112 East Scott Street.
09:42:43 I always like to give God all the praises and Thank God for
09:42:47 another day of living.
09:42:48 I'm a disciple of Jesus Christ. Thank God.
09:42:55 We have got a lot of issues, and you say we all have three
09:43:01 minutes.
09:43:05 I have a lot more to talk in three minutes.
09:43:08 In fact it would take hours, two or three hours.
09:43:12 But you all are talking about sexual predators in your
09:43:23 neighborhood.
09:43:24 If we are going to talk about sexual predators in the
09:43:26 neighborhood, I think there would be nobody left in the
09:43:30 neighborhood but me, because we got sexual predators all
09:43:33 over the United States.
09:43:37 And if you want to look, married.
09:43:53 Are you going to check out all the Catholic church?
09:43:56 No.
09:43:56 But you are going to harass me.
09:43:58 And here I am trying to do the right thing in my church.
09:44:03 You blocked up my streets.
09:44:05 Blocked up my right-of-way.
09:44:07 And tell me run a public right-of-way to some Bank of
09:44:14 America, and having my people from coming to church and
09:44:18 worship God almighty.
09:44:22 But yet you make major things.
09:44:25 We got some problems here.
09:44:27 And I think this young man thank this man for coming up and
09:44:30 speaking on my behalf and the rest of the black folks.
09:44:35 We got a dividing line.
09:44:36 Black on one side and white on the other side.
09:44:39 Whites get all the respect.
09:44:41 Blacks don't get no respect in Tampa, half of Florida, maybe
09:44:45 all over the United States of America.
09:44:49 Neither do Mexicans.
09:44:50 I have homeless people coming to my church.
09:44:52 I don't run them out of church.
09:44:55 I stand up for their rights.
09:44:56 They have rights just like you all have rights.
09:44:58 I have rights just like you all have rights.
09:45:04 My Constitutional right has been, my human rights have been
09:45:13 objected, everything that I do, saying our Constitutional
09:45:16 right, and that's not right.
09:45:17 I Thank God for another day.
09:45:19 And I often tell you all I am going to pray for you all.
09:45:23 But you all have got to pray for yourself in the name of
09:45:26 Jesus Christ.
09:45:26 God bless all of you.
09:45:28 >> I'm Kelly Grumsfeld, 2701 north 9th street here on
09:45:40 behalf of the VM Ybor association but mostly on behalf of
09:45:44 myself as a parent, a homeowner and a very concerned city
09:45:47 residents.
09:45:48 As of this morning there are 77 predatory people living
09:45:52 within a quarter mile of my house, a net increase of two
09:45:55 since the last City Council meeting pertaining to the
09:45:57 subject.
09:45:58 As of the beginning of January, there have been 14 predatory
09:46:01 people listing their addresses as VM Ybor with many of them
09:46:07 in the rooming houses along Nebraska Avenue.
09:46:10 Half of those 14 are brand new to VM Ybor.
09:46:14 They seem to come back to VM Ybor.
09:46:17 We also had a murder in VM Ybor since the last meeting and
09:46:22 the perpetrator was one of those rooming house occupants
09:46:26 that is a sex offender.
09:46:28 These are not the most upstanding residents.
09:46:33 I understand they have to live somewhere.
09:46:35 But why do they have to live within a mile of our
09:46:39 neighborhood?
09:46:40 I am also noticing there's an influx of individuals coming
09:46:42 from other counties as you can see from these flyers.
09:46:46 We have some from Hernando county.
09:46:53 This guy is from Broward County.
09:46:56 This guy is from Manatee County.
09:47:00 This guy is from Miami-Dade county.
09:47:02 These are all new ones since the beginning of the year.
09:47:04 And they are also combing to our neighborhood after being
09:47:08 adjudicated.
09:47:13 This is 2015, and June 2015.
09:47:24 They are being directed to our neighborhood by the Florida
09:47:26 department of corrections, and I hope this is something that
09:47:29 Mr. Shelby will be looking into.
09:47:31 I'm asking that the city enforce the existing Hillsborough
09:47:34 County anti-clustering ordinance that is already on the
09:47:36 book.
09:47:37 The Board of County Commissioners voted unanimously
09:47:39 yesterday to make this ordinance stronger by increasing the
09:47:42 safety zones around schools, daycares and parks by
09:47:46 increasing to 2500 feet.
09:47:48 That would actually include -- 2500 feet for perpetrators or
09:47:52 victims under 16.
09:47:53 That the would actually include the majority of the sexual
09:47:56 predators and offenders that live in VM Ybor.
09:48:00 Because most of their victims are under 12 or under 16.
09:48:03 My concern is that the city creates its own ordinance that
09:48:06 will only go into effect going forward thereby making VM
09:48:10 Ybor a penal colony, essentially.
09:48:15 The county ordinance that went into effect in 2008 could
09:48:18 hopefully be applied to our existing situation, and it
09:48:23 should have been applied -- an ordinance that should have
09:48:25 been enforced when as in the county.
09:48:30 And for the safety of my children and myself I am asking you
09:48:33 to enforce the existing ordinance on the book and provide
09:48:35 some relief to our neighborhood.
09:48:37 Thank you.
09:48:37 (Bell sounds)
09:48:42 >> Good morning.
09:48:43 My name is Kim Headland. I reside at 1001 East 24th
09:48:48 Avenue and here to speak on item number 5 and the clustering
09:48:52 of sex offenders.
09:48:54 Adjacent counties have already created requirements for sex
09:48:57 offenders, eliminate the options for living.
09:49:01 There's a strong desire on the part of the Florida
09:49:02 department of corrections and local law enforcement to have
09:49:05 these individuals in housing instead of on the streets
09:49:08 immediately upon their release.
09:49:09 I understand that.
09:49:11 But there's also been a lack of enforcement of the
09:49:13 anti-clustering ordinance since 2008 primarily along the
09:49:17 Nebraska Avenue corridor, central and East Tampa
09:49:20 neighborhood, Sulphur Springs and the university area.
09:49:23 Most recently the fire marshal negotiated with a local
09:49:26 rooming house owner for of two rooming houses against the
09:49:33 special organization magistrate's ruling, and left us with
09:49:37 two 3,000 foot rooming houses, 30 foot in each of them.
09:49:43 That's 100 feet per person.
09:49:47 I understand everyone needs a place to live and understand
09:49:50 the FDLE and find it much easier and safer to stop by one or
09:49:58 two properties to check 50 or 60 individuals than to go to
09:49:59 many properties.
09:50:00 I also understand that providing housing to sex offenders
09:50:03 can be lower cost but also very profitable to individuals
09:50:07 that own multifamily housing and rooming houses.
09:50:10 What I can't understand is how it's ever possible to house
09:50:14 30 individuals in 3000 square feet while turning a blind eye
09:50:19 to local code, and also don't understand why it's accessible
09:50:21 that our urban core neighborhoods like East Tampa, Sulphur
09:50:24 Springs, University area, have become a dumping ground for
09:50:27 the Florida Department of Corrections when there is a county
09:50:31 ordinance that could be enforced.
09:50:34 So enough is enough.
09:50:37 We have been discussing this for more than five years.
09:50:38 I'm here to ask you to start to take action.
09:50:41 I understand you're hearing a report a little later today.
09:50:41 Please work with finding a way to enforce that county
09:50:45 ordinance, and the building code already in existence, the
09:50:50 same way they would be enforced in any other area of our
09:50:54 city.
09:50:54 Thank you.
09:50:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: Next speaker.
09:50:58 >> Judy Greer, 1314 east 15th Avenue.
09:51:04 I also reside in VM Ybor.
09:51:06 And of course I ditto what Kelly has said and research.
09:51:15 Our neighborhood is perfect lit conducive to housing all of
09:51:18 these people, but the homeless people, whatever you want to
09:51:23 call them, the sexual predators are the most concern to us.
09:51:28 We have an alternative cafe.
09:51:30 We have so many places.
09:51:31 We have the interstate where they can sleep under, and TPD
09:51:36 can't keep up with all of them, even if they can't stay in
09:51:39 the rooming houses.
09:51:40 So instead of coming up with your own laws, something that
09:51:47 can only be enforced from hear going forward, we need to
09:51:50 look back at the 2008 Hillsborough County ordinance that
09:51:54 would take in all the ones that are already living there.
09:52:01 There's no deterrent.
09:52:04 Even if they are not here, they want to come here because
09:52:07 everything is here for them.
09:52:09 And then as far as Pinellas County has a substation, a
09:52:18 sheriff's substation.
09:52:19 The station there, the area where the sexual predators are
09:52:27 most encircled.
09:52:29 I think you can do whatever you do to get TPD involved but
09:52:36 there's no way that the cops can check on the sexual
09:52:39 predators unless they are in rooming houses.
09:52:44 They do a daily head count.
09:52:46 They check where they are going and all that kind of stuff.
09:52:49 That's the way it's going to be if you are going to hurt a
09:52:51 child or hurt anybody else illegally, then you have to pay
09:52:54 the price.
09:52:55 Thank you.
09:52:55 >>FRANK REDDICK: Next speaker.
09:52:57 >> Michael Minardi, an attorney in the State of Florida and
09:53:04 speaking about item 6.
09:53:05 Specifically 7 to 1.
09:53:06 That is the arrest ratio from Tampa of African-Americans
09:53:11 versus whites for cannabis.
09:53:13 Even though use by individuals is the same.
09:53:16 That is an incredible disparity. This ordinance can help
09:53:19 stop that.
09:53:22 Civil citations.
09:53:23 You understand the effects of criminal laws on cannabis.
09:53:26 You get a license suspension punishable by up to one year in
09:53:30 jail, a $1,000 fine.
09:53:32 You have to have multiple DUIs to have a 6 month license
09:53:36 suspension in the State of Florida with no hardship but with
09:53:39 one possession of cannabis charge walking down the street
09:53:42 with 20 grams you can lose your lie seasons for six months,
09:53:45 can't get a hardship, causes problems with work.
09:53:47 I have had children, college students, lose scholarships,
09:53:52 lose ROTC programs, for simple couple of grams of cannabis.
09:53:57 And you are ruining these children and these peoples lives
09:54:00 forever by causing this decriminalization.
09:54:03 The city of Miami has estimated about $40,000 in Miami
09:54:08 estimated savings of about $40,000 just by going to a
09:54:13 decriminalization program.
09:54:15 You guys are discussing the sexual predators being
09:54:19 everywhere.
09:54:20 Well, in Florida there's over 10,000 sexual assaults that
09:54:23 are untested as a result of funding, a lack of funding.
09:54:29 We can take this decriminalization money, save on law
09:54:33 enforcement.
09:54:34 Maybe we'll have more officers available to go out and check
09:54:36 on these sexual predators and we can save peoples lives,
09:54:40 prevent them from losing scholarships, prevent them from
09:54:43 injuring military.
09:54:44 That's the implication of what cannabis criminalization does
09:54:49 right now.
09:54:50 As I am sure you know there are four states in this country
09:54:53 and other ballot measures going forward with legalization.
09:54:55 We are not talking about decriminalization.
09:54:57 We are talking about full legalization, regulating cannabis
09:55:02 like alcohol.
09:55:03 And it's working.
09:55:04 It's shown to be a sensible policy.
09:55:06 Colorado made $986 million in revenue from cannabis, has
09:55:10 seen minimal detriments from that.
09:55:13 And the woman earlier who was talking about use, she's very
09:55:21 accurate.
09:55:21 Studies have shown in medical states or legal states, teen
09:55:24 use has not increased and in some states has decreased.
09:55:28 That is one thing the drug war has not done in over 40
09:55:31 years.
09:55:31 In 40 years of our drug war, it has not reduced the use of
09:55:37 any drugs.
09:55:38 This is sensible policy for the City of Tampa, and is
09:55:42 something that I hope you all support.
09:55:44 We have to turn our criminalization of individuals but a lot
09:55:48 of our individuals are young, 18-25 who are getting
09:55:52 arrested.
09:55:52 Many of my clients are 50-plus.
09:55:55 Elderly, 45 and up are the biggest percentage of the
09:55:59 population in our country that are moving and I hope you
09:56:06 approve this message.
09:56:07 >>FRANK REDDICK: Next speaker.
09:56:10 >> My name is Dana Moxley, and I am a former chairman of the
09:56:15 libertarian party of Florida and resident in the Tampa Bay
09:56:19 area. I'm also third generation Floridian, and I have
09:56:19 children now who are fourth generation Floridians.
09:56:27 I'm very proud of our state.
09:56:28 Also, I have been an advocate for cannibas. I came down
09:56:28 with lyme disease back in 2010 right after I had my daughter
09:56:36 and was slowing down quickly.
09:56:37 And I was at the point where I thought -- I was making plans
09:56:42 for my husband to take care of her forever.
09:56:47 When I realized, when I break the law and use this cannabis
09:56:56 oil, even under the risk, I took it and I got better from
09:57:00 it.
09:57:01 And it healed me.
09:57:07 It made me also realize that in doing so, it gave me the
09:57:14 perception that I was a bad person, that I was a criminal.
09:57:17 But if I went out and talked to people that was the
09:57:20 impression I got.
09:57:22 And I think the message in general that we are sending about
09:57:27 medications and about cannabis essentially is totally off
09:57:31 base, destroying the moral fabric of our society.
09:57:38 I don't remember anyone having a vote on whether to give
09:57:42 oxycodone to children. Yet we are doing that.
09:57:49 No side effects.
09:57:50 And it's not just the legal aspect.
09:57:53 I know we are talking about this in a little bit.
09:57:55 But at least make it look like a civil infraction and not a
09:57:58 criminal, because I don't want my child to think that people
09:58:04 of that use this medicine are criminals when people that can
09:58:09 use medicine prescribed by doctors, even though it's the
09:58:13 standard, are not crimes.
09:58:14 And what I like to teach my children is we don't hurt other
09:58:17 people that haven't hurt you.
09:58:21 We don't cause harm to others.
09:58:23 And sometimes there's rules put in place that force us to
09:58:26 cause harm to other people.
09:58:27 And when those rules are there, instead of making people
09:58:34 break the rules, and making criminals out of them, a civil
09:58:41 infraction is a beginning.
09:58:52 Something like oxycodone.
09:58:56 Medications have horrible side effects proven, when there
09:59:01 have been one proven.
09:59:02 I think this confirms the moral fabric and where we are
09:59:08 going as a society in general, we need to take
09:59:13 criminalization off of this drug.
09:59:14 (Bell sounds).
09:59:17 >>FRANK REDDICK: Next speaker.
09:59:18 >> Derek Chamblee, Google D-E-R-E-K, C-H-A-M-B-L-E-E, St.
09:59:36 Paul.
09:59:37 Derek Chamblee, Google "Tampa Bay Times," nix Dixon.
09:59:49 I want to speak to an issue that I spoke to at the county
09:59:55 commissioners yesterday about this confederate flag issue
10:00:00 again and this thing that some are calling racist, and if we
10:00:08 can erase racism, the vestiges of racism in America, by
10:00:12 taking down the particular sculptures, the particular
10:00:18 images, for instance, the confederate heroes, I call them.
10:00:22 And it goes even to the point of going into the cemeteries
10:00:26 and saying, hey, everyone that fought for the confederacy or
10:00:32 everyone that has an image related to the war, we have got
10:00:36 to remove their tombstones, and you know what?
10:00:40 They might even be part of the same family.
10:00:44 We had a lot of families that sacrificed in the civil war,
10:00:49 members that fought on both sides, and I told the county
10:00:53 commissioners yesterday that we need to push for a sculpture
10:00:58 of our first African-American president, Barack Obama, on
10:01:03 stone mountain outside of Atlanta, and we are going to do
10:01:07 this in an equal and a friendly way.
10:01:09 We are not going to take down and erase the sculptures of
10:01:14 the confederate heroes, and we are not going to do this in
10:01:19 Tampa, we are not going to do it in Hillsborough County and
10:01:21 we are not going to do it in the United States of America,
10:01:24 and I have reminded them again that I don't think that with
10:01:27 any time in which General Grant, General Lee at Appomattox
10:01:36 said the confederates could not keep their flag.
10:01:40 In the nation of the world, this is the battleground zero
10:01:43 epicenter of the 2016 presidential campaign, right here in
10:01:47 Tampa, right here in Hillsborough County, and everybody over
10:01:52 the State of Florida.
10:01:53 What are they going to do for the State of Florida?
10:01:55 What are we going to do?
10:01:57 Build a wall around the state?
10:01:58 One person said Florida is a penal colony.
10:02:01 Yes.
10:02:02 Welcome to Florida.
10:02:03 Welcome to Florida.
10:02:04 We are going to fill up the jails.
10:02:06 The homeless workers are continuing to come.
10:02:08 And we are going to register them here in Tampa,
10:02:13 Hillsborough County, and we are going to break the grip of
10:02:15 this Republican party on the State of Florida.
10:02:21 Furthermore --
10:02:29 (Bell sounds)
10:02:32 Legalize it.
10:02:33 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right.
10:02:33 Next speaker.
10:02:39 >> I'm Mariah Barnhart.
10:02:43 It's great to address you guys.
10:02:44 As you know, we have gone to the Florida State legislature
10:02:46 in regards to cannabis for several years and have gotten
10:02:49 nowhere so we are really hoping on a local level we can get
10:02:54 some laws passed.
10:02:56 What we all know, anyone with knowledge of the politics
10:02:58 about cannabis legislation, we are a minority.
10:03:03 It is by far the most dangerous and expensive war the United
10:03:06 States has ever waged.
10:03:08 And in regards to our personal circumstances -- you will
10:03:12 hear from another cannaMom -- we have an organization that
10:03:13 advocates for the cannabis medicine.
10:03:18 What you have here in the State of Florida and in the City
10:03:19 of Tampa is a lot of parents, chronically ill children who
10:03:24 are no longer waiting on the legislature.
10:03:26 As everyone knows cannabis has been here forever.
10:03:29 It's not going anywhere. And patients and parents of
10:03:32 critically ill children need away to help their loved ones
10:03:35 or themselves.
10:03:36 We are not criminals for saving our children's lives.
10:03:39 We truly appreciate not only measure but adding the extract
10:03:43 from the plant.
10:03:45 So children, we really like decriminalize on a local level,
10:03:52 as well as the state legalization.
10:03:54 Thank you.
10:03:55 >>: Next speaker.
10:03:55 >> Rene Petro.
10:04:02 And I'm here on behalf of cannamoms and the war on drugs is
10:04:11 a war on humanity.
10:04:13 I have a child who has really, really bad seizure disorders.
10:04:22 He's been on 19 different pharmaceutical FDA-approved
10:04:28 medications.
10:04:30 And every day he asks me, mom, I want to get better.
10:04:34 And I know that cannabis will help him.
10:04:38 But I have to also, as with others, we have to worry about
10:04:42 people coming to knock down the doors and take us away
10:04:47 because we are trying to save our children's lives.
10:04:49 And to me, being in the United States of America, it's about
10:04:55 equal opportunity.
10:04:56 It's about justice and freedom.
10:04:58 And it's about doing what's right by the people.
10:05:01 And Brandon deserves that right.
10:05:05 Everyone deserves that right.
10:05:07 So again, I think we should just -- thank you.
10:05:14 >>FRANK REDDICK: Next speaker.
10:05:16 >> Good morning.
10:05:18 My name is Joel Lee Sherman, Tampa, Florida.
10:05:24 I am here to speak on item number 5, the sexual predator
10:05:29 issue.
10:05:30 Thank you for allowing me to be able to speak.
