TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 27, 2022
9:00 A.M.

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09:01:57AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
GOOD MORNING,.
THE TAMPA CITY COUNCIL IS IN SESSION TODAY ON OCTOBER 27, 2022.
COUNCILMAN GUDES, I BELIEVE YOU HAVE INVOCATION.
09:02:13AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
GOOD MORNING, MR. CHAIR AND COUNCILMEMBERS.
THE DIRECTOR OF TRINITY EVANGELICAL CHURCH, AND BOTH
ORDAINED CLERGY AND CHURCH OF NORTH AMERICA.
THEY ENJOY COFFEE, READING AND TIME WITH THEIR SON, ROWAN,
STUDIES OF THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTH FLORIDA AND PURSUING
MASTERS OF ART THEOLOGY.
HE HAS SERVED IN PASTORAL MINISTRY FOR EIGHT YEARS.
THIS MORNING I GIVE YOU PASTOR TRAVIS LOWE.
09:02:50AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ALL PLEASE STAND AND REMAIN STANDING FOR THE
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
09:02:55AM >> LET'S PRAY.
OH MIGHTY GOD, WE COME BEFORE YOU THIS MORNING KNOWING OF
THAT IN HOLY SCRIPTURE WE SHOULD PRAY FOR THOSE IN
AUTHORITY, THOSE IN POSITIONS OF LEADERSHIP AND SO WE DO
THAT GRATEFULLY AND GLADLY.
WE LIFT UP EVERY MEMBER IN THE CHAMBER, THE COUNCILMEN AND
COUNCILWOMAN WHO IS LEADING OUR CITY.
THOSE IN CHARGE ARE LEADING IN A WAY THAT IS JUST, RIGHT AND
GOOD AND REQUIRES WISDOM.
SO, FATHER, WE ASK THAT YOU WILL GIVE THESE LEADERS WISDOM
IN ABUNDANCE.
THAT YOU GRANT THEM DISCERNMENT AND KNOWLEDGE BY THE POWER
OF YOUR SPIRIT.
GOD, WE ASK THAT YOU WILL GIVE EACH OF THEM THE MIND OF
CHRIST WHO ALTHOUGH HE WAS LORD TOOK ON THE FORM OF A
SERVANT.
GOD, I PRAY THAT YOU WILL GIVE THEM THE MINDS OF SERVANTS
AND THEY WILL SEE THEMSELVES AS SERVANTS FOR THE PEOPLE OF
THIS CITY.
GOD, WE ASK THAT IN ALL OF THE DELIBERATIONS, ALL OF THE
DECISION THAT ARE MADE TODAY, GOD, THAT THEY WOULD BE GUIDED
AND GOVERNED IN A WAY THAT IS GOOD, RIGHT AND TRUE.
WE PRAY FOR THE PEOPLE OF THIS CITY, TAMPA.
GOD, WE PRAY THAT YOU WOULD LEAD THEM TO FLOURISHING AND TO
ABUNDANCE AND TO JAI.
WE ASK ALL OF THESE THINGS IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER, THE
SON, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT.
WE SAY AMEN.
[PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE]
09:04:33AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ROLL CALL.
09:04:34AM >>BILL CARLSON:
HERE.
09:04:39AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
HERE.
09:04:40AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
HERE.
09:04:41AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
HERE.
09:04:42AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
HERE.
09:04:43AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
HERE.
09:04:45AM >>CLERK:
YOU HAVE A PHYSICAL QUORUM.
09:04:47AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
MR. SHELBY.
09:04:50AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
YES, GOOD MORNING, MR. CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS
OF THE CITY COUNCIL, MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC.
MARTIN SHELBY, CITY COUNTY ATTORNEY.
I WILL BE VERY BRIEF AND PEOPLE ARE FAMILIAR WITH THE
GUIDELINES AS THEY ARE IN THE NOTICE AND ALLOW FOR USE OF
COMMUNICATION IMMEDIATE CA TECHNOLOGY OR CMT THAT REQUIRES
PREREGISTRATION.
THOSE INSTRUCTIONS ARE AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC ONLINE.
I WILL ASK THAT THE COUNCIL WAIVE THE RULES FOR THE USE
OF CMT UNTIL WE CHANGE THE RULES.
09:05:19AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
MOTION.
09:05:20AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
SECOND.
09:05:21AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ALL IN FAVOR.
THANK YOU.
WE WILL BE GOING THROUGH THE AGENDA AT THIS TIME.
IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT AGENDA ITEM NUMBER, FILE NUMBER
E-2022-8-27 BE CONTINUED UNTIL FEBRUARY 23, 2023.
09:05:44AM >>BILL CARLSON:
SO MOVED.
09:05:47AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SECOND.
09:05:48AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE ON THAT, PLEASE.
09:05:51AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:05:58AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:05:59AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:06:00AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:06:02AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:06:07AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:06:08AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY WITH COUNCILMAN VIERA
BEING ABSENT.
09:06:12AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I BELIEVE THAT AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 9 IS ASKED
TO CONTINUE UNTIL JANUARY 26, 2023 FILE NUMBER CM22-76274.
09:06:25AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SO MOVED.
09:06:31AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
SECOND.
09:06:31AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE.
09:06:34AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:06:36AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:06:37AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:06:39AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:06:41AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:06:42AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:06:43AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:06:44AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:06:46AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 10, FILE
NUMBER CM22-76981 BEING ASKED TO BE CONTINUED UNTIL NOVEMBER
3, 2022.
09:06:57AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SO MOVED.
09:07:02AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
SECOND.
09:07:03AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ROLL CALL VOTE.
09:07:05AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:07:08AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:07:09AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:07:10AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:07:12AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:07:13AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:07:14AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:07:15AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:07:17AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
FILE NUMBER CM22-75606 IS BEING ASKED TO
CONTINUE FOR A DATE TO BE DETERMINED IN THE FUTURE.
09:07:26AM >>LUIS VIERA:
IF I MAY, MR. CHAIRMAN.
09:07:29AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES, COUNCILMAN VIERA.
09:07:31AM >>LUIS VIERA:
LET'S CONTINUE THAT ALL THE WAY TO THE MARCH
20 WHATEVER AT THE WORKSHOP.
WE DON'T HAVE MANY THERE, IF I MAY.
MARCH 2023.
MARCH 2023.
LET ME SEE WHAT THAT IS --
09:07:47AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
23rd.
09:07:50AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MARCH 23, 2023.
09:07:52AM >>LUIS VIERA:
PLEASE.
09:07:54AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MOTION BY COUNCILMAN VIERA.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
ROLL CALL VOTE.
09:08:00AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:08:01AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:08:02AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:08:06AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WAIT A MINUTE, I AM GOING TO VOTE FOR IT
WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR, SHOT SPOTTER -- OH, I AM SORRY, I
APOLOGIZE.
YES.
09:08:18AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:08:20AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:08:22AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:08:22AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:08:25AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 12, CM22-79680 IS BEING
ASKED TO CONTINUE UNTIL NOVEMBER 17,2022.
MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ROLL CALL.
09:08:43AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:08:45AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:08:46AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:08:47AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:08:48AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:08:49AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:08:50AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:08:51AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:08:53AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 14, TM-74623 IS BEING
ASKED TO CONTINUE UNTIL JANUARY 26, 2023.
MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
ROLL CALL VOTE.
09:09:10AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:09:12AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:09:14AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:09:15AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:09:16AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:09:18AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:09:19AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:09:20AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:09:21AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AND THEN AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 18, CM22-74323 IS
BEING ASKED TO BE CONTINUED UNTIL JANUARY 26, 2023.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ROLL CALL VOTE.
09:09:42AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
09:09:43AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:09:44AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:09:45AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:09:47AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:09:49AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:09:50AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
09:09:51AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
09:09:55AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE ASKING FOR CHANGE TO OUR AGENDA?
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
09:09:59AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I DON'T KNOW WHAT CITY COUNCIL'S RULES WITH
REGARD TO WORKSHOP, BUT SOME OF THE ITEMS WE MOVED PUT ON
THE AGENDA SIX OR MORE MONTHS AGO AND SOME OF THEM -- THEY
ALL MOVED FOR DIFFERENT REASONS BUT SOME OF THEM MOVED
BECAUSE SUDDENLY A WHOLE BUNCH OF THESE REAL ESTATE ISSUES
ENDED UP ON THIS AGENDA.
AND I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A LIMIT TO HOW MANY WORKSHOP
ITEMS WE CAN PUT ON.
AND THEN IF THE ADMINISTRATION OR OTHER CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS
COME BACK AND WANT TO ADD MORE, WE DRAW A HARD LINE
OTHERWISE WE HAVE GOT TO KEEP MOVING THESE ALL THE TIME.
WE SAY OUR HOUSE AND OUR AGENDA, BUT SOMEHOW HALF THE AGENDA
ARE THING THAT CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS DIDN'T PUT ON.
DO WE HAVE A HARD RULE ON IT -- ON WORKSHOPS?
09:10:44AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
NO, SIR.
YOU HAVE YOUR CALENDAR.
NO.
IN TERMS OF ITEMS, THE RULE IS --
09:10:58AM >>BILL CARLSON:
ANYBODY ELSE AGREE THE NUMBER OF ITEMS ON
WORKSHOP DAYS?
09:11:03AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
09:11:04AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I AGREE, BUT I ALSO THINK THAT HAVING THEM
TOPICAL HELPS.
HAVING THEM ALL ON A SIMILAR TOPIC ALLOWS US TO TALK ABOUT
THIS IS MOSTLY FOCUSED ON HOUSING AND TEXT AMENDMENTS.
MAKES SENSE THE THINGS THAT WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT SORT OF
THE SAME IDEAS.
JUST A THOUGHT.
09:11:30AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
MR. CHAIR --
09:11:34AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
MOST OF THEM TODAY FITS THAT MOLD, BUT IT
SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD BE NICE TO TRY, IF WE CAN, SO THAT THE
PUBLIC IS FOCUSED ON ONE THING.
AND WE ARE FOCUSED ON ONE THING.
I AM SORRY.
09:11:46AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
OH, NO, PLEASE.
09:11:48AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNSELOR SHELBY.
09:11:51AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
DIRECT COUNCIL'S ATTENTION A MEMO FROM THE
CHIEF OF STAFF WHERE HE PROPOSES SETTING FORTH WORKSHOPS
SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED CERTAIN TIMES OF THE YEAR FOR CERTAIN
ITEMS FROM THE ADMINISTRATION ON CERTAIN GENERAL AREAS.
AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT COUNCIL, I ASK THAT YOU TAKE A
LOOK AT.
BECAUSE WHEN WE DO CHANGE THESE RULES, I WOULD LIKE TO BE
ABLE TO BE CONSISTENT.
THE RULE FOR THE WORKSHOP IS A WORKSHOP SHALL BE DEFINED AS
A MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL HELD FOR THE PURPOSE OF
COUNCIL BEING INFORMED ON AND DISCUSSING MATTERS OF SPECIAL
CONCERN THAT REQUIRE TIME IN EXCESS OF THAT USUALLY AFFORDED
FOR STAFF REPORTS AT A REGULAR MEETING.
AS YOU KNOW OUR STAFF REPORTS ARE GETTING MORE NUMEROUS AND
LENGTHIER.
SO I WOULD ASK THE COUNCIL GIVE CONSIDERATION HOW IT WANTS
TO STRUCTURE ITS WORKSHOP AND CERTAINLY GIVE ME DIRECTION
AND I WILL BE ABLE TO ASSIST THE CHAIR IN IMPLEMENTING THAT
AND ITS RULES.
09:12:48AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
CHIEF, I SEE YOU ON LINE.
SOMETHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO ADD?
09:12:53AM >>JOHN BENNETT:
GOOD MORNING, MR. CHAIRMAN.
GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
GOOD MORNING, PUBLIC.
JOHN BENNETT, CHIEF OF STAFF.
JUST LISTENING TO THE CONVERSATION, I WILL BE BRIEF.
I APPRECIATE MR. SHELBY BRINGING FORWARD THAT SUGGESTION.
WHAT I HAVE ANALYZED OVER THE YEARS IS THAT THERE IS ABOUT
NINE WORKSHOPS A YEAR.
I WAS TRYING TO TARGET SIX OF THOSE IN THAT SEMI ANNUAL
APPROACH.
NOT TO JUST SAY THAT THIS IS THE ONLY SPACE THAT IT CAN
HAPPEN, BUT TWO FOR PARKS AND PUBLIC SAFETY.
TWO FOR HOUSING AND DEVELOPMENT AND ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY.
AND TWO FOR INFRASTRUCTURE AND MOBILITY.
AND THEN THAT ALSO BRINGS IN TWO MORE FOR THE BUDGET,
MIDYEAR REPORT AND A BUDGET WORKSHOP AFTER THE MAYOR'S
PRESENTATION OF THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR.
THAT WILL MAKE UP EIGHT OPPORTUNITIES.
AND THEN FEBRUARY WAS THE ONE THAT I KIND OF LEFT OPEN FOR,
YOU KNOW, WHATEVER ELSE MAY COME UP TOURING THE CALENDAR
YEAR, THE FISCAL YEAR.
AND THEN THERE IS TYPICALLY A GAP IN NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER
AND IN THE SUMMER.
SO, AGAIN, THAT'S WHY I WAS LOOKING AT NINE, WHETHER THERE IS
ONE MISSING IN JUNE OR JULY HAS TO BE DISCUSSED.
BUT THAT WILL ESSENTIALLY TAKE CARE OF NINE WORKSHOPS AS
PLACEHOLDERS FOR THESE LARGER WORKSHOP ISSUES.
WE ARE FLEXIBLE AND SUPPORTIVE, SO WHATEVER THE CHAIR AND
COUNCIL COME UP WITH, WE ARE HAPPY TO SUPPORT.
THANK YOU.
09:14:23AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNSELOR SHELBY.
09:14:27AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
TO COUNCILMEMBER CARLSON'S POINT, IT RAISES
THE ISSUE THAT THERE ARE THINGS THAT COUNCIL BRINGS FORTH
INDIVIDUALLY THAT ARE SOMETIMES OF A TIME-SENSITIVE NATURE
THAT SOMETIMES WE REQUIRE A LITTLE BIT MORE WORK AND A
LITTLE BIT MORE TIME.
SO IT WOULD HAVE TO WORK WITHIN SOME SORT OF FRAMEWORK
BECAUSE CERTAINLY COUNCIL -- IF FEBRUARY IS THE ONLY OPEN
WORKSHOP ONLY ONE WORKSHOP FOR CITY COUNCIL ONCE A YEAR AND
HAS TO BE SOME SORT OF A BLEND AND SOMETHING I AM WILLING TO
WORK WITH THE CHAIR, THE STAFF AND THE CHIEF OF
ADMINISTRATION TO EFFECTUATE.
COUNCIL NEEDS TO BRING THINGS FORWARD ON A TIME-SENSITIVE
NATURE AND TIME-FRIENDLY MANNER.
09:15:12AM >>BILL CARLSON:
OPPOSITE.
THIS IS CITY COUNCIL'S WORKSHOPS.
CITY COUNCIL HEARS FROM THE PUBLIC EVERY DAY AND WE BRING UP
ISSUE THAT ARE IMPORTANT TO REVIEW AND WE WANT STAFF TO
REVIEW AND WHAT THE CHIEF OF STAFF PRESENTED IS THE
ADMINISTRATION WILL CONTROL ALL NINE.
WHAT HAPPENED TO SEPARATION OF POWERS.
JOB WHY THE CITY ATTORNEY IS NOT STEPPING UP SAYING THE
ADMINISTRATION IS TRYING TO USURP THE POWER OF INDEPENDENT
POWERS OF CITY COUNCIL.
I MEAN A SEPARATION OF POWER HERE.
WE HAVE GOT ISSUES AND SERIOUS SUBSTANTIVE ISSUES TO DISCUSS
TODAY AND IT SUDDENLY BECAME REAL ESTATE THEMED EVEN THOUGH
WE BOOKED SOME OF THESE SIX TO EIGHT MONTHS AGO.
BASED ON THE SCHEDULE HE DESCRIBED, ONE TIME A YEAR IS CITY
COUNCIL GOING TO PUT SOMETHING ON THE AGENDA.
IMAGINE IF COUNCILMAN VIERA WANTED TO BRING UP
APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAM OR SOMETHING RELATED TO DISABILITIES,
DOESN'T FIT ANY OF THE THEMES THAT JUST CAME UP.
DOESN'T GIVE US ANY FLEXIBILITY WHATSOEVER.
WHAT IT IS THE ADMINISTRATION PROGRAMMING WHAT THEY WANT US
TO HEAR.
AND WE HAVE THE RIGHT TO ASK THEM IF THEY CAN LOBBY US, YOU
KNOW AS THEY ARE DOING ON A LOT MUCH ISSUES ALREADY.
BUT HANDING OVER THE WORKSHOPS TO THEM.
WE HAND OVER MOST OF THE REGULAR AGENDA TO THEM.
WHEN CAN WE BRING UP THE ISSUES THAT CONSTITUENTS WANT US TO
BRING UP.
09:16:35AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA AND THEN COUNCILMAN
VIERA.
09:16:38AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
WE HAVE ONE ITEM OR 15 ITEMS OR 20 ITEMS.
THE PUBLIC IS THE ONE THAT WE SERVE, THE EIGHT OF US, THAT
INCLUDES THE ADMINISTRATION AND CITY COUNCILMEMBERS.
SO I AM NOT AGAINST ANYTHING THAT IS HAPPENING.
I AM FOR GIVING -- YOU WANT AN ITEM.
YOU WANT SIX, SEVEN OR EIGHT ITEMS CUT OFF, THAT'S FINE.
BUT I SUGGEST MAYBE THE CHAIR CAN HAVE MORE DIRECT
CONVERSATION WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THE AGENDA.
I AM NOT SAYING YOU DON'T, SIR.
BUT MAYBE YOU CAN SAY WE GOT TOO MANY.
WE NEED TO STOP IT HERE.
HAVE IT ON COUNCIL DISCUSSION.
HAVEN'T HAD THE FIRST ONE YET AND DISCUSSING AN ITEM THAT IS
NOT ON THE AGENDA.
SO THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT YOU GOT TO LOOK AT.
WE GOT TO BE TIME FOCUSED AND REALIZE -- I AM NOT SAYING WE
DON'T, BECAUSE WE DO, BUT I DON'T LIKE TO BICKER ABOUT
THINGS THAT ARE SMALL.
AND I AM NOT SAYING THIS IS SMALL.
WANT SOMETHING DONE WHEN IT IS ON THE AGENDA COMPLETED.
ALREADY TODAY WE HAVE -- HOW MANY CONTINUATIONS FROM THIS
AGENDA TO ANOTHER AGENDA.
SO THAT AGENDA THEN IS GOING TO BE FULL WITHOUT EVEN
STARTING IT, BECAUSE WE MOVED SOME ITEMS FROM ONE AREA TO
THE OTHER AREA.
SO NOT WHAT SIDE YOU ARE ON OR THE OTHER SIDE, THIS IS ABOUT
ALL OF US PLAYING IN THE SAME FIELD TO HAVE THE SAME GOALS
AND MAKE SURE THAT THE PUBLIC IS THE WINNER.
THAT'S ALL I GOT TO SAY.
I AM NOT SAYING WE ARE NOT DOING THAT, BUT WE NEED TO FIND A
BETTER WAY DEFINING IT, THAT'S ALL.
09:18:06AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
09:18:08AM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.
I THINK THAT WE SHOULD HAVE A MOTION IN PLACE TO ASK OUR
CHAIR TO WORK WITH OUR COUNSEL WITH THREE BASIC ISSUES: TO
LIMIT THE NUMBER OF WORKSHOPS PUT ON THE AGENDA, VERY SIMPLE
TO A CERTAIN AMOUNT.
THEY CAN COME UP WITH A PROPOSAL.
AND DEAL WITH -- IF ANY ISSUES WITH THE ADMINISTRATION,
THINGS THAT ARE PUT ON THE AGENDA, ETC., TO HAVE A POLICY SO
THE ISSUES CAN BE WEIGHED OUT AND DEALING WITH STAFF REPORTS
AND HAVE IT COME BACK IN TWO WEEKS.
THAT'S IT.
END OF STORY.
09:18:38AM >>BILL CARLSON:
SECOND.
09:18:42AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
09:18:45AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
PLEASE, IF I CAN, MADAM CLERK -- OR MR.
VIERA.
YOU SAY TWO WEEKS --
09:18:51AM >>LUIS VIERA:
CHAIR AND COUNSEL.
09:18:52AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
I KNOW --
09:18:54AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR.
09:18:56AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES, SIR, RESTATE -- MY MOTION IS TO SIMPLY
HAVE THE CHAIR AND OUR ATTORNEY, MR. SHELBY, WORK IN A POLICY
TO LIMIT THE NUMBER OF WORKSHOPS THAT CAN BE PROPOSED EITHER
FROM EACH COUNCILMEMBER ON AN AGENDA OR WHATEVER IT MAY BE
THAT INCLUDES WORKING WITH ADMINISTRATION -- TO HAVE A
HOLISTIC POINT OF VIEW AND LIMITING STAFF REPORTS.
WE DO THAT AND WE SOLVE 99% OF OUR PROBLEMS.
MAYBE 60%, WHATEVER.
BUT WE SOLVE A GREAT MANY OF OUR PROBLEMS.
LEAVE IT TO THE CHAIR OR MR. SHELBY WHEN IT WILL COME BACK.
NOVEMBER 17, IS THAT GOOD, SIR?
09:19:36AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THAT GOOD FOR RESTATING THE MOTION?
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
09:19:43AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I SAID A LONG TIME AGO WHEN I WAS A
CHAIRMAN AND I WILL SAY IT AGAIN.
YOU HAVE A HEAD COACH.
MR. SHELBY, YOU ARE THE HEAD COACH.
I TOLD YOU THAT MANY A TIMES, SIR.
KEEP SAYING THAT.
YOU ARE THE HEAD COACH.
THE CHAIRMAN IS THE QUARTERBACK.
THE QUARTERBACK RUNS THE SHOW.
YOU ARE THE HEAD COACH.
YOU GIVE THE OVERVIEW, THE SCHEME A LITTLE BIT.
AND, AGAIN, MR. VIERA BROUGHT UP THE POINT.
WORKING WITH THE CHAIR.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF RELATIONSHIP YOU HAVE WITH THE
CHAIR OR NOT, BUT I THINK SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT COME UP,
YOU AND --
09:20:18AM >> THE BROADCAST IS NOW STARTING.
09:20:21AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
LIKE ME AND YOU DID.
I THINK THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE COUNCIL AND THE
COUNCILMEMBERS AND THE CHAIR NEED TO BE STRONGER WITH ALL
COUNCILMEMBERS BECAUSE I HAVE SEEN A LACK OF DISRESPECT FOR
YOU BY CERTAIN COUNCILMEMBERS.
I AM NOT MENTIONING NAMES, BUT I THINK IT IS DOWNRIGHT
WRONG.
YOU ARE THE LEAD COUNSEL FOR THIS COUNCIL.
YOU DON'T ANSWER TO THE CITY ATTORNEY.
YOUR JOB IS TO GUIDE IN COUNCIL.
I TOLD YOU MANY, MANY TIMES THAT SOMETIMES I DON'T SEE THAT
BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO FIGHT WITH THE ADMINISTRATION.
I DON'T CARE ABOUT THAT.
YOU ARE MY COUNSEL.
IT IS YOUR JOB TO PROTECT THIS HOUSE, REGARDLESS.
SO, AGAIN, I DON'T WANT TO SAY THAT AGAIN.
I THINK THAT A LOT OF COUNCIL SEEING IT THAT WAY NOW.
I WANT YOU TO BE COACH AND THE CHAIRMAN TO BE QUARTERBACK.
THE COACH NEEDS TO LEAD THE QUARTERBACK HOW WE NEED TO RUN.
I APPRECIATE IT.
I YIELD BACK.
09:21:21AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY COMMENTS.
COUNCIL, WE ARE A DIFFERENT COUNCIL THAN THE OTHER COUNCILS
THAT COME BEFORE US.
WE ARE HEARING MORE AND MORE AND MORE AND MORE AT EACH ONE
OF OUR COUNCIL MEETINGS, WHETHER IT BE WORKSHOPS, WHETHER IT
BE STAFF REPORTS, REZONINGS, ABs.
COUNCIL, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO GO TO ANOTHER DAY.
MAYBE TWO MORE DAY AS MONTH.
IF WE ARE GOING TO TAKE CARE OF THE BUSINESS OF THIS CITY.
LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE ON COUNCILMAN VIERA'S MOTION.
09:22:03AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
09:22:08AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
09:22:13AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
09:22:14AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
09:22:15AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
09:22:17AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:

09:22:20AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
ANY OTHER --
09:22:27AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
MR. CHAIRMAN SINCE WE ARE TALKING OF DAYS
AND SO FORTH, MR. CHAIRMAN I AM GOING TO ASK YOU TO PUT ON
THE CHARTER REVIEW.
THIS COUNCIL AND THIS CITY HAS GROWN TREMENDOUSLY.
I MEAN TREMENDOUSLY.
WE ARE NO LONGER A LITTLE CITY.
THIS IS A FULL-TIME JOB.
NO LONGER A PART-TIME JOB.
IT SAYS "PART-TIME."
I AM GOING TO RECOMMEND AT THE CHARTER REVIEW THAT THE CITY
CHARTER BE CHANGED THAT CITY COUNCIL BE A FULL-TIME
POSITION.
THE HOURS THAT SOME OF US ARE WORKING, OUT IN THE
COMMUNITIES, FOR OUR FAMILIES.
THIS NEEDS TO BE STATED AS SUCH AS THIS POSITION IS NO
LONGER PART-TIME, AND I WANT TO HAVE THAT DISCUSSION DURING
THE CHARTER REVIEW.
09:23:10AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
DO YOU NEED A SECOND?
09:23:13AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO.
09:23:14AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
A SECOND.
09:23:15AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MOTION BY COUNCILMAN GUDES.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ALL IN FAVOR.
09:23:20AM >>LUIS VIERA:
IF I MAY EXPLAIN MY VOTE, SIR.
NO, AGAIN, I AM GLAD TO DISCUSS THAT BY VOTING.
I AM NOT VOTING YES -- I AM JUST -- AS A COURTESY TO HAVE
THAT DISCUSSION.
THANK YOU.
09:23:32AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYTHING FURTHER ON THE AGENDA.