10:05:38 Dealing with issues such as these it's hard not to become
10:05:41 emotional but I want to point out a few facts.
10:05:44 The issue about predatory people and potential harm to
10:05:50 others, in a particular area, it should be noted that an
10:05:59 ordinance and any laws that we pass on the books in the
10:06:01 State of Florida did not save the lives of the last three
10:06:07 Tampa police officers that were killed in the line of duty.
10:06:10 Those Tampa police officers were killed less than five miles
10:06:19 from the VM Ybor neighborhood association boundaries.
10:06:30 Killed two of their employees, was not prevented by city
10:06:35 ordinance.
10:06:38 And Hoffman who killed a driver on Howard Frankland bridge
10:06:45 Monday, her first two DUIs were here in Hillsborough
10:06:49 County with an address of Swann Avenue.
10:06:57 I want us to be clear that the documents that I have seen as
10:07:07 written certainly raise numerous Constitutional issues as
10:07:15 far as various things to personal rights that are afforded
10:07:24 individuals.
10:07:25 And additionally, I want to make sure that everyone is clear
10:07:27 that the sexual offenders, sexual predators living in this
10:07:34 area and throughout the City of Tampa, Hillsborough County,
10:07:39 many of them are working.
10:07:41 They are paying taxes.
10:07:42 They are contributing to your salaries.
10:07:44 They are contributing other things which the speakers are
10:07:51 getting the benefit of as we all are.
10:07:54 I want to state for the record that this matter should be
10:07:58 terminated and disregarded and ended immediately, not
10:08:03 wasting taxpayers dollars on this.
10:08:07 If this goes forward, if this is enforced, I will certainly
10:08:11 be taking all legal action in state or federal court.
10:08:15 I thank you for your time.
10:08:17 And I'm sorry I cannot stay further for additional comments.
10:08:20 Thank you very much.
10:08:22 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.
10:08:22 Next speaker.
10:08:22 >> 921 East Broad Street, Susan Long, if you haven't heard
10:08:32 that before.
10:08:32 There are three items I want to address.
10:08:34 The first one is decriminalization of marijuana.
10:08:38 I moved here from Michigan in 1982, long before
10:08:46 commissioners, Ann Arbor had changed the law for possessing
10:08:50 small amounts of marijuana with a parking ticket.
10:08:53 You didn't see people lying in the streets smoking pot.
10:08:57 It wasn't an issue.
10:08:58 They just didn't go to jail for it.
10:09:01 I think they did that prior to '78, before I ever moved
10:09:08 here.
10:09:09 We are slow.
10:09:10 We are behind the times.
10:09:11 Not a big surprise.
10:09:13 I think we ought to decriminalize.
10:09:16 I know tons of people that utilize it for things other than
10:09:19 just recreation. There are benefits to all of them.
10:09:25 The third thing I want to talk about is the clustering of
10:09:30 sexual predators.
10:09:31 You already do that.
10:09:32 Stick them all along Nebraska Avenue, clustered in Seminole
10:09:37 Heights, Tampa Heights, Ybor.
10:09:39 That's where you put them.
10:09:42 Why don't you either make a small area or get them out of my
10:09:48 backyard.
10:09:49 They live in our parks.
10:09:51 They bathe in the stream, in the park.
10:09:54 You can go down there, be surprised to see some man stark
10:09:58 naked bathing in the stream and you find out he's a sexual
10:10:01 predator, or offender, one or the other.
10:10:04 I would like to see this resolved.
10:10:06 I don't have a quick solution.
10:10:09 You are talking about making solicitation on the sidewalks
10:10:12 legal.
10:10:15 In my neighborhood the solicitation on the sidewalks on
10:10:19 Nebraska Avenue is prostitutes.
10:10:20 I don't think that's what you meant.
10:10:23 I think you are talking about solicitation to sell
10:10:25 newspapers and other goods.
10:10:26 But I have read it and I thought, oh, my goodness, it's now
10:10:30 legal to be prostituting because you are other sidewalk?
10:10:33 I know that wasn't what you intend, okay.
10:10:37 But those are the three things that I wanted to address.
10:10:41 Thank you very much.
10:10:42 >>: All right, thank you.
10:10:44 We move to item 52. Items to be set for public hearing.
10:10:52 Item number 52.
10:10:57 I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, second by Mr. Suarez.
10:10:59 All in favor? Opposed?
10:11:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Move 53.
10:11:04 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.
10:11:06 >>: All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:11:08 Opposed?
10:11:08 Okay.
10:11:08 >> Move item 54.
10:11:12 >>FRANK REDDICK: Motion by Mr. Cohen.
10:11:14 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
10:11:15 All in favor?
10:11:16 Opposed?
10:11:17 >> Move 55.
10:11:19 >>FRANK REDDICK: Motion by Mr. Suarez.
10:11:21 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco to move item 55.
10:11:24 All in favor say aye.
10:11:25 Opposed.
10:11:25 >> I move to open all public hearings 56 through 58.
10:11:29 >> Second.
10:11:30 >>: I have a motion by Mr. Suarez.
10:11:31 Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.
10:11:33 All in favor say aye.
10:11:34 Opposed?
10:11:35 All right.
10:11:35 Item number 56.
10:11:36 Anyone wish to speak on item 56, 57, 58, please stand to be
10:11:41 sworn in.
10:11:42 Anyone going to speak on item 56, 57 or 58, please stand to
10:11:45 be sworn in.
10:11:46 (Oath administered by Clerk).
10:11:59 >>FRANK REDDICK: Item 56.
10:12:02 Item number 56.
10:12:06 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I think many of the people were not in the
10:12:09 room when we asked them to move forward.
10:12:13 So they have not been sworn in.
10:12:15 >> We are still waiting for some of the applicants to come
10:12:27 in right now.
10:12:46 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Item 56?
10:12:48 >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes.
10:12:48 Is that everybody?
10:12:50 >> Shaun, is that everybody?
10:12:56 >>FRANK REDDICK: Please stand if you are going to speak on
10:12:57 56, 57, 58, please stand to be sworn in.
10:13:00 (Oath administered by Clerk).
10:13:09 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
10:13:10 Site plan has been certified.
10:13:13 Staff has no objection.
10:13:15 >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.
10:13:15 Petitioner.
10:13:16 Item number 56.
10:13:17 >> 5312 North Armenia Avenue.
10:13:29 >> Jonathan Baker with the Tiller Law Group.
10:13:32 I think we went over everything last time.
10:13:40 I'm just here if you have any questions.
10:13:43 To let you know that we did update with staff council's
10:13:48 recommendations.
10:13:49 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions from council?
10:13:50 Anyone in the public wish to speak on item number 56?
10:13:53 >> Move to close.
10:13:53 >> Second.
10:13:55 >>: Motion to close by Mr. Miranda.
10:13:57 Second by Mrs. Montelione.
10:13:58 All in favor say aye.
10:13:59 Opposed?
10:14:00 Mrs. Montelione.
10:14:01 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I move an ordinance being presented for
10:14:05 second reading and adoption, an ordinance repealing
10:14:07 ordinance 2013 149 approving a special using permit S-2 for
10:14:11 alcoholic beverage sales, restaurant, consumption on
10:14:14 premises only, and making lawful the sale of beverages
10:14:17 regardless of alcoholic content, beer wine and liquor on
10:14:20 that certain lot, plot or it tract of land located at 6312
10:14:24 North Armenia Avenue, Tampa, Florida as more particularly
10:14:26 described in section 3, that all ordinances or parts of
10:14:29 ordinances in conflict be repealed, providing an effective
10:14:32 date.
10:14:32 >> Second.
10:14:33 >>FRANK REDDICK: I have a motion by Mrs. Montelione.
10:14:35 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:14:36 Please record your vote.
10:14:44 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin being absent.
10:14:50 >>FRANK REDDICK: Item number 57.
10:14:58 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
10:14:59 The site plan has been revised and certified.
10:15:10 >>SHAUN AMARNANI: In the first reading I had two questions
10:15:13 that I would like to answer. The first question is can the
10:15:18 City Council condition for maximum for alcohol permits, and
10:15:20 the answer is no, it would be preempted under Florida
10:15:22 Statute 562.45C, and the second question is, can the City
10:15:28 Council condition be interior of the building designed in a
10:15:32 way that impacts how the establishment -- alcohol operations
10:15:36 operate?
10:15:37 And that again is no.
10:15:40 That would also be preempted by 562.45C.
10:15:45 I'm here for any questions.
10:15:52 >>FRANK REDDICK: Questions by council?
10:15:52 Anyone in the public wish to speak on item number 57?
10:15:57 Anyone in the public?
10:15:58 >> Clay Bricklemyer for the applicant.
10:16:07 That being said, I did bring a floor plan just for you guys'
10:16:13 understanding.
10:16:14 Let's see if it works here.
10:16:16 I brought copies in case.
10:16:28 So you can see -- I brought pictures, too.
10:16:36 That would be this.
10:16:43 The entrance as you go in.
10:16:44 To the west, you see this fancy writing.
10:16:50 Proposed alcohol.
10:16:51 That would be to the left.
10:16:56 The last two registers would be points of sale.
10:17:03 We have one in Indianapolis doing the same thing.
10:17:11 That is the way it looks.
10:17:12 The only difference, you can see there's signage and
10:17:19 cut-offs, and that's how that is being dealt with.
10:17:26 I do have Wanda -- she's the food and beverage special --
10:17:38 special concepts manager.
10:17:40 This training is sort of how they deal with it.
10:17:50 >> Hi.
10:17:53 First of all, when --
10:17:57 >> I'm sorry, could you state your name?
10:17:59 >> Wanda Cole.
10:18:05 And going to the theaters that are alcohol sales, our rules
10:18:20 and regulations with every staff member of the theater, and
10:18:24 then we go through a training program that teaches how
10:18:37 they -- if someone gets intoxicated, or starts, we teach
10:18:46 them how to make sure that people aren't getting
10:18:50 intoxicated.
10:18:53 We talk to them about underage, because we do have a lot of
10:18:58 underage customers in our theaters.
10:19:00 And we go through a six to eight-hour training period before
10:19:08 we ever serve any alcohol.
10:19:12 And they have to go through the training.
10:19:20 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions from council?
10:19:24 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Mr. Bricklemyer, seeing this photograph
10:19:27 that you showed us kind of reinforces my position how I am
10:19:33 not comfortable with having the alcohol at the same counter
10:19:38 as all of the popcorn and soft drinks, candy and whatever.
10:19:48 It seems very easy for people to not follow the rules or the
10:19:56 training.
10:19:57 You know, a lot of people everybody trained in a lot of
10:20:00 things.
10:20:00 And training itself doesn't necessarily mean that 100% at a
10:20:06 time they are going to ask in a manner consistent with the
10:20:11 training that they have received.
10:20:14 Oversight is important.
10:20:15 And creating boundaries is also important because its
10:20:24 physical boundaries, I think, are more of a deterrent even
10:20:30 than training, or supervisory methods are performed
10:20:37 reinforcing the training.
10:20:38 So, you know, having someone -- and as far as I understand,
10:20:46 an underage person could be behind the counter serving the
10:20:49 alcohol.
10:20:50 I mean, do they have to be 21 to serve?
10:20:56 It's your policy but it's not the law?
10:21:01 So I have those concerns.
10:21:04 In other theaters, there is a separation, a physical
10:21:07 separation between where the alcohol is sold and watch your
10:21:15 process is different.
10:21:19 So I still have my concerns.
10:21:21 >> Councilman Montelione, I understand your concerns.
10:21:28 Again, this is more of the operation standpoint that we are
10:21:32 preempted by the Florida statutes.
10:21:35 What we were saying before is the interior of the building,
10:21:37 what we are looking at from an operational standpoint, that
10:21:40 the division of alcohol of the state perspective that they
10:21:46 are the ones doing the operation so we can't go into that
10:21:50 because we are preempted.
10:21:52 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Preempted from which parts of the
10:21:56 discussion?
10:21:57 You spoke about two different things.
10:22:00 >>SHAUN AMARNANI: So talking about the counter and talking
10:22:02 about the -- kind of the location of setting up the alcohol
10:22:06 and where it goes through, in fact the interior of the
10:22:09 building.
10:22:09 If you wanted to do -- basically, if there were conditions
10:22:15 put on for mitigating impact to the neighborhood, you want
10:22:19 to orient the building a little bit one way to mitigate
10:22:24 those kind of aspects that could affect other neighbors.
10:22:29 That's one area that the City Council can get into.
10:22:31 But when you start going into the operation, we are
10:22:34 preempted by Florida statutes.
10:22:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
10:22:40 I understand the concerns of my esteemed colleague.
10:22:44 However, when you look at that philosophy of mind anyway,
10:22:47 you look at pro sports.
10:22:49 Not only do they have it where you go by a pizza or hotdog,
10:22:53 you can buy water, beer, Coca-Cola, at the same line.
10:22:57 They can hawk it in the stadium.
10:23:01 Kids have to pass the beer to the adult.
10:23:03 So I understand that.
10:23:07 Although I am not completely in favor of all those things, I
10:23:11 also understand the position that you are in.
10:23:12 So I would be supportive of this.
10:23:16 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any other questions or questions by
10:23:19 council?
10:23:20 Anyone in the audience wish to speak on item 57?
10:23:23 Anyone in the audience to speak on item 57?
10:23:25 >> Move to close.
10:23:26 >> Second.
10:23:26 >>: Motion by Mrs. Montelione.
10:23:28 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
10:23:29 All in favor?
10:23:30 Opposed?
10:23:31 Mr. Maniscalco, would you read item 57?
10:23:34 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I have an ordinance being presented for
10:23:36 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving a
10:23:39 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, large
10:23:42 venue, consumption on premises only, and making lawful the
10:23:45 sale of beer and wine at or from that certain lot, plot or
10:23:48 tract of land located at 18002 Highwoods Preserve, Tampa,
10:23:52 Florida as more particularly described in section 2nd
10:23:55 that all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict are
10:23:58 repealed, providing an effective date.
10:24:00 >> Second.
10:24:02 >>: I have a motion by Mr. Maniscalco.
10:24:05 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
10:24:06 Please record your votes.
10:24:07 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin being absent.
10:24:15 >>FRANK REDDICK:Item number 58.
10:24:21 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
10:24:22 The site plans have been certified.
10:24:24 I have no further comments.
10:24:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: Petitioner?
10:24:27 Item number 58.
10:24:28 >> Jonathan Baker, Tiller Law Group, same thing.
10:24:42 We went over everything, if there are any questions we would
10:24:45 be happy to answer them.
10:24:47 The site plan was corrected.
10:24:50 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions by council?
10:24:52 Anyone in the public wish to speak on item number 58?
10:24:57 I have a motion to close by Mrs. Montelione, seconded by Mr.
10:25:00 Cohen.
10:25:01 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:25:02 Opposed?
10:25:03 Mr. Cohen.
10:25:04 >>HARRY COHEN: I move an ordinance being presented for
10:25:09 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving a
10:25:11 special use 2, S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, large venue
10:25:17 on premises only making lawful the sale of beverages
10:25:20 regardless of alcoholic content beer wine and liquor on that
10:25:23 certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 4116 Boy Scout
10:25:28 Boulevard, suite 1 and 2, Tampa, Florida as more
10:25:31 particularly described from section 2, that all ordinances
10:25:33 or parts of ordinances in conflicts are repealed, providing
10:25:35 an effective date.
10:25:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
10:25:38 >>: Motion by Mr. Cohen.
10:25:39 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
10:25:41 Please record your vote.
10:25:42 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Reddick voting no and
10:25:53 Capin --
10:25:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: I'm sorry, I pushed the wrong button.
10:26:00 >> Move to revote.
10:26:03 >>FRANK REDDICK: Motion by Mr. Miranda.
10:26:05 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:26:06 I'm sorry.
10:26:07 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin being absent.
10:26:16 >>FRANK REDDICK: Item number 59.
10:26:20 We go to item number 59.
10:26:22 Mr. Territo.
10:26:29 I got a motion by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
10:26:33 All in favor?
10:26:36 Opposed?
10:26:36 Thank you.
10:26:37 >>SAL TERRITO: We are here to do something you do on a
10:26:40 regular basis with a slight difference.
10:26:41 We have to have a public hearing on this particular bond
10:26:44 issue.
10:26:44 The daycare organization is asking the city to issue $225
10:26:47 million worth of bonds for three hospitals.
10:26:51 One in Tampa, one in Hillsborough County, and one in
10:26:53 Pinellas County.
10:26:54 They will hold hearings -- I'm sorry.
10:27:03 Please close the door.
10:27:04 They will hold hearings in Hillsborough and Pinellas County.
10:27:08 As well as here. Here they are asking you to issue the
10:27:10 bonds.
10:27:10 This is a bond issue for $225 million to help three
10:27:14 hospitals.
10:27:14 Basically it's for work done there.
10:27:18 The city will receive a fee as it usually does in this
10:27:21 particular case for the $115,000.
10:27:24 It's a very large bond issue.
10:27:25 The city will have no responsibility on paying these bonds
10:27:28 back.
10:27:32 It's simply to make that provision.
10:27:34 You have to ask the public if they have any questions or if
10:27:37 there are any questions you may have.
10:27:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I read this about 3:30 in the morning.
10:27:43 This is for one hospital, 220 some beds in south
10:27:46 Hillsborough, close to Ruskin.
10:27:49 And I want to make sure that the city, as you well know, I
10:27:54 was not permitted to vote in a rezoning recently passed 4-2
10:27:58 by this council.
10:27:58 I want to make sure that none of this money is being used
10:28:01 for any of the work that was discussed at that meeting.
10:28:04 >>SAL TERRITO: This has nothing to do with zoning matters
10:28:07 or --
10:28:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want the record to have show.
10:28:13 Thank you very much.
10:28:15 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any other questions from council ever?
10:28:17 Anyone in the public wish to speak on item number 59?
10:28:19 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Move to close.
10:28:24 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.
10:28:25 >>FRANK REDDICK: All in favor say aye.
10:28:26 Opposed?
10:28:27 >> Move the resolution.
10:28:28 >> Second.
10:28:29 >>FRANK REDDICK: I have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
10:28:31 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:28:32 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:28:34 Opposed?
10:28:35 All right.
10:28:37 We go to committee reports.
10:28:39 And after committee reports we will be doing presentations.
10:28:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I move 14 through 17.
10:28:53 >>FRANK REDDICK: I got a motion by Mr. Miranda.
10:28:55 Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.
10:28:57 All in favor say aye.
10:28:58 Opposed?
10:29:00 Motion passed.
10:29:01 Parks and recreation.
10:29:02 Mr. Maniscalco.
10:29:03 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I move items 18 through 26.
10:29:12 >> Motion seconded by Mr. Cohen.
10:29:17 Is that correct?
10:29:19 All in favor?
10:29:20 Opposed?
10:29:21 Public works.
10:29:21 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move 27 through 30.
10:29:24 >> Motion by Mr. Suarez.
10:29:26 Seconded by Mr. Miranda.
10:29:28 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:29:30 Opposed?
10:29:34 Finance Committee, Mr. Cohen.
10:29:35 >> Move 31 through 36.
10:29:37 >> Motion by Mr. Cohen.
10:29:39 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:29:40 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:29:41 Opposed.
10:29:42 Building zoning preservation.
10:29:44 Mrs. Montelione.
10:29:45 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Move 37 through 48.
10:29:54 >> Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:29:55 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:29:57 Opposed?
10:29:59 Transportation committee, Mr. Miranda.