09:23:37AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
THERE WAS NO VOTE ON THAT?
09:23:44AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ARE WE GOOD?
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION ON THE AGENDA?
09:23:48AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
MADAM CLERK.
WAS THERE A VOTE?
09:23:51AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES, WE DID.
WE SAID ALL IN FAVOR.
ALL IN FAVOR.
AYE.
OKAY.
ANYTHING ELSE ON THE AGENDA?
YES, MA'AM, YOU -- I UNDERSTAND YOU WOULD LIKE TO HAVE
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 1, 3, 4, 5, 7, 8 AND 15 ALL HEARD
TOGETHER.
09:24:20AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
YES, SIR, GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
NICOLE TRAVIS, DIRECTOR OF DEVELOPMENT AND ECONOMIC
OPPORTUNITY.
WE SUBMITTED A MEMO THAT THOSE ITEMS BE BUNDLED TOGETHER.
THOSE ARE ITEMS THAT YOU REQUESTED FOR US TO COME BACK TO
YOU IN A WORKSHOP FORM.
THAT IS WHY WE ARE HERE.
MISS FEELEY AND MR. COTTON ARE GOING TO PRESENT MOST OF
THOSE ITEMS TO YOU.
ITEM NUMBER 15, WHILE IT IS ON YOUR AGENDA, I HAVE TO BEG
YOUR FORGIVENESS.
I DROPPED THE BALL IN UPLOADING THE ITEMS TO SIRE.
I HAVE A HANDOUT.
NOT TAKING ANY ACTION ON COMMUNITY BENEFITS AGREEMENT.
STRICTLY INFORMATIONAL.
WE DID PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT AND IF YOU WOULD INDULGE US AND
ALLOW US -- TO WALK ON THESE ITEMS FOR YOU TODAY.
I HEARD YOU LOUD AND CLEAR WANTING THE ITEMS AHEAD OF TIME.
AND IT WAS IN MY IN-BOX AND I DROPPED THE BALL.
ASKING FOR YOUR INDULGENCE TO PRESENT THAT INFORMATION TO
YOU TODAY IF YOU WOULD, PLEASE.
09:25:16AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WITHOUT OBJECTION.
09:25:17AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
SECOND.
09:25:19AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE WILL GO AHEAD HEARING 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8
AND 15 WITH THE PRESENTATION FROM MISS NICOLE.
MR. SHELBY.
09:25:32AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
YES, THANK YOU.
COUNCIL, I WANT TO BRING THIS TO YOUR ATTENTION, WHEN YOU
HAVE THE ITEMS BUNDLED TOGETHER SPECIFICALLY WHEN IT AFFECTS
CHANGES IN THE CODE.
I SPOKE WITH MISS FEELEY ABOUT THIS EARLY THIS MORNING.
WHAT I RECOMMEND STRONGLY IS THAT WHAT YOU DO IS WHEN YOU
FINISH A SUBJECT MATTER WITHIN THAT PRESENTATION, YOU ACT ON
A DECISION POINT.
IF THERE IS A DECISION POINT TO BE MADE.
RATHER THAN HEARING THE WHOLE PRESENTATION WITHOUT
INTERRUPTION AND HAVING TO RECALL THE FIRST ITEM AFTER THE
SIX OR SEVEN ITEMS HAVE BEEN BROUGHT UP.
IN TERMS OF THE WAY THE WORKSHOP SHOULD BE STRUCTURED WHEN
ITEMS ARE BUNDLED, I ASK THAT COUNCIL TAKE THE TIME TO
REFLECT UPON WHAT YOU HAVE HEARD AND IF A DECISION POINT IS
TO BE TAKEN TO TAKE IT AT THAT TIME AND MOVE IT ON TO THE
NEXT ITEM, PLEASE.
09:26:20AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
CAN I HAND THESE OUT?
09:26:26AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SURE.
WE WILL GO TO PUBLIC COMMENT.
09:26:29AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
THANK YOU.
09:26:30AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AT THIS TIME WE WILL TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT.
ANYBODY IN CHAMBERS WHO WISH TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT AT THIS
TIME.
PLEASE FORM A LINE TO MY LEFT, YOUR RIGHT.
09:26:45AM >>BILL CARLSON:
MR. CHAIR, CAN I ASK AV THAT SHOWS THAT THE
BROADCAST IS NOT UP.
AND OUR MONITORS ARE NOT UP EITHER.
09:26:59AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE WILL NOW TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT AT THIS
TIME.
09:27:15AM >> GOOD MORNING, MY NAME IS STANLEY GRAY.
3020 WEST HARBORVIEW AVENUE.
I'M HERE REPRESENTING THE INTERESTS OF THE URBAN LEAGUE OF
HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY AT 1250 RAY CHARLES BOULEVARD.
I AM ASKING YOU TO SUPPORT AND LEGITIMIZE AS WELL AS
LEGISLATURE ALL ISSUES PERTAINING TO THE ACCEPTANCE OF
ACCESSORY BUILDINGS.
I AM ALSO ASKING YOU TO ASSIST IN THE FUTURE THE URBAN
LEAGUE OF HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY TO OBTAIN CITY PROPERTY SO WE
CAN ACTUALLY BUILD AND MAKE MORE ACCESSORY BUILDINGS,
HOUSING FOR SPECIFIC PARTIES, SENIOR CITIZENS ON FIXED
INCOMES, AS WELL AS RETURNING CITIZENS.
NOSE TWO PARTIES OR DESIGNATIONS ARE TWO OF THE FASTEST
GROWING HOMELESS POPULATIONS WITHIN OUR CITY.
I THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION OF MY REQUEST.
09:28:13AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
NEXT.
09:28:18AM >> GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
NATHAN HAGAN REPRESENTING NIMBY TAMPA TODAY.
I AM FOCUSING ON THIS.
THE MOST IMPORTANT ITEM ON THE AGENDA TODAY.
I AM JUST WANT TO FOCUS ON WHAT I BELIEVE THE MISSION IS WHY
WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THIS RIGHT NOW.
WE HAVE AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING CRISIS.
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS HAVE MANY DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES,
THE WAY PEOPLE LOOK AT IT.
BUT THE WAY WE NEED TO LOOK AT THIS TODAY, HOW DOES THIS
PROVIDE HOUSING FOR PEOPLE WHO NEED IT.
I WOULD JUST EMPHASIZE THE GOALS IN MY MIND OF THESE CHANGES
ARE TO CREATE AS MUCH AFFORDABLE HOUSING AS WE POSSIBLY CAN.
SO WHEN WE LOOK AT THE OPTIONS, THERE ARE WAYS TO BICKER OH,
WELL, PEOPLE WILL SAY SOMETHING ABOUT ACCESSORY -- OR AIRBNB
THAT WE CAN'T REGULATE AND WE KNOW WE CAN'T.
THE NUISANCE IS NOT A GOOD REASON TO SAY NO TO AFFORDABLE
HOUSING.
I WOULD ASK COUNCIL TO KEEP THAT IN MIND TODAY AS WE HAVE
THESE DISCUSSIONS.
IN PARTICULAR, I HEARD FROM NEIGHBORHOODS AS I HAVE GONE OUT
AND SPOKE WITH FOLKS.
THAT THE HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS ARE GOING TO BE A CONCENSUS
TOPIC WHEN IT COMES TO VOTING AND SO DO THE SETBACKS.
I WANT TO ENCOURAGE YOU HOW THAT MIGHT EFFECT WHETHER UNITS
WILL BE BUILT OR NOT BE BUILT.
TO THE EXTENT THEY WILL NOT BE BUILT, THAT SHOULD UNDERMINE
CRITICISM TO THOSE ITEMS.
THERE ARE THREE THINGS THAT ARE NOT BEING PROPOSED THAT I
WOULD LIKE TO SEE DISCUSSED TODAY WHICH I HOPE ARE PROPOSED
MAYBE ON A SEPARATE CODE CHANGE AFTER THESE ONE THAT ARE
PROPOSED.
THOSE ARE, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE REMOVAL OF THE OFF-STREET
PARKING REQUIREMENT.
THE PEOPLE WHO SHOULD BE LIVING IN THESE HOMES ARE THE
PEOPLE LESS LIKELY TO OWN CARS.
TO REQUIRE THEM TO PAY FOR PARKING IN THEIR RENT I DON'T
THINK IS USEFUL.
AND WE SHOULD ALLOW IT CITYWIDE, THAT INCLUDES IN SOUTH
TAMPA AND THE FEW PLACES IN NORTH TAMPA THAT WILL NOT BE
PROHIBITED BY DEED RESTRICTION.
THOSE PLACES SHOULD BE ELIGIBLE TO HAVE THEM AS WELL.
AS WELL AS YBOR.
I DON'T THINK YBOR IS CONSIDERED UNDER THIS CHANGE.
WHY WOULDN'T YBOR BE ABLE TO HAVE ACCESS.
WE NEED THAT AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.
AND FINALLY -- AND I THINK THIS GOES BACK TO WHAT STANLEY
WAS SAYING IS THIS CAN'T JUST BE FOR HOMEOWNERS AND PEOPLE
OCCUPYING THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE.
LANDLORDS THAT WOULD LIKE TO BUILD MORE HOUSING AND RENT IT
OUT AT AFFORDABLE RATES.
NOT ALL OF THEM WILL BE AFFORDABLE, BUT SOME WILL BE A GOOD
DEAL THAN WILL BE.
AND NONPROFITS THAT WOULD LIKE TO OPERATE PROPERTIES ARE
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS AND WOULDN'T BE IN WHAT IS BEING
PROPOSED.
I WILL ASK TO REMOVE ANY RESTRICTIONS OF PRIMARY RESIDENCE
BEING OCCUPIED BY THE HOMEOWNER.
I DON'T THINK THAT WILL HELP US BUILD MORE UNITS.
I UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE HAVE THAT PERSPECTIVE, BUT I WILL
ASK NOT TO HAVE THOSE THINGS.
THOSE ARE MY RECOMMENDATIONS FOR TODAY.
AND I HOPE THAT CITY COUNCIL TAKES THIS AS AN AFFORDABLE
HOUSING ISSUE AND NOT A NUISANCE MINIMIZATION ISSUE.
THANK YOU.
09:31:19AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
09:31:20AM >> MY NAME IS PASTOR WILLIAMS.
LOCATED 1112 EAST SCOTT STREET, PARADISE MISSIONARY BAPTIST
CHURCH.
YOU KNOW I HAVE BEEN COMING DOWN HERE YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER
YEAR AND DON'T GET NO KIND OF RESULT.
BUT THE THING ABOUT IT, I GUESS I AM TALKING TO THE WRONG
PEOPLE.
I NEED TO TALK TO GOD MORE ABOUT THIS SITUATION.
I JUST -- WHEN I USED TO COME DOWN HERE A LONG TIME AGO,
THEY DIDN'T HAVE A BLACK MAN SITTING UP THERE.
AND THEY DIDN'T HAVE A WHITE WOMAN SITTING UP THERE.
IT WAS ALL WHITE MEN.
AND WE THOUGHT ABOUT HAVING A BLACK MAN SITTING UP THERE AND
A WOMAN SITTING UP THERE, WE WILL GET SOME RESULTS, BUT IT
SEEMS LIKE IT DONE GOT WORSE.
YOU KNOW, YOU ALL KNOW THAT I KEEP MY TRUST IN GOD.
I DIDN'T COME TOWN HERE WITH NO WALKER TODAY BECAUSE I FELL
IN THE ELEVATOR LAST WEEK.
POLICEMAN OUT THERE HAD TO GET ME OUT.
NOW I AM WALKING WITH THIS CANE, AND IT WORSER THAN MY
WALKER, BUT I AM TRYING TO DO THE BEST HE CAN.
STAND UP FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS OF ALL PEOPLE.
ANY OF YOU CIVIL RIGHTS LAWYERS?
IF YOU DO, I NEED YOU.
BECAUSE I GET NO RESULT AT MY CHURCH.
AND I AM A SENIOR CITIZEN.
I AM ON A FIXED INCOME AND YOU TREAT ME WORSER THAN YOU DO
SOME OF Y'ALL'S DAMN DOGS.
I AM TRYING TO DO THE BEST I CAN TO KEEP MY CONGREGATION
COMING BACK AND WORSHIP GOD ALMIGHTY BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT IT
IS ALL ABOUT AND HAPPY TO BE HERE TODAY.
ALTHOUGH PAINFUL, BUT I THANK GOD THAT I'M HERE.
I AM NOT TRYING TO IT BE -- SPEAKING FOR THE BLACK FOLK.
NO, I SPEAK FOR EVERYBODY, BECAUSE I AM A PREACHER.
AND THAT IS WHAT IT IS ALL ABOUT.
WE WANT EVERYBODY TO GO TO GLORY.
EVERYBODY WILL BE UP THERE WITH JESUS CHRIST.
IT IS COMING THAT DAY ONE DAY WHEN WE ARE NOT GOING TO BE
ABLE TO COME DOWN HERE.
WE WILL BE DEAD AND GONE ON TO GLORY.
BUT YOU KNOW WHAT, I AM HAPPILY COMING DOWN HERE BECAUSE YOU
CAN SEE -- I ASKED THE YOUNG LADY THE OTHER DAY.
HOW COME YOU DON'T COME TO THE CITY COUNCIL MEETING ANYMORE.
THEY SAID YOU DON'T DO NOTHING FOR ME.
AND DON'T DO FOR SOMEBODY THAT LOOK LIKE US.
I SAY ONE DAY WE MIGHT CHANGE.
I WAS BORN IN 1938.
I WAS BORN BEFORE ALL OF YOU ALL AND THANK GOD THAT I AM
STILL HERE, ALIVE AND STILL KICKING.
I WANT YOU TO DO SOMETHING FOR ME AND WHAT IS RIGHT FOR ALL
PEOPLE.
THE BLACK, THE MEXICAN, THE JEWS, THE WHITE FOLK, AND
EVERYBODY ELSE.
DON'T JUST PICK OUT CERTAIN PEOPLE THAT YOU ALL WANT TO BE
CATERED TO.
BE CATER TO EVERYBODY.
ESPECIALLY THESE PEOPLE SITTING UP HERE WAITING TO COME UP
HERE TO BE WHERE I AM.
I HEARD IT.
THANK YOU.
GOD BLESS ALL OF Y'ALL.
I GOT TO GET OUT OF HERE.
09:34:38AM >> MENTESNOT, TAMPA, FLORIDA.
LOST MY KEYS LAST WEEK.
I WANT TO THANK EVERYBODY WHO ASSISTED ME IN FINDING THEM
AND LOCATING THEM.
I WAS ABLE TO FIND THEM.
A LOT OF NICE PEOPLE OUT THERE IN THE WORLD.
WHAT I'M HERE TO SAY THIS MORNING IS IT IS AN IGNORANT
PROCESS YOU HAVE GOING ON HERE.
THIS INVOCATION STUPIDNESS.
ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY IGNORANT.
PROBABLY ILLEGAL UNCONSTITUTIONAL.
AND YOU NEED TO GIVE INDIVIDUALS EQUAL TIME OR SOME FORM OF
REBUTTAL TO MAKE IT FAIR.
WEEK AFTER WEEK YOU HAVE IGNORANT PEOPLE THANKING Y'ALL.
THANKING GOD.
THANKING JESUS CHRIST.
THANKING STUPIDITY.
BLESSING THIS PERSON.
BLESSING THAT PERSON.
NOT REFLECTIVE OF POOR AND WORKING-CLASS PEOPLE IN THIS CITY
AND ANY OTHER CITY THROUGHOUT THE WORLD.
SO THAT IS UNFAIR FOR THE VOTERS TO PUT Y'ALL UP THERE TO
HAVE THIS IGNORANCE, PEOPLE COMING DOWN HERE BEGGING FOR
$1500 FOR JUNETEENTH, FOR A PARK AND 34th STREET.
BLACK PEOPLE HAVE BIGGER ISSUES THAN THAT.
APPEAR AND ALL THIS IGNORANT STUFF THAT YOU DO DOESN'T MAKE
ANY SENSE.
ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY NO SENSE.
IT IS UNFAIR.
UNFAIR.
HURTFUL AND HARMFUL.
NOTHING MORE AND NOTHING LESS.
THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE.
INVOCATIONS NEED TO BE REMOVED FROM THE AGENDA OR ALLOW
EQUAL TIME FOR REBUTTAL RESPONSE.
THIS AGENDA SHOULD SHOW RESPECT TO THE AFRICAN PEOPLE IN
THIS CITY BY PLACING REPARATIONS ITEM IN THE AGENDA.
THIS CITY LIKE MOST CITIES ARE ON AUTOMATIC.
THESE CITY COUNCILS ARE DISTRIBUTORS OF TAX MONEY COLLECTED
FROM THE MASSES OF PEOPLE WHO WERE DISRESPECTED YEAR AROUND
UNTIL IT IS ELECTION TIME.
THE ONLY TIME THESE TALKING HEADS STEP UP TO THE PLATE IS
WHEN THE GAME IS OVER.
DID THEY STEP UP TO THE PLATE $150 MILLION PROJECT GOING ON
BEFORE COUNCIL DISCUSSION?
NO.
DID THEY STEP UP TO THE PLATE ON A 18% POLICE PAY INCREASE?
NO.
THEY DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH THE INCREASE WAS GOING TO BE.
THEY SAY 18% AND THEY DON'T TELL THE TAXPAYERS NOTHING.
DID THEY STEP UP ON THE PLATE ON A $1 BILLION BUDGET THAT
GOT STUFFED DOWN THE CITY'S VOTE AND NOTHING FOR IT FOR 26 %
OF THE AFRICAN COMMUNITY?
NO.
DID THEY STEP UP TO THE PLATE WHEN POLICE WERE ABUSING THE
AFRICAN COMMUNITY?
NO, STEP UP TO THE PLATE TO SOLVE AND RESOLVE ANY REAL
PROBLEMS INSIDE THE AFRICAN COMMUNITY?
NO.
THIS CITY COUNCIL AND ANY OTHER CITY COUNCIL BEFORE IT HAS
DONE NOT ONE SINGLE THING FOR AFRICAN PEOPLE OR THE AFRICAN
COMMUNITY AND A REAL HOUSING CRISIS IN CITY AND OTHER
CITIES.
NOT A HOUSING CRISIS BUT A GLOBAL, NEW WAVE OF WHITE PEOPLE
MAN FEST DESTINY.
MOVING WHITE PEOPLE AND NORMALLY MOVING.INDIANS AND OTHER
INDIGENOUS PEOPLE OFF OF THEIR LAND, NOW MOVING WHITE
PEOPLE.
AND NOW THIS CITY COUNCIL NEEDS TO STEP UP AND DO SOMETHING.
26% OF THE POPULATION AND WE WANT TO SEE SOME RESULTS.
THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO SEE.
09:37:55AM >> THANK YOU.
I AM GETTING OLD.
I NEED TO SIT DOWN.
RUNNING FOR VICE PRESIDENT OF THE NAACP ON NOVEMBER 17.
I NEED EVERYBODY'S VOTE TO GET IT STRAIGHT.
MISS FEELEY TALKING OF TEXT AMENDMENT.
WE NEED IT IN WEST TAMPA.
CHARLIE, 30-YEAR PLAN ON INCINERATOR.
I WANT TO HEAR THAT VERY CLEAR.
DON'T WANT TO LOSE THE JEWEL.
A SUSTAINABLE PLANT.
IF DONE RIGHT.
I AM ONE OF THE EXPERTS ON IT.
COMMUNITY BENEFIT AGREEMENT.
DIDN'T HAVE BACK-UP IN HERE BUT GOT ONE ON ROME YARD.
HOPEFULLY THIS ONE WILL BE WORTH SOUTH CAROLINA, DON'T KNOW
YET.
16, DPR.
HMM ... I WILL HOLD MY THOUGHTS ON THAT.
A WHOLE PAGE ABOUT ANY NORTH BUSINESSES.
THE EXPERT IN THIS AREA ON MINORITY BUSINESS AND NOBODY
ASKING ME NOTHING.
AND 17, HANNA.
APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAM.
AIN'T OFF THE GROUND YET.
LISTEN.
I COME DOWN HERE AND I WILL BE HERE ALL DAY.
I DECIDED TO TAKE A DAY AND SIT HERE, OBSERVE AND DOCUMENT,
FACE TO FACE.
AND I AIN'T EVEN GOT MY MASK ON BECAUSE I AIN'T WORRIED
ABOUT COVID BECAUSE IF I GO, I WILL GO.
LET ME TELL YOU THIS.
I HAVE BEEN HELPING THIS CITY FOR DECADES.
EVERYBODY CALLS ME GOOD, BAD, UGLY, THEY HATE ME, ONE THING
OF JOE ROBINSON, IF I TELL YOU SOMETHING, YOU OUGHT TO DO
SOMETHING ABOUT IT AND TAKE IT SERIOUSLY.
EVERYBODY LISTENING, THE NAACP, LISTEN.
SCHOOL BOARD TOO.
LISTEN.
I KNOW A LOT AND DO A LOT AND I ASK FOR NOT ONE DIME BACK.
ZERO.
I THINK ALL OF YOU KNOW THAT AND I GO TO CHURCH EVERY
SUNDAY, RIGHT.
GUIDO.
WHAT I AM SAYING IS I'M HERE TO HELP.
NOT DESTROY IT.
THE PROBLEM YOU HAVE IS WE HAVE A GROWING CITY.
WE HAVE SO MANY DIFFERENT THINGS BEING DESIGNED.
SO MANY PEOPLE COMING TO TOWN.
WE HAVE SO MUCH DEVELOPMENT.
Y'ALL AIN'T GOT ENOUGH TIME ON THE AGENDA TO CARRY THAT.
THAT IS WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT ON THE AGENDA FOR 20
MINUTES.
YOU GOT TO FIGURE OUT MORE TIME.
GOT TO FIGURE OUT MORE TIME TO HANDLE THE BUSINESS OF THE
CITY.
THE MOST COMPLEX THIS HAS EVER BEEN.
WE HAD A REGULAR MICKEY MOUSE BUDGET 20 YEARS AGO.
WE HAVE A BILLION DOLLAR BUDGET.
THINGS ARE GROWING, BUT NOT THE TIME TO SPEND ON THEM.
I ASK THAT YOU DO SPEND MORE TIME.
PICK ANOTHER DAY.
WHATEVER YOU GOT TO DO TO GET THE BACKLOG TAKEN CARE OF, AND
THEN YOU WILL BE BACK TO NORMAL.
AS SOON AS YOU GET YOUR BACKLOG DONE -- I HAVE A BUSINESS.
I DO MY BACKLOG.
I HAVE NOTHING TO DO BUT JANUARY 2023 TO FIND OUT WHAT IS
GOING ON.
TELL THE TRUTH.
AND KEEP EVERYBODY AROUND HERE HAPPY.
AND LET'S CUT THIS NONSENSE OUT.
WE WILL BE HERE WITH YOU ALL DAY DOCUMENTING FOR FUTURE
REFERENCE.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.
09:40:55AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
ANYBODY ELSE IN CHAMBERS --
09:41:06AM >> THANK YOU.
I AM SORRY I AM OUT OF BREATH BECAUSE I THOUGHT PUBLIC
COMMENT WAS AT THE END, AND I THOUGHT IT WAS UP -- AT THE
BEGINNING AND THEN I HEARD MR. SHELBY AS I WAS IN THE CAR
DRIVING SAYING YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE IT AFTER EVERY ITEM.
SO I AM GOING TO GO NOW BECAUSE I BARELY MADE IT.
I AM SUSAN SWIFT.
MY ADDRESS IS 3621 SOUTH HESPERIDES STREET IN TAMPA.
AND I WILL TAKE A DEEP BREATH AND GET TO MY COMMENTS.
I'M HERE ABOUT THE TEXT AMENDMENTS.
SO I AM GOING TO BUNDLE MY COMMENTS HERE.
I THINK I HAVE AN UNIQUE PERSPECTIVE ON THIS AND
QUALIFICATIONS.
I'M HERE REPRESENTING MYSELF AS A CERTIFIED PLANNER AND A
RESIDENT AND HOMEOWNER OF THE CITY.
THOSE WHO DON'T KNOW ME SHOULD KNOW I WAS THE ZONING DIRECTOR
FOR THE CITY FOR 20 YEARS IN THE '80s AND '90s AND I OPENED THE
CONSTRUCTION SERVICES CENTER, AND I WROTE MUCH OF THE ZONING
CODE WHICH ADMITTEDLY HAD GREAT AND NOT-SO-GREAT CHANGES
FROM THAT EDITION OF IT.
I FEEL SO STRONGLY OF SOME OF THESE TEXT AMENDMENTS THAT ARE
PROPOSED TODAY THAT I ACTUALLY TOOK THE DAY A YOU HAVE TO
SPEAK IN PERSON TODAY.
AGAIN, I APOLOGIZE FOR MY BREATHING.
AND I ALSO OFFER IN ADVANCE TO MEET REQUEST ANY OF YOU TO
DISCUSS THE DRAFTS OF THESE IN MORE DETAIL AND THE
IMPLICATIONS THEY HAVE ON THE GROUND WHEN APPLIED.
THERE ARE SEVERAL THAT ARE GREAT CONCEPTS, BUT AS WRITTEN
AND PERHAPS UNENFORCEABLE IN SOME CASES.
EITHER WAY, I THINK SOME OF THESE ARE GOING TO CREATE SOME
UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES THAT ARE VERY SERIOUS AND WILL
ACTUALLY RUIN THE CHARACTER OF SOME OF OUR WONDERFUL
NEIGHBORHOODS.
I HEARD SOME ITEMS WERE REMOVED.
I COULDN'T KEEP TRACK OF WHAT THEY WERE.
SO I AM GOING TO TELL YOU BY TITLE, NOT NUMBER, WHICH ONES I
AM SPEAKING ON TODAY.
AND I HAVE OTHER CONCERNS ABOUT SOME OF THE OTHERS, BUT
THESE ARE THE THREE THAT I FIND MOST IMPORTANT.
AND MY -- MY BIGGEST -- THOSE ARE THE ACCESSORY DWELLING
UNITS, MULTIFAMILY, AND TOWNHOUSES IN ALL COMMERCIAL
DISTRICTS AND ARTERIAL AND COLLECTORS WHICH -- AND I WILL
ALSO PROVIDE WRITTEN COMMENTS, BUT AS I SAID, I FEEL REALLY
STRONGLY ABOUT THIS.
THERE ARE -- THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, I THINK -- WELL,
ALL OF THEM, I THINK THESE THREE ARE MAJOR CHANGES IN POLICY
THAT WARRANT BEING IN THE PLAN UPDATE NOT -- NOT PRESENTED
AS TWEAKS TO THE ZONING CODE.
AND THOSE ARE THOSE THREE THAT I MENTIONED: ACCESSORY
DWELLING UNITS AND THE OTHER TWO.
09:44:31AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
GIVE YOU 30 SECONDS MORE.
09:44:33AM >> THANK YOU.
AND THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS I WILL GET TO.
DOUBLES THE DENSITY IN THESE THREE AREAS OF THE CITY.
I AM NOT SURE QUESTION A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IF THIS LITTLE
TWEAK WILL DO THAT.
THE NUMBER OF LOTS, SINGLE-FAMILY LOTS THAT WILL NOW HAVE
TWO, I WOULD ASK YOU TO ASK HOW MANY LOTS THERE ARE IN THESE
THREE -- IT IS BASICALLY A THIRD OF THE CITY.
SO WE ARE DOUBLING THE DENSITY IN A THIRD OF THE CITY.
IT'S -- THE -- HAVING NO PARKING, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE
ARBITRARY -- THE ARBITRARY NUMBERS.
THEY SEEM ARBITRARY TO ME.
NO PARKING FOR SMALL UNITS.
WHERE ARE THEY GOING TO PARK.
WE DON'T HAVE GOOD TRANSIT.
SAME THING FOR 900-SQUARE-FOOT UNITS.
THERE IS NO WRITTEN PART OF THIS THAT SAYS YOU CAN'T HAVE A
GARAGE AND AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT AND A SWIMMING POOL
AND THIS AND THAT ON A 5,000-SQUARE-FOOT OR
6,000-SQUARE-FOOT LOT.
WE HAVE STORMWATER PROBLEMS IN TAMPA THE MOST EGREGIOUS IT
ALLOWS ADUs AND NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES, SOMETHING THAT
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN WAITING DECADES FOR A NONCONFORMING
STRUCTURE TO GO AWAY, NOW PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY GOING TO MAKE
IT A UNIT AND MAKE MONEY OFF OF IT.
09:45:54AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MA'AM.
09:45:56AM >> THANK YOU.
09:45:57AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. SHELBY.
09:45:59AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
INTERESTING POINT WAS RAISED WITH REGARD TO
PUBLIC COMMENT.
AND I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR ABOUT HOW COUNCIL WANTS TO
ADDRESS THIS WORKSHOP.
WE HAVE MULTIPLE ITEMS ALL BEING HEARD AT THE SAME TIME WITH
REGARDS HOW YOU WISH TO TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT.
NORMALLY THREE MINUTES AT THE END OF EACH AGENDA ITEM FOR
THE WORKSHOP.
HOW DOES COUNCIL WISH TO TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT TODAY OTHER
THAN THE GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS AT THE FRONT?
I JUST WOULD LIKE SOME DIRECTION.
09:46:29AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WOULD YOU LIKE TO DISCUSS -- WHAT YOU HAD
TOLD ME YESTERDAY HOW THE CITY CLERK'S OFFICE HAD POSTED
THIS.
09:46:35AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
WHAT I TALKED TO YOU YESTERDAY WAS REQUEST
REGARD TO TUESDAY'S SPECIAL CALLED WORKSHOP.
THIS WORKSHOP ACTUALLY I DON'T HAVE THE NOTICE IN FRONT OF
ME.
I DON'T KNOW HOW IT WAS NOTICED.
BUT WHEN THE ADMINISTRATION ASKED THAT YOU COMBINE ITEMS,
HOW DOES THAT AFFECT FOR THE OPPORTUNITY FOR PUBLIC TO SPEAK
AT YOUR WORKSHOP SINCE YOU ARE FORMULATING PUBLIC POLICY AT
THIS TIME BASED ON INPUT FROM THE ADMINISTRATION AND THE
OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PEOPLE TO SPEAK.
I WANT IT TO BE CLEAR SO THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE PUBLIC KNOW
THEY HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY.
I KNOW THAT COUNCIL HAS BEEN GETTING LETTER FROM PEOPLE
RELATIVE TO SOME OF THESE ITEMS, BUT IN TERMS OF KNOWING HOW
TO PROCEED FOR THE PURPOSE OF THIS WORKSHOP.
I WOULD LIKE CLARITY FOR PURPOSES OF THE PUBLIC'S EDUCATION.
09:47:29AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCIL?
09:47:35AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
I KNOW THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE ONLINE.
09:47:37AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I WAS JUST ASKED THAT.
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
09:47:41AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RULES ARE, BUT HAVEN'T
WE RECENTLY BEEN ALLOWING PEOPLE TO SPEAK TO EACH ITEM.
AND THEN IF WE ARE BUNDLING A BUNCH OF THEM TOGETHER, I
GUESS THEY HAVE TO SPEAK AT ONE TIME.
PART OF MY QUESTION IS, THE PREVIOUS QUESTION OR --
QUESTIONER SPOKE TO THREE OF THE ITEMS.
WHAT DO WE DO -- DOES SHE HAVE A RIGHT TO SPEAK TO THE OTHER
ITEMS ALSO SHE DIDN'T SPEAK ABOUT?
OR IS SHE JUST USED HER OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
09:48:09AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
THAT IS THE QUESTION.
SHE INDICATED SHE TOOK THE DAY OFF TO BE HERE.
AND I DON'T -- I CAN TELL YOU WHAT COUNCIL'S STATED RULES
ARE.
I HAVE ASKED THIS COUNCIL SEVERAL TIMES FOR AN OPPORTUNITY
TO HAVE A WORKSHOP PERHAPS -- NOT A WORKSHOP, BUT A SPECIAL
DISCUSSION MEETING IN THE SISTER CITIES ROOM OR MASCOT ROOM
TO TALK OF THESE THINGS OFF LINE IF WE CAN.
NOTICE PUBLIC MEETING.
BUT I NEED TO BE CLEAR NOW THAT WHEN A -- WHEN A MEMO COMES
IN FROM THE ADMINISTRATION ASKING THAT THESE ITEMS BE
BUNDLED, DOES THAT THEN TAKE ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR, FIVE,
SIX, SEVEN ITEMS AND COMBINE THEM TO AT THAT YOU CAN TO
COUNCIL FOR THREE MINUTES AT THE START OF THE MEETING.
THAT IS WHAT I NEED TO KNOW FOR CLARIFICATION.
09:48:54AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I WOULD JUST SAY THAT FOLKS HAVE TO SPEAK TO
IT THE BUNDLED ITEM TOGETHER.
I ASSUME THAT WOULD MEAN THREE MINUTES.
BUT IF WE WANTED TO, WE CAN GIVE THEM FOUR, BECAUSE
OTHERWISE THREE MINUTES EACH.
BUT TO THE -- TO THE PREVIOUS SPEAKER.
I WOULD SAY IF -- IF WE HAVE ITEMS OTHER THAN THE THREE SHE
SPOKE TO JUST LIKE WE WOULD NORMALLY, SHE WOULD HAVE A RIGHT
TO SPEAK TO ALL THE OTHER ITEMS INDIVIDUALLY.
AND THE BUNDLE ONES SHE DIDN'T SPEAK TO, SHE WOULD HAVE THE
RIGHT TO SPEAK AGAIN AND SAME THING FOR ANYBODY ELSE.
09:49:27AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THAT WOULD BE MY OPINION, MR. SHELBY.
09:49:30AM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
OKAY.
I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR BECAUSE I WANT COUNCIL TO KNOW WHAT
THE EXISTING RULES ARE.
THE SUBJECT CHANGED.
COUNCIL' RULES AND COUNCIL'S MEETING.
SUBJECT MATTER CAN BE TAKEN UP TO 30 MINUTES AT THE END OF
EACH WORKSHOP ITEM, THREE MINUTES PER SPEAKER.
NO OFFICIAL ACTION ON THE MATTER WHICH IS THE SUBJECT OF THE
WORKSHOP SHOULD CAN TAKEN DURING OR AFTER A WORKSHOP UNLESS
THE PUBLIC IS SAY FORKED AN OPPORTUNITY TO COMMENT PRIOR TO
ACTION.
AND THAT IS, AGAIN, SUBJECT TO REVISION, BUT THAT IS FOR
ANOTHER DAY.
BUT I WANTED TO BE CLEAR FOR TODAY'S WORKSHOP HOW TO HANDLE
IT.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR GUIDANCE.
09:50:07AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MY OPINION SINCE WE ARE BUNDLING THEM ALL
TOGETHER, THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE CHAMBERS THAT WISH TO SPEAK
TO THEM CAN SPEAK TO THEM AFTER WE HAVE DISCUSSED ALL THAT
ARE BUNDLED TOGETHER AND THEN THAT WAY THEY CAN SEPARATE
WHICH ONES THEY WISH TO SPEAK TO.
COUNCIL MIRANDA.
09:50:28AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I WANT TO SAY THIS.
THE PUBLIC ARE LISTENING TO US AND SAYING, WHAT ARE THEY
TALKING ABOUT.
IS IT ALL THE SAME ITEM OR ALL THE ONES WE TOOK OFF THAT
WILL BE UNDER ONE.
ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR, FIVE, SIX, SEVEN, EIGHT AND 15
TOGETHER.
WE HAVE BEEN TALKING FOR 50 MINUTES AND NOT ONE ITEM YET ON
THE AGENDA.
THAT IS FINE WITH ME; HOWEVER, WE COULD HAVE DONE ONE, THREE
AND FOUR MORE LIKELY THAN NOW AND WE WOULD HAVE BEEN A THIRD
OF A WAY WHAT WE NEEDED TO DO.
BUT INSTEAD WE ARE TALKING OF THE PROCESS AND THE CLARITY OF
SOME ITEM THAT WE HAVEN'T EVEN DISCUSSED.
SO THE PUBLIC IS HEAR.
THEY WANT TO SPEAK ON CERTAIN ITEM.
MAYBE ONE OF THOSE OR NONE OF THOSE.
MAYBE ALL TOGETHER BUT I BELIEVE THEY ARE ENTITLED TO SPEAK
ON EACH ITEM.
THEY ARE THE PUBLIC.
THEY ARE NOT USED TO WHAT WE ARE DOING HERE.
TO HEAR ITEM ONE, THREE, FOUR INDIVIDUALLY AND LISTEN TO
WHAT WE ARE SAYING SO NO MISTAKE WHAT WE HAVE DONE AND WHAT
WE HAVE NOT DONE THAT'S ALL I AM SAYING.
TAKE IT ONE AT A TIME AND STOP THIS STUFF AND KEEP GOING.
09:51:38AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE STILL HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT SPEAKERS
ONLINE.
LET'S GET -- LET'S FINISH OUR PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN I AM
GOING TO ASK COUNCIL IF WE CAN GO AHEAD AND TAKE EVERYTHING
SEPARATELY.
09:51:53AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
MAY I MAKE A COMMENT ON THAT.
THE BUNDLING IS FOR US TO PUT THE SUBJECT MATTER TOGETHER.
NOT FOR US TO NOT HEAR THE PUBLIC.
EACH ITEM IS A SEPARATE ITEM AND WILL BE PRESENTED THAT WAY.
YOU CAN TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT AND SHOULD TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT
AFTER EACH ONE OF THE ITEMS.
WE ARE JUST PUTTING ALL THE SUBJECT MATTER ITEMS TOGETHER.
THANK YOU.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
09:52:17AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WHO DO WE HAVE ONLINE?
IS MICHAEL RANDOLPH ONLINE?
MR. RANDOLPH.
09:52:43AM >> YES.
HOW IS EVERYBODY TODAY.
MY NAME IS MICHAEL RANDOLPH, AND I AM FROM THE WEST
TAMPA CAC.
I'M HERE TODAY TO TALK ABOUT A VERY IMPORTANT MEETING THAT
IS COMING UP, AND IT AFFECTS ALL OF US.
THE TITLE OF THE MEETING IS "REDUCING STREET VIOLENCE: A
NATIONAL APPROACH."
THE SUBTITLE IS "HEALTH, PUBLIC SAFETY AND ECONOMIC I
DEVELOPMENT: DETECTING THE DOTS TOGETHER."
BRINGING TOGETHER VENDORS, INVESTORS, BUSINESS, GOVERNMENT,
PRIVATE SECTOR, AS WELL AS THE PUBLIC SECTOR.
THE MEETING IS GOING TO BE DISCUSSING FROM COMMUNITIES
AROUND THE NATION TO TALK ABOUT WHAT THEY ARE DOING IN THEIR
COMMUNITY TO REDUCE VIOLENCE.
AS YOU KNOW IN BALTIMORE RIGHT NOW, CITY -- AROUND THE
NATION CITIES ARE MEETING IN BALTIMORE TO TALK ABOUT THE
PROBLEM WITH PUBLIC SAFETY.
THE AS A MATTER OF FACT, THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE WILL BE
ATTENDING BECAUSE THEY ARE INTERESTED IN THE MODEL THAT WE
ARE DOING.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, WE WILL BE TALKING OF THE ROME YARD
DEAL.
MADE IT TO THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT WITH WEST TAMPA CAC.
WE ARE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT THE -- THE FLORIDA
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION IN PARTNERSHIP WITH WEST TAMPA
TO CREATE OVER 100 JOBS.
WE ARE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT THE WEST TAMPA TECHNOLOGY
CENTER AND JOB CREATION CENTER AND TO HAVE PEOPLE TALK OF
THE WEST TAMPA CAC.
AS YOU KNOW, THERE ARE DIFFERENT TYPES OF PROGRAMS AVAILABLE
FOR RESIDENTS AND COMMERCIALS THAT PEOPLE CAN GET GRANTS IN
THE CAC AREA.
AND IN ADDITION TO THAT, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE
REPRESENTATIVES FROM LOCAL, REGIONAL AND FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON IN THE
COMMUNITY.
SO IMPORTANT THAT WE ADDRESS THE ISSUE OF VIOLENCE IN OUR
NEIGHBORHOOD.
THIS MEETING ADDRESSES THAT NOT AS A PROBLEM BUT AS A
SOLUTION.
AND I ENCOURAGE EVERYBODY TO ATTEND THAT MEETING.
YOU WILL BE SURPRISE WHAT THEY ARE DOING AROUND THE NATION
TO REDUCE VIOLENCE IN SOME OF THE MOST DRUG-INFESTED AND
THUG-INFESTED COMMUNITY IN OUR NATION.
THAT MEETING WILL BE ON THE 31st, WHICH IS MONDAY.
YOU CAN E-MAIL US AT WESTTAMPACDC@GMAIL.COM.
FOLKS, WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE VIOLENCE IN OUR
CITY.
DOING THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER IS INSANITY.
WE GOT TO THINK OUT THE BOX.
THANK YOU.
09:55:23AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
YES, MA'AM.
09:55:33AM >>CLERK:
NEXT SPEAKER IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
09:55:38AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
DOES SHE WANT TO SPEAK TO EACH AGENDA ITEM?
09:55:42AM >>CLERK:
THAT WAS STEPHANIE POYNOR.
PLEASE UNMUTE YOURSELF.
YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO SPEAK.
09:55:50AM >> THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
I WANT TO SPEAK AT THE THAT THE TEXT AMENDMENTS WERE
ADDRESSED.
09:55:56AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
LET'S GO WITH AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 1 PLEASE.
FILE NUMBER E-22-8, CHAPTER 27.
09:56:13AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
ABBYE FEELEY, DIRECTOR OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
I DON'T WANT MISS SWIFT TO MISS THE CONVERSATION THAT WE ARE
HAVING, SO WE ARE HERE TODAY ON ITEMS 1, 3 -- SORRY, 1, 3,
4, 5, 6, 7 AND 8.
THOSE ARE ALL TEXT AMENDMENT ITEMS.
AS MISS TRAVIS STATED WE ARE GOING TO PRESENT EACH ITEM
INDEPENDENTLY.
THESE ITEMS HAVE BEEN TRAVELING TOGETHER IN FRONT OF YOU
SINCE THE JUNE 23 WORKSHOP WHEN WE FIRST BROUGHT THEM TO YOU
IN CONCEPT AND SAID TO YOU, COUNCIL, THESE ARE THE THINGS
THAT WE LIKE TO WORK ON AND WENT THROUGH ALL OF THEM AND WHY
WE WERE DOING THEM AND SAID TO YOU, IF WE HAVE YOUR APPROVAL
TODAY, WHAT WE WILL DO IS, WE WILL GET STARTED NOW ON
ACTUALLY WRITING THE TEXT FOR THESE.
I SENT A MEMO ON SEPTEMBER 15 WITH THE ACTUAL TEXT.
THAT WAS ASSOCIATED WITH EACH OF THESE CHANGES.
WE HAD A PUBLIC INFORMATION WORKSHOP LAST WEEK.
THAT INFORMATION WORKSHOP WENT WENT FOR ALMOST FOUR HOURS.
WE TOOK EACH ITEM INDEPENDENTLY.
WE HEARD FROM THE PUBLIC INDEPENDENTLY ON EACH OF THOSE
ITEMS.
MISS POYNOR, MISS SWIFT WAS IN ATTENDANCE.
WE HAD -- I BELIEVE WE HAD 93 REGISTERED AND 57 ATTENDED
THAT PUBLIC INFORMATION WORKSHOP.
NOW WE ARE HERE TODAY TO TALK BECOME THROUGH THOSE ITEMS
WITH YOU AGAIN.
AND WE WILL GO AHEAD AND GET STARTED.
I DO HAVE A PRESENTATION.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
I WILL DRIVE.
CAN I DRIVE?
YES, I CAN.
OKAY.
SO JUST TO GO OVER A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND WHICH I JUST
DID.
WE WILL TALK ABOUT IN A MOMENT.
WE WILL GO THROUGH EACH OF THE AMENDMENTS AND A SUMMARY OF
THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING THAT WE CONDUCTED AND WE WILL
TALK ABOUT WHERE WE ARE IN PROCESS, SCHEDULE AND TIMELINE
AND THEN TAKE ANY QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS.
HERE YOU WILL SEE THE AGENDA ITEM OVER ON THE LEFT.
AS I JUST MENTIONED.
AND THE CODE SECTION THAT IS BEING ADDRESSED BY THAT AGENDA
ITEM AND THE SUBJECT AREA THAT IS RELATED TO EACH OF THOSE.
WE WILL TAKE EACH OF THOSE INDEPENDENTLY.
ONE ITEM, THE LAST ITEM SHOWN THERE, THE WEST TAMPA OVERLAY
DISTRICT.
THIS WAS THE DISCUSSION OF THE ALLEYS WITH THE CHANGE OF THE
"SHALL" AND THE "MAY" BACK A WHILE AGO.
STEVEN HAS BEEN WORKING WITH WEST TAMPA ON THAT.
WE DID HAVE A TEXT CHANGE FOR THAT.
UNFORTUNATELY, THAT TEXT CHANGE WAS NOT NOTICED FOR TODAY.
SO IT IS IN THE PRESENTATION.
WE WILL TALK TO YOU ABOUT IT IN CONCEPT TODAY AND WE WERE
GOING TO ASK FOR NOVEMBER 17, BUT SINCE IT WAS NOT ON THE
AGENDA TODAY, WE DID NOT WANT TO TAKE ANY ACTION ON THAT.
BUT WE DO WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT CONTINUES TRAVELING
BECAUSE THAT WAS IN RESPONSE TO THE DESIGN EXCEPTIONS.
IF YOU MAY RECALL WITH A CHANGE THAT HAPPENED THAT SAID, NEW
CONSTRUCTION MAY ACCESS AN ALLEY AND NOW IT SAYS "SHALL" AND
WE WERE HAVING PEOPLE COME IN AND ASK FOR DESIGN EXCEPTIONS
TO NOT ACCESS THE ALLEY.
YOU MIGHT RECALL ONE HOUSE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BLOCK WHERE
ALL THE DRIVEWAYS FACE THE STREET AND THE NEW CODE WAS
REQUIRING THEM TO THEN ACCESS VIA THE ALLEY AND IT HAD
STARTED OTHER DISCUSSION.
SO WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT AS WELL.
BUT THAT IS NOT AN AGENDA ITEM.
AND, AGAIN, I WILL TAKE THE MEA CULPA AND ASK FOR THAT ON
NOVEMBER 17 BECAUSE IT WAS NOT PROPERLY NOTICED FOR TODAY'S
HEARING.
AS I MENTIONED TO YOU THE JULY 2022 AMENDMENT CYCLE, IT HAS
12 CHANGES.
WE CAME TO YOU IN CONCEPT ON JUNE 23.
WE TALKED TO YOU ABOUT WHY ARE WE DOING THIS.
HOW DOES THIS WORK.
AS WE TALK ABOUT EACH ONE, WE WILL GIVE A BRIEF -- A BRIEF
REFRESHER ON WHERE WE WERE ON THAT.
WE PROVIDED THE SPECIFIC LANGUAGE IN A MEMO.
AN MEMO THAT HAD AN EXHIBIT WITH STRIKE-THROUGH UNDERLINE
FOR YOU BACK IN MID-SET OF.
I CAME TO YOU AND SAID I SENT YOU GUY THIS MEMO.
SENDING YOU THE LANGUAGE TODAY.
WE WILL COME BACK IN OCTOBER AND TALK ABOUT THIS THEN.
I WANTED TO GIVE THE PUBLIC TIME.
I WANTED TO GIVE YOU TIME.
I WANTED TO GIVE EVERYBODY TIME TO LOOK AT THAT.
AND WE HELD THE PUBLIC INFORMATION SESSION.
WE ALSO DID GO TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR A BRIEFING.
WE HAVE NOT GONE FOR HEARING.
THAT HEARING WILL BE MONDAY OF NEXT WEEK DEPENDING ON THE
ACTION YOU TAKE TODAY AND SEE WHERE THAT GOES AND HANDLE
THAT ACCORDINGLY.
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE.
THIS WAS THE ALTERNATIVE DESIGN EXCEPTIONS.
THIS FIRST STEP WAS JUST ADDRESSING PUBLIC NOTICE FOR
SETBACKS.
RIGHT NOW IF YOU COME BACK FOR A DESIGN EXCEPTION ANYWHERE
IN THE CITY THAT IS NOT IN AN OVERLAY DISTRICT, YOU PROVIDE
PUBLIC NOTICE.
THIS CHANGE WILL NOW REQUIRE THAT IF YOU ARE IN AN OVERLAY
AND COMING IN FOR A SETBACK REDUCTION YOU WILL BE REQUIRED
TO GIVE PUBLIC NOTICE.
AN INCONSISTENCY IN THE CODE AND BROUGHT UP BY MISS SANCHEZ
IN A OVERLAY IF YOU ARE DOING A SETBACK REDUCTION, NOBODY IS
GETTING NOTICED.
WE SAID YOU ARE CORRECT.
HERE WE ARE.
WE WANT TO MAKE THAT CHANGE IF YOU ARE DOING THE SETBACK
REDUCTION IN ANY OF THE OVERLAYS, EAST TAMPA, WEST COMPANY,
KENNEDY BOULEVARD OVERLAY, WEST SHORE OVERLAY AND COMING IN
ADMINISTRATIVELY FOR THAT REQUEST, YOU WILL NOW PROVIDE
PUBLIC NOTICE.
WITH 27-49, THE GENERAL NOTICE.
THE 250 FEET AND THE MAILING AND THE SURROUNDING PROPERTY
OWNERS WILL BE NOTIFIED.
THAT IS THE FIRST CHANGE BEFORE YOU TODAY ITEM NUMBER 1.
IF YOU WANT TO TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT AND WE WILL BE HAPPY TO
ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
10:02:46AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE IN CHAMBERS WHO WISHES TO MAKE PUBLIC
COMMENT?
10:02:50AM >> JOE ROBINSON.
WEST TAMPA.
AND VICE-CHAIR OF THE WEST TAMPA CDC ON THIS ONE.
I DON'T HAVE ANY OBJECTIONS TO THIS.
SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE.
WE FOUND THIS OUT WHEN WE WERE GETTING THE SO-CALLED GOOD
NEIGHBOR NOTICES, AND THERE WAS AN ISSUE THAT CAME UP THAT
WE WEREN'T GETTING THESE DESIGN REVIEWS BECAUSE THEY ARE
ADMINISTRATIVELY PRETTY MUCH.
THIS WILL SOLVE THE PROBLEM AND GIVE BETTER NOTICE.
GOT TO SPEND A LITTLE MORE MONEY IF YOU WANT TO GET NOTICE
OUT, BUT IT IS WELL WORTH IT ONCE AGAIN.
THANKS FOR MAKING THIS CHANGE.
LET'S MOVE FORWARD WITH IT.
10:03:29AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE IN CHAMBERS WHO WOULD LIKE TO
MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT?
MISS POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE?
MISS POYNOR?
MISS SWIFT, YOU ARE HERE IN CHAMBERS.
DID YOU WANT TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT TO THIS AGENDA ITEM?
10:03:54AM >> NO, THANK YOU.
10:03:55AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE?
MISS BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE?
10:04:09AM >> I'M HERE NOW.
10:04:11AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS POYNOR.
10:04:13AM >> I SUPPORT THIS.
I THINK IT IS A GREAT IDEA.
I THINK IT NEEDS TO BE IN ALIGNMENT WITH THE REST OF THE
CODE.
AND I WOULD LIKE TO THANK MR. COTTON FOR BRINGING THIS
FORWARD.
THANK YOU.
10:04:22AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS BENNETT, ARE YOU THERE?
10:04:33AM >> HI, CARROLL ANNE bENNET.
I ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT THIS AND I WOULD LIKE TO THANK STAFF
FOR BRINGING THIS FORWARD.
THIS IS A GREAT CHANGE.
THANK YOU.
10:04:42AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
10:04:45AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I WANT CLARITY, THIS IS THE ONLY THING
THAT NUMBER ONE IS ABOUT?
10:04:53AM >> YES, SIR.
10:04:53AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
TALKS ABOUT ACCESSORY STRUCTURES AND
ALLOWING SINGLE-FAMILY WINDY MULTIFAMILY TO BE PERMITTED AND
DISTRICTS AND SO FORTH.
THAT IS NOT HERE?
10:05:04AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THAT IS NOT THIS ITEM, NO, SIR.
IT IS ON OUR AGENDA BUT NOT ITEM NUMBER 1.
10:05:10AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH MUCH.
I APPRECIATE IT.
10:05:13AM >> I HEARD FROM THE PUBLIC AND.