10:30:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move items 49 through 51.
10:30:03 >> Second.
10:30:04 >>: I have a motion by Mr. Miranda.
10:30:06 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
10:30:07 All in favor?
10:30:08 Opposed?
10:30:09 All right.
10:30:11 We go to presentations.
10:30:21 Item number 1.
10:30:23 Madam clerk.
10:30:32 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: City clerk.
10:30:33 I'm here regarding items number 1 and 2.
10:30:36 Number 1, presentation by applicant for the Architectural
10:30:44 Review Commission.
10:30:46 We have three vacancies and one applicant.
10:30:50 Mr. Steven Buckman.
10:30:57 See if he's here.
10:30:58 I don't see him.
10:30:59 >> Move the appointment.
10:31:00 >> Second.
10:31:01 >> Move the resolution.
10:31:06 >> Second.
10:31:07 >>: I have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
10:31:09 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
10:31:10 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:31:12 Those opposed?
10:31:13 Okay.
10:31:13 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Council, we will readvertise for
10:31:17 the other two vacancies.
10:31:19 Moving on to item number 2, Variance Review Board.
10:31:24 We have two vacancies and two applicants.
10:31:35 Mr. John Dingfelder is here.
10:31:37 >> Thank you.
10:31:42 Good morning, council.
10:31:43 It's a pleasure to be here in front of you today.
10:31:45 My name is John Dingfelder.
10:31:49 City of Tampa.
10:31:51 I have applied.
10:31:55 It's interesting sitting on this side of the podium today
10:31:57 and watching the action from out here.
10:32:03 You are doing a great job.
10:32:05 My wife asked me this morning, she said, so what are you
10:32:08 going to say to these guys? Why do you want to go back to
10:32:11 sit on the Variance Review Board?
10:32:13 Many of you know me as serving almost eight years on City
10:32:16 Council with many of you.
10:32:17 But what you might not know is that I actually started on
10:32:20 the Variance Review Board.
10:32:22 I served I think approximately three years, about 15 years
10:32:25 ago, on the Variance Review Board, heard hundreds of cases
10:32:29 with the VRB, it was an honor and privilege to serve our
10:32:34 community in that capacity.
10:32:35 I learned a lot.
10:32:36 Went on to do thousands of zoning zoning cases as a member
10:32:44 of council, learned more, and frankly the answer to her
10:32:48 question is, I miss the public service, miss the opportunity
10:32:52 to be up here and to help guide our community to great and
10:32:56 better things.
10:32:57 So I respectfully request your selection. If you have any
10:33:01 questions, I'll be glad to answer.
10:33:15 >>MIKE SUAREZ: You said you served almost eight years on
10:33:17 council.
10:33:18 Why do you think that gives you any -- (Laughter).
10:33:22 >> Her question is why I would want to come back.
10:33:25 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.
10:33:27 I appreciate it.
10:33:27 >> Thank you, Mr. Suarez.
10:33:29 >>: Any other questions from council?
10:33:30 Okay.
10:33:31 >> I move the appointment to the board.
10:33:36 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman. If you can,
10:33:42 there are two applicants for which position?
10:33:44 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Shirley Foxx-Knowles, city clerk.
10:33:48 There are two vacancies and two applicants.
10:33:52 One for the position of attorney and one for the position of
10:33:56 alternate.
10:33:58 I think Mr. Feldman is here, also.
10:34:02 >> The incumbent alternate.
10:34:11 >> Yes, incumbent alternate.
10:34:14 I put in for the open seat as well.
10:34:16 My name is Brett Feldman.
10:34:20 I have been serving as alternate on the Variance Review
10:34:22 Board since 2014, been an attorney in this city since 2000.
10:34:30 I have been board certified in construction by the Florida
10:34:32 Bar.
10:34:37 Leadership Tampa class, I served on the committees for
10:34:42 Enrichment Tampa.
10:34:43 I just want to continue my service for the board and for the
10:34:47 city.
10:34:54 Through the process of being an alternate, and I have put in
10:34:57 my name for the open seat.
10:35:04 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions by council?
10:35:05 All right.
10:35:06 Mr. Suarez.
10:35:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I have a question now, because my backup
10:35:14 material has something a little different.
10:35:16 We have one position for landscape architect or arborist
10:35:21 which is to expire in October 2015.
10:35:25 Now the backup may be incorrect.
10:35:29 And we do show the one alternate and does not say whether or
10:35:34 not it is for an attorney position.
10:35:37 I just need to clarify that far.
10:35:40 So do we still have 2001 vacancies and two applicants for
10:35:45 two different positions?
10:35:46 Or do we have two applicants for one position?
10:35:48 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We have two vacancies and two
10:35:53 applicants.
10:35:56 Both of the gentlemen are attorneys.
10:35:59 So the alternate position has expired, or will expire by the
10:36:07 end of this month.
10:36:13 The alternate member fills the attorney position also.
10:36:23 So he would either be considered for the attorney or the
10:36:26 alternate.
10:36:27 >>MIKE SUAREZ: If I could, according to what I am looking
10:36:33 at here, Mr. Feldman is the alternate currently.
10:36:36 And then there's vacant alternate position.
10:36:38 That's where the confusion is at.
10:36:40 There is a vacant alternate position that expired January
10:36:44 31st.
10:36:45 So is that available for another attorney position?
10:36:56 That answers that question.
10:36:57 Again I am not sure why we have Kelsey Trujeque.
10:37:02 Thank you.
10:37:06 I apologize.
10:37:07 I was confused in terms of the application, the background
10:37:10 material and all the other things that are in here.
10:37:13 >>FRANK REDDICK: So we are voting for alternate and -- is
10:37:18 that what we are doing?
10:37:19 And then one for attorney?
10:37:21 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We are voting for -- Mr. Feldman is
10:37:25 an incumbent but he's also looking at moving up to being the
10:37:31 attorney.
10:37:32 >>FRANK REDDICK: So the first vote will be the vote between
10:37:34 the two for just the attorney position.
10:37:38 Is that correct?
10:37:39 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Yes.
10:37:41 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right.
10:37:42 Do we have a ballot?
10:37:43 >> It's a little confusing, in the backup material.
10:37:51 And I apologize.
10:37:56 I'm a little bit confused.
10:37:57 >> The two positions for today are for the attorney and the
10:38:05 alternate.
10:38:06 Those are the two coming up.
10:38:09 It expires on February 28th.
10:38:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: [Off microphone.] I would move to elevate
10:38:24 Mr. Feldman to the attorney position and Mr. Dingfelder to
10:38:27 the alternate position.
10:38:29 I think that we can do that, is that correct?
10:38:31 There's no limitation as to him being an alternate and also
10:38:34 an attorney, correct?
10:38:39 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right, we got a motion from Mr. Suarez.
10:38:41 Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.
10:38:43 Any further discussion on the motion?
10:38:45 All in favor of the motion say aye.
10:38:48 Any opposed?
10:38:55 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
10:38:56 As you mentioned before, Kelsey Trujeque's name is on here
10:39:00 from Rahenkamp Design Group.
10:39:03 She, according to the information we have in our agenda
10:39:08 packet, she's a landscape architect, and her current term
10:39:14 expires October 31, 2015.
10:39:18 >> 2019.
10:39:19 >> It says here 2015.
10:39:23 It's what it says here.
10:39:24 >> Yes.
10:39:26 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So, yes, this is what the backup
10:39:31 material was.
10:39:32 So are we also voting to --
10:39:37 >>THE CLERK: No. Reappointed by council.
10:39:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So this backup material is wrong,
10:39:42 period.
10:39:42 >>THE CLERK: (Off microphone.) What I have is it shows --
10:39:52 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Moving right along.
10:39:54 Thank you for that clarification.
10:39:56 And Mr. Suarez and I need to go to the copy machine.
10:40:02 Anything else, madam clerk?
10:40:04 >> We already did it?
10:40:12 >> He made the motion.
10:40:13 I seconded it and we didn't vote.
10:40:18 >>FRANK REDDICK: Well, all those in favor of the motion say
10:40:20 aye.
10:40:21 Opposed. Okay.
10:40:22 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: And as far as the alternate
10:40:25 position, Mr. Dingfelder for that.
10:40:29 >> That was part of the motion.
10:40:37 >>FRANK REDDICK: We go to item number 3.
10:40:48 >>SAL TERRITO: Legal department again.
10:40:50 Item number 3 you asked to move, the attachment spells out
10:40:57 the process.
10:41:00 The three issues that I spelled out in the memo which I will
10:41:02 just mention to you one more time, one of them is dealing
10:41:05 with contracts we have with SPP because we have a contract
10:41:13 that says they will receive 20% of the tax increment
10:41:15 financing collected downtown, and when we did that, the
10:41:18 legal description included the parcel which you now want to
10:41:21 move.
10:41:22 So in effect we would have to amend that agreement to change
10:41:25 the legal description that may or may not have a large
10:41:27 impact on the ability for us to pay them back in a timely
10:41:31 manner because if that property were to generate a large
10:41:35 tax, that tax would now be in Ybor rather than downtown,
10:41:38 which would give the city the requirement of paying that
10:41:41 back over a longer period of time because we simply wouldn't
10:41:43 have the money coming in as quickly as that.
10:41:46 Another issue dealing with is one that I can't answer at
10:41:49 this particular time, is what impact it would have on the
10:41:52 original baseline that we set up.
10:41:54 I can tell you most likely it would not have any impact.
10:41:57 This has been done in other locations.
10:42:00 But there has never been any litigation on it, has never
10:42:04 been any attorney generals opinions, and the concern we have
10:42:06 is one that if we are wrong that would mean that there's a
10:42:10 $7 million hit to the tax increment financing, not that the
10:42:14 city couldn't continue contributing to it, but could be use
10:42:18 that funding for long-term financing because the
10:42:21 contribution would be from property taxes, not from TIF.
10:42:25 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Territo, what's that $7 million that you
10:42:28 mentioned?
10:42:29 >> The city is putting in around $7 million a year in tax
10:42:32 increment financing.
10:42:33 >>MIKE SUAREZ: That's for what, the downtown?
10:42:37 >>SAL TERRITO: That's for the downtown CRA area.
10:42:39 And that is anticipated to grow over time.
10:42:43 So as a development comes in, the TIF would be get larger.
10:42:47 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Your statement is you don't know what that
10:42:53 particular gas site will do to that 7 million, even though
10:42:56 it doesn't seem like there's any litigation or other issues?
10:43:00 >>SAL TERRITO: Correct.
10:43:01 It's an open question that hasn't been answered and if I
10:43:04 give you an opinion that it's not going to be a hit and it
10:43:07 is a hit, it could have a $7 million, $8 million, $9
10:43:10 million hit to you, and that money could still be
10:43:12 contributed by the city, but at that that point that money
10:43:17 would no longer be tax increment financing, it would be
10:43:20 property taxes.
10:43:22 Property taxes for long-term financing for more than one
10:43:25 year requires you to go to a voter referendum.
10:43:29 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.
10:43:31 >>FRANK REDDICK: We can also request -- because it seems
10:43:33 like you stated that you don't have an answer to some of the
10:43:38 questions.
10:43:38 We can also request an attorney general's opinion.
10:43:40 >>SAL TERRITO: That's correct.
10:43:42 That's what I suggested.
10:43:43 Because you have two issues.
10:43:44 We have an agreement right now with the county, an
10:43:47 interlocal agreement with the county.
10:43:49 Needing their permission to change boundaries.
10:43:51 So the first step would be are they okay with it?
10:43:55 In informal conversations we had were the counties they
10:43:57 didn't seem to have a problem moving that property from
10:43:59 downtown to Ybor.
10:44:01 But that's just an -- they have to actually go back and
10:44:04 amend the downtown portion of the interlocal agreement, the
10:44:08 boundary, and to amend the Ybor City 2 portion to give it a
10:44:12 new boundary.
10:44:13 That would require the city, the CRA, and the county to make
10:44:19 that agreement formally for changing boundaries, assuming
10:44:23 that's done.
10:44:24 Assuming that SPP were okay with making that change we would
10:44:28 have to go back and make if agreements that talks about how
10:44:30 much money we are going to contributes because we are
10:44:32 contributing from a larger piece in the original agreement
10:44:34 than we are contributing in the aftermath because they are
10:44:38 moving it out of the property.
10:44:39 That would require the city, the CRA, and SPP to agree to
10:44:46 that agreement, so we have these two agreements to get out
10:44:47 of the way first.
10:44:48 Those are the easy parts.
10:44:49 The hard part is getting the attorney general -- the hard
10:44:52 part is having a decision from the attorney general that
10:44:55 this should not be a problem.
10:44:59 >>: In that case then, I am going to make a motion that the
10:45:04 legal department draft a letter to the attorney general
10:45:10 within ten days, and that letter be reviewed by council's
10:45:15 attorney prior to the submission to the attorney general as
10:45:22 an opinion on all the unanswered questions, the reservation
10:45:26 you have to this request.
10:45:27 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion and second.
10:45:30 We'll have council discussion of the motion.
10:45:32 Councilman Montelione.
10:45:35 >> Thank you.
10:45:36 When we first discussed this, the last time we opened up the
10:45:42 CRA discussion with the county, it included more than just
10:45:48 boundaries.
10:45:49 It was, you know, what percent of the revenue would be of
10:45:55 those funds, and it did change from our original agreement.
10:46:00 If we change a boundary of an area, will that reopen the
10:46:06 discussion with the county to change the revenue sharing?
10:46:12 >>SAL TERRITO: That would reopen the entire agreement, not
10:46:15 just this portion of the agreement.
10:46:17 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So there is a possibilities that the
10:46:18 county could come back and ask for more revenue, and we
10:46:24 would have to have that -- and it would only be these two
10:46:31 CRAs, Ybor 2 and downtown.
10:46:38 I mean, it wouldn't be just the one CRA that would be open
10:46:42 for discussion and possible renegotiation with the county,
10:46:46 not just on the boundary line but on the revenue sharing,
10:46:48 but it would be both?
10:46:50 >>SAL TERRITO: Yes.
10:46:51 And right now that would not have any impact on downtown
10:46:54 because the county doesn't contribute to downtown except for
10:46:57 the portion downtown by the SPP project.
10:47:01 So there would be no impact on the county either way until
10:47:04 it gets moved into Ybor City.
10:47:06 And rights now that parcel would go to Ybor City 2 and they
10:47:09 have a 70% contribution.
10:47:10 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So it won't affect both.
10:47:15 The revenue sharing -- it would just go up.
10:47:19 >>SAL TERRITO: Financially it won't. Except for the fact
10:47:20 that whatever that project it generates in taxes would no
10:47:24 longer be available for downtown.
10:47:27 It would now be available in Ybor City.
10:47:28 And that would have an impact on the SPP project because the
10:47:32 city's agreement with them is 20% of the entire downtown
10:47:35 CRA.
10:47:35 And we would have to talk to them about are they okay with
10:47:38 changing the agreement we have with them?
10:47:41 Because if we did do that, we would have to change the maps
10:47:45 that were attached to that agreement to the smaller amounts
10:47:47 and that would mean we would have to extend our payment back
10:47:49 to them because you wouldn't have 20%, larger than 20% than
10:47:57 the smaller project.
10:47:58 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And reading your brief here, your memo,
10:48:10 It seems there is reluctance to do that because that would
10:48:13 increase the length of time that the city would be --
10:48:17 >>SAL TERRITO: In formal discussions they wanted to see
10:48:20 more of an impact, what the impact would actually be.
10:48:22 I know from the people who were in favor of this, a $12,000
10:48:29 hit.
10:48:30 Right now it's a $12,000 hit because that's all it's
10:48:33 generating.
10:48:33 If they put a larger development on that parcel that would
10:48:36 be a bigger hit downtown.
10:48:37 Not only would it not make the money available to SPP, it
10:48:40 would not make it to the other properties downtown as
10:48:43 welling that you may want to contributes to.
10:48:45 But that's really your decision, not mine.
10:48:46 I want to give you what the implications would be and it's
10:48:50 your decision to make whether you want to move forward.
10:48:52 One other issue is I don't know the administration's
10:48:55 position.
10:48:55 You will say why does that have an impact with CRA?
10:48:59 We can do what we want to do.
10:49:00 Well, I have to change the ordinances, because now the
10:49:04 ordinances have a different legal description, and that is
10:49:06 subject to the mayor's signing on that particular documents.
10:49:11 It's one more issue.
10:49:12 I'm not trying to make it harder than it is but I wants you
10:49:15 to go into this with your eyes open knowing the full impacts
10:49:18 of what it is that you are doing and then it's your decision
10:49:20 how to want to handle it.
10:49:22 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Territo.
10:49:26 I again with getting the attorney general's opinion but I
10:49:28 still don't know that we have enough information, the cost
10:49:31 estimates, the negotiation was SPP, and especially the refer
10:49:34 new sharing position with the county for Ybor 2 should we
10:49:39 move forward with it.
10:49:40 >>SAL TERRITO: And that would open it up if they wanted to
10:49:43 discuss the sharing or any other CRA areas because it's one
10:49:46 big document that addresses all of the CRA areas.
10:49:51 I don't have any indication that they want to make any other
10:49:53 changes, but that's certainly open to discuss that if they
10:49:56 wish to do so.
10:49:58 >> Thank you very much.
10:49:58 >>SAL TERRITO: You're welcome.
10:50:00 >>HARRY COHEN: Any other council members with questions on
10:50:02 the motion?
10:50:03 I just have one question for you, Mr. Territo.
10:50:05 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Territo, I know that SPP, what we
10:50:12 originally negotiated with the county, when you are talking
10:50:14 about that 20%, that's a 20% that we negotiated with the
10:50:18 county, because is it not true that our agreement with SPP
10:50:22 is that we are going to reimburse them for work that is
10:50:25 already being done and will be completed?
10:50:28 Is that correct?
10:50:30 Why is it that specific to the boundaries of the CRA?
10:50:36 >>SAL TERRITO: Because when we agreed with the county, and
10:50:38 with SPP, we put a legal description in there as part of the
10:50:41 agreement.
10:50:42 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And I just want to make sure.
10:50:46 The agreement between us and the county, which then SPP has
10:50:50 some role from that.
10:50:52 >>SAL TERRITO: We have an SPP agreement between the city,
10:50:55 the county and the CRA --
10:50:57 >> And the SPP agreement does say we have the boundaries of
10:51:01 the CRA?
10:51:04 >>SAL TERRITO: I want to -- bell, it's an attachment.
10:51:09 We are going to give you 20% of the attachment.
10:51:11 And the attachment includes the entire downtown CRA area.
10:51:14 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I just want to make sure, because there's a
10:51:17 lot of different ways to skin the cat in terms of that
10:51:20 because whatever we are going to produce under the
10:51:22 boundaries of a CRA, downtown CRA, you know, that's going to
10:51:28 happen one way or the other.
10:51:30 The attachment is part of that agreement.
10:51:32 I think we may be, you know, we need to really look at this
10:51:36 and how that's really going to affect it because it does
10:51:38 change how we look at it, definitely, if it has that
10:51:43 specificity in there.
10:51:45 So the other thing is that -- and I will make a friendly
10:51:49 amendment, chair, to your motion -- and I don't know -- and
10:51:51 I'll ask Mr. Territo first before I make the motion -- I
10:51:55 mean before I make the suggestion -- have you contacted and
10:51:57 dealt whenever the Florida redevelopment association?
10:52:00 >>SAL TERRITO: I have not.
10:52:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: You have not?
10:52:03 >> I have not.