I AGREE WITH THIS.
DO YOU NEED A MOTION AFTER THE DISCUSSION THAT WE MOVED
FORWARD WITH THIS.
10:05:23AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WAS GOING TO SAY TO MOVE THIS FORWARD.
THIS IS WHAT EVERYONE WANTS.
IT MAKES SENSE.
10:05:37AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE HE WILL WANT TO MAKE A COMMENT.
10:05:39AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
MOVE FORWARD ON THE ALTERNATIVE DESIGN
EXCEPTIONS REGARDING THE SETBACK REDUCTION REQUEST AND
PUBLIC NOTICE REQUIREMENTS IN THE OVERLAY DISTRICT.
10:05:48AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
SO MOVED.
10:05:49AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MOTION BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO, SECONDED BY
GUDES.
ROLL CALL VOTE PLEASE.
10:05:55AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
10:06:02AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
10:06:04AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
10:06:06AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
10:06:09AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
10:06:10AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
10:06:11AM >>CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
10:06:13AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ITEM NUMBER 3.
10:06:15AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THANK YOU.
IF I CAN HAVE THE PRESENTATION BACK PLEASE.
THE NEXT ITEM AGENDA ITEM 3 AS JUST MENTIONED.
THE CODIFICATION OF THE DOWNTOWN DESIGN REVIEW PROCESS.
THE DOWNTOWN DESIGN REVIEW PROCESS HAS BEEN IN PROCESS FOR A
WHILE.
THERE HAS BEEN A PLACEHOLDER IN THE CODE FOR THE
CODIFICATION OF THE PROCESS BUT THE PROCESS WAS NEVER
CODIFIED.
THIS IS THIS SECTION THAT TAKES A PROCESS WE HAVE BEEN DOING
NOW FOR SEVERAL YEARS.
WHEN THE DOWNTOWN CODE WAS UPDATED TO BE A FORM-BASED TYPE
CODE.
IT HAD AN MOTHER'S DAY ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS WHEN A PROJECT
COMES THROUGH TO ENSURE COMPLIANCE WITH THOSE FORM-BASED
OBJECTIVES.
THIS NOW CODIFIES THAT CODE SECTION AND INDICATES WHAT ARE
THE REQUIREMENTS.
WHAT DO YOU NEED TO PROVIDE.
HOW IS THAT BEING PROVIDED.
AND TALKS TO THE REVIEW PROCESS AND ANY APPEAL TO THAT
PROCESS.
THAT IS ITEM NUMBER 3.
10:07:18AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THERE ANYONE IN CHAMBERS WHO
WISHES TO SPEAK TO ITEM NUMBER 3, FILE NUMBER E2022-8-CHAPTER 27.
10:07:30AM >> JOE ROBINSON, TAMPA, FLORIDA.
SINCE I MIGHT BE GETTING PROPERTY DOWNTOWN.
THIS IS NECESSARY BECAUSE THERE ARE SOME VACANT LOTS
DOWNTOWN.
AND WHAT WE NEED IN THE CITY, YOU ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING
TODAY.
YOU ARE GETTING THIS THING TOGETHER.
YOU ARE CODIFYING IT.
BACK WHEN CHARLIE WAS AROUND, YOU KNOW, THIS STUFF WAS LIKE
WALK OVER HERE AND DO THAT.
BUT THIS WILL MAKE IT CLEAR TO EVERYBODY COMING INTO TOWN,
DOWNTOWN, THAT YOU ARE PART OF A CODE, YOU HAVE AN APPEAL
RIGHT AND YOU CAN DO THAT.
SO THIS IS JUST CLEANING UP, YOU KNOW, AND MAKING THINGS
MORE TRANSPARENT.
THIS IS A TRANSPARENCY MOVE AND LET'S EVERYBODY KNOW WHAT
THE RULES OF ENGAGEMENT ARE.
DEFINITELY WE SUPPORT IT.
10:08:13AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
I DO NOT SEE ANYBODY ONLINE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TO AGENDA
ITEM NUMBER 3.
ANY COUNCILMEMBERS?
10:08:22AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS AS LONG AS IT
IS NOT ANY NONCONFORMING STRUCTURE BEING ADDED.
10:08:30AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS FEELEY, DO YOU NEED A MOTION?
10:08:32AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
YES, PLEASE.
10:08:33AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
MOTION.
10:08:34AM >>LUIS VIERA:
SECOND.
10:08:36AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ROLL CALL TO VOTE.
10:08:40AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
10:08:43AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
10:08:44AM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
10:08:45AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
10:08:46AM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
10:08:51AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY WITH COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO BEING
ABSENT AT VOTE.
10:09:02AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 4.
10:09:04AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THANK YOU, COUNCIL.
ABBYE FEELEY.
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 4 IS ALSO IN CONCEPT A CODE CLEANUP.
SORRY.
THERE ARE -- A RECENTLY PRIVATELY INITIATED TEXT AMENDMENT
DONE BY MR. MICHELINI ADDRESSED TOWN HOME DESIGN.
AND THIS TALKED ABOUT ALLOWING RESIDENCES TO FACE INTERIOR
COURTS RATHER THAN STREETS RIGHT-OF-WAY.
YOU SEE THIS A LOT IN A LOT OF PDs.
MOST FAMILIAR ARE THE LETTER CASHIERS THAT CAME RECENTLY.
TWO PLACES IN THE CODE WHERE THESE TOWN HOME DESIGN
STANDARDS EXIST.
ONE IS FOR SINGLE-FAMILY DESIGNED ATTACHED STANDARDS.
FEE SIMPLE TOWN HOMES.
THE SECOND IS FOR MULTIFAMILY TOWN HOME STYLE.
THOSE ARE RENTALS WHEN NOT PLATTED.
MR. MICHELINI'S AMENDMENT CHANGED ONE OF THOSE TWO, BUT NOT
THE OTHER.
SO STAFF WAS MAKING THIS CHANGE IN ORDER TO ENSURE THAT THE
CODE WAS CONSISTENT FOR EITHER RENTAL TYPE TOWN HOME OR FEE
OWNERSHIP TOWN HOME IN TERMS OF DESIGN.
THAT IS ALL THAT THIS AMENDMENT IS DOING.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:10:28AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I DON'T SUPPORT THIS.
I DON'T THINK IT IS A GOOD IDEA.
IF WE DON'T MAKE THEM -- MAKE DEVELOPERS FOCUS ON THE
STREET, IT WILL NOT HAPPEN.
SO NOT ONLY DO I NOT LIKE THIS.
I DON'T BELIEVE I WAS THERE FOR THAT OTHER AMENDMENT.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO TAKE THAT ONE BACK.
THAT IS MY PERSONAL STANCE ON THIS.
I DO NOT AGREE WITH THIS AT ALL.
PEOPLE WHO HAVE TOWN HOMES AND SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED,
DEVELOPERS JUST NEED TO DO A BETTER JOB OF MAKING THEM FIT
IN WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD INSTEAD OF JUST SHOVE IN ON A LOT.
IF WE ALLOW THIS, THEN WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO SHOVE
THINGS IN ON A LOT.
AND I JUST DO NOT AGREE WITH THAT AND EXACTLY WHAT I AM
HEARING FROM THE PUBLIC.
EVERYONE IS SAYING ABSOLUTELY NOT.
WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE STREET FACING AND INTERACTION WITH THE
STREET.
NOW WHAT THAT MIGHT REQUIRE IS CHANGE -- I KNOW A LOT OF
THIS HAPPENS BECAUSE OF OUR REQUIREMENTS FOR GREEN SPACE AND
I WILL BE HAPPY TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.
IF WE ARE ADDING TOWN HOMES AND DENSITY, I THINK GREEN SPACE
-- THE WAY THEY HAVE BEEN PUTTING THEM IN LOOKS WRONG.
IT DOESN'T FIT.
IF YOU LOOK ON FLORIDA AVENUE MOST RECENTLY, THERE IS SOME
DEVELOPMENT NORTH OF FLORIBRASKA THEY PUT SEVEN MAGNOLIA
NEXT TO EACH OTHER.
AYE, THEY ARE ALL GOING TO DIE BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE
ENOUGH SPACE, BUT NO CONNECTIVITY TO THAT STREET.
HOW DO WE WORK ON THAT?
HOW DO WE CHANGE THE LANDSCAPE DESIGN OR THE GREEN SPACE,
RATHER, SO THAT THOSE CAN FACE THE STREET MORE WELCOMINGLY,
MORE CLOSE TO THE STREET MAYBE.
JUST LOOK AT THINGS DIFFERENTLY BECAUSE IF WE ARE GOING TO
CONTINUE TO HAVE THESE.
PEOPLE MOSTLY HATE THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE JUST NOT
CONNECTING.
I THINK WE CAN DO -- I THINK WE CAN ALL DO A BETTER JOB.
10:12:28AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
10:12:30AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I SUPPORT WHAT COULD COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK IS
SAYING.
YOU LOOK AT COMMUNITIES AND YOU HAVE OF A BUILDING WITH A
WALL AND EVERYTHING IS INSIDE -- IT DOESN'T FIT
NEIGHBORHOODS.
SO I AM NOT A SUPPORTER OF THIS EITHER.
10:12:44AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE?
ANYONE IN CHAMBERS WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THIS AGENDA
ITEM NUMBER 4.
10:12:56AM >> JOE ROBINSON, TAMPA, FLORIDA.
I HAPPEN TO HAVE A TOWN HOUSE ATTACHED ON -- RIGHT ACROSS
THE STREET FROM ME BUT FACES THE STREET THERE WAS TALK TO
PUT FOUR OVER THERE AND WE FOUGHT THAT AND THANKS TO ABBYE,
THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN BECAUSE RM-16.
AND SO THIS ISSUE OF FACING THE STREET IS REALLY GOOD,
BECAUSE ONE THING IS, HOW IS AN EMERGENCY VEHICLE GOING TO
KNOW WHERE THEY ARE GOING.
THEY ARE LOOKING FOR ADDRESSES WITH THE AMBULANCES COMING.
YOU HAVE MULTIPLE UNITS LIKE THE ONE ON FLORIDA AVENUE.
I THINK WE NEED TO KEEP THE STREET.
AND IF SOMEBODY REALLY WANTS TO CHANGE IT, THERE ARE WAYS TO
ASK FOR WAIVERS AND WAYS TO GET THINGS DONE, BUT THAT WILL
BE MORE LIKE A ONE-OFF INSTEAD OF IT BEING AN AUTOMATIC AND
THAT IS PROBABLY WHAT THE ISSUE THAT PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO GO
THROUGH THE ONE-OFF PROCESS.
I AM NOT SUPPORTING THIS FROM EITHER, BECAUSE I GOT ONE IN
FRONT OF ME THAT HAS BEEN PUT ON A 75-FOOT LOT, CHARLIE.
AND DOING A GREAT DEVELOPMENT.
BUT A SCAGLIONE LOT, SIT ON FOUR, FIVE LOTS.
THE GUY WOULD HAVE JAMMED IT IN THERE AND WHAT HAPPENS IS I
HAVE PARKING ISSUES AND PARKING PATROLMAN ACROSS THE STREET.
THE ONLY THING I WILL SAY IS THEY TOOK UP THAT CURB.
THAT 18-INCH BY 24-INCH GRANITE CURB, CHARLIE, ON A STREET
AND NO MORE CURB AND DRIVEWAYS -- I ASKED THEM WHERE THE
CURB -- I THINK I LEFT A MESSAGE WITH YOU, MISS ABBY,E AND
NOBODY SAID WHERE IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE.
AND STORAGE FOR FUTURE USE BY THE CITY OF TAMPA.
I AM GOING TO START ENFORCING THAT IN WEST TAMPA PAUSE A
NATIONAL HISTORIC DISTRICT AND I DON'T WANT TO SEE THE
ELEMENT GO AND THE SCAGLIONE HOUSE.
THE TOWN HOUSE ACROSS THE STREET -- SELLING ONE SIDE FOR
$750,000.
NO WE ARE NOT ADRYING TO THIS -- AT LEAST I DON'T AGREE TO
THIS.
AND PEOPLE I TALK TO DON'T AGREE WITH THIS.
LIKE A DEVELOPER GETTING A SLICK WILLIE WAY TO GET AROUND
HAVING TO ASK FOR A WAIVER.
THANK YOU.
10:15:16AM >> GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
NATHAN HAGAN.
THIS IS A VERY NUANCED NOT VERY IMPORTANT ISSUE.
BUT I WILL CALL OUT THAT I THINK IT IS STRANGE THAT WE ARE
REGULATING RENTAL TYPE UNITS DIFFERENTLY THAN THESE PLATTED
OWNED PARCELS.
I THINK THAT THE FACT THERE ARE A DIFFERENT SET OF RULES FOR
DIFFERENT TYPES OF PEOPLE.
AND THAT IS PART OF THE CODE IS VERY CONCERNING TO ME.
AND I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THAT ADDRESSED.
I DON'T CARE WHICH DIRECTION THAT WE GO.
BUT I WANT TO POINT OUT A THEME IN THE COMMENTS IN ISSUES
LIKE THIS.
THAT THERE IS BASICALLY -- THIS IS, AGAIN, ME BEING A LITTLE
FACETIOUS, A WAR ON TOWN HOMES IN THE CITY OF TAMPA.
A LOT OF PEOPLE, A LOT OF NEIGHBORHOOD PEOPLE WHO OWN
SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES ARE FIGHTING TOWN HOMES EVERY CORNER,
EVERY OPPORTUNITY THEY HAVE.
IN JANUARY OR FEBRUARY, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE A DISCUSSION
ABOUT QUADPLEXES, IF THAT DOESN'T GET BUMP FROM THAT
WORKSHOP.
WE CAN'T BUILD ANYTHING BUT TOWN HOMES IF YOU WERE NOT
BUILDING AN APARTMENT COMPLEX OR SINGLE-FAMILY.
SO THE MORE WE ARE DISCOURAGING TOWN HOMES AND NOT MAKING
PROGRESS ON ANY OTHER TYPE.
WE ARE NOT MOVING FORWARD AT ALL.
IN FACT WE ARE MOVING BACKWARDS.
I DON'T CARE ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR ITEM, BUT CONSIDER THE
BROADER CONTEXT OF WHAT WE ARE DOING TO FIGHT TOWN HOMES AND
MAKE NOTHING PROGRESS.
SPENDING ALL THAT TIME FIGHTING TOWN HOMES AND MAKING NO
PROGRESS ON OTHER OPPORTUNITIES TO CREATE HOUSING.
ALSO WHAT STANDARD DOES IT SET TO THE COMMUNITY THAT WE ARE
A CITY COUNCIL THAT DOESN'T LIKE TOWN HOMES.
AND WE ARE GOING TO -- YOU KNOW, THE REASON PEOPLE ARE
FIGHTING THESE IS NOT JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE -- THEY ARE NOT
FACING THE STREET BECAUSE EVERY DOOR CAN'T FACE THE STREET
ON ANY TYPE OF HOUSING THAT EXISTS.
THAT IS KIND CAN OF CONVOLUTED.
BUT A BIGGER CONTEXT HERE WHEN I SEE THESE KIND OF ITEMS.
SO THANK YOU.
10:17:12AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
MISS POYNOR, DO YOU WISH TO SPEAK ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 4.
10:17:19AM >> YES, SIR, I DO.
I WOULD LIKE TO CALL THIS THE ANDRE THE GIANT SUBMISSION.
BECAUSE THAT IS THE KIND OF DENSITY -- AND I AM NOT EVEN
AGAINST THE TOWN HOUSES.
BUT WHEN YOU ARE TALK OF 35 FEET ON TOP OF BEING BUILT UP 10
FEET, YOU HAVE A HUGE BUILDING SEVEN FEET FROM SOMEBODY'S
NEXT DOOR.
I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT I SENT YOU GUY AS DATA SET
FOR THE LAST FOUR EVENING MEETINGS ATTACHED TO ONE OF MY
E-MAILS.
OF THOSE 24% WERE MISNOTICED.
GO FIGURE.
37 AND MOST OF THEM DIRECTLY APPLIED TO THIS PARTICULAR
ISSUE.
I LIVE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD THAT IS 12 SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AND
36 TOWN HOUSES.
THEY ARE BEAUTIFUL.
THEY ARE DUPLEXES.
THEY ARE NOT 35 FEET HIGH.
THEY DID A FABULOUS JOB SETTING THEM ON SMALLER LOTS.
IT CAN BE DONE.
I WILL ALSO OFFER THAT CASA BELLA CIRCLE IS AN EXAMPLE TO
HAVE INWARD-FACING PROPERTIES.
TO GIVE CART BLANCHE, I HAVE TO AGREE WITH COUNCILWOMAN
HURTAK, IT SHOULDN'T HAVE PASSED IN THE FIRST PLACE AND I
WOULD ALSO OFFER IF TAKE A LITTLE BIT OF TIME I WOULD EXPECT
THAT IT THE SAME DEVELOPMENT REPRESENTATIVE THAT GOT IT
PASSED BEFORE PROBABLY MISNOTICED ON MOST OF THESE.
YOU GUYS GO FIGURE WHO IS THE MISNOTICED AND WHO WANTS IT
THE MOST, BUT I HAVE A NEIGHBORHOOD RIGHT NOW THAT IS A
MISNOTICED WITH THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION WHERE THEY WILL
BACK UP WITH A SINGLE-FAMILY 1970s HOUSE THAT IS ONE-STORY.
AND THESE PEOPLE WILL BE LOOKING 45 FEET UP AT THE BUILDING
NEXT DOOR TO THEM.
THAT IS JUST NOT STARE.
IT NEEDS TO BE CONSIDERED ON A CASE -BY-CASE BASIS.
EVERY 15-YEAR-OLD DOESN'T NEED TO DRIVE AUTOMATICALLY.
THERE IS A PARENT IN THE ROOM FOR THAT.
SO THAT NEEDS TO BE THE CASE ON THIS PARTICULAR INCIDENT.
10:19:14AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
MISS BENNETT, ARE YOU THERE?
10:19:22AM >> HI, I AM CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
BASICALLY I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING THAT COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK
AND COUNCILMAN GUDES SAID.
AND I ALSO AGREE THERE ARE TIMES WHEN THAT CAN BE DONE.
AND THOSE CAN BE DEALT WITH LIKE WHAT STEPHANIE TALKED ABOUT
THE CASA BELLA, BUT CART BLANCHE IS NOT THE WAY TO GO.
AND I DON'T THINK -- AND I AGREE WITH NATHAN.
SHOULDN'T BE DIFFERENT.
BUT I DON'T THINK THEY SHOULD BE CHANGE THIS WAY.
THE ONE THAT WAS CHANGED SHOULD BE CHANGED BACK.
I ALSO WANT TO ADDRESS THE WHOLE ISSUE OF MISSING MIDDLE.
PART OF THE PROBLEM WITH THE MISSING MIDDLE IN THE CITY IS
THAT ALL THE RESIDENCE THAT ARE BEING TORN DOWN CONTINUE TO
CREATE GIGANTIC McMANSIONS FOR THE APARTMENT COMPLEXES WHERE
AVERAGE PEOPLE CAN AFFORD IT AND THEY ARE BEING TORN DOWN
AND EVERY APARTMENT NOW IS TWO OR THREE TIMES THE SQUARE
FOOTAGE OF THE ORIGINAL.
NO ADDITIONAL UNITS.
THEY ARE NOT INCREASING DENSITY.
THEY ARE JUST MAKING EACH ONE GRANDER.
THE HEIGHT, YOU ARE MAXIMIZING ARE ASKING FOR EXCEPTIONS SO
THEY CAN HAVE THESE CATHEDRAL CEILINGS AND TAKING THIS
MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING AND REPLACING WITH LUXURY HOUSING.
THE BOOK BY JANE JACOBS, ONE OF THE THINGS SHE TALKS ABOUT
WHICH IS VERY IMPORTANT YOU NEED TO HAVE A MIX OF OLD AND
NEW.
AND THE OLD IS BEING ELIMINATED IN THIS CITY.
A SINGLE EXAMPLE BEING CAME BEFORE VRB, A WELL-MAINTAINED
MODEST THREE BEDROOM HOUSE AND THEY BULLDOZED IT DOWN AND
WANTED TO BUILD A SIX-BEDROOM HOUSE ON A 50 X 100 LOT AND
NEED VARIANCE TO DO THAT.
BE WITH WOULD HAVE SAID I WOULD HAVE PURCHASE THAT OLD HOME.
THIS SIX-BEDROOM HOUSE IS OUT OF MY PRICE RANGE AND RUINING
THE NEIGHBORHOODS.
WE NEED THESE OLDER APARTMENT COMPLEXES.
WE NEED THESE OLDER DUPLEXES.
WE NEED THESE OLDER SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES THAT ARE MODEST AND
AFFORDABLE AND ALL BEING ILLUMINATED IN LUXURY OF GIGANTIC
HOUSING AND THAT IS A BIG PART OF THE PROBLEM.
THANK YOU.
10:21:34AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
COUNCILMEMBERS, COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS?
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:21:41AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WANT TO SAY NOT AN ISSUE FOR ME OF
DISLIKING TOWN HOMES, I THINK THEY ARE NOT RIGHT FOR EVERY
LOT AND WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT FACT.
NOT TOWN HOMES BUT THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT NAMES.
INSTEAD OF THREE STORIES FOR EACH TOWN HOME, ONE FOR EACH
LEVEL THAT GO -- SO MANY THINGS -- THE MISSING MIDDLE THAT I
KNOW WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT, BUT THE IDEA OF SQUEEZING
THESE IN THIS WAY JUST DOESN'T WORK.
SO THAT -- AND I HAVE A MOTION IF --
10:22:16AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
10:22:19AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I AGREE WITH THE COMMENT COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK
SAID JUST NOW AND ALSO BEFORE.
TO NATHAN'S POINT.
HE BRINGS A LOT OF THOUGHTS AND GOOD IDEAS.
I AM DEFINITELY NOT AGAINST TOWN HOMES.
I DON'T THINK THIS BOARD IS.
I WILL JUST SPEAK FOR MYSELF FOR A SECOND.
I THINK THERE ARE DIFFERENT WAYS THAT DEVELOPERS AND THEIR
REPRESENTATIVES APPROACH THESE.
THIS THEY COME IN AND FIT THE EXISTING ENTITLEMENT AND THEY
WANT SMALL CHANGES AND CONSISTENT WITH THE SIZE, SCALE AND
IN SOME CASES THE DESIGN OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT THE
NEIGHBORHOOD DOESN'T OBJECT TO IT AT ALL.
THEY REFUSE TO TALK TO THE COMMUNITY AND COME IN WITH -- I
AM USING WORST-CASE SCENARIO, SUBURBAN DESIGN AND A BIG BOX
THAT IS TALL, OUT OF SCALE.
AND THEY TRY TO GET ALL THOSE VARIANCES.
THOSE ARE THE CASE THAT HAVE PROBLEMS.
ALSO IF YOU CAN PUT FIVE UNITS AND WANT TO PUT TEN, YOU
MIGHT RUN INTO APPROXIMATE.
SO IF FOLKS ARE REASONABLE AND WORK WITH THE COMMUNITY AND
WORK WITHIN THE GUIDELINES OF THE LAW AND THE EXISTING
GUIDANCE AND WANT SMALL EXCEPTIONS, WE APPROVE THEM ALL THE
TIME.
THANK YOU.
10:23:35AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE.
10:23:38AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THE ONE THAT PASSED IS 9 AND 10.
10:23:46AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IF I CAN HAVE THE PRESENTATION BACK FOR A
MOMENT.
I DID HAVE THE SLIDE THAT WENT THROUGH THE SINGLE-FAMILY
ATTACHED STANDARDS.
10:23:52AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY, THANK YOU.
10:23:54AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I HAVE THE ONE THAT IS THE MULTIFAMILY
STANDARDS.
AND THE CURRENT LANGUAGE THAT SAID THE GROUND FLOOR
ENTRANCES, FRONT DOORS TO THE DWELLING UNITS SHALL FACE A
STREET RIGHT-OF-WAY NOT INCLUDING ALLEYS RATHER THAN THE
SIDE OR CORNER LOT LINES.
ENTRANCES MAY FACE INTERIOR COURTS, PLAZAS OR SIMILAR DESIGN
ELEMENT WITH THE IMPROVEMENT OF THE ALTERNATE DESIGN BY THE
ZONING ADMINISTRATOR.
WE HAVE PROPOSED THAT THOSE DWELLING UNITS MAY FACE THE SIDE
LOT LINES PROVIDED THAT THOSE THAT FACE THE STREET HAVE TO
HAVE ENTRANCES, WINDOWS, PORCH AND OTHER ARCHITECTURAL
EMBELLISHMENT ALONG THAT PORTION OF THE STRUCTURE.
AND THEN THIS WAS THE ONE THAT WAS CHANGED BY MR. MICHELINI.
BECAUSE NOW YOU SEE IT NO LONGER SAYS AS AN ALTERNATIVE
DESIGN THROUGH THE ZONING ADMINISTRATOR.
THAT NUMBER 1 THERE, THAT IS THE ONE THAT HAD RECENTLY BEEN
MODIFIED.
AND THEN WE DID HAVE THE DIAGRAM TO SHOW THAT ON THESE, WHAT
HAPPENS IS, THEY COULD BUILD THOSE FIRST TWO ON THE FAR
RIGHT THAT ARE ON THE STREET AND THEN THEY WILL NEED THE
EXCEPTION FOR THE REMAINING EIGHT UNIT REMAINING EIGHT UNITS
THAT ARE SHOWN UP THERE.
SO IF IT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL TO KEEP THE CODE THE WAY
IT IS ALTERNATE DESIGN COMING BEFORE COUNCIL FOR PD.
WE NEED TO GO BACK AND MODIFY THE ONE THAT WAS RECENTLY DONE
TO PUT IT BACK TO THE WAY THAT WAS.
10:25:45AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THAT IS MY FIRST MOTION FOR STAFF TO COME
BACK WITH AN ORDINANCE TO RESCIND 27-282.9.
-- 10.
SORRY, 10.
AND THEN ALSO MY SECOND MOTION -- WELL, I GUESS I NEED TO DO
THAT ONE FIRST.
ANYBODY?
10:26:05AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN GUDES.
WE ARE GOING TO TAKE VOICE VOTES.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR -- EXCUSE ME, ANY COMMENTS?
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
IS THERE ANY OPPOSED?
THANK YOU.