10:52:04 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And I would suggest not only the legal
10:52:06 department contact the AG's office concerning an opinion --
10:52:10 but also to delve into the Florida Redevelopment Association
10:52:14 and some of the things that think they may have seen in the
10:52:16 past to get an answer.
10:52:18 I think it will be helpful because it may have been
10:52:20 something --
10:52:21 >>SAL TERRITO: I can tell you, I have background
10:52:23 information.
10:52:23 Two things.
10:52:24 This has been done before.
10:52:26 And it has no impact on the original baseline.
10:52:29 If the baseline was set in '83, removing that part is the
10:52:34 baseline stays the same.
10:52:36 It happened before in several locations so I know that has
10:52:38 been done before.
10:52:38 The only reluctance I have is that the only opinions that
10:52:41 count here are the ones you get from us that protect you,
10:52:44 and the AG -- and the AG -- if someone takes that to court
10:52:52 the AG is not even persuasive -- I feel much more
10:52:56 comfortable in at least having that as some support.
10:52:58 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I agree, and that's why I want the Florida
10:53:01 Redevelopment Association because not only do they know
10:53:02 about the things that have already been done but the things
10:53:04 that are proposed and their opinion as to the way it fits
10:53:09 into the redevelopment statute.
10:53:10 Not that you don't have expertise on it.
10:53:12 You absolutely do.
10:53:14 But it's always nice to have another opinion for someone
10:53:18 that does this all the time.
10:53:19 >>SAL TERRITO: And I have spoken with bond council, because
10:53:22 if we do any financing, they have to do it as well.
10:53:25 And they are the same way we are.
10:53:26 It's probably not going to be an issue.
10:53:28 But let's be careful.
10:53:30 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And my motion would be ask for response from
10:53:35 the Florida Redevelopment Association.
10:53:37 >>HARRY COHEN: Okay.
10:53:38 So it's indicated that both the maker and the seconder of
10:53:43 the motion accept the friendly amendment.
10:53:47 Before we vote on it if there are no other council members
10:53:49 that wants to say anything, I just want to ask you one
10:53:52 question, and that is, how long generally does it take to
10:53:54 get the attorney general's opinion back?
10:53:57 >>SAL TERRITO: It could be a week.
10:53:58 It could be months.
10:53:59 There is no real answer to that.
10:54:01 It could take a very long time and sometimes a short time.
10:54:05 This is not a difficult question.
10:54:07 I know they are going to come back and say there's nothing
10:54:09 in the statute.
10:54:10 I'm not even sure they are going to come to a conclusion.
10:54:12 >>HARRY COHEN: My sense for having opinions before is this
10:54:19 will come back relatively quickly.
10:54:20 So I was going to suggest to you that we continue to
10:54:22 research some of these other questions simultaneously while
10:54:25 the opinion is being asked for.
10:54:27 And if no one else has anything else to say, all those in
10:54:31 favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
10:54:33 Opposed?
10:54:34 All right.
10:54:41 >>FRANK REDDICK: We move to item number 4.
10:54:43 >> Everything good morning.
10:54:51 City of Tampa Police Department, Chief Ward.
10:54:56 Item number 4.
10:55:01 Quarterly report.
10:55:15 These are the comparisons of the last of 2014 and the 2015.
10:56:13 >> Okay.
10:56:13 >> The chart compares the first, second and third quarter.
10:56:30 Total of bike stops.
10:56:31 >>HARRY COHEN: So just saying, it looks as though you are
10:56:37 basically stopping the same number of people but issuing far
10:56:39 fewer citations.
10:56:43 Is that correct?
10:56:45 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: That's correct.
10:56:46 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Can be you give the different types of
10:56:53 citations, the general citation that you are giving
10:56:57 specifically when you have a stop and then have a citation?
10:57:02 What would be the number of citations, what type of
10:57:06 citations?
10:57:06 >> Number of stops?
10:57:08 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Is it just a traffic citation of some sort?
10:57:11 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: More than likely the citation itself is
10:57:15 because of some type of bicycle infraction.
10:57:19 >>MIKE SUAREZ: A safety violation?
10:57:20 >> Right.
10:57:25 >>MIKE SUAREZ: It's a pretty significant difference between
10:57:32 what it was previously to what it is now.
10:57:33 And I think one of your graphics, the first graphic that you
10:57:36 have, I think you had a pretty significant drop, probably
10:57:39 more than half.
10:57:43 So what do you attribute that to?
10:57:48 You have done a more aggressive education of the officers
10:57:53 that are out there policing?
10:57:55 Or what contributes to that?
10:58:00 >> I think expressing my concerns and having the officer
10:58:03 understand education first before the citation was the key.
10:58:05 And a lot of the officers have gone into the philosophy of
10:58:11 educating first before that citation is issued, and that's
10:58:18 proven in these charts here.
10:58:20 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Do you know how many arrests came out of
10:58:22 these stops?
10:58:26 I apologize.
10:58:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, chief.
10:58:31 Chief, on these items that you just showed us regarding the
10:58:34 stops, you said they are primarily stops for traffic
10:58:37 infractions, correct?
10:58:39 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Correct.
10:58:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have you seen one or two or many that
10:58:44 are the second or third time offenders in the same group
10:58:48 that whatever reason?
10:58:52 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: What I am seeing is when the education
10:58:55 doesn't work, then those individuals get citations.
10:58:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know you offered lights to some bikes
10:59:02 that didn't see them that should have them because you can't
10:59:04 see them at night.
10:59:05 It's very difficult to have been see that.
10:59:06 So I assume you have that program still ongoing?
10:59:10 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Absolutely.
10:59:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:59:19 Getting to citations, this is a three-month comparison.
10:59:28 That's the total number of bike citations issued.
10:59:42 Looking at the same time last year -- there's not much of a
10:59:48 difference.
11:00:08 (Baby calling out.)
11:00:10 >>FRANK REDDICK: The baby agrees with that.
11:00:12 >> Total citations by quarter. First, second and third,
11:00:16 comparing the three.
11:00:33 This is the total before arrests from bike stops in the last
11:00:56 quarter compared to the first and second quarter.
11:00:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: When they are arrested, what are they
11:01:03 charged with?
11:01:04 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: The last quarter, this is a breakdown of
11:01:20 that, 65 for the quarter.
11:01:37 >>FRANK REDDICK: When you say assist O/J, what does O/J
11:01:43 stand for?
11:01:43 >> If we stop somebody that they come out of Tampa. Come
11:01:56 out of Pinellas, somewhere else.
11:01:57 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
11:02:02 So there were 65 people that were arrested as a result of a
11:02:09 bike stop.
11:02:12 And the top 3 or the third one is possession of a controlled
11:02:18 substance.
11:02:20 So we are speaking a little later --
11:02:25 >> Let me just clarify.
11:02:27 That's felonies.
11:02:29 That's misdemeanor.
11:02:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: That's 7.
11:02:35 So top 5 instead of top 3.
11:02:40 So the other question I have is carry concealed firearm.
11:02:47 I'm assuming that is someone who doesn't have a permit to
11:02:51 carry a firearm?
11:02:53 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Right.
11:02:54 >>LISA MONTELIONE: All right.
11:02:59 Thank you very much, chief.
11:03:21 >> The next, the green bar, bike stops, arrests, also
11:03:32 traffic stops and all others, different categories.
11:03:44 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Chief, these are stops separated by all
11:03:47 other traffic stops and bike stops.
11:03:50 So for all the bike stops, for the third quarter we had
11:03:56 three arrests for I guess it would be using firearms, is my
11:04:01 guess?
11:04:04 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Whether it led to an arrest or not.
11:04:07 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So we will seize the firearms whether we
11:04:10 arrest them?
11:04:11 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Well, let's say we stopped them on a
11:04:16 bike, and we recover the firearm and not the person.
11:04:24 >> And the same thing when you are looking at the traffic
11:04:26 stop, someone that might have a weapon, typically if they
11:04:29 got probable cause to stop them, you will ask them if they
11:04:32 have got any weapons, sometimes they say yes, sometimes they
11:04:35 say no, but eventually you might investigate and find a
11:04:38 weapon in there?
11:04:39 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Absolutely.
11:04:41 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Do you find this unusual that number in
11:04:44 terms of number of, you know, weapons that you find on
11:04:47 somebody that might be part of a bicycle stop as opposed to
11:04:52 something that's unusual, or something that's normal, such
11:04:55 as the case of your experience?
11:04:59 >> CHIEF ERIC WARD: No.
11:05:00 Most of our street level robberies, the suspect is on a
11:05:04 bike.
11:05:04 So that's not unusual.
11:05:05 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
11:05:09 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any other questions of the chief?
11:05:17 Chief, let me suggest -- and I don't know if -- don't know
11:05:22 if I have to do this in the form of a formal motion, but
11:05:25 since you have given a report seeing these results change,
11:05:31 so that means attention has been drawn to this issue.
11:05:35 I feel comfortable enough to suggest that instead of
11:05:39 quarterly reports that we get a biannual report, just come
11:05:43 to us twice a year with a biannual report. I feel
11:05:46 comfortable enough to do that.
11:05:48 >> I would second that.
11:05:49 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion and a second to change from
11:05:52 a quarterly report to a bibiannual report on this item. If
11:05:56 there's no discussion please indicate by saying aye.
11:05:59 Opposed?
11:05:59 >>FRANK REDDICK: Anything else, Cleve?
11:06:05 CHIEF ERIC WARD: No, sir.
11:06:06 >>FRANK REDDICK: Don't go too far.
11:06:08 Item number 5.
11:06:19 >> He was supposed to come up but I guess he had another
11:06:41 meeting.
11:06:43 Item number 5.
11:06:43 >> Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Martin Shelby, City Council
11:06:52 attorney to discuss with you item number 5.
11:06:56 And let me begin by saying that the report that I was
11:07:01 preparing to give you was very different 24 hours ago than
11:07:09 what it is now, and the reason being that I was informed
11:07:12 yesterday afternoon that yesterday morning, the Board of
11:07:16 County Commissioners took up the issue of sexual predators
11:07:22 and child safe zone and protective radius.
11:07:26 And it was a motion initially based on the agenda by
11:07:31 Commissioner Murman.
11:07:33 That being said, I had the opportunities to review the
11:07:37 replay of the broadcast.
11:07:39 I saw it last night and again this morning.
11:07:41 And frankly, council, I believe it would change my
11:07:46 recommendation to you before going further with a city
11:07:52 ordinance.
11:07:54 That being said, let me tell you that it was my intention to
11:07:57 come in here to inform you that with the whole many issues
11:08:03 that have to be discussed and vetted to be able to implement
11:08:07 what council asked for, I have had substantial work -- I
11:08:13 have done substantial work in preparation for that.
11:08:16 More work needs to be done.
11:08:20 In order for me to bring you back a decision point.
11:08:23 But that being said, council, I was struck yesterday by the
11:08:30 very clear, resounding support presented by the Board of
11:08:36 County Commissioners by unanimous vote of 7 to 0 to move
11:08:43 forward with expanding the ordinance.
11:08:50 Actually, the way the county attorney placed it, to go along
11:08:57 with what presently exists.
11:08:59 For newly registered sex offenders, that would bar sex
11:09:03 offenders that would be sex offenders whose victims who are
11:09:05 younger than 16 from living within 2500 feet of a child care
11:09:09 facility, library, playground, park or school in
11:09:13 Hillsborough County.
11:09:15 Now, I have the county's existing ordinance here, and
11:09:21 Commissioner Hagan did go into, in some detail, the history
11:09:25 of the fact that in 2008, when he was obviously on the Board
11:09:30 of County Commissioners, the county commission created the
11:09:33 child safe -- actually, the child sex crime prevention
11:09:37 ordinance creating safe zones, which was similar to what
11:09:40 Councilman Suarez had asked for in his motion.
11:09:43 The existing county ordinance as it is now is narrow in
11:09:49 scope to where it applies.
11:09:50 It doesn't really apply to city buildings.
11:09:53 But I can read you the list of where it does apply.
11:09:55 It's currently listed within 300 feet.
11:09:58 But it's an ordinance that's been on the books for going on
11:10:04 since 2008.
11:10:05 Much as the section that deals with the -- the term, I'm
11:10:14 sorry -- the anti-clustering provision.
11:10:23 There are certain hurdles that obviously, with an ordinance
11:10:26 in the city, you would have to pass in order to be able to
11:10:31 enact a city ordinance.
11:10:33 In 2007, that process had begun before the county came in
11:10:38 with their ordinance and the city decided to go along with
11:10:40 the county.
11:10:49 Just to make the point, specifically, the county ordinance
11:10:52 that's on the books presently, section 36-311, says unless
11:10:57 there lab an municipal ordinance duly enacted to the
11:11:01 contrary this provision shall be uniformly enforced
11:11:04 throughout Hillsborough County by all state and local
11:11:10 enforcement agencies and code enforcement agencies.
11:11:13 And an exception and a penalty that goes under what the
11:11:16 county may do in regard to this.
11:11:20 But the point that I would like to make to you, I was struck
11:11:27 when I heard the county commission support for the existing
11:11:31 ordinance, even to the point where there was discussion
11:11:36 about existing -- well, enhancing the existing
11:11:41 anti-clustering provision.
11:11:46 Commissioner asked the county attorney in fact whether it
11:11:50 could be expanded to single-family and maybe based on
11:11:52 density.
11:11:53 So I will share with you that -- I have 30 more seconds --
11:11:59 my impression is, council, that I think there was a clear
11:12:07 declaration bits Board of County Commissioners yesterday in
11:12:11 support of the existing ordinance and its desire to expand
11:12:14 it, and its desire for all residents of Hillsborough County.
11:12:22 So on that basis, council, it's my recommendation -- and it
11:12:25 doesn't have to be a long time to puts this up because I
11:12:27 know time is of essence for a lot of members of the
11:12:30 communities -- for the legal department of the city to work
11:12:33 with the county attorney and for TPD to work together with
11:12:37 the sheriff's office who, by the way, does not have a
11:12:40 representative there yesterday at the Board of County
11:12:42 Commissioners.
11:12:44 That absence was noted by the BOCC.
11:12:47 And it was advised that obviously the sheriff's office has
11:12:51 an integral role to play and will have to be very involved
11:12:54 in this.
11:12:55 So my suggestion would be to engage --
11:13:00 >>LISA MONTELIONE: As we understand, Mr. Shelby -- I have a
11:13:02 question before you repeated the same thing like three
11:13:07 times.
11:13:11 So I did not get the BOCC's proceedings but I did read an
11:13:17 article that was published about the meeting, and although
11:13:22 it was a 7-0 vote, two commissioners were not generally in
11:13:28 favor, you know, jumping on board with this.
11:13:34 The newspaper report mentioned Commissioner Hagan and his
11:13:43 concern, and also mentions Commissioner White's concern.
11:13:49 They ultimately voted in concert with their fellow members,
11:13:53 but I think there's going to be probably a little more
11:13:57 discussion when it comes back.
11:13:59 My concern -- and would you put this on the Elmo for me?
11:14:06 My concern is that although, you know, we are trying to do
11:14:14 right by some of our citizens, people who have committed
11:14:21 crimes have paid their dues to society by being incarcerated
11:14:28 or released, and to make the assumption that all of these
11:14:33 individuals are going to be repeat offenders is really not a
11:14:37 fair generalization.
11:14:43 That shows my house.
11:14:45 As you can see my aide circled right there, and within a
11:14:50 five mile radius from my house.
11:14:52 So you see it extends all the way out past 75 there to the
11:14:58 east.
11:15:02 And there are 600, I think -- you can't see right there --
11:15:06 it's 630 sexual offenders, sexual predators living in the
11:15:11 area.
11:15:14 I have been in my house or in the area between my current
11:15:18 home now.
11:15:18 I had a few other residences when I first moved to Florida
11:15:22 in Temple Terrace for 30-some-odd years, and served as
11:15:28 president or civic association on the board and so on, or
11:15:32 president of the Junior Women's Club in Temple Terrace.
11:15:35 And to my knowledge, my experience, just anecdotally, we
11:15:39 have not had a problem with any of these sexual offenders
11:15:46 beyond one particular operation that was housing sexual
11:15:55 predators, and that was dealt with by the Tampa Police
11:15:58 Department and taken care of.
11:16:01 It took a number of years but they did take care of it.
11:16:04 So I would be -- piggybacking to my social education, I
11:16:15 would be hard pressed to put another barrier on individuals
11:16:21 that are already complying with the terms of their release
11:16:27 from prison.
11:16:29 Our problem just becomes somebody else's problem.
11:16:33 So if we follow Hillsborough County's ordinance, and have
11:16:39 2500 feet from a school, daycare, playground, whatever, all
11:16:43 of these people will have to move.
11:16:48 Where are they going to go?
11:16:50 So Pasco County passes an ordinance that these individuals
11:16:59 are harming their citizens, not even considering that these
11:17:04 individuals are their citizens.
11:17:05 So they move, say, to Hillsborough County.
11:17:10 Hillsborough County passes an ordinance.
11:17:11 Then what?
11:17:12 They move to Pinellas County, and they move to Hernando
11:17:15 county, they move to Orange County?
11:17:17 I mean, sexual predators when they are released from prison
11:17:23 from the State of Florida, I don't know what these
11:17:27 particular people are going to do.
11:17:28 And I asked Chief Ward maybe when this discussion comes back
11:17:33 to us -- I have a feeling it will come back to us -- that I
11:17:39 narrow down the sample, it becomes a little closer than five
11:17:43 miles, and we check maybe randomly some of the individuals
11:17:47 and see if they are repeat offenders.
11:17:50 But I have a concern with going with what the county's
11:17:55 ordinance is.
11:17:56 I think that is a little bit of an overreach.
11:18:05 I don't want anyone else to be harmed.
11:18:07 But I also want the right of these individuals to be
11:18:09 considered as well.
11:18:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
11:18:12 Mr. Shelby, I am going to ask specific questions about the
11:18:15 county ordinance and some things that are part of our
11:18:18 motion.
11:18:20 One, there was a lot of discussion earlier yesterday during
11:18:24 the BOCC meeting concerning 2500-foot demarcation point.
11:18:31 Can you explain what it is that we are talking about that it
11:18:36 wasn't as clear as I would like it to be?
11:18:38 Is it that right now the ordinance says only 2500 feet from
11:18:43 schools, playgrounds ands other places where children may be
11:18:47 congregating?
11:18:50 >>MARTIN SHELBY: No, if I am correct, I believe what it
11:18:52 refers to is presently they operate under the state statute
11:18:57 which is 1,000 feet.
11:18:58 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So right now their ordinance mirrors
11:19:02 whatever the state statute is currently?
11:19:04 >> That's correct.
11:19:07 >> So if we wanted to -- and this is not necessarily what I
11:19:10 am going to suggest but if we wanted to, we could make it
11:19:13 more stringent than the thousand feet, correct?
11:19:15 So we are not preempted from that, is that correct?
11:19:17 >> That's correct.
11:19:17 >> And then the next question is that the ordinance that we
11:19:22 were talking about, the 2008 ordinance, it not only has the
11:19:27 anti-clustering portion, is that correct?
11:19:30 But it's a broader ordinance or not?
11:19:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, it is.
11:19:35 It's an anti-clustering provision, but it also has areas of
11:19:40 300 feet from safe zones, that allows to travel across, to
11:19:44 and from.
11:19:45 But typically, there are less places than what the motion
11:19:52 calls for.
11:19:53 It says, for instance, certain locations, not limited to
11:19:58 public and private schools, Boys and Girls Clubs, libraries,
11:20:02 parks, youth sports facilities, playgrounds, YMCA
11:20:07 facilities, and it is also -- let's see, safety zones,
11:20:16 daycare centers, places where children are likely to be.
11:20:21 What the motion for council was with regard to city
11:20:23 buildings.
11:20:24 I should also point out just very quickly because it's very
11:20:27 important with regard to the predicate.
11:20:29 Council has to have a factual predicate, has to have basing,
11:20:33 and that includes mapping.
11:20:34 Part of the direction of the county commission to their
11:20:36 staff was to begin that process of the mapping and the like.
11:20:40 If the city wants to go off on its own, you would have to
11:20:43 have the time to be able to prepare all these documents and
11:20:46 gets all these studies and be able to have a factual
11:20:49 predicate before a change to your ordinance.
11:20:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Our own ordinance.
11:20:58 Another thing is part of what my decision to the original
11:21:04 motion was that those safe places, as an example, one place
11:21:10 in particular, is advertised, for runaways and other kids,
11:21:19 that is a corporate decision so people can be considered
11:21:21 safe if they go there, you know, if we were able to do that
11:21:26 at a private entity to be identified to, because they have
11:21:29 already made that determination.
11:21:31 That's something that we can put in the ordinance in
11:21:33 addition, correct are?
11:21:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe you have to have a factual basis
11:21:36 to be able to support that, and I believe you also have to
11:21:39 be able to provide --
11:21:42 >> The factual basis what, sir?
11:21:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Saying that there's a greater risk for
11:21:48 children --
11:21:54 >>MIKE SUAREZ: There is not a -- designated safe area that
11:21:59 are they would be --
11:22:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: My --
11:22:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ: The answer to my --
11:22:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: My research has not indicated specifically
11:22:08 what you are asking for.
11:22:09 It doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
11:22:11 It means I haven't gotten to that point yet.
11:22:13 >>MIKE SUAREZ: One last thing on the county ordinance.
11:22:16 The designation between sexual offenders and sexual
11:22:19 predators in terms of the definition of who they are trying
11:22:22 to keep away from these particular areas, because there is a
11:22:29 distinct difference between the two in state law, and in
11:22:32 terms of -- by those folks that are designated as predators
11:22:40 as opposed to offenders.
11:22:42 So it does have a distinction.
11:22:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: They would make a distinction of predatory
11:22:49 individuals.
11:22:50 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So the distinction already is for predatory
11:22:52 individuals, not necessarily all sexual offenders.
11:22:56 The reason that I ask is because Ms. Montelione put on top
11:23:01 of the map on there and it is all sexual offenders, and it's
11:23:04 hard because some of these sexual predators are here, some
11:23:08 part of that, and that's no one's faults other than that's
11:23:11 how the map was.
11:23:15 There's still a lot that are obviously hidden underneath it.
11:23:18 It's a wide radius.
11:23:19 So for me, the immediate dangers are the sexual predators,
11:23:25 when we start talking about how do we deal with W this
11:23:28 particular issue.
11:23:29 You know, I agree that right now, the ordinance seems to fit
11:23:33 into what the spirit of our discussion was previously.
11:23:37 And what we'll do, I think, is ask our chief that, you know,
11:23:44 to enforce what is already on the books, as long as the
11:23:47 legal department doesn't have any problems with what that
11:23:52 ordinance says.
11:23:53 Obviously it's been other books for a long time and we have
11:23:55 not done a very good job of actually enforcing that
11:23:59 ordinance.
11:23:59 So I think that's the first step.
11:24:01 But I would like to say that I would like to hold out the
11:24:05 fact that is correct we may need to clean up what the
11:24:07 ordinance says based on the fact that we haven't even
11:24:10 enforced it yet so we don't even know what some of the
11:24:13 problems are.
11:24:14 So Mr. Shelby, I appreciate it.
11:24:16 I think again, the discussion that was done yesterday at the
11:24:19 county commission is great, but I still think that they are
11:24:23 in the same boat we are in, in terms of the enforcement of
11:24:27 it.
11:24:27 They have other issues such as Commissioner White brought up
11:24:31 some issues concerning rural areas and whether single-family
11:24:36 homes will be included.
11:24:37 That's I think important issues to discuss.
11:24:38 But I think right now we need to talk about enforcement
11:24:41 especially since it's got the 300-foot designation.
11:24:44 To me, that gives me a little bit more confidence that it is
11:24:49 something that will help with the problem that is specific
11:24:53 to VM Ybor currently and for other neighborhoods throughout
11:24:58 the city.
11:24:58 Thank you, chair.
11:24:59 I appreciate it.
11:25:00 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Cohen.
11:25:01 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much.
11:25:04 Based on the concerns and comments that the council members
11:25:08 have made and based on what you said and based on also
11:25:11 watching the discussion of the board yesterday, my view is
11:25:14 that they are going to pass something, and as we all know,
11:25:19 we are, in the absence of something that contradicts it, we
11:25:22 are bound by what they pass.
11:25:24 My suggestion is that we wait to see what it is that they
11:25:27 ultimately come up with.
11:25:29 We know that the provisions might change subtly between now
11:25:34 and when they finally vote on it.
11:25:36 And if there are specific items that we want to address in
11:25:39 addition, we take it up after their ordinance is passed and
11:25:42 we keep whatever we do very narrow so that we can
11:25:47 incorporate this broadly as possible, their ordinance, and
11:25:51 if there are going to be tweaks, about very, very distinct
11:25:59 issues.
11:26:04 We can address that very narrowly without changing the broad
11:26:07 confines of the ordinance down the.
11:26:09 So really, you know, I am generally in support of keeping an
11:26:14 eye on this for a little while.
11:26:16 It doesn't seem to me like it's going to take them very long
11:26:19 to come to a conclusion about where they are going to go.
11:26:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I can just address something.
11:26:25 >>FRANK REDDICK: Make it brief.
11:26:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I will.
11:26:30 With regard to anti-clustering, that is already on the
11:26:34 books.
11:26:36 That is actually going to be -- I don't think that is looked
11:26:38 at to be really tough but for the fact that it is necessary
11:26:45 for the city TPD and the legal department to get assurance
11:26:50 from the county that the county is behind that ordinance.
11:26:54 There was nothing said yesterday that would give me any
11:26:56 indication that it wasn't.
11:26:57 But in order for the chief and for the legal department and
11:27:01 Mike Schmitt is here to discuss it, has met with the county
11:27:04 attorney, and there are concerns with being able to enforce
11:27:07 the county's anti-clustering.
11:27:10 The advantage to enforcing the county, you have heard from
11:27:12 the public, is that it's been on the books since 2008.
11:27:17 If you passed your own ordinance, those would be
11:27:20 grandfathered in.
11:27:22 There would be moving registered sex offenders and that's a
11:27:27 major difference.
11:27:28 >>: Let me say this because we need to move this along.
11:27:32 Mr. Cohen is absolutely right.
11:27:35 In the discussion, had a chance to see the tape of the
11:27:39 county discussing it yesterday.
11:27:41 They are coming back with an ordinance.
11:27:45 I mean, a unanimous vote to bring an ordinance back and have
11:27:49 open discussion about this.
11:27:51 The biggest issue, the reason why I even brought this issue
11:27:57 up before is because enforcement.
11:28:02 I mean, we had a young lady here this morning.
11:28:04 The problem we are everything, these people everybody forced
11:28:07 out of other cities and they are coming here, and you see
11:28:13 them over there in VM Ybor.
11:28:17 So there's no enforcement behind it.
11:28:23 Now, the county has an ordinance in place, even though they
11:28:26 are trying to expand, but the county is not enforcing it.
11:28:32 And the Sheriff's Department is not enforcing it.
11:28:36 The city police department is not enforcing it.
11:28:39 The county ordinance.
11:28:41 We are trying to get to the point -- and this is what I have
11:28:45 been saying -- if we can enforce this issue, with
11:28:50 enforcement, we'll solve a lot of these problems.
11:28:54 And Mr. Cohen, I'm waiting to see what happens with the
11:29:01 county because the county is coming back with an ordinance.
11:29:04 It might be one or two votes that might be different, but
11:29:07 it's going to be a 5-2 or 7-0 vote for a new ordinance.
11:29:11 That's obvious.
11:29:14 And this will be coming back in a short time.
11:29:18 It's not going to be six months, ten months down the road.
11:29:21 It's going to be in a few weeks.
11:29:23 They are coming back with this ordinance, draft ordinance,
11:29:27 for the board to review and approve.
11:29:31 So I'm willing to be patient and see what they have, because
11:29:42 we can support their ordinance, and just say let's enforce
11:29:45 it, I support that.
11:29:47 And that's what my position is.
11:29:51 Let's see what the county comes up with.
11:29:53 And as you say, we want to do all the mapping, do all these
11:29:56 other things, and it might be better for us to see if the
11:30:01 county comes back and move from there.
11:30:03 All right.
11:30:04 Final comments.
11:30:04 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Final comment.
11:30:07 You know, it just puzzles why the county or we are
11:30:14 considering passing another's ordinance.
11:30:16 Why don't we just enforce the one we have now?
11:30:20 And -- no, but it's also, you know, where if we are going to
11:30:29 move forward with some other kind of ordinance, speaking to
11:30:32 what you said, Mr. Cohen, the county's ordinance in a very
11:30:35 narrow way, bringing something back.
11:30:36 So we are talking about another ordinance.
11:30:38 But I don't even see why this needs to be a discussion
11:30:43 whether here or at the county.
11:30:45 All we need to do is enforce what we have now instead of
11:30:48 making it more restrictive.
11:30:50 But that was final comment.
11:30:53 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any other final comments?
11:30:54 Any other final comments ever? Any last comments?
11:30:58 We need to move on.
11:30:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, thank you.
11:31:01 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right, thank you.
11:31:05 So the position of this council is we are going to sit
11:31:07 patiently to see what the county is going to come back with.
11:31:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And let the chief know we wants to enforce
11:31:16 the currents ordinance.
11:31:16 >>FRANK REDDICK:Mr. Miranda.
11:31:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We have TPD watching this.
11:31:26 I was doing work in the office of what was going on.
11:31:29 And no legislative body can certainly pass all the laws they
11:31:32 want.
11:31:34 But the enforcement part, if it's not enforced, or tried to
11:31:38 be enforced, there's no sense of writing that law or any
11:31:41 other law.
11:31:41 And I'm not blaming no one.
11:31:43 But it goes back to a lot of other laws.
11:31:46 I don't want to get into that right now.
11:31:48 But we lack enforcement.
11:31:51 That's all.
11:31:51 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right.
11:31:55 We move to item number 6.
11:31:57 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: What we have today is what we would like
11:32:13 council to consider as a draft.
11:32:14 I also brought with me Kirby Rainsberger.
11:32:19 He's going to address questions right now reference to the
11:32:22 draft.
11:32:29 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Legal department.
11:32:29 >>HARRY COHEN: Mr. Rainesberger, just for the public and
11:32:36 for everyone that's watching this, you have presented to us
11:32:41 a draft ordinance of that we could set for first reading at
11:32:45 some point in the near future if we are so inclined.
11:32:48 Basically, outlining decriminalization of small amounts of
11:32:55 marijuana for adults.
11:32:57 Would you just tell us basically what the provisions are of
11:33:00 the ordinance, and what it is that's being proposed?
11:33:03 >> The statutory misdemeanor amount of marijuana is 20
11:33:10 grams or less.
11:33:11 So we started with that amount.
11:33:15 Instead of making that a misdemeanor criminal offense, the
11:33:22 civil citations program, made it a class 1 civil violation.
11:33:28 The penalty for first offense is $75 under the existing
11:33:31 structure.
11:33:31 (Baby crying.)
11:33:33 That would be handled internally by the legal department,
11:33:38 means the citation would be handled by the legal department
11:33:41 in terms of receipt of the fine amounts. If that is not
11:33:45 paid within 30 days, a citation is sent over to the county
11:33:50 court's office for adjudication in front of the county court
11:33:55 judge.
11:33:55 It would remain a civil violation, not a criminal violation,
11:34:01 would end up in front of the county court judge for a
11:34:05 citation as well.
11:34:07 >>HARRY COHEN: Just to be clear for everyone's benefit,
11:34:09 this is only for adults.
11:34:10 Juveniles go through an entirely separate system when they
11:34:14 are apprehended with controlled substances?
11:34:20 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: There is, under similar construction at
11:34:23 the moment, a system to put juveniles under a parallel
11:34:28 system that involves modifying a treatment program.
11:34:34 And that would be the primary difference between the two.
11:34:38 >>HARRY COHEN: And that's what exists currently so we are
11:34:40 not even talking about affecting that in any way?
11:34:45 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: The juvenile system aspect to marijuana
11:34:49 does not even exist in this county at the moment.
11:34:51 It's something we would add to a system that exists for
11:34:54 other crimes to be committed by juveniles, but marijuana is
11:35:00 not among them.
11:35:01 >>HARRY COHEN: But my point is what we are discussing today
11:35:03 is strictly limited to adults?
11:35:07 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Yes.
11:35:07 >>HARRY COHEN: Yes.
11:35:09 Okay.
11:35:09 Thank you.
11:35:09 I just want to reserve a few minutes at the end of the
11:35:12 discussion after other council members have spoken.
11:35:13 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Miranda.
11:35:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: As I read this early this morning, real
11:35:27 early in the morning, the first 75, the third is 300, the
11:35:32 fourth is 450.
11:35:34 Am I correct?
11:35:34 >> Yes.
11:35:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And then how many can you have?
11:35:39 10 at 450, 100 at 450?
11:35:43 I don't know that.
11:35:44 It didn't say that.
11:35:46 From what I read.
11:35:46 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: This is not a get-out-of-jail-free card.
11:35:56 >> Well, everybody is a first time offender.
11:35:59 >> Exactly.
11:36:00 You have to have the discretion.
11:36:02 Somebody that's a repeat offender not to have govern through
11:36:04 the civil process but go the criminal route.
11:36:07 >>FRANK REDDICK: And believe me, I read this real early this
11:36:12 morning.
11:36:12 It said code enforcement and the legal department.
11:36:14 So are we prepared as a legal department to handle and keep
11:36:19 up with whether it's one or 1,000 or 10,000 or whatever it
11:36:23 is that you arrest on a yearly basis to make sure that those
11:36:26 records are kept up and processed and fines are collected
11:36:29 and so forth?
11:36:30 Is that what I read was correct?
11:36:32 It said code enforcement also, if I remember.
11:36:35 >> We are prepared to do that --
11:36:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It did say code enforcement, I think.
11:36:48 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Code enforcement is part of the program
11:36:50 that utilizes the citation form.
11:36:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And I think there's diversion from
11:36:56 adults.
11:36:57 I'll tell you why.
11:36:57 In October of 14, I was in a store and some individual --
11:37:01 and I read the police report on what happened to my car --
11:37:04 decided that he went around the car, opened the door,
11:37:11 passenger side, opened the glove compartment, and slashed
11:37:14 one of my tires.
11:37:14 He went in, made a purchase, all on tape.
11:37:20 Went back around, opened that passenger car, opened the
11:37:23 glove compartment and did the same thing to the front tire.
11:37:26 So that's two tires.
11:37:28 The car was sideways like a sinking ship. It was all on
11:37:33 tape.
11:37:33 The guy confessed.
11:37:34 What's bothering me about all this, that individual is a
11:37:39 flight nurse in a helicopter.
11:37:41 And he was slapped on the hand.
11:37:44 And pay restitution and whatever, and I told them they can
11:37:50 stick the restitution where they never find it.
11:37:52 Nothing happened to the guy.
11:37:53 A flight nurse on a helicopter.
11:37:56 To me, what we are going in society is, any day we can't fix
11:38:00 up we set a diversion project.
11:38:03 And I diversion, at the end of the day, really doesn't work
11:38:07 much because you can have repeat offenders.
11:38:11 You know when I was growing up my parents told me, don't do
11:38:13 this or don't do that.
11:38:14 If I did it I was on my own. My father gave me a dime when
11:38:20 I was 14 and said if you have a problem with somebody, call
11:38:24 somebody else when you get arrested.
11:38:26 That's been in my mind. But today you can do whatever you
11:38:28 want, and they say, well, you have got a little problem, or
11:38:31 she's got a little problem, and you do it 100 times, 10
11:38:34 times, two times, and believe me, I'm 100% for whatever use
11:38:39 it is for anybody, but nobody wants to challenge it.
11:38:43 Nobody wants to do, let's get them medicated, get somebody
11:38:47 to prescribe, go pick it up.
11:38:48 I don't know how to solve that problem.
11:38:54 But now we are saying, there's too many arrests happening.
11:38:57 So we have to do something.
11:38:59 And I agree with that.
11:39:00 But to just say that 20 grams, how do you know it's 20 grams
11:39:05 when you arrest somebody?
11:39:06 How do you know it's not 19 grams or 30 grams?
11:39:09 I'm just speaking.
11:39:10 You can answer all these.
11:39:11 You are much more prepared than I am.
11:39:13 I'm not an expert, you are.
11:39:15 And diversion.
11:39:21 There's got to be diversion for adults.
11:39:23 I don't discriminate in any fashion that I know of.
11:39:27 The distribution.
11:39:30 Are we going to have a certain area where they can buy it?
11:39:33 Do you grow it it?
11:39:33 Are you going to arrest the seller who says, hey, I'm only
11:39:36 complying with the law.
11:39:37 All he wants is 20 grams and I have 3,000 grams of 20 grams
11:39:42 each that I can sell legally.
11:39:43 You asked me to sell it, I'm selling it now.
11:39:48 And people are buying it.
11:39:53 It seems to be a very positive thing, everybody is happy.
11:39:56 And these are the things that I don't understand.
11:40:01 And what happens to those who are caught wholesaling it?
11:40:08 >> That's a felony.
11:40:11 They are not part of this program are in anyway, shape or
11:40:13 form.
11:40:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The buyer is not a felony, right?
11:40:19 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: If he's buying 20 grams or less, that's
11:40:21 correct.
11:40:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I see.
11:40:24 I understand.
11:40:24 So if you buy it and you get caught, that's the idea, get
11:40:27 caught.
11:40:28 Three times, four times, ten times.
11:40:30 You can use at thousand times and not gets caught, which is
11:40:32 fine.
11:40:33 But to have somebody say, you can't use it -- you can use it
11:40:38 but you can't sell it, either legalize it, criminalize it,
11:40:45 but don't politicize it.
11:40:47 This is all about politics.
11:40:51 Get it done right.
11:40:52 Either criminalize everybody or say you can do what you
11:40:56 want.
11:40:56 But I don't have the authority to do that.
11:40:58 That's Tallahassee or Washington.
11:41:02 Why are we not doing that?
11:41:04 I mean, states have it.
11:41:06 There's four states, I believe was stated earlier, everybody
11:41:09 is happy.
11:41:09 But at the end of the day it's not about having it or not
11:41:12 having it.
11:41:12 It's about those states making money.
11:41:16 That's what it's all about.
11:41:17 These what this whole country is based on.
11:41:19 Revenue.
11:41:20 More revenue, baby.
11:41:21 Let me have it.
11:41:22 That's why you hear all the problems.
11:41:24 $3 million.
11:41:26 It's all about money.
11:41:27 It ain't about gambling.
11:41:30 Gambling for profit for the state.
11:41:32 That's what it's about.
11:41:34 That's all I have got to say right now because I am out of
11:41:37 time.
11:41:38 Thanks.