10:26:18AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
MY OTHER ONE IS A MOTION FOR STAFF TO COME
BACK WITH IDEAS TO ENCOURAGE TOWN HOUSE-STYLE HOMES TO FACE
THE STREET, POSSIBLY AT LOOKING AT REDUCING GREEN SPACE AND
LOOKING AT SOME DESIGN STANDARDS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS THE APPROPRIATE PLACE FOR THAT, BUT
I THINK A LOT OF WHAT I AM HEARING FROM MY COLLEAGUES AND
FROM THE PUBLIC TODAY THAT THEY DON'T FIT.
I KNOW IF WE HAVE SOME DESIGN STANDARDS, THAT COULD HELP.
10:26:46AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY COMMENTS?
ANY QUESTIONS?
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
10:26:52AM >>BILL CARLSON:
LET ME COMMENT REAL FAST.
THIS COUNCIL DIDN'T APPROVE IT BUT TOWN HOMES BUILT IN HYDE
PARK THE LAST 10 TO 15 YEARS.
THEY LOOK LIKE SINGLE-FAMILY AND FOUR UNITS INSIDE IT.
AND DESIGN IT IN THE ARC IN A WAY THAT YOU CAN'T TELL.
THE POINT IS, THERE IS A WAY TO GET DENSITY WHILE BEING
SENSITIVE TO THE SURROUNDING AREA.
IF YOU CAN DO IT IN HYDE PARK IN A SENSITIVE WAY TO GET
THEIR APPROVAL.
YOU CAN DO IT IN OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS, EAST TAMPA, WEST
TAMPA, THEY HAVE UNIQUE ARCHITECTURE AND NOT PLOP IN BIG
SUBURBAN BIG BOXES.
THANK YOU.
10:27:33AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:27:35AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I NOTICED IF YOU GO BACK TO THE ACTUAL
ORDINANCE ITSELF.
IF YOU CAN GO ONE BACK, TWO BACK.
OBVIOUSLY WE SHOULD TRY TO MAKE THESE SIMILAR.
WE SHOULD TRY TO HAVE THESE MIRROR EACH OTHER.
ONE THING I DON'T LIKE IN THE CURRENT LANGUAGE IS SAYS
"GROUND FLOOR ENTRANCES TO THE DWELLING UNIT SHALL FACE THE
STREET RIGHT-OF-WAY AND NOT INCLUDING ALLEYS."
I THINK IF WE REALLY WANT TO LOOK AT DENSITY AND CONCLUSION
OF THINGS, WHY CAN'T THEY FACE THE ALLEY?
10:28:05AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT WHEN WE COME BACK.
A LONG HISTORY AND WHAT HAPPENED IN COURIER CITY OSCAWANA
WHEN GOING IN THAT WAY.
ALLEYS TYPICALLY DON'T HAVE THE SAME AMOUNT OF CAPACITY AND
ARE NOT DESIGNED IN THE WAY THAT A STREET IS DESIGNED AND
THEY HAVE ACTIVITY GOING ON IN THE ALLEY THAT IS NOT
CONDUCIVE TO THE ENTRIES OF THE UNITS OCCURRING THERE.
WE HAVE PRESENTATIONS THAT I AM HAPPY TO SHARE REQUEST WITH
YOU OF -- I DON'T WANT TO SAY THE OBLITERATION OF OUR
ALLEYS, BUT THE OTHER THING IS WHEN I -- WHEN MERMT OR FIRE
COMES DOWN AND YOU ARE HAVING A HEART ATTACK, YOU CAN'T BE
ADDRESSED OFF AN ALLEY.
SO THEY ARE GOING TO THE FRONT OF YOUR UNIT.
THERE ARE A COUPLE OF FACETS RELATED TO THAT AND I AM HAPPY
TO GET INTO THAT WHEN WE COME BACK AND HAVE THAT DISCUSSION
RELATED TO THE SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED.
10:28:54AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I ALSO -- BUT I THINK THAT IS A LARGER
DISCUSSION WE NEED TO HAVE ABOUT ALLEYS.
WE ALREADY HAVE THE ALLEYS.
THEY ARE THERE.
WE DON'T MAINTAIN THEM.
WE HAVE A LOT OF WORK TO DO WITH OUR ALLEYS.
IF WE ARE REALLY TALKING OF DENSITY AND INCREASING, WE HAVE
TO LOOK AT EVERY POSSIBLE WAY.
AND I THINK IF YOU LOOK AT ANY BIG CITY, YOU WILL SEE PEOPLE
WHO COME -- WHO HAVE RESIDENCES OFF OF ALLEYS.
I DON'T THINK THAT HISTORY AND WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN AN ALLEY
BEFORE IS WHAT SHOULD STOP US.
YES, I KNOW THAT COSTS MONEY AND THAT TAKES TIME.
BUT SOMETHING THAT LONGER TERM THIS CITY REALLY NEEDS TO
LOOK AT FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING.
WE ABSOLUTELY.
WE HAVE SUCH DEEP LOTS AND PART OF THE ISSUE OF THE TOWN
HOMES IF WE CAN JUST HAVE FOUR PLACE THAT HAVE ALLEYS, WHY
CAN'T THEY FACE AN ALLEY.
GO TO, THEY HAVE FULL-ON HOUSES THAT FACE ALLEYS, AND YES,
THEY HAD TO WORK TO MAKE THEIR ALLIES BETTER BUT THEY ARE
NOT VERY MUCH BIGGER THAN OURS.
I WILL SAY THAT.
I WOULD LOVE A FURTHER DISCUSSION ON HOW TO MAKE ALLEYS
INVITING.
AND THIS MAY BE SOMETHING FOR MUCH FURTHER IN THE FUTURE,
BUT I THINK WE SHOULD KEEP THAT IDEA THERE.
I WOULD LOVE TO TAKE AWAY NOT INCLUDING ALLEY FROM THAT
LANGUAGE.
10:30:17AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
10:30:22AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I VOTE AGAIN THE ALLEY APPLICATIONS.
IN SOME AREAS, IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
WE NEED A BETTER ALLEY MAINTENANCE PROGRAM BECAUSE WE HAVE
TREES BLOCKING THEM.
AND -- AND GARBAGE TRUCKS REFUSE TO GO TO CERTAIN
NEIGHBORHOODS PAUSE OF IT.
BUT MY OLD HOUSE IN HYDE PARK, I DIDN'T BUILD IT.
IT WAS A 1921 HOUSE, BUT THE GARAGE WAS BUILT FACING THE
ALLEY, AND ALL OF MY NEIGHBORS WENT IN AND OUT THROUGH THE
ALLEY.
AND A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE SOME KIND OF DWELLING UNIT ABOVE
THEIR GARAGE.
YOU TALK OF ADUs.
YOU NEED TO PUT THE PARKING IN BACK AND DESIGN STANDARDS
MOSTLY IN CITIES ARE PUTTING PARKING IN BACK INSTEAD OF
DESIGNING THE STREET LEVEL TO BE HEAVY ON GARAGES.
IT'S INVITING TO PEOPLE.
AND YOU PUT THE GARAGE IN THE BACK.
SO ALL OF THAT LEADS TO BETTER ALLEYS, THANK YOU.
10:31:21AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
10:31:24AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I LOOK AT PUBLIC SAFETY IN ALLEYWAYS.
ALLEYWAYS ARE HORRIBLE IN TAMPA.
GARBAGE MEN, MANY, MANY MOONS GO, MR. MIRANDA, USED TO GO
THROUGH THAT.
TRUCKS ARE BIGGER NOW.
CARS ARE BIGGER NOW.
37 AND THEY ARE NOT MAINTAINED.
IF YOU TALK OF ALLEYWAYS, LOOK AT MAINTENANCE PLAN FOR AN
ALLEY.
ONE, ANYWAY, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN SUPPORT DOWN THE ROAD
I CAN SEE A GARAGE IN THE BACK OF THE ALLEY BUT A PLACE
FACING AN ALLEY AESTHETICALLY AND THE COMMUNITY, I DON'T
KNOW ABOUT THAT BUT I CAN SEE UTILIZING THAT.
BUT AS FAR AS THE DESIGN, HAVING AN ALLEY AND A FRONT DOOR
FACING OUT IS SOMETHING THAT WE CAN TALK ABOUT.
BUT I KNOW FOR ONE, PUBLIC SAFETY WILL BE A KEY GOAL FOR ME
WHEN TALKING OF AN ALLEY.
THE FIRE TRUCK AND SOME OF THE CARS CAN'T GET THROUGH THE
ALLEYS.
10:32:20AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
10:32:21AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, COUNCILMAN
GUDES.
ALLEYS FOR THAT TIME WERE FOR BARGAIN TRUCKS THAT GO BY.
FOUR INDIVIDUALS, IT WASN'T THAT WIDE, LONG OR HEAVY.
MAYBE IT CARRY A FIFTH OF WHAT WE CARRY NOW.
A DRIVER, TWO THROWERS AND ONE CATCHER.
AND THEY WOULD THROW AND EVERY -- AND EVERY DAY.
I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY DIDN'T BREAK THEIR BACKS BUT EVIDENTLY
THEY SURVIVED AND WHAT WE HAVE NOW ARE MONSTROUS TRUCKS NOT
EVEN COMPARABLE TO WHAT WE HAD.
WHAT WE HAD THEN COMPARED TO NOW IS LIKE HAVING A MINI CAR
HALF THE SIZE OF A VOLKSWAGEN COMPARED TO WHAT WE HAVE THAT
TAKES OUT TONS AND TONS OF IT AND TAKES IT TO THE PLANT TO
GET BURNED AND EXPOSED OF.
THINGS HAVE CHANGED.
THE ALLEYS HAVE NOT GOTTEN ANY BIGGER.
MOST OF THE ALLEYS IN YBOR CITY ARE THERE.
A LOT OF THEM IN WEST TAMPA, DO A STUDY, 50% DON'T HAVE AN
ALLEY.
CLOSED YEARS AGO AND THE OTHER PERCENT HAS AN ALLEY THAT
CANNOT MAKE A TURN INTO THE HOUSE BECAUSE OF THE WIDTH OF
THE ALLEY.
I AM NOT SAYING ALL OF THEM CAN'T MAKE A TURN BUT MOST OF
THEM I DON'T BELIEVE CAN A MOTION.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:33:38AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WANT COUNCIL TO THINK OF THIS BECAUSE WE
WILL HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT ADUs.
WHERE DO THEY FACE?
THOSE ENTRY DOORS FACE THE ALLEY FOR THE MOST PART.
WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS.
THEY ARE GOOD ENOUGH -- A LOT OF THEM CAN.
THE NEIGHBORHOODS I AM IN AN ADU.
THE FRONT DOOR FACES THE ALLEY.
SO I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD NOT -- I THINK WE SHOULD DISCUSS
THIS MORNING BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE A LOT OF THE ADUs WILL
FACE THAT IS WHERE OUR PARKING IN WITH THE ALLEY.
MULTIPLE ADUs IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD THAT ACTUALLY ENTER FROM
THE ALLEY.
AND THOSE CITIZENS -- I MEAN IT KIND OF FEELS LIKE WE ARE --
DON'T THEY DESERVE A GOOD FRONT SPACE TOO.
10:34:30AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
PUBLIC OUGHT TO KNOW WHAT ADUs ARE.
10:34:35AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT, BUT RIGHT NOW WE
ALREADY HAVE -- WE ALREADY HAVE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS
THAT FACE THE ALLEY.
SO I -- I THINK THAT EXPANDING THAT ISN'T OUTSIDE OF OF THE
REALM OF WHAT IS OCCURRING IN THE CITY.
SO ANYWAY.
10:34:51AM >> WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
MISS FEELEY.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN GUDES, I BELIEVE.
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
I AM GOING TO VOTE YES ON THIS.
BUT YOU TOUCHED ONE ON ONE THING PERMEABLE SPACE TAKING AWAY
GREEN SPACE.
WE HAVE CONSTITUENTS OUT THERE CALLING OUR OFFICES ABOUT
FLOODING THAT COME FROM ANOTHER BUILDING ON TO THEIR
PROPERTY OR EXCESSIVE FLOODING THAT RUNS OFF OF HOUSING THAT
IS TOO BIG FOR THE LOT INTO THEIR STREETS.
SO I AM GOING TO VOTE WITH YOU ON THIS ONE, BUT I WANT TO
BRING THIS UP IN FURTHER DISCUSSION.
ALL IN IF I EVER SAY AYE.
ANY OPPOSED?
THANK YOU.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:35:47AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I DO WANT TO MAKE ANOTHER MOTION ABOUT ALLEYS
BUT I WANT TO WORK WITH STEVEN ON THAT.
I AM NOT QUITE SURE OF TIMING AND THE DEPTH OF DISCUSSION
ABOUT ALLEYS.
I WANT TO SAY I WILL LIKE TO BRING THAT FORWARD IN A FUTURE
MEETING I WILL HAVE A MOTION ABOUT HAVING A DEEPER
DISCUSSION ABOUT OUR ALLEYS.
10:36:06AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5.
10:36:13AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THANK YOU.
ABBYE FEELEY.
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5 IS TO DISCUSS THE ABILITY FOR
SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED AND MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL TO BECOME
A PERMITTED USE IN OUR COMMERCIAL DISTRICT.
RIGHT NOW -- OOPS, I WENT THE WRONG WAY.
SORRY.
RIGHT NOW, MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND SINGLE-FAMILY
ATTACHED IS PERMITTED IN OUR COMMERCIAL DISTRICT AS S-1.
A SPECIAL USE 1.
TWO CRITERIA THAT GO WITH THEM.
SO IF YOU ARE IN A COMMERCIAL GENERAL ZONING DISTRICT AND
YOU WOULD LIKE TO PUT APARTMENTS IN, YOU COULD COME IN
THROUGH AND ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS AND THERE ARE TWO
CRITERIA THAT GO WITH THAT PROCESS.
THE FIRST IS YOU ARE ON AN ARTERIAL OR COLLECTOR AND FOLLOW
THE RM-24 STANDARDS.
THE RESIDENTIAL 24 STANDARDS.
YOU MEET THOSE TWO CRITERIA YOU ARE APPROVABLE AS A
PERMITTED USE WITNESS THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICT.
FOR EXAMPLE, YOU HAVE OF A COMMERCIAL PIECE OF PROPERTY ON
SOUTH FLORIDA AVENUE.
AND YOU WOULD LIKE TO DEVELOP THAT WITH A FIVE-STORY
APARTMENT BUILDING.
YOU COME INTO ZONING.
IT COMES AS A CONTINUAL USE.
YOU BRING A SITE PLAN.
YOU SHOW THAT YOU MEET THOSE TWO CONDITIONS.
ONE THAT YOU ARE ON AN ARTERIAL AND COLLECTOR STREET AND TWO
THAT YOU MEET THE RM-24 STANDARDS.
WHAT IS BEFORE YOU TODAY IS TO MAKE THAT TO ALLOW IT AS A
SPECIFIED LOOK.
AND DO HAVE CRITERIA FOR THE APARTMENT BUILDING TO COME IN
AND WILL NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH A SPECIAL USE PROCESS.
IT WILL GO THROUGH PERMITTING.
THIS IS A PROCESS IMPROVEMENT TO TRY TO MAKE THOSE
OPPORTUNITIES A LITTLE BIT MORE AVAILABLE FOR THOSE
DEVELOPMENTS.
SO THE -- AND, AGAIN, FEEDING BACK TO THE INVENTORY AND THE
AVAILABLE LAND TO CREATE HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES WITHIN THE
CITY SO -- -- I WILL GO THROUGH THAT.
AND THIS WILL BE EITHER TOWN HOME OR MULTIFAMILY
RESIDENTIAL.
AND THIS WILL BE FOR THE RO, WHICH WILL BE RESIDENTIAL
OFFICE, THE RO-1, THE OP, OFFICE PROFESSIONAL OP-1, CG,
COMMERCIAL GENERAL, C-I, COMMERCIAL INTENSIVE DISTRICT.
HERE IS THE CODE WITH WHAT I WENT OVER.
DIRECT ACCESS TO THE ARTERIAL COLLECTOR AND THE RM-24
STANDARDS A 25-FOOT FRONT, A 15-FOOT REAR AND SEVEN-FOOT
SIDES.
AND ALSO ON THE RM-24, ONCE YOU GET OVER 35 FEET, YOU HAVE
TO STEP THE BUILDING IN ADDITIONAL SETBACK.
THOSE CRITERIA THAT ARE THERE AS A SPECIAL USE WILL BE
SPECIALIZED USE CRITERIA.
WILL SAY WHEN YOU ARE DOING MULTIFAMILY IN A NONRESIDENTIAL
ZONING DISTRICT THESE WILL BE THE CRITERIA THAT YOU WILL
FOLLOW.
THE FIRST IS WHEN YOU ARE LOCATED IN AN OFFICE AND OR
COMMERCIAL DISTRICT, YOU WILL MEET THE DIMENSIONAL
REGULATIONS OF THE UNDER LYING ZONING DISTRICT THE SIDE AND
REAR YARDS WHICH IS NO LESS THAN TEN FOOT.
WHICH MEANS IN A COMMERCIAL GENERAL THAT CURRENTLY HAS A
TEN-FOOT SETBACK FOR THE FRONT THAT YOU CAN ALSO BENEFIT
FROM HAVING THAT TEN-FOOT SETBACK AND PICKING UP THOSE
ADDITIONAL 15 FEET OF LAND TO BE ABLE TO DESIGN ON THE
PROPERTY.
IT ACTUALLY WILL RESULT IN THE PROJECT COMING CLOSER UP TO
THE STREET MOST LIKELY WHEN RIGHT NOW IT FORCES IT TO BE 25
FEET BACK.
IT WILL BE CREATING MORE OF THAT PUBLIC REALM.
THE SECOND IS THAT ANY VARIANCES TO HEIGHT AND SETBACK MAY
BE GRANTED BY THE APPROPRIATE BOARD OR COMMISSION.
AND THE THIRD IS THAT THE DENSITY WOULD BE CONSISTENT WITH
THE UNDERLYING FUTURE LAND USE CATEGORY.
10:40:38AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
10:40:40AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
GLAD WE BROUGHT THAT UP.
THAT IS WHAT I WAS GOING TO TALK ABOUT.
LET YOU GO UP.
HOW DO WE BENEFIT.
HOW DO WE BENEFIT AS FAR AS, WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS.
MISS TRAVIS, MAYBE YOU CAN JUMP IN ON THAT.
I KNOW WE HAD A DISCUSSION ON THAT.
HERE SHE COMES.
HOW DO WE BENEFIT?
HOW DO WE PUT SOMETHING IN TO MAKE SURE WE ARE BENEFITING
WHEN WE ARE DOING A LOT OF THIS STUFF.
I KNOW PROJECTS THAT ARE COMING ONLINE.
AND I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GOT A BENEFIT OUT OF
IT.
HOW DO WE BENEFIT.
10:41:20AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
HOW DO YOU BENEFIT AS SPECIFIED USE?
10:41:25AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THAT AND GOING UP.
10:41:26AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
OH, THE DENSITY -- GOING UP.
WELL -- GOING -- JUST INCREASING YOUR DENSITY OVERALL, WE
ALREADY HAVE OUR HOUSING SHORTAGE, CORRECT.
AND SO IT IS NOT AFFORDABLE HOUSING SHORTAGE.
JUST HOUSING SHORTAGE OVERALL.
SO WHEN YOU HAVE MIXED USE DENSITIES GOING UP, IT ALLOWS YOU
TO GET MORE UNITS IN A SMALLER PIECE -- SMALLER SPACE.
TAMPA IS PRETTY MUCH BUILT OUT.
SO ANY PROJECTS THAT WE HAVE ARE REDEVELOPMENT PROJECTS.
YOU GO HIGHER IN DENSITY.
MORE UNITS.
IS THAT GENERALLY WHAT YOU WERE SAYING?
10:42:06AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
AND TRYING TO WORK WITH PEOPLE COMING IN TO
SEE IF THEY CAN HELP US WITH THIS SITUATION.
10:42:12AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
SO YOU HAVE OPTIONS WHEN YOU HAVE -- GETS A
LITTLE INTO YOUR FUTURE LAND USE AND GETS INTO THE HEIGHT
LIMITATIONS AND WE HAVE CAPS ON CERTAIN AREAS BUT THINGS
THAT YOU WANT AS A COUNCIL THAT YOU HAVE TALKED ABOUT,
HOUSING AFFORDABILITY BEING ONE OF THEM.
START LOOKING HOW DO YOU INCENTIVIZE AFFORDABILITY IN DOING
-- TAKING THE CAP OFF IN CERTAIN AREAS.
CHANNELSIDE IS ONE OF THOSE AREAS WITH A 7 F.A.R.
IF YOU WANT TO ALLOW THAT TO GO HIGHER.
WE BENEFIT AS A COMMUNITY TO TAKE THE CAP OFF AND HAVE THEM
DO ADDITIONAL DENSITY WITH REGARDS TO HOUSING AFFORDABILITY.
10:42:55AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THANK YOU.
10:42:56AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
THANK YOU.
10:42:57AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS.
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
10:43:00AM >>BILL CARLSON:
STATEMENT AND A QUESTION.
WE ARE IN A HOUSING CRISIS JUST LIKE MOST OF THE REESE OF
THE COUNTRY OR PARTS OF THE COUNTRY THAT PEOPLE ARE MOVING
TO.
BUT ALSO IN AN ECONOMIC CRISIS.
TAMPA HAS BEEN IN AN ECONOMIC CRISIS FOR 10, 11 YEARS AND
BEFORE THAT THE GREAT RECESSION AND WE PAINT A PRETTY
PICTURE HOW TAMPA IS DOING BECAUSE THE REGION IS DOING WELL.
BUT GO TO -- IF YOU WANT GO TO THE CENSUS DATA YOURSELF.
TAMPA HAS NOT DONE WELL.
WE FAILED ECONOMICALLY IN THE LAST 11 YEARS.
WE HAVE GONE SIDEWAYS COMPARED TO CITIES LIKE CHARLOTTE,
AUSTIN AND ATLANTA THAT GREW THEIR ECONOMIES AND DISPARITIES
BETWEEN RICH AND POOR, BLACK AND WHITE AND MEN AND WOMEN ARE
TERRIBLE.
OUR HOMEOWNERSHIP RATE IS TERRIBLE.
MY POINT IS THAT WE HAVE TO GROW OUR ECONOMY.
WHAT WE ARE DOING RIGHT NOW IS WE HAVE TEN YEARS OF
SUBSIDIZING A COUPLE OF DEVELOPERS AGAINST EVERYBODY ELSE.
WASN'T FAIR TO EVERYBODY ELSE AND ALSO SUBSIDIZE A FEW THAT
BROUGHT BACK OFFICE JOBS.
WE HAVEN'T DONE MUCH TO GROW OUR ECONOMY.
AND WE HAVE GOT TO SWITCH THAT.
WHAT IS HAPPENING BECAUSE OF THE HOUSING CRISIS AND NOT
PAYING ATTENTION TO IT THE ECONOMIC CRISIS WHICH IS ABOUT TO
GET VERY, VERY WORSE CONVERTING COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL
LAND TO HOUSING.
TEN YEARS WHEN WE WAKE UP AND SAY, HOLY CRAP, WE HAD 20
YEARS OF ECONOMIC CRISIS AND TAMPA IS NOT DOING WELL, WE ARE
GOING TO SAY NO PLACE TO PUT BUSINESSES ANYMORE.
AS I SEE THE ECONOMIC NUMBERS GETTING WORSE, I AM MORE
COMPARED OF CONVERTING INDUSTRIAL LAND BECAUSE WE NEED IT TO
GROW THE ECONOMY.
WE DON'T HAVE PEOPLE SITTING WORKING REMOTELY FROM NEW YORK.
WE NEED BUSINESSES HERE AND THEY HAVE TO BE LOGISTICALLY.
SO MY QUESTION IS, IS THERE A WAY TO JUST LIMIT THIS TO WHAT
I CALL SHOP HOUSES WHERE WE MANDATE AND GOT TO BE MIXED USE
INSTEAD OF SINGLE-FAMILY AND WE MANDATE THAT IT HAS TO BE
COMMERCIAL ON THE GROUND LEVEL OR FIRST AND SECOND LEVEL AND
THEN HOUSING ON TOP?
10:45:17AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
SO ABBYE FEELEY.
RIGHT NOW OUR CODE SPEAKS TO THIS BEING ALLOWED WITHIN THE
COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS.
IT IS JUST AS A CONTINUAL USE.
IT IS ALLOWED.
YOU CAN TO IT TODAY.
YOU CAN COME IN WITH AN APPLICATION.
SO WE ARE NOT CREATING SOMETHING THAT ISN'T ALLOWED TODAY.
IT IS ALLOWED TODAY.
10:45:36AM >>BILL CARLSON:
TELL US WHAT WE ARE ALLOWING.
SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING.
10:45:46AM >> TAKE IT FROM ONE APPLICATION PROCESS.
THE SPECIAL USE APPLICATION PROCESS OR CONDITIONAL USE
APPLICATION PROCESS WITH THOSE TWO CRITERIA AND MAKING IT A
SPECIFIED USE.
YOU NO LONGER HAVE AN ADDED LAYER OF HAVING TO FILE A
CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION, BUT THE CRITERIA ARE STILL
THERE TODAY.
SOME OF THE DISCUSSIONS WE HEARD FROM THE PUBLIC TAKING AWAY
COMMERCIAL.
IT IS ALLOWED TODAY COMES TO YOU ON APPEAL AS THE COMMERCIAL
PROPERTY BECAUSE HAVEN'T MET THE CRITERIA OF THE ARTERIAL
COLLECTOR.
A COMMERCIAL GENERAL AND THEY CAN BUILD A WANT THERE, BUT
FOR RESIDENTIAL, THEY HAVE TO -- THAT CRITERIA REQUIRES THEM
TO MEET BEYOND A ARTERIAL COLLECTOR.
10:46:37AM >>BILL CARLSON:
SIMILAR TO WHAT COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK SAID ON
THE HE SHALL ISSUE.
I WISH WE WOULD GO BACK.
AREAS WHERE WE PROVIDE A LOT OF DENSITY, LOTS OF HOUSING
UNITS ON TOP, BUT PROTECT THE GROUND LEVEL FOR COMMERCIAL.
10:46:53AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE DO HAVE A PERMITTED USE WITHIN ALL OF
THOSE COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS CALLED "STOREFRONT RESIDENTIAL."
"STOREFRONT RESIDENTIAL" NON RESY ON THE GROUND FLOOR OR
BEHIND OR RESIDENTIAL ABOVE.