11:41:38 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Suarez.
11:41:40 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
11:41:42 Let me ask specifics.
11:41:44 We are talking a little bit about diversion programs.
11:41:47 Diversion programs already exist, or either drug court, and
11:41:51 there are other diversion programs for other folks for
11:41:55 first-time offenders, depending on the type of crime it is.
11:41:59 Is that correct?
11:42:00 >> Yes, sir.
11:42:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So this is not going to preclude that or
11:42:04 change that in any way.
11:42:05 The civil citation itself is there just to make sure that we
11:42:10 are trying to not incarcerate as many people as we have been
11:42:16 incarcerating for small amounts of marijuana.
11:42:19 Is that correct?
11:42:21 That's the direction we have taken with this?
11:42:24 >> Correct.
11:42:24 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Correct.
11:42:26 So to me the idea is there.
11:42:28 We talked about this prior, the three of us, in terms of
11:42:32 what it means once you get arrested for the -- not arrested
11:42:36 but cited for the first amount of marijuana that you have.
11:42:41 If I recall correctly, chief, I asked did same question Mr.
11:42:44 Miranda just asked, which is how do you know you have 20
11:42:47 grams or less.
11:42:48 >> And you said there's going to be a scale there.
11:42:51 Guys have a scale.
11:42:52 They usually have scales with them, correct?
11:42:56 >>CHIEF ERIC WARD: Absolutely.
11:42:57 Part of our investigation.
11:42:59 >>MIKE SUAREZ: For example, they get someone, they weigh
11:43:01 it, it's 18 grams, they will write up a citation and gone
11:43:04 about it his way or her way and to pay that citation,
11:43:07 correct?
11:43:08 So if they do not pay the citation, that 30-day period,
11:43:12 which they have in order to do the citation -- I know what
11:43:16 it's like when you don't pay your traffic ticket after 30
11:43:19 days.
11:43:19 What happens with folks that have been cited after 30 days
11:43:23 and they haven't paid the first fine?
11:43:26 >> The citation is transferred to the clerk's office of the
11:43:29 county court where it ends up being assigned to a county
11:43:33 court judge who holds a hearing.
11:43:35 The person is notified and they can attend that hearing.
11:43:40 A judge may find them not guilty.
11:43:42 Obviously there is no fine or penalty attached to that.
11:43:47 A judge assigns them guilty and assesses appropriate fine
11:43:51 and court costs.
11:43:54 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So they get hit with court costs in addition
11:43:58 to the other fine.
11:44:00 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: The other penalty is the refusal or
11:44:03 failure oh to pay that fine results per the language of the
11:44:06 ordinance in them not being qualified to be under this
11:44:13 program in the event of a future arrest.
11:44:16 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So the smart thing to have been do is, let's
11:44:19 say I'm someone who doesn't use marijuana very much but I
11:44:22 have got a joint or couple of them from somebody that I
11:44:24 know, I get cited for it.
11:44:28 Smart thing is to pay the fine right away.
11:44:31 Or as fast as you can so that you don't get yourself into
11:44:33 the criminal system after that 30 day from the citation
11:44:38 point.
11:44:39 Correct?
11:44:41 >> Correct.
11:44:41 With the exception of the word criminal system.
11:44:43 It will remain a civil violation even though it's in front
11:44:47 of a county court judge.
11:44:48 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Okay, I apologize.
11:44:50 I know there's some distinction here that we are having to
11:44:53 wrestle with, which is we are used to the criminalization,
11:44:57 the possession of marijuana.
11:44:59 So now we are under decriminalization it's a totally
11:45:03 different tact that we have.
11:45:04 But there are penalties for people who are constants lip
11:45:06 getting caught and not paying their citation.
11:45:08 Correct?
11:45:11 >> In the criminal context or the civil context?
11:45:14 >>MIKE SUAREZ: First in the civil and then the criminal if
11:45:16 you could give me that distinction.
11:45:19 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: In the criminal context, yes.
11:45:22 There are substantial penalties and eventually that will
11:45:25 catch up.
11:45:28 The problem, and other jurisdictions are experiencing this
11:45:30 with their civil citation programs, is the refusal to pay.
11:45:35 Those don't really have a down side.
11:45:39 We are not going to file a civil suit to recover $500, which
11:45:43 is why in our draft they don't get a second bite of that
11:45:49 apple.
11:45:49 They get one time and if they refuse to take advantage
11:45:53 before that lack of a criminal history record, the next time
11:46:01 they are arrested, the next time they are caught with
11:46:03 marijuana regardless of the amount, they could go through
11:46:08 the misdemeanor arrest process.
11:46:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Typically the reason why -- and based on our
11:46:13 conversation, to what my reading of the ordinance is, we are
11:46:18 really just trying to say, look, if you get caught with
11:46:21 something, pay your fine, go about your business, and even
11:46:26 if they get caught, a second time, let's same two or three
11:46:29 months after the first fine has been cited and paid, they
11:46:32 can be cited, paid again, and they can go about their
11:46:35 business.
11:46:35 Is that correct?
11:46:36 Without any of the criminal background.
11:46:40 Is that correct?
11:46:42 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Yes, sir.
11:46:42 Including a higher fine amount for subsequent violations.
11:46:46 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So if I get called a second time it's 150.
11:46:49 Am I correct? So the idea is that when you get caught, pay
11:46:53 your citation.
11:46:54 Don't do anything that you shouldn't do, which is not pay
11:46:58 it, put yourself in a position where you may be skirting
11:47:02 along to a criminal channel as opposed to a civil direction.
11:47:06 Is that correct?
11:47:08 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Right.
11:47:09 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
11:47:10 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mrs. Montelione.
11:47:11 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
11:47:13 I have a couple of questions about the construction of the
11:47:15 ordinance.
11:47:19 Your definition, cannabis is a definition, paraphernalia is
11:47:24 a definition.
11:47:25 And then paragraph C states that if you are charged with
11:47:32 possession of cannabis and receive -- we are assuming first
11:47:37 offense.
11:47:37 We'll just, as an example, you received a $75 fine.
11:47:41 It says, B, may not be charged with possession of
11:47:45 paraphernalia arising out of the same incident.
11:47:51 It doesn't say anywhere in the ordinance what the penalty is
11:47:58 for possessing paraphernalia.
11:48:00 >> That's accurate.
11:48:08 A problem with my writing of the ordinance.
11:48:09 But I believe it says and it was intended to say that if you
11:48:12 just have paraphernalia, which translated is frequently a
11:48:18 pipe, for example, a bong for smoking in it that has
11:48:22 marijuana residue in it, not enough for a field test but
11:48:27 perhaps not the green leafy substance that you can weigh it
11:48:32 independent of paraphernalia, a device for ingesting it.
11:48:36 So this ordinance would also make a civil violation out of
11:48:39 possession of the paraphernalia.
11:48:41 Frequently, those items are found together.
11:48:43 But the paraphernalia and green leaf --
11:48:48 >>LISA MONTELIONE: But on occasion they are not.
11:48:51 As you said on occasion it's just the paraphernalia that
11:48:54 somebody has with them.
11:48:57 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Right.
11:48:57 Which under Florida law is itself a misdemeanor so the
11:49:01 ordinance would also decriminalize the possession of the
11:49:04 mere paraphernalia.
11:49:07 >> So I think that needs to be called out specifically in
11:49:09 the ordinance.
11:49:10 And it doesn't seem to very clearly.
11:49:23 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Section C.
11:49:24 Any person honor possesses paraphernalia, except as
11:49:27 otherwise authorized by law, commits a violation of this
11:49:31 subsection.
11:49:32 Provided, however, that a person charged with possession of
11:49:34 cannabis under subsection B may not be charged with
11:49:38 possession of paraphernalia arising out of --
11:49:42 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Bu right, but they wouldn't be charged
11:49:44 twice.
11:49:44 >> Right.
11:49:46 >> I get that.
11:49:46 But to me it doesn't call out separately, if you only have
11:49:51 paraphernalia, it's also a $75 fine and it would follow the
11:49:56 same process as having the actual product.
11:50:01 It's just not clear.
11:50:06 It's not clear to me.
11:50:07 I'm sure it's not going to be clear to a lot of other
11:50:09 people.
11:50:11 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: I understand completely.
11:50:12 I'll take another look at that.
11:50:15 >> So maybe we can just have two paragraphs that isolate out
11:50:19 the concept so that it is very clear to the ordinary citizen
11:50:22 who is reading this.
11:50:24 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: I understand.
11:50:24 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
11:50:33 Then the other about the fines and if you don't pay the fine
11:50:36 and what happens thereafter earlier.
11:50:39 We were talking about bicycle citations, and when we heard
11:50:43 some of the testimony, when we were dealing with that issue,
11:50:46 we heard from some people who either didn't pay, you know,
11:50:51 their ticket, and then ended up having complications out of
11:50:57 not having paid their ticket.
11:51:01 I don't know how many individuals -- I don't recall from the
11:51:06 testimony where we had that hearing -- how many people ended
11:51:09 up having worse circumstances because they didn't pay the
11:51:17 ticket.
11:51:22 Are the tickets only payable by writing a check or giving a
11:51:25 credit card, by mail?
11:51:27 Tell me a little bit about the process of how the ticket is
11:51:30 paid.
11:51:31 If we want people to pay it right away, I want to make it as
11:51:34 easy as possible to pay that ticket and not have it be some,
11:51:40 you know, antiquated way of writing a check and putting it
11:51:44 in an envelope and sticking a stamp on it and sending snail
11:51:48 mail.
11:51:48 Hardly anybody does that anymore.
11:51:51 >> Part of the reason that we can do this without additional
11:51:53 personnel is that the process is essentially in existence.
11:52:00 It's the open container process.
11:52:02 That we have used now for a couple of years.
11:52:07 Civil citations for open containers.
11:52:11 >> What is that?
11:52:11 I have never had to pay an open container fine, sir.
11:52:21 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Basically it's written according to the
11:52:23 city attorney's office.
11:52:26 Personnel collects the fine.
11:52:28 People can walk in.
11:52:29 The address is on the citation.
11:52:31 People can mail in.
11:52:37 And there's a collection point for that.
11:52:40 And then records are kept as to whether or not that citation
11:52:42 is paid.
11:52:43 At the end of 30 days if than the citation is not paid it's
11:52:46 forwarded to the county.
11:52:47 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Can you pay the citation on our website?
11:52:49 I mean, you can pay your utility bill and I think you can
11:52:52 pay a parking ticket.
11:52:55 I know I pay my utility bills by going to the website.
11:52:58 I think I have to go to the website.
11:53:00 I think paying a parking ticket is also there.
11:53:03 And I am getting nodding heads.
11:53:06 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: From behind me, I hope.
11:53:08 (Laughter).
11:53:13 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: Have you paid an open container
11:53:14 citation?
11:53:15 >>LISA MONTELIONE: We can't ask that question, Mr.
11:53:18 Rainesberger.
11:53:19 >> We do pay things in that fashion, yes.
11:53:24 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So I would like to see this also be
11:53:28 available for payment on our website.
11:53:31 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: It will be.
11:53:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Great.
11:53:33 Thank you.
11:53:35 I think that's our customer process for people now senior to
11:53:39 just go to a website and make a payment on the website.
11:53:42 Thank you.
11:53:42 That's all the questions I have, sir.
11:53:45 >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.
11:53:47 I am going to let you close it out.
11:53:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I hope it's not under the open container
11:54:02 rule because open containers, in my opinion -- and not to
11:54:06 disrespect anyone here -- it's certainly not adhered to over
11:54:12 all parts of the city.
11:54:13 You can fine 10,000 people, between Himes and Dale Mabry,
11:54:19 and MLK and Tampa Bay Boulevard, in fact 10,000 of them in
11:54:26 one day.
11:54:29 How many get a ticket there?
11:54:30 Very few.
11:54:31 However, if you go somewhere else in the city, find one
11:54:38 dude, and bingo, he's arrested or she's arrested.
11:54:41 Again no offense to anyone here but I can prove everything I
11:54:44 say.
11:54:45 You can watch what happened.
11:54:47 Out can't have 200, 300 police officers taking care of
11:54:50 60,000 people.
11:54:51 They get stampeded.
11:54:53 They can't handle it.
11:54:54 So what bothers me the most is it's all about money.
11:55:00 If you really want to help society, if you really want to
11:55:03 help the young people, that had the choice of their parents
11:55:07 raising them, they had the choice of having the parents or
11:55:10 grandparents, the aunt, uncle, the police officers going to
11:55:13 parks talking about don't do this, don't do that, I can't
11:55:17 legislative choices.
11:55:18 The public here has choices that they have to make on that
11:55:21 you are own.
11:55:22 That's their choice to do what they want to do.
11:55:24 If it's the law, abide by it.
11:55:28 If you want to take the risk and do what you want to do,
11:55:31 then take the risk.
11:55:32 I can't legislate what you want to do.
11:55:33 That's your prerogative, ladies and gentlemen.
11:55:36 That's not mine.
11:55:37 I don't tell you where to live, what to buy, I don't tell
11:55:40 you what car to drive.
11:55:42 I don't tell you what to smoke.
11:55:44 If you want to do it, do it.
11:55:46 But there's a penalty with that.
11:55:50 Here is where it comes in.
11:55:51 If we really want to help the young people -- a and most of
11:55:55 them don't have the el diniro to pay the fine-o, what do you
11:56:02 think they are going to do?
11:56:04 They have only got two choices.
11:56:05 Don't pay it -- it doesn't work very well in my view.
11:56:17 That's just my view.
11:56:21 So what are we doing?
11:56:23 If the feds want to change the law I'm all for it.
11:56:26 But to me, to legislate and try to work around something
11:56:35 just because we want to do it, everybody wants to do it,
11:56:40 that's fine.
11:56:40 But don't take and choose who you want to do it and how you
11:56:43 want to do it.
11:56:45 The money part of it to me is a disgrace.
11:56:50 If you really want to help the young people, don't find
11:56:54 them.
11:56:54 Put them in the diversion program, including those of age.
11:56:58 Money doesn't mean anything.
11:57:01 We already have a police force.
11:57:04 We have code enforcement.
11:57:05 We have the legal department.
11:57:07 Why do you have to collect money? There's no need to
11:57:10 collect money if you really want to talk to them and say you
11:57:13 are doing the wrong thing.
11:57:16 You either have the opportunity to make the right choice for
11:57:18 yourself -- not for me.
11:57:19 I told my kids the three thing.
11:57:24 I don't believe they have ever done it.
11:57:25 If they did, I sure as hell don't know about it.
11:57:29 But to place it all on money, it's what's ruining this
11:57:34 country.
11:57:37 Get a red light.
11:57:38 Pay a ticket.
11:57:39 Pay the ticket.
11:57:40 They don't have the money.
11:57:41 And we continue to talk about money.
11:57:43 That's the only thing that bothers me in this ordinance is
11:57:47 about money.
11:57:48 If you already have it in place, and you don't need no other
11:57:55 employees, why do we need moneys?
11:58:00 Answer that?
11:58:02 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: A philosophical issue -- and if you are
11:58:04 asking me in my personal capacity --
11:58:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I wouldn't embarrass you.
11:58:10 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: You would.
11:58:11 We go back a very long way.
11:58:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We both had hair and you still do.
11:58:21 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: The people behind me would disagree.
11:58:24 We are not trying to encourage the use of marijuana. So the
11:58:27 balance for the police department and, frankly, for the
11:58:29 other members of council and for the citizenry, is we don't
11:58:34 want to encourage the use, and we don't want to give
11:58:39 somebody a criminal history record for what society has come
11:58:45 to conclude is a very minor violation.
11:58:48 But somewhere between just ignoring it and putting you in
11:58:53 jail is some kind of penalty.
11:58:56 And what kind of penalty can we assess?
11:59:01 The penalties that we have chosen to assess is financial.
11:59:04 If you can't pay the fine, one of your options is to not do
11:59:08 the crime.
11:59:09 And we would hope that maybe people would select that opens
11:59:13 because frankly outside of medical marijuana context, I
11:59:19 don't know personally how good it is for you.
11:59:21 So we discourage its use.
11:59:25 And if only to encourage compliance with existing law.
11:59:29 If you want to go to Tallahassee and completely wipe the law
11:59:34 off the books, that's society's prerogative.
11:59:36 The city doesn't have that power.
11:59:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And thank you very much.
11:59:49 I don't want to take too much of your time.
11:59:51 But again, I don't like it.
11:59:55 I am going to vote against it.
11:59:57 I am going to tell you this.
11:59:59 I one vote more likely for it on a trial basis if it had no
12:00:03 money because I want to make sure that those young kids --
12:00:07 it's a shame that it goes on for life but that's a choice
12:00:10 that they made.
12:00:11 They knew watch the law is.
12:00:12 If I rob a bank, do I go to jail if I rob the bank for $100
12:00:18 and for $20 I go to this program?
12:00:20 No.
12:00:21 I robbed a bank.
12:00:23 I'm not trying to make it the same.
12:00:25 But what I am saying is if I break the law as I know it and
12:00:28 they know it, there's a penalty.
12:00:31 So if you are going to have money into it, there might be
12:00:36 another breaking of the law.
12:00:37 That's all I'm saying.
12:00:40 >>FRANK REDDICK: We need to get --
12:00:42 >> Move to extend for another half hour.
12:00:45 >>: All right.
12:00:45 Another half hour, by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mr. Miranda.
12:00:50 All in favor?
12:00:51 Opposed?
12:00:57 Make it brief.
12:00:59 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm in the slow motion this morning.
12:01:00 I don't know about anybody else.
12:01:04 So, the only option we are doing here is payment of a fine.
12:01:12 Would it be possible, without having to end up in front of
12:01:17 this judge in a court, to have a component of community
12:01:25 service if someone can't afford the fine? And then as a
12:01:31 first offense? Or as alternative to the $75 for first
12:01:36 offense?
12:01:36 I mean if it's a second or third I understand that.
12:01:39 But if it's somebody who -- Mr. Suarez used the example, you
12:01:44 know, doesn't frequently smoke marijuana, but has the
12:01:49 unfortunate incident that they get caught, or one of the few
12:01:54 times that they do, and having to pay a $75 fine, could they
12:02:01 do community service instead?
12:02:05 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: It's possible.
12:02:05 But not without a substantial administrative infrastructure
12:02:12 that we don't currently have.
12:02:15 So if you want to hire a couple of people to administer this
12:02:26 program, to make sure that people perform those community
12:02:30 service hours --
12:02:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: But doesn't the court system already
12:02:35 have a process?
12:02:38 Do you want to weigh in on this?
12:02:40 Because there are other infractions that the court deems,
12:02:45 you know, that they serve community service instead of, you
12:02:50 know, a fine or jail sentence.
12:02:52 >> Mike Schmitt.
12:02:56 I can give you a little more to go back on.
12:03:03 When somebody gets arrested they are going to have to pay
12:03:05 substantial court costs, hire an attorney, bond associated
12:03:12 with that.
12:03:12 There's going to be a substantial cost to arrest an
12:03:15 individual for possession of cannabis.
12:03:20 The city's proposal is a citation, $75.
12:03:24 It's a substantial will you less alternative.
12:03:28 An individual getting arrested honor does have the option of
12:03:31 going to diversion is still going to face even more cost,
12:03:37 because the way diversion is set up, you would go to county
12:03:40 court.
12:03:42 You qualify for what's flown as misdemeanor intervention
12:03:45 program.
12:03:46 You actually have to pay for that program.
12:03:48 And that's a substantial cost.