AND THAT IS A PERMITTED USE TODAY.
IF ANYBODY WAS OUT THERE WANTING TO DO THAT, THEY COULD DO
IT TODAY AND GO STRAIGHT INTO THE PERMITTING PROCESS.
10:47:17AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
SO COUNCIL, TO YOUR POINT, RIGHT, THE
SPECIFIED USE SHORTENS THE PROCESS TIME.
TAKING FROM A TWO-LAYER APPLICATION PROCESS TO A SINGLE
APPLICATION PROCESS.
SO SHORTENS -- IT CHARTENS THE LENGTH OF TIME OF THE
APPLICATION.
WHAT YOU ARE TALKING BY UNDERSTAND IS GREATER THAN -- THIS
IS REAL ESTATE THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT NOW.
YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT LARGER ECONOMIC IMPACTS WHERE WE
SHOULD BE LOOKING AT MORE THE TYPE OF JOBS.
10:47:53AM >> BECAUSE OF ECONOMIC PROBLEMS WE NEED TO LOOK AT
COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL SPACE AND CONVERTING HOUSING.
I WOULD RATHER TOUGHEN IT UP AT LEAST AT THE GROUND LEVEL SO
IF YOU DO THIS, NO NOTICE TO THE -- TO THE NEIGHBORS THAT --
THAT YOU ARE GETTING WHAT USED TO BE AN EXCEPTION.
10:48:08AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
ON SPECIFIED USE WOULD NOT GET NOTICE.
ON THE S-1, YOU WOULD GET NOTICE.
10:48:19AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I WON'T SUPPORT THIS, WHATEVER MY COLLEAGUES
DO, I WISH WE WOULD GO BACK TO HEAVY MULTIUSE.
THE MULTIUSE LOOPHOLE TO PUT 100 SQUARE FEET AND BUILD 5 00
UNITS OF HOUSING.
I THINK IN COMMERCIAL AREAS IN PARTICULAR, I THINK WE NEED
-- WE NEED, LIKE, A MANDATE FOR THE GROUND LEVEL AT LEAST OR
-- OR 10 OR 20% OR WHATEVER THE PERCENTAGE IS THAT IT HAS TO
REMAIN COMMERCIAL BECAUSE WHERE ELSE IN OUR BUSINESS.
NO PLACE FOR PEOPLE TO EARN MONEY TO AFFORD THESE HOUSES.
THE REASON WE HAVE A HOUSING PROBLEM, THERE IS A SHORTAGE OF
UNITS, BUT THEIR RENT PRICES ARE GOING UP AND WAGES ARE NOT
KEEPING UP WITH IT BECAUSE RECRUITING CRAPPY JOBS THROUGH
THE .
AND WE NEED TO CREATE OUR OWN JOBS INSTEAD OF SUBSIDIZING
OTHER JOBS THAT DON'T PAY VERY MUCH.
10:49:11AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
10:49:14AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
.COUNCILMAN CARLSON, DON'T SAY WE WISH, WE CAN
GO BACK.
WE CAN MAKE THESE CHANGES.
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU.
AND, YES, IT IS A HUGE PROBLEM RIGHT NOW WHERE THEY PUT IN
THIS INCREDIBLY TINY PIECE OF COMMERCIAL.
AND THEN THE REST OF IT IS BUILT OUT.
I CAN THINK OF MULTIPLE EXAMPLES WHERE IT IS -- IT GETS ME
-- IN NORTH HYDE PARK A DUCKWEED IN A CORNER AND NOTHING BUT
PARKING WALL.
AND -- I MEAN THAT DUCKWEED IS ABSOLUTELY PACKED.
IT IS BUSY ALL THE TIME.
NOW THAT AREA IS A WALKABLE NEIGHBORHOOD.
WE CAN NOT GET THAT BACK.
WE CANNOT GET THAT FRONTAGE SPACE BACK.
I COMPLETELY AGREE.
WE NEED TO SUPPORT THIS.
I WOULD -- I WOULD NEED TO HAVE A GUARANTEE IN A COMMERCIAL
DISTRICT -- AGAIN YOU ARE SAYING THAT THEY CAN ALREADY DO
THIS.
I WOULD LIKE TO FIND A WAY TO ROLL IT BACK AND FIND A WAY WE
DEMAND COMMERCIAL ON IN ANY OF THESE UNITS THAT HAVE -- WHAT
IS IT, THAT FIT THOSE TWO THINGS WITH THE ARTERIAL ROAD AND
THE RM-24.
IS THAT THE REQUIREMENTS?
SO THE OTHER THING WILL HAVE TO BE THE THIRD REQUIREMENT
WOULD HAVE TO BE COMMERCIAL USE ON THE GROUND FLOOR JUST
THROWING THAT OUT THERE.
10:50:43AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
ALLOW US THE OPPORTUNITY TO GO LOOK AT
THAT.
IF YOU TALK THROUGH THE CRITERIA AND LET US KNOW WHAT WITH
YOU LIKE OR DON'T LIKE.
WE HEAR THE COMMENTS.
37 AND WE WERE JUST WHISPERING TO EACH OTHER THAT WE THINK
THERE ARE SOME TWEAKS WE CAN MAKE AND SUGGESTIONS TO COME UP
WITH.
IF ALLOWS THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME BACK.
WE HEAR YOU LOUD AND CLEAR.
A LARGER ECONOMIC AND YOU HAVE TO PROTECT THAT IN THE LAND
USES AND YOUR ZONING.
10:51:11AM >>BILL CARLSON:
MR. CHAIR.
10:51:13AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
10:51:16AM >>BILL CARLSON:
CAN I ASK MISS SWIFT AS A CONTENT EXPERT TO
GIVE A MINUTE OF FEEDBACK ON THIS.
10:51:22AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
SHE WAS GOING TO SPEAK IN THE PUBLIC
COMMENT.
10:51:30AM >>BILL CARLSON:
THANK YOU.
10:51:32AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I HAVE SPOKEN TO MISS FEELEY AND SOME OTHER
PEOPLE.
IT SHOULD BE MANDATORY THAT BOTTOM FLOOR IS RETAIL.
MAKE IT MANDATORY.
WE HAVE MIXED USE THAT HAS COME IN THAT A 5,000, 6,000,
7,000 SQUARE FOOT.
AND 50 FOOT OF IT WAS RETAIL.
THAT IS RIDICULOUS.
THAT IS ABSURD.
AND PUT IT ON THE ONUS ON THE DEVELOPER THAT FOR SOME REASON
THEY ARE AT THE END OF A DEAD-END STREET OR SOMETHING WHERE
IT IS NOT GOING TO WORK FOR THEM TO HAVE THE RETAIL ON THE
BOTTOM FLOOR, MAKE THEM HAVE TO HAVE THE BURDEN OF PROOF.
ALL RIGHT, ARE WE FINISHED WITH COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
I HAVEN'T PASSED MY GAVEL YET.
MISS SWIFT, SPEAK TO AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5.
10:52:32AM >> THANK YOU.
I AGREE WITH COUNCILMEMBERS CARLSON AND HURTAK.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THIS ROLLED BACK, ALTHOUGH I PLEASANTLY
SURPRISED TO HEAR THAT.
THIS IS ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT IS
REALLY SUCH A MAJOR POLICY CHANGE THAT 2 NEEDS TO BE A COMP
PLAN AMENDMENT IF IT NEEDS TO GO FORWARD THAT WAY.
I RECOGNIZE THAT IT IS ALREADY A SPECIAL USE 1 AND THIS WILL
MAKE IT BLANKET.
AND MY REASONS -- THIS IS -- THERE ARE SO MANY TOOLS THAT WE
WILL NEED TO USE TO NEXT OUR HOUSING AFFORDABLE AND --
HOUSING AFFORDABILITY AND STOCK PERIOD.
MY SPECIALTY IN GRAD SCHOOL AND ALMOST ALL OF MY POSITIONS,
PUBLIC POSITIONS, I AM -- I CHANGED AFFORDABLE HOUSING LAW
TO MAKE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.
BUT AS I SAID, SOME OF THEM ARE GREAT CONCEPTS BUT WHEN YOU
PUT THEM ON PAPER AND THEN ON THE LAND IN A VERY URBAN AREA
LIKE TAMPA, SOMETIMES YOU GET LOTS OF UNINTENDED
CONSEQUENCES.
I THINK THIS SPREADS MULTIFAMILY OUT BY RIGHT TO EVERY
DISTRICT.
THAT IN ITSELF MAKES A LOT OF BAD USES NEXT TO ANOTHER USE
THAT MAYBE THEY SHOULDN'T BE NEXT TO EACH OTHER LIKE
HOUSTON.
AND I DON'T THINK THAT IS WHAT WE WANT I DON'T THINK WE WANT
TO JUST GET HOUSING MORE AFFORDABLE BECAUSE YOU CAN BUILD IT
ANYWHERE.
FIVE YEARS FROM NOW YOU WILL HAVE PEOPLE UP HERE NOT LIKING
WHAT THEY ARE NEXT TO.
SO I DO THINK THAT IT SHOULD BE -- IF IT MOVES FORWARD IT
SHOULD BE A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN UPDATE DISCUSSION.
I -- THE -- I THINK YOU SHOULD ASK FOR A MAP OF HOW ALL
THESE DISTRICT -- WHEN YOU SEE THE MAP OF ALL THE DISTRICTS
THE WHOLE CITY THAT WILL HAVE 35 OR 60 FOOT HIGH.
THE DIMENSIONAL REGULATIONS ARE OTHER THINGS NOT IN MY THREE
MINUTES.
AND SOMETHING THAT IS DEFINITELY NOT IN MY THREE MINUTES AND
DETAILS -- DETAILED AND YOU NEED A FLOW CHART TO FOLLOW IS
THE RM-24 DESIGN STANDARDS AND HOW THEY ARE BEING APPLIED
AND HOW YOU ARE -- YOU ALL ARE BEING ALLOWED TO APPEAL
THINGS THAT I DON'T THINK WERE EVEN MEANT TO MOVE FORWARD IN
FROM A DEVELOPER'S APPLICATION.
AND SO YOU -- THE SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD DOESN'T REALLY
HAVE RELIANCE ON THE CODE BECAUSE IT IS ALL CONFUSING.
THANK YOU.
10:55:46AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
10:55:48AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I RESPECT ALL COMMENTS.
MY AIDE BROUGHT US THIS INFORMATION.
SOMEONE SENT ME BUILDING SUBSIDIZED LOW-INCOME HOUSING LIFTS
PROPERTY VALUES CONTRADICTING NIMBY RETURNS.
CONCENTRATING LOW HOUSING DEVELOPMENTS IS NOT AS BAD AS
RESIDENTS FEAR.
INCREASING PROPERTY VALUES AT FASTER RATE THAN OTHER
NEIGHBORHOODS.
YOU USE THE WORD "SUBSIDIZED" AND "LOW INCOME" YOU THINK ALL
POOR PEOPLE.
CERTAIN LEVELS DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE AT THE BOTTOM BUT AT A
RATE THAT YOU CAN'T SUSTAIN.
IT DOESN'T MEAN BAD PEOPLE.
YOU KNOW, SECTION 8 -- PEOPLE ON SECTION 8 ARE NOT BAD
PEOPLE.
THEY HAVE DECENT JOBS, BUT JUST CAN'T SUSTAIN TO BE WHERE
THEY NEED TO BE.
SO I WANT US TO THINK ABOUT THIS, BECAUSE NO MATTER WHAT YOU
DO, HOUSING -- PEOPLE FEEL MORE VIABLE AND FEEL MORE GOOD
WHEN THEY HAVE A PLACE TO STAY.
THEY KNOW AT NIGHT -- EVEN IF THEY DON'T HAVE ANY FOOD AND
LAY MY HEAD IN A SAFE PLACE.
SO MY BIGGEST CONCERN IS YOU NEED COMMERCIAL OF THAT
PROBLEM.
YOU CAN HAVE THE LOCAL GUY IN THE APARTMENT COMPLEX COULD BE
THE -- THE BARBER FOR EVERYBODY IN THE BUILDING.
MISS JONES WHO DOES CAKES AND PIES FOR A FEW FRIENDS CAN
HAVE A BAKE SHOP AND HAVE A OR SOUL GOOD DINNER.
I BELIEVE THAT THE BOTTOM SHOULD BE COMMERCIAL.
WITH SPACE AND HAVE IT IN THERE.
BUT MAKE SURE YOU HAVE HOUSING AT THAT TOP LEVEL.
I WANTED TO THAT OUT THAT PEOPLE ARE WATCHING AND PEOPLE ARE
NOTICING.
THANK YOU.
I WILL YIELD BACK.
10:57:35AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA AND THEN COUNCILMAN
MANISCALCO.
10:57:38AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
WITH COUNCILMAN GUDES' COMMENTS.
SOCIETY IS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT A COUPLE YEARS BACK.
HOMEOWNERS INSURANCE AND THE AUTOMOBILE INSURANCE POLICY,
$5,000 BETWEEN BOTH OF THEM.
CEMENTS LIKE A LOT OF MONEY, ABOUT YOU HAVE A MORTGAGE, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE THAT.
YOU CAN'T DRIVE EVEN THOUGH A LOT OF PEOPLE DRIVE WITHOUT
INSURANCE.
HOW DO I KNOW THAT?
WELL, I WASN'T INVOLVED BUT THE CAR THAT I OWN WAS HIT BY AN
INDIVIDUAL WHO DIDN'T HAVE INSURANCE, BUT HE DIDN'T EVEN
HAVE A DRIVER'S LICENSE.
THOSE THINGS HAPPEN.
AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT A SALARY OF LET'S SAY $40,000 OR
$45,000 AND HAVE A WIFE AND TWO KIDS, YOU ARE LOSING $5,000
JUST ON THOSE TWO ITEMS.
WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN?
YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO MAKE THE PAYMENT, THAT IS WHAT IS
GOING TO HAPPEN.
SO WE ARE CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE BETWEEN RISING PRICES.
NOT BECAUSE OF WHAT IS HAPPENING NOW.
NOT BECAUSE OF EXPENDITURE OF WHOEVER IS IN GOVERNMENT AND
SO ON AND THE TOP-NOTCH OF FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
THE INDIVIDUALS TRYING TO CARRY THE LOAD CAN'T PULL THE
WAGON ANYMORE BECAUSE THE WAGON IS OVERLOADED.
THAT IS THE PROBLEM WE HAVE.
BACK THEN, YOU COULD BUY A HOUSE WITH PAYMENTS OF 65, 75,
$80 A MONTH.
YOU CAN'T EVEN RIDE THE BUS FOR $80 A MONTH.
SO WHAT I AM SAYING, LET'S FACE REALITY.
AND REALITY IS, EVERYTHING IS OVERPRICED.
SO DON'T CATCH A COLD.
BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T HAVE INSURANCE, YOU WILL BE IN TROUBLE.
THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT -- THAT WE ARE FACING IN THIS
COUNTRY.
THE WHOLE WORLD IS FACING IN THIS COUNTRY.
AND IF WE THINK WE ARE BAD OFF, LOOK AT ANOTHER COUNTRY AND
COMPARE YOURSELF TO THEM, AND YOU ARE NOT AS BAD OFF AS YOU
THINK.
ANYWAY, THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
10:59:34AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
10:59:36AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
I LIKE TO COMPARE IN THE HISTORIC YBOR CITY MODEL.
BUSINESSES ON THE TOP FLOOR AND PEOPLE LIVE UP TOP.
THE BARBER ON THE SECOND FLOOR THAT HAS HIS PLACE BELOW, BUT
ELIMINATING A LOT OF COST BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE IN THAT
LIVE-WORK ENVIRONMENT.
AND YOU CREATE BETTER OPPORTUNITIES WHILE CUTTING THE COST
OF LIVING OVERALL BECAUSE NOT SPENDING SO MUCH MONEY.
AT THE SAME TIME, IT CREATES A DENSITY, BUILDS A CLIENTELE,
BUILDS A SENSE OF COMMUNITY AND I THINK IT WORKS.
AGAIN MENTIONING YBOR CITY IS THE PERFECT EXAMPLE BECAUSE
EVERYTHING IN ONE, DENSE AREA.
PEOPLE DIDN'T NEED TO GO OUTSIDE THAT AREA BECAUSE
EVERYTHING THAT THEY NEEDED WAS THERE.
AND, AGAIN, GOING BACK TO ALL COMMERCIAL DOWN BELOW WHEN THE
SERVICES YOU NEED ARE ON THE FIRST FLOOR AND PEOPLE LIVE UP
TOP, I THINK IT MAKES IT EASIER.
11:00:29AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. ROBINSON.
11:00:34AM >> THANK YOU FOR THE PUBLIC COMMENT.
SINCE WE ARE THROWING CREDENTIAL.
LICENSED PROFESSIONAL SINCE 1982, MR. CARLSON, I DO
CONSULTING AND A RELEVANT MATTER FOR HOUSING.
AND HAVING DONE IT ALL WORK FOR THE CITY OF TAMPA AND
SEVERAL OTHER AGENCIES AROUND HERE, INCLUDING THE BUCS.
LET ME JUST SAY THIS.
I LOOK AT THIS AS MORE OF A PROCESS CHANGE FOR MORE
EFFICIENCY.
THE SUBSTANTIVE DISCUSSION THAT YOU ALL ARE HAVING DEALING
WITH THE -- WITH THE -- I HAVE PROPERTY THAT IS ON AN
ARTERIAL THAT IS -- RM-24.
RM-16 JUST LIKE THIS BUT RESIDENTIAL.
I REFUSE TO KNOCK DOWN MY WOOD FRAMES.
AND I CAN DO EXACTLY WHATEVER Y'ALL ARE DOING.
EVEN IN WEST TAMPA, WE HAVE A -- WE HAVE -- A PROGRAM THAT
THEN COURAGE YOU TO HAVE RETAIL ON THE BOTTOM AND TO HAVE
RESIDENTIAL UP TOP WHERE YOU CAN REHAB.
MARVIN KNIGHT, HOPE YOU ARE LISTENING TO THIS AND GO OVER
AND DO WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.
THIS TIES INTO THE LONG DISCUSSION ABOUT ALLEYS.
LET ME GIVE YOU ENGINEERING REASONS.
SIZE OF THE TRUCKS LIKE CHARLIE SAID.
I REMEMBER WHEN THEY USED TO PICK THEM UP OF THE TOP OF THE
SCAGLIONE HOUSE.
THE COUNTY HAS NOT DONE AN ASSESSMENT OF ANY ALLEYS.
THEY COULDN'T TELL YOU WHAT ALLEY WOULD BE ANYWHERE.
WILL BE CLOSED.
AND PAYING TAXES AND VACATED -- WASN'T VACATED BUT IT WAS
VACATED.
ALLEYS ARE NOT DOCUMENTED.
AND CLOSED, VACATED, YOU KNOW, FLOODING WHICH WE HAD OVER
THERE IN TAMPA HEIGHTS.
LET ME JUST TELL YOU WHAT WEST TAMPA DID LAST NIGHT.
TUESDAY NIGHT.
ALLOCATED $250,000 TO BE -- YOU KNOW WE ARE INNOVATIVE IN
WEST TAMPA.
WE ARE GOING TO SET THE BAR.
WE HAVE APPROVED -- AT LEAST NOT APPROVED BY OTHER PEOPLE
LOOKING AT -- BUT APPROVED ALLEYS TO BE STUDIED.
THIS GUY SITTING RIGHT THERE MADE A PRESENTATION.
AND WE SAID -- I MADE THE MOTION WE WILL PUT MONEY ON THESE
ALLEYS IN WEST TAMPA.
WE ARE GOING TO FIND OUT WHERE THEY ARE.
CATALOG.
GIVE ME A MAP.
GIS AND DEAL WITH IT.
YOU CAN NOT SOLVE AN ENGINEERING PROBLEM WITHOUT HAVING THE
INFORMATION.
YOU CAN'T SOLVE A PROBLEM WITHOUT THE GETTING.
WE NEED TO GET THAT IDENTIFIED WITH WHAT WE ARE DOING, OKAY.
WE NEED TO IDENTIFY WHAT WE ARE DOING, WHAT WE HAVE.
THAT IS WHY YOU HAVE A BALL OF CONFUSION.
WHY SOME OF THAT -- THEY HAVE NOT BEEN CATALOGED AND NOT
DETERMINED.
AND THE CITY WILL TELL YOU THEY DON'T HAVE A STANDARD FOR
ALLEY SURFACE.
WE GOT TO DEAL WITH THAT.
SOME ALLEYS ARE BRICK.
SOME ALLEYS ARE GRAVEL.
THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU GOT OUT THERE.
OKAY.
SO WE DECIDE AS ENGINEERS -- WE ARE SMART GUYS.
LET'S JUST START WITH DOCUMENTING WHAT WE HAVE.
FINDING OUT WHAT CONDITION THEY ARE IN.
GENERATE A MAP THAT SHOWS EVERY ONE OF THEM, AT LEAST IN
OUR CRA AND PUT $250,000 UP AND MOTION PASSED
UNANIMOUSLY TO GIVE IT UP.
WE ARE TIRED OF HEARING ABOUT THESE ALLEYS BECAUSE --
DEPENDS.
IT IS SITUATIONAL.
WE ARE IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT LIKE YBOR CITY AND WE DON'T
WANT TO LOSE SOME OF THAT FABRIC.
I'M HERE TO TELL YOU THAT LET'S HAVE THIS DISCUSSION ON
ALLEYS.
BUT THIS THING IS ABOUT TRYING TO -- TO MAKE EFFICIENCY FROM
-- HAVING SPECIFIED USE TO HAVING A SPECIAL USE.
ON THIS ONE, THEY COULD GO EITHER WAY, BUT THE DISCUSSION
THAT YOU WERE HAVING -- THIS IS ADDRESSING THE PROCESS OF
MAKING THINGS MORE EFFICIENT.
BUT IT REALLY DOESN'T MATTER, BECAUSE I THINK THAT NOW THAT
YOU GUYS HAVE THE GIST OF WHAT IS GOING ON, YOU SEE THAT WE
HAVE GOT A LOT OF PROCESSES.
AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE NEED TO DO -- WE DON'T HAVE THE
TIME LIKE WE USED TO HAVE.
ALL THIS STUFF MOVING IN.
THE MORE YOU MAKE PROCESS EFFICIENT, THE BETTER IT IS GOING
TO BE AND THEN HAVE THE SUBSTANTIVE.
SUFFICIENCY.
THAT IS WHY I CAME DOWN HERE.
I HAVE PLENTY TO DO.
THE ALLEYS, WEST TAMPA CRA CAC IS WAY AHEAD OF Y'ALL.
11:05:00AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. HAGAN.
11:05:02AM >> NATHAN HAGAN.
THAT WAS AN AWESOME COMMENT.
I THINK IT IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO EMPHASIZE SOMETHING THAT I
NOTICE AS SOMEONE WHO WATCHES THESE MEETINGS A LOT AND TALK
TO A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY.
THERE IS -- WE HAVE DEVELOPED A CULTURE.
BUT YOU CAN LOOK AT OUR PD PROCESS OF THE BEST EMBODIMENT OF
THAT.
WE SEE -- WE LOOK AT -- WE ASK OURSELVES HOW CAN WE SOLVE
THE PROBLEMS THAT WE HAVE WITH DEVELOPMENT IN OUR COMMUNITY.
AND CONSISTENTLY, THE ANSWER IS, OR THE INCENTIVES HAVE A
LINE -- JUST -- AS I NOTICED THE ANSWER IS PROCESS.
WE DON'T WANT TO MAKE THINGS BETTER.
WE WANT TO ADD MORE PROCESS TO CATCH BAD THINGS IN -- AS
THEY GO.
WHEN I WORK WITH NEIGHBORHOODS, LET'S SAY I AM SUPPORTING A
PROJECT AND THEY ARE FIGHTING A PROJECT.
WE ALL AGREE THAT THE CODE NEEDS TO BE BETTER.
BUT WE DON'T HAVE TIME TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
ALL WE CAN DO IS TALK OF THE PROCESS WE ARE IN THE MIDST OF.
I WOULD SAY GENERALLY THIS COUNCIL NEEDS TO BE VERY
AGGRESSIVE AT TAKING STEPS TO REDUCE PROCESS.
SO THAT WE CAN FOCUS ON WHAT ACTUALLY NEEDS TO BE FIXED
WHICH IS OUR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND EVERYBODY IF YOU ARE
A DEVELOPER, ADVOCATE AND ELECTED OFFICIAL.
NOTHING LIKES IT.
WE WANT TIME FOR CHANGES AND SO MUCH TIME SPENT ON PROCESS.
WE ALSO -- YOU KNOW, ON THAT LINE, WE TALKED A LOT OF
SUBSEQUENT POLICY WITH THIS IS PROCESS.
WE OPENED PANDORA'S BOX AND COMMENT IN A LITTLE BIT.
FLORIDA RISING IN THE TENANT UNIT DON'T SHOW UP FOR THESE
MEETINGS, THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE DEPENDING ON WHAT NUMBER
YOU LOOK AT IN THE CITY OF TAMPA ARE RENTERS.
IF YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE COMP PLAN CHANGES COMING UP,
THERE IS GOING TO BE EVEN MORE RENTER AS SOON AS THE FUTURE.
SO -- RENTERS IN THE FUTURE.
THIS AS FAR AS MY UNDERSTANDING HOW IT WAS EXPLAINED, NOT A
CHANGE IN WHERE YOU CAN DO RM-24 ON COMMERCIAL CITYWIDE.
SOUNDS LIKE YOU CAN DO THAT -- ANY COMMERCIAL ZONING
ANYWHERE CITYWIDE.
ALL THIS DOES IS IMPROVE THE PROCESS BUT I WANT TO POINT OUT
SOMETHING THAT I CAN NEVER INSTITUTE ENOUGH.
BUILDING A HOUSING COMPLEX THAT HOUSES 500 PEOPLE.
WE ARE AFRAID 10 OR 15 YEARS NEIGHBORS WILL SAY THESE 500
NEIGHBORS DESTROYED MY LIFE.
NOBODY IN THAT 300-UNIT BUILDING EVEN KNOWS THERE IS A
PROBLEM.
THEY APPRECIATE THE FACT THEY HAVE HOUSING.
SO I WANT TO EMPHASIZE, HOMEOWNERS SHOULD NOT RUN THE CITY.
THE CITY IS NOT MAJORITY HOMEOWNERS ANYMORE.
WE SHOULD SISTER THAT WITH MULTIFAMILY AND WHETHER IT
DESTROYS MY NEIGHBORHOOD ALL OVER THE PLACE.
THE TRUTH IS PEOPLE NEED HOUSING.
THE DATA YOU SHOWED, IF YOU LOOK AT THE DATA, MORE HOUSING
SOLVES IT.
AND WE NEEDS TO DO THINGS LIKE FIX THE CODE AND HAVE
AFFORDABLE HOUSING BONUSES THAT ACTUALLY PEOPLE TAKE
ADVANTAGE OF.
I WILL STOP THERE BECAUSE YOU KNOW I CAN TALK FOREVER.
I WILL BE UP 234 A FEW MINUTES.
11:08:11AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
11:08:13AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WANT TO SAY -- I UNDERSTAND THIS IS ABOUT
PROCESS.
AND I DON'T DISAGREE WITH MAKING THE PROCESS EASIER, BUT I
DO THINK THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME SAFEGUARDS ON IT.
AND THAT IS THE CONCERN THAT I AM SEEING.
AND SINCE I AM NOT AN EXPERT AT THIS, I AM ASKING HOW DO WE
ADD THAT SAFEGUARD UNTIL WE GET THE CODE THAT WE WANT, WHICH
I KNOW IS A MUCH LARGER -- OR THE CODE REFRESH THAT WE NEED
THAT IS A MUCH LARGER PROCESS.
I THINK THAT IS WHAT ALL OF US ARE CONCERNED ABOUT.
BECAUSE IF THIS IT -- THESE ARE TECHNICALLY ALREADY ALLOWED.
BUT HOW DO WE STOP WHAT WE ARE ALL SEEING OF THESE
500-SQUARE-FOOT COMMERCIAL.
WHAT IS OUR STOPGAP UNTIL WE GET THOSE CODE CHANGES TO MAKE
SURE THAT WE GET WHAT WE NEED TO ENCOURAGE OUR ECONOMIC
DEVELOPMENT, AS WELL AS HOUSING.
11:09:12AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
ABBYE FEELEY.
I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT THE EXAMPLE YOU KEEP GIVING OF THE
500 SQUARE FEET THAT IS IN A MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL, THOSE
ARE PDs THAT HAVE COME TO YOU TO GET THE BUMP-UP FOR
ADDITIONAL F.A.R. BY DOING TWO USES.
THOSE HAVE BEEN -- COME BEFORE THIS COUNCIL AND THIS COUNCIL
HAS APPROVED THEM.
AND STEVEN AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND MYSELF AND ERIC,
WE ARE WORKING THROUGH WHAT THAT MINIMUM FOR THOSE REQUESTS
ARE.
SO THAT -- THAT IS ONE ELEMENT OF THIS.
BUT THAT IS COMING TO YOU IT UNDER A DIFFERENT UMBRELLA.
WHAT THIS IS LIKE I SAID.
THIS SAY LOWED TODAY THROUGH A SPECIAL USE -- THIS IS
ALLOWED TODAY THROUGH A SPECIAL USE PROCESS.
WE ARE ASKING THAT THIS BE FROM A SPECIAL USE PROCESS TO A
SPECIALIZED PROCESS WHERE WE NO LONGER HAVE TO COME FOR THE
SECOND LAYER.
IF THEY ARE MEETING THIS CRITERIA, THEY WILL BE ALLOWED TO
GO TO PERMITTING.
I CAN SHOW YOU -- I AM HAPPY TO GO BACK AND SHOW YOU THE
NUMBER OF PDs THAT CAME IN COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS AND HAD THAT
MADE AVAILABLE TO THEM.
THEY WILL BE ALLOWED TO GO TO PERMITTING BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T
NEED A WAIVER FOR X, Y AND Z, BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT MEETING
ONE OF THOSE TWO CRITERIA, A SIX TO NINE-MONTH PROCESS, A
$10,000 PROCESS, ANOTHER HOLD-UP WHERE OUR CODE RIGHT NOW
SAYS, HEY, IF YOU WERE IN A COMMERCIAL DISTRICT AND YOU MEET
THESE TWO STANDARDS, YOU ARE ALLOWED.
I AM NOT TRYING TO CHANGE ANY OF THAT.
IF WE ARE ALLOWED UNDER THIS TWO CRITERIA, WHAT IF IT WAS
EASIER BEING ALLOWED AND I WILL HAVE TO MEET CRITERIA.
NOT A FREE FOR ALL.
THE OTHER THING I WANT TO TALK ABOUT WHERE WE HAVE REQUIRED
NONRESIDENTIAL FIRST FLOORS IN THE CHANNEL DISTRICT, IT HAS
TAKEN US 25 YEARS TO GET THE REQUIRED RETAIL SPACES FILLED
BECAUSE CHANNEL DISTRICT HAS JUST APPROACHED A THRESHOLD
POPULATION TO SUPPORT THOSE KIND OF BUSINESSES AND MAKE IT
PROFITABLE FOR THE SMALL BUSINESSES TO GO INTO THOSE SPACES
THAT WE REQUIRE.
MANY OF THOSE SPACES HAVE SAT VACANT FOR MANY, MANY YEARS A
DECADE NO USE IN THEM.
A GROUND FLOOR WITH A LEASE.
WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT THINGS.
STOREFRONT RESIDENTIAL.
IF A DEVELOPER WANTS TO GO IN TODAY AND BUILDS
NONRESIDENTIAL ON THE FIRST FLOOR AND RESIDENTIAL ABOVE, NOT
EVEN A SPECIAL USE.
THAT IS PERMITTED.
IT COULD HAPPEN TOMORROW FOR THOSE PEOPLE IF THEY WERE
MAKING THOSE CHOICES.
WHAT WE ARE SEEING IS THE MARKET ISN'T MAKING THOSE CHOICES
BECAUSE EITHER IT IS NOT LUCRATIVE FOR THE MARKET OR SOME OF
THEM ARE COMING TO YOU IN THE FORMS OF OTHER THINGS.
I AM HAPPY TO GO BACK AND POLL HOW MANY COMMERCIAL
PROPERTIES CAME TO YOU ASKING FOR EITHER SINGLE USE
RESIDENTIAL OR RESIDENTIAL WITH SOME PORTION OF
NONRESIDENTIAL.
BUT THAT WAS JUST TO GET THAT ADDITIONAL INTENSITY BUMP.
SO HAPPY TO TAKE THIS DISCUSSION IN ANY DIRECTIONS WITH YOU.
I THINK OUR INTENT AS WAS MENTIONED TODAY, THIS WAS A
PROCESS IMPROVEMENT TO LOOK AT WHAT IS COMING TO YOU EITHER
ON APPEAL, LIMITING THOSE APPEALS.
IF WE THINK IT IS APROP -- APPROPRIATE AS A CONDITIONAL USE,
TO TAKE SPECIFIED USE.
HAPPY TO TAKE DIRECTION.
11:13:00AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
THIS IS ON THE HEELS OF A PREVIOUS WORKSHOP
WHERE WE WERE IN THE MIDST OF HAVING RENT STABILIZATION
CONVERSATIONS AND WE WERE TRYING TO DO A LOT OF SOLVING AND
PROCESS IMPROVEMENTS, POLICY CHANGES, AND HOW CAN WE
CONTINUE TO HELP WITH THE HOUSING CHALLENGES THAT WE HAVE.
SPECIFIED USE IS THE PROCESS IMPROVEMENT THAT CAME IN THE
HEELS OF A PREVIOUS WORKSHOP WE HAD EARLIER THIS YEAR
BROUGHT BACK TO YOU TODAY.
IN FACT YOU GUYS ASKED US TO ACCELERATE IT SO WE COULD MAKE
THIS -- AGAIN, PROCESS IMPROVEMENT.
THE OTHER SAFEGUARDS THAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT IN ANOTHER
PROCESS.
THIS IS ALREADY ALLOWED TODAY.
11:13:43AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
11:13:48AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
AND I APPRECIATE THAT, BUT TO COUNCILMEMBER
CARLSON'S POINT EARLIER AND TO COUNCILMEMBER GUDES' POINT,
WE CAN'T -- YOU ARE SAYING THE MARKET DOESN'T BEAR CERTAIN
THINGS, BUT RIGHT NOW WE ARE NOT SEEING PEOPLE BUILD
AFFORDABLE HOUSING OUT OF CHOICE.
IT IS VERY RARE.
SO IT IS OUR JOB TO INCENTIVIZE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND
INNOCENT RISE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
WHILE THIS A PROCESS ISSUE AND MY COLLEAGUES CONCERN.
IF THEY WEREN'T THERE TO BEGIN WITH, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE
ANYTHING AND ANY PLACE TO GO.
THAT IS MY CONCERN AND I DON'T WANT TO PUT WORDS IN
COUNCILMAN CARLSON'S MOUTH BUT HE IS NODDING.
THAT IS MY CONCERN THAT WE ARE NOT GOING TO BE PREPARED FOR
WHAT THIS CITY IS PREPARING AND AT AFFORDABLE HOUSING ISSUE.
WE AREN'T HAVING ENOUGH PEOPLE COMING IN SAYING WE NEED TO
BUILD MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.
WE NEED TO INCENTIVIZE REQUIREMENTS.
BUT THE GROUND FLOOR IS A NO BRAINER.
WE CAN DO THAT.
11:15:13AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
IF I MAY, I WILL TELL YOU BY EXPERIENCE.
WHEN THERE ARE REQUIREMENTS FOR COMMERCIAL GROUND FLOOR IN A
BUILDING WHERE THE -- THERE ARE NOT -- THEIR POPULATION IS
NOT THERE TO SUSTAIN THE COMMERCIAL IT SITS VACANT AND A
COST TO -- AN UNBEARABLE COST TO DEVELOPERS SOMETIMES.
SO WHEN YOU ARE NEGOTIATING THESE DEALS, I JUST.
YOU CAN PUT IT IN THERE AND I DON'T KNOW YOU CAN GET THE
RETURN YOU WANT OUT OF IT.
I THINK WE ARE HAVING TWO DIFFERENT CONVERSATIONS IN THIS
PROCESS IMPROVEMENT RECOMMENDATION.
I THINK THE SAFEGUARDING OF COMMERCIAL -- COMMERCIALLY-ZONED
PROPERTY AND INDUSTRIALLY ZONED PROPERTY IS A CONVERSATION
FOR FUTURE LAND USE AND THE CODE AND NOT THIS PROCESS AND I
100% AGREE WITH THAT.
ONCE YOU GIVE IT AWAY.
IT'S GONE, RIGHT.
THAT IS NOT THIS PROCESS.
AND MAKING IT REQUIREMENT THAT THERE IS COMMERCIAL ON THE
GROUND FLOOR.
I WILL TELL YOU DEVELOPER IT IS ENOUGH POPULATION TO MAKE IT
ECONOMICALLY WORK, THEY GET A BIGGER CONCERN IF THEY HAVE
SOME COMPONENT IN THERE.
THEY WILL INCLUDE IT IF THEY NEED TO.
TO MANDATE AND NOT HAVE IT IN AN AREA THAT THAT POPULATION
THRESHOLD HAS NOT MADE, I DON'T KNOW IF WE WILL BE DOING
OURSELVES A SERVICE.
BUT TALKING OF TWO DIFFERENT ISSUES FOR THIS ONE.
I HEAR YOU LOUD AND CLEAR TO PROTECT THE COMMERCIAL AND
INDUSTRIAL ZONE AND HOW TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE SPACE
SATISFIED FOR THE BUSINESSES WE ARE RECRUITING AND FOR THE
OTHER SIDE THE ECONOMIC CONVERSATION FOR INDUSTRIES THAT --
AND CLUSTERS WE WANT TO HAPPEN, THEY NEED TO OCCUR
SOMEWHERE.
IF WE WANT TO CONTINUE TO HAVE ZONING CHANGES WHICH IS NOT
THIS CONVERSATION.
IF WE CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE ZONING CHANGES MUCH FROM
INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL TO JUST RESIDENTIAL USE, YOU ARE
NOT SAFEGUARDING FROM THAT IN THE FUTURE.
AND I HEAR YOU 100%.
WE CAN FIGURE THAT OUT AND IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A
MOTION TO COME BACK AFTER RESEARCH, WE CAN DEFINITELY DO
THAT.
BUT ADDRESSING EXACTLY WHAT YOUR CONCERNS ARE AND COUNCILMAN
CARLSON'S CONCERN IS NOT IN THE SPECIFIED USE ISSUE.
11:17:30AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THANK YOU.
I WILL SAY ONE MORE THING AND COUNCILMAN CARLSON THEN WANTS
TO SAY SOMETHING.
THE BIGGEST FEAR THAT WE DO -- OUR RESIDENTIAL SPACE BECOMES
-- COMMERCIAL SPACE BECOMES RESIDENTIAL AND WHERE DOES THE
COMMERCIAL PLACE GO, THE COUNTY.
I DON'T WANT THEM TO HAVE ANY MORE -- I WANT US TO HAVE
THIS.
I WANT THE BUSINESSES TO STAY HERE AND WALK AND TAKE TRANSIT
AND NOT DRIVE OUT OF THE CITY FOR WORK.
THAT IS HUGE.
THAT IS HUGE FOR TAXES.
THAT IS HUGE FOR QUALITY OF LIFE.
SO I THINK THAT IS WHAT IS SCARING US ABOUT THIS.
11:18:06AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
I GET THAT.
MY RESPONSE WHEN YOU HAVE PLANNED DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION
THAT ARE ASKING FOR SOME OF THOSE CHANGES, AS A COUNCIL AND
A BOARD, YOU NEED TO THINK ABOUT, ARE YOU SAFEGUARDING --
YOU NEED TO THINK OF THOSE ISSUES AND BIG PICTURE ITEMS THAT
YOU IT WANT.
WE ARE PD CAPITAL.
WE HAVE A BUNCH OF PDs.
WE TALKED ABOUT TRANSITIONING AND GETTING OURSELVES OUT OF
THAT.
SAFEGUARDING.
I HEAR YOU LOUD AT CLEAR.
IF YOU MAKE A MOTION -- EVEN IF YOU DON'T MAKE A MOTION, WE
WILL FOLLOW UP ON THAT.
BUT NOT IN THIS SPECIALIZED USE PIECE.
I APPRECIATE THE COMMENTS VERY MUCH.
THANK YOU.
11:18:53AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
11:18:55AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I WILL APPRECIATE HAVING THAT AS A SEPARATE
DISCUSSION IF CHAIR CITRO OR COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WANT TO
MAKE THE MOTION.
WE HAVE AN ECONOMIC CRISIS IN OUR COMMUNITY THAT HAVE PEOPLE
NOT REPRESENTING OR BUYING HOMES.
WE NEED TO SOLVE THAT.
I HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IN ST. PETE AND
PINELLAS OVER THE YEARS BECAUSE TAMPA YOU HAVE TO BE AN
INSIDER OF A INSIDER TO BE INVOLVED IN IT.
IF YOU HOOK AT THE NUMBERS, ST. PETE EDC RUNS CIRCLES AND
ST. PETE ECONOMICALLY RUNS CIRCLES AROUND TAMPA.
THEY DO A REALLY GOOD JOB OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND REALLY
GOOD JOB OF PLANNING.
THE ONE MISTAKE THEY MADE, THEY DIDN'T PROVIDE ENOUGH SPACE
FOR COMMERCIAL.
THE BIGGEST REASON WHY ST. PETE AND PINELLAS LOSE DEALS,
THEY DON'T HAVE MORE OFFICE SPACE.
IF THEY PLANNED BETTER AND HAVE MORE OFFICE SPACE, THEY WILL
GET ALL THE DEALS IN THE REGION.
WE NEED TO PROTECT THIS PLAN.
A GO-NO GO.
PEOPLE WANT TO INCLUDE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL, AND I WILL
MENTION PAR RETIME BECAUSE WE NEED TO PROTECT THAT TOO.
YOU EITHER KEEP COMMERCIAL LEVEL ON YOUR PROPERTY.
WE NEED HOUSING, YES.
BUT WE NEED JOBS AND HIGHER PAYING JOBS AND WE NEED TO
PROTECT THAT.
WHY IS IT THAT WE CAN'T IT SHALL AND BEFORE SOMEBODY RUNS
THE -- AND SAY CITY COUNCIL IS AGAINST DEVELOPERS.
WE ARE NOT AT ALL.
WE APPROVE ALMOST ALL THE PROBLEMS THAT ARE OUT THERE.
WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO IS LOOK 20 AND 30 YEARS IN ADVANCE.
I MIGHT NOT BE AROUND HERE WHEN THE PORT -- AFTER THE PORT
GETS COMPLETELY PLOWED OVER WITH CONDOS.
WE WILL LOSE OUR BIGGEST ECONOMIC GENERATOR IN IF THE
REGION.
AND 30 YEARS PEOPLE WILL BE UPSET.
SOMEBODY IN THE FUTURE WILL BE REALLY UPSET.
WHY IS IT -- WE ARE IN A CYCLE RIGHT NOW.
WHY SO MANY APARTMENTS BEING BUILT AND NOT OFFICE BUILDINGS?
BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE CAPITAL IS GOING.
WE TALK TO DEVELOPERS ALL THE TIME.
WHERE THE CAPITAL MARKETS ARE.
DID CONDOS BEFORE 2008 AND NOW DOING APARTMENTS AND NOT
FUNDING OFFICE BUILDINGS.
BECAUSE THE CAPITAL MARKETS ARE NOT TEMPORARILY FUNDING
OFFICE BUILDINGS AND DOES NOT MEAN IN THE FUTURE WHEN TEN
YEARS WHEN CAPITAL MARKET SWITCHES AND LOOKING FOR OFFICE
BUILDINGS.
WE WILL BE LOOKING FOR SPACE.
10, 20 YEARS, TAMPA WILL BE HERE AND NOT A LAKE OR PART OF
THE BAY, AND WILL HAVE A VIBRANT CITY THAT WILL BE GLAD WE
MADE TOUGH DECISIONS NOW.
THANK YOU.
11:21:39AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE WILL STILL HAVE TO HEAR FROM PUBLIC
COMMENTS TO SOME PEOPLE THAT ARE ONLINE TO THIS, BUT I JUST
WANT TO SAY BOTH OF THESE COUNCILPEOPLE HAVE A POINT.
WE DON'T HAVE RETAIL COMMERCIAL ON OUR BOTTOM FLOORS, THEN
PEOPLE WILL HAVE TO GO IN THEIR CARS TO GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.
IF WE WANT TO BE A LIVABLE, WALKABLE CITY, PEOPLE SHOULD BE
ABLE TO GET OUT OF THEIR CONDOMINIUMS AND CONDOS AND WALK
AND BUY GROCERIES OR WALK AND GET THEIR HAIR DONE.
MISS POYNOR, ARE YOU ON THE LINE TO TALK TO AGENDA ITEM
NUMBER 5.
11:22:26AM >> YES, SIR.
CAN YOU HEAR ME?
11:22:28AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
11:22:29AM >> FIRST OF ALL, WHAT COUNCILMAN CARLSON WAS JUST TALKING
ABOUT HAS ALREADY HAPPENED IN THE CITY.
IT IS CALLED SOUTH OF GANDY, WEST OF DALE MABRY, WE ARE A
FOOD DESERT.
WHERE WILL WE PUT A GROCERY STORE?
BEATS ME.
BECAUSE MOST OF OUR COMMERCIAL LAND HAS BEEN CHANGED TO
RESIDENTIAL IN THE PAST THREE TO FOUR YEARS WE HAVE TAKEN
THE BRUNT OF THIS.
I CANNOT -- I FAILED TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE CAN MAKE BLANKET
COMMITMENTS TO DENSITY AND IGNORE WE HAVE A CHAA.
WE ARE CURRENTLY IN THE MIDDLE OF A $500 STUDY OF THE CHA.
HOW CAN WE MAKE CHANGES THAT WILL DRAMATICALLY IMPACT THE
DENSITY WITHOUT THE EVIDENCE FROM THAT.
I AM SORRY BUT S.O.G. HAS BEEN PILLAGED FOR ALL THE
COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL LAND.
YES, I UNDERSTAND THIS IS A SU-1, BUT I WILL POINT OUT WE
HAD A SU-1 IN THE LAST YEAR OR SO THAT WE ASKED FOR CHANGES
FROM THE DEVELOPER BECAUSE WE KNEW IT WAS COMING.
THE DEVELOPER DIDN'T JUST GET TO COME IN AND DO WHAT THEY
WANTED.
AND THE NEIGHBORHOODS ACTUALLY ASKED FOR SOMETHING VERY
SMALL, THAT COST PROBABLY ABOUT $1,000 TO HAVE IT DONE.
AND THE DEVELOPER WAS VERY GRACIOUS ABOUT DOING IT.
SO IF IT IS DONE BEHIND CLOSED DOORS WITHOUT ANY
INTERACTIONS WITH THE COMMUNITY, IS THAT GOING TO BE
POSITIVE?
AND THE ANSWER IS NO.
SO THAT WASN'T -- IT WAS A SPECIAL USE 1.
AND THEY DID WHAT WE ASKED THEM TO DO.
WE ARE NOT TALKING -- I MEAN SERIOUSLY, IT WAS MOVING THE
DUMPSTER ON THE SITE FROM BEHIND SOMEBODY'S HOUSE.
SO, I AM PRETTY MUCH WITH NATHAN THAT WE HAVE A PROBLEM.
WE HAVE A LAND USE CODE FROM 1978.
AND WE HAVE A -- WORK ON A COMP PLAN THAT IS 44 YEARS OLDER
AND MARRY THEM UP TOGETHER.
WON'T THAT BE AN ODD SET.
I AM AGAINST THIS.
I AM NOT EVEN AGAINST IN FOR THE WHOLE CITY BUT ANYTHING NOR
THE CHAA.
WHY?
BECAUSE PEOPLE DON'T EVACUATE FROM COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES.
THEY EVACUATE FROM THEIR HOMES.
THANK YOU.
11:24:46AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS POYNOR.
ARE YOU ONLINE?
SORRY, MISS CARROLL ANN BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE?
MISS BENNETT?
11:24:58AM >> HEY, CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
I JUST WANT -- I KNOW IT MAY NOT BE EXACTLY ON TOPIC BY WHAT
THEY ARE PRESENTING BUT I WANT TO REITERATE SOME OF THE
POINTS THAT COUNCILMEMBERS MADE.
THE -- THE JOBS ARE JUST AS IMPORTANT AS HOUSING.
AND RATTLESNAKE POINT WAS THE PERFECT EXAMPLE OF COMMERCIAL
AND INDUSTRIAL THAT PROVIDED GOOD PAYING JOBS AND AN UNIQUE
PROPERTY THAT IS HARD TO FIND PEOPLE WHO -- BIG COMPANIES
THAT ARE COME ALSO LOOK THROUGH THE ENTIRE STATE OF FLORIDA
-- NOT JUST OUR PART OF FLORIDA, BUT ENTIRE STATE WITH A
PORT AND RAILROAD.
IT WAS UNIQUE.
IT WAS VALUABLE.
AND IT COULD CONTINUE TO PAY GOOD PAYING JOBS AND IT IS GONE
AND NOT GOING TO GET IT BACK AND NOT CREATE MORE LAND WITH A
RAILROAD AND PORT.
I AM A LITTLE UNCLEAR ON THIS.
AND, YEAH, MAYBE THEY CAN CLEAR IT UP FOR US, BUT THE
SPECIAL USE 1.
I HEARD HER SAY IT REQUIRES NOTICE.
I AM WANTING TO KNOW, IS THAT NOTICE LIKE A HAZARDOUS TREE
NOTICE WHERE IT IS LETTING ME KNOW THAT SOMETHING IS
HAPPENING AND YOU CAN WRITE AN E-MAIL ABOUT IT, BUT THERE IS
NO VOTE.
THE INPUT FROM THE PUBLIC IS NOT REALLY TAKEN INTO COUNTY.
IT IS BASED -- THE DECISIONS ARE BASED ON WHAT THE CODE
ALLOWS THAT MAKES A DIFFERENCE.
AND SOMETHING THAT IS DONE ADMINISTRATIVELY LIKE THE FINAL
OF THE FTNs AND THE HAZARDOUS TREE.
THAT MAKES A DIFFERENCE.
I AM A LITTLE UNCLEAR ON THAT.
THANK YOU.
11:26:38AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON PUBLIC
COMMENT FOR AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5.
WHAT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL?
11:26:58AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
COULD YOU ACTUALLY ANSWER MISS BENNETT'S
QUESTION?
BECAUSE THAT WAS A QUESTION I HAD TO AND I FORGOT IT IN
OTHER THINGS I WAS TALKING ABOUT.
SO THE NOTICE IS A CONCERN -- AND A CONCERN FOR RESIDENTS.
11:27:12AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
SPECIAL USE 1 WILL COME IN WITH THE SPECIAL
USE 1.
WILL HAVE TO MEET THE TWO CRITERIA.
ON AN ARTERIAL AND COLLECTOR STREET AND MEET THE RM-24
STANDARDS.
IF YOU MEET THOSE TWO, IT IS APPROVABLE.
WITHOUT -- YOU MET THE CRITERIA THAT THEN SHIFTS IT FROM
BEING CONDITIONAL TO BEING APPROVED.
BASICALLY THE CODE IS SAYING IF YOU MEET THESE TWO CRITERIA
FOR THIS USE THROUGH THIS ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS, THAT USE
IS PERMITTED REQUIRES PUBLIC NOTICE BUT THE PUBLIC NOTICE TO
THE TWO CRITERIA THAT MAKES THE USE APPROPRIATE.
AND THE PUBLIC NOTICE IS A NOTICE PROCESSED.
COMMENTS ARE BROUGHT IN, BUT IT IS NOT -- IT'S NOT
APPLICABLE AS IF IT WERE COMING TO YOU IT AS A PD AND THOSE
CRITERIA BEING MET OR THEY ARE NOT BEING MET AND THE PUBLIC
INPUT AND YOU TAKE THAT INPUT IN ANOTHER WAY.
A PUBLICLY NOTICED PROCESS, BUT IF THE TWO CRITERIA ARE
SATISFIED, THEN THAT PROJECT MAY BE APPROVED.
AND THAT -- SO -- SO IT'S HAPPENING NOW.
YOU ARE NOT SEEING THOSE S-1s.
WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS, THAT THAT COULD HAPPEN WITHOUT IT
HAVING TO PAY FOR A SEPARATE APPLICATION AND THE OTHER LAYER
OF THE ONION TO THE SYSTEM, IF WE SET THOSE CRITERIA IN A
WAY THAT WE STILL HAVE TO MEET THEM.