12:03:49 As for the city doing community service, I have looked into
12:03:54 that issue in the past.
12:03:55 And not only what Mr. Rainesberger said, but we have to
12:04:06 consider insurance.
12:04:07 I contacted Salvation Army, and we would have to have these
12:04:10 people shard.
12:04:10 Otherwise, when they go do community service hours, they get
12:04:14 injured, they sue the city.
12:04:15 So having somebody just do community service hours to work
12:04:20 something off not only is the administrative costs but there
12:04:22 is the risk of liability to the city.
12:04:26 So the way that misdemeanor provision works, the person has
12:04:30 to purchase an insurance card, and that insurance comes at
12:04:34 an additional cost to the person.
12:04:36 But the person has to purchase an insurance card before they
12:04:39 go out and start cleaning up trash or whatever, if they are
12:04:42 going to do insurance through the Salvation Army.
12:04:46 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Do you know how much that cost is?
12:04:49 >> Well, you know, this is a couple of years ago, and this
12:04:53 was back when the Salvation Army was still supervising it.
12:04:58 They are no longer supervising.
12:05:00 So back in, I believe, the conversation I had with them, I
12:05:03 believe it was $15.
12:05:05 It wasn't a substantial thing, but that's because they had
12:05:09 already done --
12:05:11 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So to see if it was imperative for those
12:05:14 fines.
12:05:16 Substantially less.
12:05:16 >> But in order to do that, they have to pay the monthly
12:05:20 cost for insurance because they have a community service
12:05:22 probation officer.
12:05:23 They have a probation officer.
12:05:25 That's, I think, 40 bucks a month plus the insurance card,
12:05:29 another 15, $20.
12:05:31 You have to get a contract with that insurance company.
12:05:33 So it's a lot of steps.
12:05:37 Which did research that in the past because I wanted to
12:05:39 consider community service for the City of Tampa.
12:05:42 And it got to be so overwhelming that we haven't initiated
12:05:48 it.
12:05:49 >> I understand.
12:05:50 Thank you.
12:05:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I think he was looking at my way without
12:05:57 mentioning my name, and I understand everything the young
12:05:59 man said.
12:05:59 I don't have that capability.
12:06:02 But the city did say that there was no cost involved, and
12:06:07 they had it all done, code enforcement police and the legal
12:06:09 department was going to have it.
12:06:10 They had no hires to be hired.
12:06:12 But there was ample personnel on staff to do that.
12:06:16 That's what I heard.
12:06:17 >> If you do it over a fine system as it's presently
12:06:21 constructed Miranda so if there's no fine, there should be
12:06:25 no problem then.
12:06:26 >> If you are not going to penalize them at all, you're
12:06:29 right.
12:06:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So that's what you are trying to do.
12:06:32 You know, you can only be halfway pregnant?
12:06:37 >>KIRBY RAINSBERGER: We are not understanding each other.
12:06:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, it's all right.
12:06:40 I understand.
12:06:40 You understand what I am saying.
12:06:42 >> (Audience member): No.
12:06:46 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right.
12:06:46 >>LISA MONTELIONE: It's a public meeting.
12:06:51 This is a council meeting.
12:06:52 It's not a public town hall.
12:06:53 So, I mean, Mr. Chairman, you said earlier outbursts and you
12:07:02 can't just call out from the audience.
12:07:04 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: When I see this, I think about a
12:07:07 gentleman I knew in college back in 2005.
12:07:09 He was arrested, misdemeanor charge.
12:07:13 Eventually, the charges were dropped.
12:07:16 The case was dismissed but only after he had to spend a
12:07:19 night in jail, had to pay for an attorney, had to deal with
12:07:23 let's of stress.
12:07:24 And after that, anytime he applied for a job he had to say,
12:07:28 he was asked if he has ever been arrested, he had to explain
12:07:31 what the situation was.
12:07:32 Had this been in place back then, he would have paid a $75
12:07:36 fine instead of thousands to an attorney, never had to go to
12:07:39 jail, never had to deal with that, and in future employment,
12:07:42 didn't have to answer the question of previous or prior
12:07:46 arrests.
12:07:47 Today, last time I heard he was a productive member of
12:07:50 society were a family, with a good job and whatnot, but that
12:07:53 always lingers.
12:07:54 Had this been in place it would have never been an issue.
12:07:59 That $75 fine.
12:08:00 That was his only infraction, only time he did anything
12:08:04 against the law.
12:08:05 So when it comes to this, I'm glad to see that we are
12:08:07 bringing there up.
12:08:10 >>FRANK REDDICK: You know, before I turn to Mr. Cohen to
12:08:14 make final comments, make a motion, I first want to thank my
12:08:21 colleagues for initiating this discussion here today by
12:08:25 putting it on the agenda for discussion, and Mr. Cohen.
12:08:29 I had a chance ton review the board minutes, the draft that
12:08:36 you submitted to us, and let me just say briefly that we
12:08:44 have got to get away from thinking about -- everything has
12:08:51 changed.
12:08:51 We see this in this current presidential election.
12:08:57 Things are changing.
12:08:58 But you cannot -- and I feel good about this -- I would
12:09:04 encourage everyone to go back and read the article on
12:09:10 Saturday where she spoke about the young man who made one
12:09:14 mistake, one mistake, and he's paying for it the rest of his
12:09:22 life.
12:09:23 One mistake.
12:09:28 He got caught with less than 20 grams.
12:09:32 And he's paying for it.
12:09:35 He's denied so many opportunities for jobs, for college, for
12:09:39 the military, he's been denied all those opportunities
12:09:43 because he made that one mistake.
12:09:51 Should we deny all these individuals to make that one
12:09:54 mistake?
12:09:55 Because I guarantee you, each one of us goes back to our
12:09:58 young days.
12:09:59 We made a mistake.
12:10:01 We made a mistake.
12:10:04 We just didn't get caught.
12:10:06 But we made a mistake.
12:10:08 And I don't think not one of us can sit up here and say we
12:10:12 have not made a mistake.
12:10:15 Ran a red light, we were standing in a park drinking a beer
12:10:21 with open container.
12:10:22 You made a mistake.
12:10:25 You just didn't get caught.
12:10:26 But some of these people out there that make a mistake, they
12:10:32 deserve that opportunity for a second chance.
12:10:34 And this ordinance -- yes, I support this.
12:10:41 You continue to violate, violate, and violate, and not pay
12:10:44 the fine, I think there's something in the ordinance about
12:10:53 30 days, you have some type of penalty after 30 days and all
12:10:56 of this.
12:10:58 So what kind of future can we have, what kind of city can we
12:11:05 have, when we deny the people an opportunity because they
12:11:10 made one mistake?
12:11:16 We just can't be that type of city.
12:11:20 I mean, you got a 19, 18 or 19-year-old, and you get caught
12:11:25 with a joint or two joints, and I still don't know how many
12:11:33 joints is 20 grams but if he got caught with a joint or two,
12:11:37 and he's denied the opportunity for provide for your family
12:11:42 by one mistake, you are denied the ability to go to military
12:11:46 to represent your country because of one joint or two
12:11:49 joints, or you are denied that opportunity to be an elected
12:11:55 official because of one joint or two joints.
12:12:00 I guarantee you, if you look at the citizens around this
12:12:08 country and this city, and they were denied an opportunity,
12:12:11 some of them had that joint, or two joints growing up.
12:12:21 If they got caught they wouldn't be sitting here now.
12:12:23 So I am going to support this ordinance here.
12:12:28 And I agree, it can use some tightening up that Mrs.
12:12:35 Montelione talked about, I support that.
12:12:38 And I support my colleagues bringing there forward because
12:12:42 let mow just conclude by saying this.
12:12:45 When you deny these people that second opportunity, these
12:12:50 are the people that you are going to find out, these are the
12:12:57 people you are going to find on the street corners without a
12:12:59 job.
12:13:01 These are the people that have to rob to make ends meet
12:13:06 because they are denied these opportunities.
12:13:13 We have got to be about making changes in society, that we
12:13:17 are going to deny one mistake about a joint.
12:13:28 And then in my senior year, at prom night, somebody passed
12:13:40 me a joint to me and I had the worst day of my life.
12:13:43 (Laughter)
12:13:43 I haven't seen a joint since.
12:13:44 But suppose passing that joint around on prom night they got
12:13:51 caught, I would not be sitting here today.
12:13:57 And that's the reason why I say these people at least
12:14:03 deserve this opportunity.
12:14:04 And I turn to my colleague, Mr. Cohen.
12:14:06 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
12:14:14 Things are changing in this country.
12:14:16 And our nature, our sense of what's fair and unfair, what's
12:14:20 right and wrong, continues to evolve.
12:14:23 And the presidential election was mentioned in passing,
12:14:27 because we are seeing right now so many of the issues that
12:14:33 are contentious are things that have been building up over
12:14:35 time, things that have been crying out for change.
12:14:41 And the fundamental problem with our current marijuana laws
12:14:46 are that the punishments don't fit the offense.
12:14:52 We are punishing people so disproportionately in relation to
12:14:56 what it is that they have done that we completely,
12:14:59 completely have gotten the system out of whack.
12:15:04 The reason it is so bad to enter the court system on the
12:15:08 first time was amply discussed here today, and what it is is
12:15:11 that the minute you walk in the door of the courthouse, it's
12:15:15 thousands of dollars out of your pocket to deal with the
12:15:18 costs that come with just walking in the door and availing
12:15:23 yourself of the system.
12:15:26 I actually agree with Councilman Miranda.
12:15:28 I wish there would be no fine situation for this.
12:15:31 But the fine is our way of saying, we don't approve of this,
12:15:37 we are not legalizing it, but we are recognizing that the
12:15:42 way we are handling it now is totally disproportionate to
12:15:46 what it is that we are trying to get across to people.
12:15:49 And Councilman Reddick and Councilman Maniscalco in what
12:15:54 they were describing is the fact that under the current
12:15:56 symptom, people's lives are literally ruined because of one
12:16:01 or two youthful indiscretions, things that really deserve,
12:16:10 yes, a small fine, but not the kind of a sanction that will
12:16:15 ultimately cause you not to be able to get a job, caution
12:16:18 you to fall into debt, cause you to perhaps have untold
12:16:23 legal bills.
12:16:24 You might even find yourself in a situation down the road
12:16:27 where you can't find a job.
12:16:29 And the fact is in this country whether we like it or not,
12:16:34 minorities are far disproportionately affected by these laws
12:16:39 the way that they are currently enforced, and that is just a
12:16:44 fact. And the only way that we can bring things back to
12:16:47 some kind of parody is by examining the penalties for this
12:16:51 type of behavior.
12:16:52 This is not legalization.
12:16:54 It is simply a concession that what we are doing is too
12:17:00 harsh and its consequences are too severe.
12:17:02 And peoples lives are being ruined in this present system.
12:17:08 People who need these items for medical purposes, for
12:17:14 compassionate purposes, because they are suffering from
12:17:16 cancer or glaucoma, should not be fearful that they are
12:17:20 going to end up in jail or that they are going to end up
12:17:24 bankrupt.
12:17:25 They ought to know that their behavior is not going to be
12:17:29 sanctioned in such a way that their life is going to be
12:17:32 ruined on the other side of it.
12:17:34 So my view is that we should move this ordinance forward.
12:17:38 I would like to see it come back on first reading on March
12:17:41 3rd.
12:17:41 And I would like to make a motion to set it for hearing on
12:17:44 that date.
12:17:44 >> Second.
12:17:46 >>LISA MONTELIONE: May I?
12:17:49 >>FRANK REDDICK: We have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
12:17:50 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
12:17:53 Question?
12:17:55 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Yes.
12:17:56 I would like you to consider the amendment that I asked for.
12:17:58 >>HARRY COHEN: Well, here is the issue.
12:18:00 And we can certainly discuss it but I think that Mr.
12:18:03 Rainesberger's answer goes to the heart of the current
12:18:06 problem, which is the minute that you start putting these
12:18:10 types of conditions on, there has to be a mechanism --
12:18:13 >> No, I am talking about the paraphernalia.
12:18:16 >>HARRY COHEN: I think he agreed to change the language --
12:18:22 >>LISA MONTELIONE: But I want to --
12:18:24 >>HARRY COHEN: I'm sorry, I thought you were going to the
12:18:28 other issue.
12:18:29 >> No.
12:18:29 And I just want to be sure about the payment on the website.
12:18:33 I don't not that that has to be in the ordinance.
12:18:35 But I want to hear from IC that they are going to be able to
12:18:39 make that available.
12:18:40 >>FRANK REDDICK:All right.
12:18:43 We have a motion from Mr. Cohen.
12:18:47 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco with an amendment by Mrs.
12:18:54 Montelione.
12:18:56 You accept it?
12:18:57 >>HARRY COHEN: Yes.
12:18:57 Thank you.
12:18:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just because I am going to vote for to
12:19:01 the come back doesn't mean I am going to support.
12:19:03 I put that on the record.
12:19:05 >>: All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:19:07 Opposed?
12:19:08 Okay.
12:19:13 9:30, March 3rd.
12:19:15 >>HARRY COHEN: March 3rd.
12:19:17 >>: Thank you.
12:19:19 We go to item number 7.
12:19:21 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
12:19:32 I am here on item number 7 which is a request for the legal
12:19:36 department to appear and review the possibilities of
12:19:38 adopting an ordinance allowing solicitation on the city's
12:19:42 right-of-way.
12:19:43 I have met with all of you individually, and as you know we
12:19:45 are currently in litigation under solicitation ordinance as
12:19:49 well as reviewing the others that are coming out, and we are
12:19:52 not in a position to put forward any proposed amendments at
12:19:55 this time.
12:19:55 I'm available if there are any questions.
12:19:57 >>: Mr. Cohen.
12:19:58 >>HARRY COHEN: I would like to suggest that we not receive
12:20:04 regular updates on this again until there's been somebody
12:20:07 change in the status, if someone brings it up, because we
12:20:10 keep bringing it up and there's really nothing to talk
12:20:12 about.
12:20:15 >>FRANK REDDICK: That's a motion?
12:20:16 Seconded by Mr. Miranda.
12:20:17 Any further discussion on the motion?
12:20:20 All those in favor of the motion say aye.
12:20:22 Opposed?
12:20:25 Okay.
12:20:25 I guess we won't see you for a while.
12:20:28 (Laughter)
12:20:29 All right.
12:20:29 Item number 8.
12:20:30 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Move item number 8 to March 8th.
12:20:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: May I speak to that?
12:20:47 I agree whenever Mr. Suarez to what he said.
12:20:49 But are we going to have a breakdown?
12:20:52 I can't ask for -- if you see the auditors to go do an audit
12:20:56 to find out what really transpired because the people that I
12:20:58 spoke to that did with MANCON and I don't understand how
12:21:06 MANCON can have a building on city property.
12:21:09 They pay no rent, as I understand it.
12:21:11 I don't flow if they are still there.
12:21:16 >>FRANK REDDICK: I think you need to come and --
12:21:21 >>GREG SPEARMAN: Purchasing.
12:21:23 What was the question again?
12:21:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: As I recall a year or so ago when this
12:21:29 came up first they were using the same city building that
12:21:31 the city was in without paying rent.
12:21:33 I don't not if that's still happening or are they paying
12:21:35 rent?
12:21:36 I can't ask for an audit because it's under administration
12:21:38 to do an audit of comparable cost to the city.
12:21:41 I understand and I agree. I'm not questioning anyone's
12:21:45 authority but I want to the see it on paper by an auditor.
12:21:50 >>GREG SPEARMAN: We will gets back with you when we come
12:21:53 back.
12:21:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, thank you.
12:21:54 >>FRANK REDDICK: So there is a motion to request a
12:21:58 continuance.
12:22:00 I think, Mr. Suarez, you made it?
12:22:04 Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.
12:22:06 All in favor of the motion?
12:22:07 Opposed?
12:22:08 All right.
12:22:09 Item number 9.
12:22:11 Got a resolution here.
12:22:13 Come on.
12:22:13 >> Ocea Lattimore: Department of asset management, and I'm
12:22:20 here to see if you have any questions on items number 9, 10
12:22:23 and 11.
12:22:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions on item number 9?
12:22:27 >> I have a question on 9, sir.
12:22:36 It took me off guard that it's JH Oil Company and the fuel
12:22:39 and diesel?
12:22:41 >> Yes, the fuel that we purchased, yes.
12:22:43 >> And do you know, Mrs. Lattimore, is 11.8 million higher
12:22:49 or lower than our last contract?
12:22:55 I know gas prices have gone down and we try to have more
12:23:00 efficiency.
12:23:00 >>HARRY COHEN: You want to know how much per gallon.
12:23:04 It could be a different amount.
12:23:05 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Yes.
12:23:06 So what the dollar amount is.
12:23:08 Thank you, Mr. Cohen.
12:23:09 Per gallon, not in total.
12:23:11 >> Per our last contract, I do not have that.
12:23:19 I'm sorry.
12:23:19 >>GREG SPEARMAN: We actually buy gas line, information
12:23:33 service and that is the lowest price that municipalities can
12:23:40 purchase fuel.
12:23:41 That's market rate, and we try to keep it less than what we
12:23:44 pay --
12:23:45 >>LISA MONTELIONE: That answers my question.
12:23:47 Thank you.
12:23:49 >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.
12:23:49 Other questions?
12:23:50 All right.
12:23:51 We need a motion.
12:23:52 >>HARRY COHEN: Move item 9.
12:23:57 >>: Motion by Mr. Cohen.
12:23:59 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.
12:24:00 All in favor?
12:24:01 Opposed?
12:24:02 Item 10.
12:24:02 Any questions?
12:24:04 >> Move item number 10.
12:24:05 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.
12:24:07 >>: Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
12:24:08 All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:24:09 Opposed?
12:24:10 All right.
12:24:10 Motion carried.
12:24:11 Item 11.
12:24:12 >> Move item number 11.
12:24:15 >>FRANK REDDICK: We got a motion from Mrs. Montelione.
12:24:17 Seconded by Mr. Maniscalco.
12:24:19 All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:24:21 Opposed?
12:24:21 Motion carried.
12:24:23 Item number 12.
12:24:23 >> Move item 12.
12:24:30 >>FRANK REDDICK: Saving you time to come speak.
12:24:32 We got a motion from Mr. Miranda.
12:24:34 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
12:24:36 All in favor of the motion say aye?
12:24:38 Opposed?
12:24:38 >> Move item 13.
12:24:41 >>FRANK REDDICK: Got a motion from Mr. Cohen.
12:24:43 Second by Mr. Miranda.
12:24:44 All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:24:45 Opposed?
12:24:46 Motion carried.
12:24:47 All right.
12:24:49 Item 60.
12:24:50 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Move item 60.
12:24:57 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.
12:24:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: All in favor?
12:24:59 Opposed.
12:25:00 Okay.
12:25:00 >>LISA MONTELIONE: We have five minutes left. So 15 more
12:25:14 minutes?
12:25:15 >>FRANK REDDICK: 15 more minutes.
12:25:16 Okay.
12:25:17 Yes, ma'am.
12:25:18 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
12:25:19 >> I'm sorry.
12:25:21 Excuse me for a second.
12:25:22 >>THE CLERK: This is quasi, so they need to be sworn in.
12:25:28 >>: I didn't see that. Thank you. All those to speak on
12:25:32 item 60, please stand to be sworn in.
12:25:34 (Oath administered by Clerk).
12:25:43 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
12:25:43 The petition before you is SU-1-1605, property located at
12:25:50 524 West Davis Boulevard.
12:25:53 The request is for an extended family residence as a special
12:25:57 use 1 in the RS-75 district.
12:26:02 The code requires that an extended family residence limits
12:26:07 it to 600 square feet.
12:26:09 The site plan that I had reviewed had a square footage of
12:26:14 608 feet.
12:26:16 Accessory structure which is where the extended family
12:26:19 residence is being located is also limited to a maximum
12:26:24 height of 15 feet.
12:26:26 The proposed structure, I estimated the high of 22.
12:26:30 The applicant is telling me it's over, I think, 19 feet.
12:26:34 They can clarify.
12:26:37 But the property is located on Davis Boulevard, west Davis
12:26:41 Boulevard.
12:26:43 The site plan shows the accessory structure in the rear.
12:26:49 It has a 5 foot side and rear setback.
12:26:52 Well behind the 60 foot setback in the front.
12:26:55 It is a tall structure.
12:27:02 Here is the elevation of the accessory dwelling.
12:27:06 My understanding is the grade of the property is such that
12:27:09 it requires a higher elevation because of the flood
12:27:13 regulations to bring up the finished floor.
12:27:17 Those are the waivers that are listed as being needed for an
12:27:22 extended family residence to be approved.
12:27:24 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions from council?
12:27:28 All right.
12:27:29 Petitioner.
12:27:29 >> Good morning, City Council.
12:27:32 My name is Phattara Gibbs, property owner at 524 west Davis.
12:27:39 I'm here to petition the decision made by the zoning
12:27:41 committee regarding the accessory structure.
12:27:48 The proposed structure, what we will be asking for is the
12:27:55 structure to be about 19.5 feet, which is four and a half
12:28:01 feet above what is required, what the maximum required.
12:28:07 The reason being that we have to take the FEMA requirements
12:28:13 into consideration, which means that we have to be four and
12:28:16 a half feet above grade already.
12:28:19 And if you take that aside, the structure is 15 feet.
12:28:28 The approved structure currently has a flat roof, but a
12:28:37 pitched roof.
12:28:37 That was the only difference between the approved structure
12:28:40 and approved structure.
12:28:42 The living quarter is the same.
12:28:44 The soffit is the same.
12:28:45 The location window will be the same.
12:28:46 The only difference of four feet upon the roof.
12:28:49 The reason why we asked for a pitched roof is for multiple
12:28:53 reasons. One for architectural design to be consistent with
12:28:55 the house, and structures surrounded by trees which
12:29:02 accumulate.
12:29:07 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions from council?
12:29:09 Mr. Suarez.
12:29:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: A couple of quick questions.
12:29:12 First of all, I had a flat roof before.
12:29:14 I know they don't flow.
12:29:18 It's never a good thing.
12:29:19 In terms of the specific FEMA requirement, what does it say?
12:29:27 >> They have to be above sea level in order to ensure the
12:29:33 property, and that was the minimum requirement required by
12:29:36 FEMA.
12:29:36 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So you are saying that in order to get your
12:29:39 insurance, FEMA is requiring a certain height?
12:29:42 >> And approved by the city we have to be a certain height.
12:29:48 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So you are caught between a flood and a --
12:29:52 >> And if you take that grading a way, we are at 15 feet.
12:29:55 So it was out of our control to have to build it up, it was
12:30:00 kind of out of our control.
12:30:03 >> And you could build it up -- could not build it up?
12:30:06 You would be doing it structurally instead of on the grade.
12:30:10 You are not filling in in order to make it higher, correct?
12:30:12 >> Correct.
12:30:13 And that's the lowest that we can build.
12:30:17 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
12:30:20 >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay, any questions?
12:30:21 Anyone in the audience wish to speak on item number 60?
12:30:23 >> My name is Janice Rickert.
12:30:31 I am the property owner at the southern border of the fence
12:30:35 line that The accessory structure is on.
12:30:46 You talk about a flat roof in Florida, and I understand that
12:30:48 because half of my personal dwelling is flat roof.
12:30:53 It can't be done.
12:30:56 This allows council to realize this is an accessory
12:30:59 structure. This is not the main house.
12:31:01 What is being proposed to be built is 22 feet high, 5 feet
12:31:08 off of my fence line.
12:31:09 It is the visual view of my family room, out my kitchen, out
12:31:14 my dining room.
12:31:19 He's a great neighbor.
12:31:22 The construction crew has been fine.
12:31:23 But it is a large house that is being built there.
12:31:26 It is not out of control that FEMA is requiring this
12:31:30 accessory structure be built four and a half feet hair.
12:31:33 This is not his main house. He does not have to have an
12:31:37 accessory structure with living quarters in it.
12:31:41 That is a choice he's making.
12:31:43 We talked about choice today.
12:31:49 So I would like you to understand and appreciate the effect
12:31:52 that a large secondary structure will have on the
12:31:55 surrounding property, on the value of the surrounding
12:31:58 property.
12:32:00 Single story ranch house.
12:32:02 I have a very large two story house going up next to me with
12:32:05 a request for a very large second home on the lot.
12:32:10 Accessory structures are meant to be garages, pool houses,
12:32:17 maybe a quick shower after getting in the pool.
12:32:19 They are not meant to be a living dwelling.
12:32:21 In addition to the square footage and the height of this
12:32:24 property, we are going to have air conditioners making
12:32:26 noise.
12:32:27 We are going to have someone having their own life going on
12:32:31 in that five feet from my fence line.
12:32:34 This is not what's meant by accessory structure. It's been
12:32:39 approved.
12:32:39 I understand that.
12:32:40 I will accept that.
12:32:40 But he then asks that it be approved beyond the ordinances
12:32:44 for building.
12:32:48 So I ask the council consider that when reviewing this.
12:32:53 >> I'm Donna Chrishain.
12:32:58 I live behind Mr. Gibbs.
12:33:01 And I think it is a fairly large structure going up.
12:33:10 I also have an original structure.
12:33:13 I plan some day to have a pool, hopefully.
12:33:17 So anyway, I don't want to repeat what she said, but I'm
12:33:23 opposed to making it bigger than it needs to be.
12:33:26 I think it was really a matter of flat roof versus a pumped
12:33:29 roof.
12:33:29 But he will get the building he wants for the uses that he
12:33:33 wants, and it's going to be beautiful.
12:33:36 But I'm opposed to that.
12:33:38 And also the other neighbors.
12:33:40 So I have letters from them, the surrounding neighbors
12:33:43 couldn't be here today.
12:33:50 That's one neighbor.
12:33:51 Then this would be our neighbor behind next to me.
12:33:56 They kind of share the same lot in the back.
12:34:02 Again, they already have a flat roof and I also have a flat
12:34:05 roof.
12:34:07 And then the neighbor on the side, he's also opposed to it.
12:34:18 You see it in the front page in this article.
12:34:20 So I appreciate it.
12:34:33 >> Randy Soloman, and I have been sworn.
12:34:38 And this is a request to review the decision of the zoning
12:34:41 administrator pertaining to a special use 1 permit
12:34:45 application.
12:34:45 The applicant is essentially requesting a height variance
12:34:48 which would result in a nonconforming new construction
12:34:52 primary structure.
12:34:53 The variance exceeds the allowable height of the ordinance
12:34:59 by more than 40%.
12:35:00 The city staff decision to deny the permit application was
12:35:03 correct based on the ordinances. To the extent the City
12:35:07 Council reverses the staff decision, which will then allow
12:35:09 for the issuance of a special permit, City Council should
12:35:13 stay within the specific basis for the decision.
12:35:16 The record should be clear as to what sections of the
12:35:18 ordinance support the decision, why this matter should not
12:35:21 be subject to the normal variance review process.
12:35:25 Section 26.61 provides direction regarding City Council's
12:35:29 review of the zoning administrator, permits, specifically,
12:35:31 City Council shall follow all applicable ordinances in
12:35:39 arriving at its decision and reviewing the permit and
12:35:43 hearing evidence and testimony either affirm the permit or
12:35:46 deny the permit.
12:35:47 The arguments presented within the applicant's petitioner
12:35:51 focused on matters which pertain to a height variance, not a
12:35:55 special use situation.
12:35:57 Section 27-132 specifically states that an extended family
12:36:02 residence must be included within a conforming accessory
12:36:06 structure and provide additional citation -- stating it may
12:36:11 not be located in a nonconforming accessory structure or
12:36:15 structure result of a variance.
12:36:17 The ordinance states in part B, the intent of this use is to
12:36:22 meet a temporary need, and part H, the special using permit
12:36:25 shall be reviewed annually by staff and if any conditions or
12:36:30 occupants change, the special use permit will be required.
12:36:34 The applicant is requesting that the City Council approve a
12:36:38 permanent high variance for a special using permit, the
12:36:41 ordinance is temporary in nature.
12:36:43 Furthermore, should the City Council grant the request,
12:36:46 there's no guarantee that a permit will be renewed.
12:36:49 If a permit is not issued the result will be a nonconforming
12:36:52 permanent structure with no special use accessory.
12:36:57 Approved outside the variance process.
12:37:01 And a special use application process is not the proper
12:37:04 venue for what is essentially a variance request and
12:37:07 approval of the applicant's request will be contrary to the
12:37:09 ordinance to establish process, be incompatible with the
12:37:16 neighborhood, and open the city to potential legal
12:37:19 challenges.
12:37:20 Thank you very much.
12:37:20 >> Debbie Zimmomond, and I have been sworn as well.
12:37:32 I would like to incorporate all the prior comments, and in
12:37:37 brevity I will not repeat the comments, but I would like the
12:37:42 comments from the last three speakers incorporated into my
12:37:44 time.
12:37:45 Thank you very much.
12:37:47 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right, petitioner.
12:37:48 >> I will speak to a couple of their concerns regarding
12:37:57 privacy issues.
12:37:58 I completely understand where the neighbors are coming from.
12:38:01 Like I told you previously, it will be the same height.
12:38:06 The structure is not going to -- it will not exceed from
12:38:12 what's approved.
12:38:13 We are asking for only four and a half feet at maximum to
12:38:15 19.5 feet, not 23 feet as stated.
12:38:19 And that four feet will only be seen at the tip of the roof,
12:38:22 and I think it makes the building appear nicer as the
12:38:28 neighbors look at it.
12:38:32 And we plan to follow all the requirements required for
12:38:37 extended family.
12:38:40 My parents live overseas, and they come just a couple times
12:38:43 a year, and that's the reason I am building it, and we plan
12:38:48 to follow all the guidelines by the city.
12:38:53 And it's not for someone to live there permanently.
12:38:57 It's only going to be a couple months out of the year.
12:38:59 >>FRANK REDDICK: Questions by council?
12:39:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
12:39:09 Can I ask a question real quick?
12:39:10 Before I ask you the question I want to point out the flat
12:39:13 roof that I was talking about was 1958, and someone added
12:39:17 onto it and did an awful job, and I have lived in that house
12:39:20 until I finally had to sell it because it was so bad.
12:39:23 But, anyway, this is totally different.
12:39:29 Ms. Moreda, we received something in a handout of the
12:39:33 proposed structure versus the approved structure.
12:39:36 Is this something that you provided to us?
12:39:38 Okay.
12:39:38 Now, according to what the applicant is saying an approved
12:39:41 structure with 600 square foot allows for a flat roof
12:39:45 design, no oven in the kitchen and a total structure, 15
12:39:48 feet.
12:39:48 Is that correct?
12:39:49 >>GLORIA MOREDA: That complies with code requirements.
12:39:51 >>MIKE SUAREZ: So the only difference is between a flat
12:39:55 roof and a pitched roof.
12:39:57 >>GLORIA MOREDA: That's correct.
12:39:58 >> I wanted to get that through earlier because, believe me,
12:40:02 sometimes, sir, I laugh at our ordinances too but I wanted
12:40:04 to make sure, which there really is a design standard
12:40:09 change, not a problem with them building the appurantment
12:40:14 structure.
12:40:16 >>GLORIA MOREDA: One of the conditions of the special use is
12:40:18 that it be conforming accessory structure.
12:40:23 It has been a longstanding practice that we take these cases
12:40:27 to council so that you can decide whether or not this is
12:40:30 appropriate, given the location and the character of the
12:40:33 area.
12:40:34 Rather than to go through the process.
12:40:39 >>HARRY COHEN: My problem with this is that this extra
12:40:46 couple of feet, five feet from the property line, totally
12:40:51 changes the character of the neighbor's yard.
12:40:52 And I'm really afraid that if we start going down this road,
12:40:56 we have properties all over the city that are in low lying
12:41:02 floodplains, and our accessory structure, 15-foot limit, if
12:41:06 we start -- if we start relaxing it, based on these types of
12:41:14 arguments, it's going to be "Katie bar the door" for the
12:41:18 size of the structures that are going to start getting built
12:41:20 literally staring right into people's yards.
12:41:23 And I understand the difficulty.
12:41:26 But the fact is you can still have the structure without
12:41:30 relaxing the rules, it just seems to be designed a little
12:41:33 bit differently, so to me it's the safer choice.
12:41:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm sorry, I didn't chuckle.
12:41:43 It's the second time you used "Katie bar the door," and I
12:41:46 don't think I have heard that in years.
12:41:48 He's too young to know that.
12:41:53 So, you know, the finished floor elevation is what the issue
12:41:57 is with the floodplain.
12:41:59 And I understand that.
12:42:02 But I don't share the same comment about the privacy,
12:42:05 because the four feet is in the pitch of the roof.
12:42:07 So unless there's going to be a wind off in that roof, and
12:42:12 the floor flat up into the attic, no one is going to be
12:42:19 peering over the side.
12:42:21 So it's just simply because of the pitch of the roof.
12:42:25 And a flat roof no matter what year they were built most lit
12:42:30 in Florida are nightmares because they just collect water
12:42:33 and debris.
12:42:35 And up north they collect snow.
12:42:37 So just flat roofs are a nightmare, period.
12:42:45 I just don't share the same viewpoint.
12:42:49 It's a flood elevation that you have to comply with a
12:42:54 building permits or you don't get the building permit.
12:42:57 To build the structure.
12:42:58 And the extra few feet is just in the pitch of the roof.
12:43:04 If it was different, if there was a second story, if there
12:43:09 were windows, if there were other circumstances, I would
12:43:14 agree with you, Mr. Cohen.
12:43:15 But since it's only the roof line, I don't have a problem
12:43:19 with it.
12:43:19 Sorry.
12:43:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want to say, because his choices.
12:43:26 They had a choice and they took it.
12:43:28 I can't control choices.
12:43:30 That's all I am going to say.
12:43:32 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any further comments?
12:43:35 Anyone else? Does anyone else wants to speak?
12:43:44 >>MIKE SUAREZ: [Off microphone.]
12:43:50 >> [Off microphone.] Everything else will be conforming to
12:43:59 the guidelines.
12:44:00 That's the only difference.
12:44:01 >> CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
12:44:03 >>FRANK REDDICK: Got a motion from Mr. Miranda.
12:44:05 Second by Mr. Suarez.
12:44:08 All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:44:11 Opposed?
12:44:12 What's the pleasure of council ever?
12:44:13 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I prove approval.
12:44:15 I guess it would be to agree with the zoning
12:44:24 administrator --
12:44:25 >> Overrule.
12:44:26 >> You look like you want to come to the microphone.
12:44:32 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Your intention is to affirm or overturn?
12:44:37 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Affirm.
12:44:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
12:44:43 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I am going to direct your attention to
12:44:44 page 3 of the order.
12:44:46 >> If you are affirming, you are overturning.
12:44:50 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It would be proper under Florida statutes
12:44:54 to give a reason for denial of the development permit to
12:44:58 state the basis, the statutory basis of that denial.
12:45:01 >> The statutory basis per the zoning administrator.
12:45:05 We are affirming the statutory process based on what the
12:45:09 zoning administrator said.
12:45:10 We are just agreeing to the fact that you are following
12:45:10 state and not allowing this particular project to go
12:45:15 forward.
12:45:16 So that's the affirmation.
12:45:17 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And therefore, correct me if I am
12:45:23 mistaken, 27-129 you are reviewing the general standards?
12:45:26 >> that's exactly what Ms. Moreda put on there so I am
12:45:31 agreeing with Ms. Moreda.
12:45:32 >>FRANK REDDICK: We have a motion by Mr. Suarez.
12:45:34 Second by Mr. Miranda.
12:45:36 Further discussion on the motion?
12:45:37 All in favor of the motion say aye.
12:45:38 Those opposed?
12:45:39 >>THE CLERK: Motion passed with Montelione voting no.
12:45:52 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Miranda?
12:45:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.
12:45:54 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Nothing right now.
12:45:57 >>HARRY COHEN: Nothing.
12:45:59 >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I would like to congratulate my sister
12:46:01 and my brother-in-law.
12:46:01 She had a baby girl this morning.
12:46:05 >>FRANK REDDICK: Congratulations.
12:46:05 >>THE CLERK: [Off microphone.] We have two items about the
12:46:16 resolution.
12:46:16 >>HARRY COHEN: I would make a motion that we postpone that
12:46:20 till our next meeting.
12:46:21 It's Councilwoman Capin's item. So let's put that till
12:46:25 March 3rd.
12:46:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: All right.
12:46:27 Anything else?
12:46:30 You say two?
12:46:30 >>THE CLERK: [off microphone.]
12:46:33 >> All in favor say aye.
12:46:35 Opposed?
12:46:36 Okay.
12:46:36 >>THE CLERK: And you have the resolution of committee
12:46:39 appointments.
12:46:40 >> Motion by Mr. Cohen.
12:46:44 Second by Mr. Suarez.
12:46:45 All in favor?
12:46:46 Opposed?
12:46:47 All right.
12:46:48 Mrs. Montelione.
12:46:48 >>LISA MONTELIONE: There is a staff report scheduled for
12:46:57 Thom Snelling and Vanessa McCleary, Hillsborough Tampa
12:47:01 Housing Authority, to appear to discuss the situation with
12:47:04 affordable housing and the number of units available.
12:47:06 So I would like to move that from a staff report to a
12:47:11 workshop, considering there might be considerable discussion
12:47:15 about it.
12:47:16 And I'm hoping there will be.
12:47:18 So that would be moved to March 24 at 9:00 a.m.
12:47:28 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.
12:47:30 >>FRANK REDDICK: I have a motion from Mrs. Montelione.
12:47:32 Seconded by Mr. Miranda.
12:47:35 All in favor?
12:47:36 Opposed?
12:47:36 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I would also ask -- and it doesn't have
12:47:39 to be part of the motion but I would also ask that legal
12:47:42 department be here and revenue and finance as well during
12:47:48 that workshop.
12:47:48 >>FRANK REDDICK: Duly noted.
12:47:50 Anything else?
12:47:51 >> No.
12:47:52 >>FRANK REDDICK: Before you do that, sir, one item.
12:48:04 Request a commendation for the second annual Tampa pride
12:48:07 celebration taking place on March 26, 2016 in Ybor City.
12:48:13 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion by Councilman Reddick, seconded by
12:48:17 Councilman Miranda.
12:48:19 All in favor?
12:48:20 Opposed?
12:48:20 All right.
12:48:20 >> (Off microphone.)
12:48:20 >>FRANK REDDICK: Got a motion from Mr. Miranda, seconded by
12:48:25 Ms. Montelione.
12:48:26 All in favor?
12:48:27 Opposed?
12:48:28 Okay.
12:48:28 Seeing no one to speak at this time, we stand adjourned.
12:48:37 (Council meeting adjourned.)
12:49:44
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