THEY WILL HAVE TO BE MET AT THE TIME OF PERMITTING IN LIEU
OF IT BEING MET WITH THE SPECIAL USE ONE.
11:28:56AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WANT TO MENTION THAT I WILL MAKE A MOTION
LATER ABOUT COMING BACK AND DOING THAT SAVING OF COMMERCIAL
SPACE.
I WANT TO TALK TO YOU TO GET SOME LANGUAGE.
GET SOME DATES.
LIKE I AM GOING TO DO WITH STEVEN ABOUT ALLEYS.
11:29:11AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THE OTHER THING I DON'T HAVE TODAY -- I CAN
BRING YOU BACK OVER THE PAST FIVE YEARS HOW MANY S-1s HAVE
BEEN PROCESSED FOR RESIDENTIAL.
YOU KNOW, TO SHOW YOU THIS HAS BEEN EIGHT PROJECTS OR 108
PROJECTS.
I THINK WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY DON'T MEET THE ARTERIAL
COLLECTOR ON APPEAL, THEY ARE GETTING APPROVED.
WE ARE CREATING A TEN-MONTH PROCESS SET IT AS SPECIFIED USE,
IT COULD BE HAPPENING.
11:29:42AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WHAT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL.
11:29:48AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
MOVE TO RECEIVE AND FILE.
[LAUGHTER]
11:30:04AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I MEAN, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS IN JUNE.
WE TALKED ABOUT THIS IN SEPTEMBER.
ABOUT.
WE TALKED ABOUT THIS SEVERAL TIMES.
YOUR PLEASURE.
WE HAVE BEEN BRING IT AND WE HAVE BEEN PASSING THAT LITMUS
TEST.
HERE WE ARE.
AND IT IS AT YOUR PLEASURE.
IF NO APPLICATION IS TAKEN TODAY, IT WILL STAY IN THE
SPECIAL USE AREA AND WILL BE ALLOWED THE WAY IT IS TODAY.
HAPPENING IN SPECIAL USE AND WE WILL CONTINUE TO OPERATE
THAT WAY AND THAT IS NOT A PROBLEM EITHER.
11:30:33AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
11:30:36AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I APPRECIATE YOU DOING THE HARD WORK AND
BRINGING IT BACK.
AS MUCH AS WE ARE ARGUING, ARGUING THE.AND NOT ARGUING WITH
YOU ALL.
SERIOUSLY ON THIS TOPIC, YOU KNOW, WE CAN RECEIVE AND FILE.
I KNOW THERE ARE OTHER MOTIONS THAT WILL BE MADE LATER
RELATED TO THIS.
ALL OF THIS IS GOOD INFORMATION AND GOOD TO HAVE A COMMUNITY
DISCUSSION.
11:30:56AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
11:31:01AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING AND NOT LEAVE IT
LIKE A DANGLING PART CIPEL.
WHICH WAY ARE WE GOING DO WE TAKE THE DIRECTION OR LEAVE IT
THE WAY IT IS.
11:31:12AM >>BILL CARLSON:
WE JUST RECEIVED AND FILE.
11:31:17AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
IT WILL BE INACTION AND WE WON'T DO WITH
IT.
JUST UNDERSTAND WHERE WE ARE TODAY IS FROM YOUR DIRECTION
THAT YOU HAVE ASKED US TO COME BACK WITH A COUPLE OF TIMES.
HOWEVER YOU WILL WANT TO PROCEED, YOUR PROCESS TO TELL US
ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
WE HAVE JUST BEEN BEFORE YOU -- WE ARE HERE TODAY WITH THE
COMMENTS WE HAVE RECEIVED IN THE TWO MEETINGS THAT WE HAD
BEFORE.
SO TOTALLY -- TOTALLY UP TO YOU.
11:31:44AM >>BILL CARLSON:
I THINK CHAIR CITRO AND COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK
HAVE MOTIONS FOR LATER, BUT UNLESS THEY WANT TO DO IT NOW,
WE WILL RECEIVE AND FILE THE REPORT.
11:31:58AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
I WISH TO -- I MOVE TO TAKE THE DIRECTION OF STAFF IN THE
NEW SPECIAL USE CRITERIA WITH THE MULTIFAMILY WITHIN
COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS ESTABLISHING A SPECIFIED USE WITH THE
CRITERIA THAT IS LISTED BELOW ON THIS DONE MENTATION.
11:32:25AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
A MOTION FROM CHAIRMAN CITRO.
DO WE GET A SECOND?
11:32:29AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I WILL SECOND IT, BUT HE BETTER SAY WHAT
NUMBER IT IS.
11:32:33AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SORRY, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5, WHICH IS FILE
NUMBERE 2022-8-CHAPTER 27.
AND DEALING WITH 27-282.
11:32:46AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
MOTION FROM CHAIRMAN CITRO.
SECOND FROM COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
ALL IN FAVOR.
ANY OPPOSED?
11:32:56AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
ROLL CALL.
11:32:57AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
LET'S DO A ROLL CALL.
I HEARD THE NAYS.
MOTION FROM CITRO.
SECOND FROM MIRANDA.
11:33:06AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
NO.
11:33:07AM >>BILL CARLSON:
NO.
11:33:08AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
11:33:11AM >>LUIS VIERA:
NO.
11:33:12AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
NO.
11:33:15AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
11:33:17AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
MOTION FAILED WITH COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK, CARLSON, VIERA,
MANISCALCO VOTING NO.
11:33:33AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WILL MAKE A MOTION TO RECEIVE AND FILE AND,
AGAIN, FOR US, I DON'T THINK IT'S YES, DO WE WANT THINGS TO
GO FASTER, IN THEORY -- I KNOW, I KNOW, BUT THIS IS -- THIS
IS A TOPIC THAT I THINK WE SHOULD REVISIT WHEN WE TALK MORE
ABOUT COMMERCIAL SPACE.
I THINK IF WE HAD -- I WOULD LIKE TO RECEIVE AND FILE AND
BRING THIS BACK AS PART OF THAT MOTION THAT WE WILL CREATE
-- AND I WILL PROBABLY BRING BACK TONIGHT, JUST SO WE CAN
HAVE A DEEPER DISCUSSION ON PROTECTING THAT.
AND I GUESS WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS THOSE -- THAT RIGHT NOW
CAN HAPPEN BUT, I DON'T KNOW.
11:34:23AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MAKE IT SOONER THAN LATER WHEN IT COMES
BACK.
11:34:28AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I AM GOING TO TRY.
SEE WHAT IS AVAILABLE WORKSHOP-WISE.
11:34:32AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SOONER RATHER THAN LATER.
MOTION TO RECEIVE AND FILE.
ALL IN FAVOR.
ANY OPPOSED.
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
11:34:43AM >>BILL CARLSON:
DO WE HAVE SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ HERE FROM THE
ATTORNEY'S OFFICE.
I THINK PROBABLY FOR THE RECORD WE OUGHT TO SAY IN ALL OF
THESE CASES, WE ARE -- WE ARE DESCRIBING -- IN ALL OF THESE
DISCUSSIONS, WE ARE DESCRIBING CERTAIN.
SPECIFIC PROJECTS THAT MAY HAVE HAPPENED IN THE PAST AND FOR
THE RECORD WE OUGHT TO SOMEHOW STATE THAT THESE DISCUSSIONS
AND THESE VOTES HAVE HAVING TO DO WITH ANY PARTICULAR REAL
ESTATE CASES AND THE CASE THAT HAVE BEEN MENTIONED ARE FOR
ILLUSTRATIVE REASONS ONLY.
11:35:16AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
TO CLARIFY MY MOTION.
IT WAS FOR THIS SPECIFIED USE; HOWEVER, I WANT TO HAVE AN
IN-DEPTH GROUND FLOOR COMMERCIAL.
AND, AGAIN, PUT THE ONUS ON THE DEVELOPERS IF THEY SAYS IT
NOT GOING TO BE FINANCIALLY FEASIBLE FOR THEM TO DO IT.
THAT IS FINE.
BRING IT TO US AND LET'S US DECIDE ON THAT.
WE SHOULD HAVE A BLANKET COMMERCIAL USE WITHIN LARGER
STRUCTURES.
WITHIN MULTIFAMILY STRUCTURES.
ALL RIGHT, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 6, FILE NUMBERE-2022-8,
CHAPTER 27.
MISS FEELEY.
11:35:59AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THANK YOU, ABBYE FEELEY.
ITEM NUMBER 6 IS TO ALLOW NONRESIDENTIAL ACCESS TO LOCAL
STREET.
THIS IS ONE OF OUR TOP TEN WAIVERS THAT COME BEFORE YOU
IN PDs.
A PD HAS NEVER BEEN DENIED ACCESS TO THE LOCAL.
WE TALKED ABOUT THIS.
AND WHERE IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE.
THE WEST SHORE OVERLAY ALLOWS ACCESS TO THE LOCAL FOR
RESIDENTIAL.
AND THE KENNEDY OVERLAY ALLOWED IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS WHEN YOU
ARE IN A CERTAIN DISTANCE FROM THE ARTERIAL OR THE
COLLECTOR.
SO WE HAD BROUGHT THIS IN JUNE.
WE TALKED THROUGH THIS.
AND WHAT WE ARE SUGGESTING IS THAT IT WILL BE PERMITTED IF
NO FURTHER THAN 150 FEET FROM THE INTERSECTION.
I DO HAVE TO JUST SHOW YOU.
THIS IS THE CHICK-FIL-A AND AT THAT HEREBY SHAN INN.
IT WAS A PD.
THE FIRST WAIVER WAS ACCESS TO THE LOCAL STREET.
THE TAHITIAN INN HAS ACCESS TO THE LOCAL STREET.
THE CODE CHANGES, THIS WOULD BE ALLOWED.
RIGHT NOW YOU CAN ACCESS THE LOCAL WHEN, LIKE, WHEN FDOT
DENIES YOU, YOU HAVE NO OTHER ACCESS BUT TO ACCESS.
BUT THIS HAS COME TO YOU ON MOST OF YOUR PDs.
YOU MAY WANT TO LOOK TONIGHT -- TONIGHT IS ALCOHOLIC
BEVERAGE AND ON THE NEXT -- THIS IS ONE OF THE TOP TEN
WAIVERS GRANTED THROUGH COUNCIL THROUGH THE PD PROCESS THAT
WILL ALLOW FOR COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT TO MOVE FORWARD WITH
THAT UNLESS THEY ARE WITHIN 150 FEET OF THE ARTERIAL AND
COLLECTOR.
11:37:49AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
11:37:56AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
MISS FEELEY EXPLAINED IT ALL.
AND HISTORICALLY SPEAKING, I DON'T THINK AN APPLICATION HAS
BEEN DENIED OR THE REQUEST FOR THIS HAS BEEN DENIED.
AT LEAST THAT YOU CAN REMEMBER OR EVER.
SO IT IS A NO BRAINER.
IF NOT, WE WOULD -- WE HEAR -- WE ARE GOING TO HEAR FROM THE
PUBLIC NOW, BUT WILL BE A TOTALLY DIFFERENT DISCUSSION.
I THINK THIS IS AN EASY ONE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH.
11:38:20AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I WILL SECOND IT AND WE WILL FIND OUT HOW
EASY IT IS.
11:38:28AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS FEELEY, I ALWAYS RESPECT WHAT YOU ARE
SAYING AND I STILL RESPECT IT, BUT WHEN YOU SAY SOMETHING
PASSES, IT DOES NOT MEAN IT IS UNANIMOUS.
SOME OF US WOULD HAVE SAID NO ON SOME OF THESE THINGS.
SOME OF US WOULD HAVE SAID NO ON OTHER THINGS.
BUT YOU ARE CORRECT, IT DID PASS.
IS THERE ANYONE IN CHAMBERS THAT WISHES TO SPEAK TO AGENDA
ITEM NUMBER 6?
11:38:57AM >> I AM TRYING TO MAKE MY DAY WORTHWHILE.
SUSAN SWIFT, 3621 SOUTH HIS PER DECEMBER STREET, TAMPA.
I WILL ADMIT THAT I AM NOT SURE I AM READING THIS DIRECTLY,
BUT I THINK I AM.
AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE WAY THE DRAFT LANGUAGE -- THE
CURRENT CODE SAYS YOU HAVE TO BE ON THE ARTERIAL OR
COLLECTOR.
THIS IS ALLOWING ACCESS 150 FEET FURTHER ON A TO -- OR OFF
OF THE ARTERIAL COLLECTOR.
AND I DO AGREE THAT DOT A LOT OF TIMES CAUSE THIS PROBLEM,
BUT TO THE CHAIR'S POINT, JUST BECAUSE IT HAS BEEN APPROVED,
THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE NEIGHBORHOOD, THAT IT IS
POTENTIALLY IMPACTING SHOULDN'T BE MADE AWARE OF THAT BEFORE
IT IS APPROVED AND I ALSO WONDER HOW MAIN PDs WERE JUST FOR
THIS, FOR THIS ITEM OR DID THE PD ASK FOR A LOT OF TO OTHER
WAIVERS OR CHANGES.
IT GOES BACK TO THE COMPATIBILITY EVERYBODY EWE AND THE LAST
-- THANK YOU FOR MAKING YOUR DECISION ON THE LAST ITEM.
BECAUSE THIS GIVES PEOPLE WHO HAVE POTENTIAL IMPACT TO
COMMENT.
AND THEY MAY ALL GET APPROVED.
THAT IS GREAT, BUT BY APPROVING THIS PROCEDURAL CHANGE, THAT
ELIMINATES IT.
AND MAYBE THAT MEANS THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH A
WHOLE PD.
A DIFFERENT PROCEDURE THEY SHOULD GO THROUGH.
I ADMIT, THIS CITY DOES TOO MANY PDs AND THEY TAKE TOO LONG.
MAYBE YOU CREATE A SEPARATE REVIEW PROCESS.
MY LAST COMMENT IS, THE WAY I READ THIS, THIS IS NOT A
CONDITION.
THIS MAKES IT SOUND LIKE IT IS A CONDITION, BUT THIS IS NOT
A CONDITION.
THIS IS ACTUALLY ALLOWING AN ALLOWANCE OF -- AND CHANGING
THE RULE.
IT CHANGES NUMBER ONE.
IT IS NOT LIKE A CONDITION.
SO THAT IS HOW THIS ISSUE ON THE RM-24, I THINK, HAS COME UP
A COUPLE OF TIMES.
BECAUSE THIS -- THE MAP -- THE MAP IS BLACK AND WHITE.
SAYS FUNCTIONAL CLASS, ARTERIAL COLLECTOR.
YOU ARE EITHER ON THAT MAP OR NOT.
I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN GET -- HOW A DEVELOPER CAN GET PAST
THE APPLICATION POINT AND GO TO YOU ALL WITH AN APPEAL OF
THAT BECAUSE THEIR STREET IS NOT ON THE MAP.
SO AGAIN, IT KEEPS WATERING DOWN THE INPUT FROM THE
NEIGHBORHOOD.
THANK YOU.
11:42:00AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
MR. HAGAN.
NATHAN HAGAN.
THIS ISN'T ABOUT HOUSING SO MUCH AS TRANSPORTATION.
I WAS TALKING TO JUSTICE BIN THIS THE OTHER DAY AND I DON'T
WANT TO SPEAK FOR HIM, BUT A BIG PROBLEM OF HAVING DRIVEWAYS
ON ROADS LIKE KENNEDY AND FLORIDA.
MANY PEOPLE IN THE CITY THAT WOULD LIKE TO SEE ONE DAY A
GOOD BUS SYSTEM AND MAYBE EVEN BETTER ON THOSE ROADS.
AND THE MORE CURB CUTS WE HAVE, THE MORE DIFFICULT TO HAVE A
PEDESTRIAN TRANSIT-ORIENTED RIGHT-OF-WAY.
I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE CITY TO GO AS FAR AS THEY CAN TO
PRESERVE CURBS IN THE AREA WHEN WE HAVE IN 50 YEARS AND OUR
GREAT GRANDCHILDREN'S LIFE, TO ADD TRANSPORTATION TO THOSE
ROUTES, I THINK THE COMPROMISE ON FOWLER PUTTING IT IN THE
MIDDLE OF THE STREET INSTEAD OF THE SIDE BECAUSE TOO MANY
CURB CUTS.
NOT A HOUSING ISSUE OR LAND USE ISSUE BUT A LONG-TERM
TRANSPORTATION PLANNING ISSUE.
I WANTED TO RAISE THIS ISSUE.
I AM NOT QUALIFIED TO SPEAK ON IT.
BUT THAT IS MY UNDERSTANDING.
11:43:09AM >> HELLO, JUSTIN MULLETS, TAMPA HEIGHTS.
I WANT TO SAY THAT I SUPPORT THIS.
I AM CURRENTLY A TRANSPORTATION CONSULTANT.
I SPENT A COUPLE OF YEARS AT HART.
SO I'M HERE TO SPEAK ON SOME OTHER ISSUES MORE SPECIFICALLY,
BUT BUT WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME AND LOCAL MONEY AND D.O.T.
MONEY TO ADDRESS THE ISSUES WITH THE ARTERIAL AND LOGICAL
IMPROVING THE LONG GAME AND IMPROVING SAFETY AND I'M HERE TO
SUPPORT THAT AND TALK ON OTHER ITEMS LATER.
THANK YOU.
11:43:44AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
11:43:47AM >> MR. CHAIR, THANK YOU, JOE ROBINSON.
I SUPPORT THIS AS WELL FROM A TRANSPORTATION STANDPOINT.
AND I HAVE PROPERTY, COMMERCIAL, RESIDENTIAL, YOU NAME IT,
AND IT MAKES SENSE WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO DO.
LIKE I JUST TOLD YOU EVEN ON MY RESIDENTIAL, I LOST 50, 75
FEET OF HISTORICAL GRANITE CURBING AND INTO LONGER THERE.
I HAVE A CURB CUT ON A RESIDENTIAL NOT EVEN COMMERCIAL
STREET, OKAY, RIGHT NOW FRONTING ME THAT I GOT TO LOOK AT,
OKAY.
SO I AM ALL FOR KEEPING CURBS.
11:44:22AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS POYNOR, ARE YOU STILL ONLINE WITH US.
11:44:32AM >> YES, SIR.
11:44:33AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
DO YOU WANT TO COMMENT ON ITEM NUMBER 6.
11:44:37AM >> ABSOLUTELY.
I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT I RECALL THAT THAT CHICK-FIL-A HAD
A LOT OF PUSH BACK FROM THE COMMUNITY.
NOT THAT I DON'T EAT THERETO AND DON'T ENJOY IT, BUT THERE
WAS QUITE A BIT.
THE OTHER THING IS, WE HAVE ENOUGH PROBLEMS -- I KNOW YOU
GUYS HERE KNOW IT BETTER THAN ANYBODY, THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH
ISSUES ON RESIDENTIAL STREETS WITH PEOPLE BUSTING THROUGH
NEIGHBORHOODS DOING TWICE THE SPEED LIMIT.
EVERYBODY IS CRYING THE BLUES, WE KEEP THROWING UP STOP
SIGNS.
THEY ARE BEGGING FOR SPEED BUMPS AND SPEED HUMPS.
HOW IS THIS GOING TO PREVENT THAT?
WAIT, IT IS NOT.
GOING TO DO THE POLAR OPPOSITE.
GOING TO INCREASE THE TRAFFIC ON OUR NEIGHBORHOOD STREETS.
I ALSO WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT -- I FORGOT MY POINT.
BOTTOM LINE IS, I THINK IT IS A BAD IDEA, UNTIL WE GET OUR
PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION DUCKS IN A ROW.
BECAUSE WE HAVE TO CUT DOWN THESE PEOPLE CUTTING THROUGH
SIDE STREETS.
THAT IS ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH THE CHICK-FIL-A AND I WILL
BE THE FIRST PEOPLE TO TELL YOU WE CUT THROUGH BEHIND THE
CHICK-FIL-A AND COME IN FROM THE BACK WAY EVERY SINGLE TIME.
SO -- AND, AGAIN, I WILL POINT OUT TO YOU, WE DON'T NEED TO
DO THIS SOUTH OF GANDY.
THANK YOU.
HAVE A GOOD DAY.
11:46:01AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MISS BENNETT, ARE YOU ON LINE?
11:46:10AM >> HI, THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
I AM GOING TO PASS ON THIS ONE.
I DON'T FEEL LIKE I HAVE ENOUGH EXPERTISE TO COMMENT.
THANK YOU.
11:46:19AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU, COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
11:46:21AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I AM GOING TO SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE, A, FDOT
HATES CURB CUTS AND EVERY TIME YOU TRY TO GET SOMETHING
THROUGH, IT IS INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT AND THAT CAN KILL A
PROJECT.
AND MY CONCERN TO GO BACK TO OUR EARLIER CONVERSATION IS
COMMERCIAL AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT YEAH.
WE CAN ADD MORE STOP SIGNS.
THAT HAS BEEN MOSTLY SUCCESSFUL.
HONESTLY EVENTUALLY THE CITY WILL BE A STOP SIGN AT EVERY
CORNER AND I AM TOTALLY FINE WITH THAT.
BUT I MEAN JUST AS MISS POYNOR SAID ALREADY USING THE BACK
STREETS.
USING THE BACK STREETS BECAUSE DALE MABRY IS BACKED UP.
WHY IS DALE MABRY BACKED UP, BECAUSE EVERYBODY IS TRYING TO
TURN RIGHT ON A CURB CUT.
ANYWAY, I WILL MOVE THIS.
I DON'T --
11:47:27AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SECOND.
11:47:28AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
WHAT IS THE WORDING.
HOW ARE WE DOING THIS.
SAY LET'S MOVE IT.
LET'S MOVE IT.
I.
11:47:35AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
A MOTION BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ANY DISCUSSION?
11:47:41AM >>BILL CARLSON:
WE ARE JUST MOVING TO BRING IT BACK, RIGHT?
11:47:46AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
SORRY, DID MANISCALCO MOVE IT --
11:47:49AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
I SECONDED IT.
11:47:51AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
IF YOU MOVED IT, I WILL SECOND.
11:47:54AM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
NO, I SAID -- I JUST MADE A COMMENT.
11:47:57AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
STAY WITH COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK MAKING THE
MOTION AND COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO SECONDING IT.
11:48:04AM >>BILL CARLSON:
THE MOTION IS TO BRING IT BACK WITH A
PROPOSED ORDINANCE.
11:48:08AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
YES.
ABBYE FEELEY.
ABOUT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION MONDAY NIGHT AND COME BACK
TO YOU ON FIRST READING.
I WILL GET TO THE SCHEDULE OF ALL THIS AT THE END.
11:48:18AM >>BILL CARLSON:
WE HAD A COUPLE OF TO EX-
COUPLE OF PEOPLE SPEAK IN FAVOR.
SOME AGAINST IT.
AND THERE WILL BE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO SPEAK ON
IT.
11:48:28AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I FAILED TO MENTION WHEN WE FIRST DID THIS
MR. BHIDE WAS WITH THE SAFETY OF PEOPLE PULLING DIRECTLY ON
TO DALE MABRY AT A 45 OR 50 MILES PER HOUR.
IT IS ACTUALLY SAFER TO THEM TO GO OUT TO THE INTERSECTION
VERSUS HAVING THE INTERSECTION, THE CURB CUT, THE
INTERSECTION, THE CURB CUT.
THIS WAS IN SUPPORT OF VISION ZERO AS WELL.
AND WE HAD BROUGHT THAT AS PART OF THE ORIGINAL PRESENTATION
IN JUNE.
SO FORGIVE ME FOR FAILING TO REITERATE THAT WHEN WE CAME
BACK TODAY, BUT IT WILL COME BACK AS A FIRST READING, YES,
SIR.
11:49:02AM >>BILL CARLSON:
CAN I ASK ONE OTHER QUESTION?
WHERE DOES THE 150 NUMBER COME FROM.
A STANDARD BY WHAT OTHER CITIES USE.
AND DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW FAR THE AREAS THAT YOU CIRCLED
IN.
ONE WAS 50 AND ANOTHER 75.
11:49:16AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THAT IS BIGGER THAN THAT.
BECAUSE BY CODE, YOU HAVE BE 54 FEET BY THE INTERSECTION TO
EVEN START TO HAVE THE DRIVEWAY.
IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AND IN WEST SHORE THAT IT IS 150 FEET
RIGHT NOW AND WE USE THAT TO BE CONSISTENT WHAT WE HAVE IN
THE I DON'T OVERLAYS THAT CURRENTLY ALLOW IT.
BECAUSE IN WESTSHORE OVERLAY, KENNEDY AND SEMINOLE HEIGHTS.
ALLOWED IN THE DESIGN DISTRICTS AND WE USED THAT SAME
NUMBER.
11:49:47AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION?
THE IRONY IS WE HAVE TWO PARCELS ON OUR OVERHEAD.
AND ONE WAS BUILT IN THE 50s.
AND ONE WAS BUILT 2019.
11:50:04AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IT WAS BEFORE THAT.
THEY CHANGED FROM A SINGLE DRIVE THROUGH TO A DOUBLE DRIVE
THROUGH IN 2019.
HOW THEY HAD TO RE- PD IT.
11:50:15AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AGAIN, THERE IS THE IRONY.
60 YEARS APART.
70 YEARS APART.
ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.
ANYONE OPPOSED?
THANK YOU.
GO TO AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7, FILE NUMBER EARS-2022-H-CHAPTER
27.
11:50:38AM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
ABBYE FEELEY.
ITEM 7 AND 8 ARE RELATED -- YEAH, I AM, THANK YOU.
THESE ARE ALL RELATED TO THE ADUs.
I SEE THE TIME IS TEN MINUTES TO NOON.
THIS IS GOING TO BE A LENGTHY DISCUSSION.
THIS IS THE LAST ITEM RELATED TO TEXT CHANGES CREATING THE
SPECIFIED USE FOR THE ADUs FROM THE FEEDBACK WE HEARD FROM
THE PUBLIC.
I THINK IT MAY TAKE A BIT.
SO I JUST WANT TO ENSURE IT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL TO
MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS AT THIS TIME.
11:51:13AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A HARD STOP AT 12:30.
DO WE KNOW THEN I WILL TELL YOU WHAT -- LET'S -- LET'S DO --
LET'S DO THEN -- MOVE ON TO 15.
11:51:35AM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL, NICOLE TRAVIS,
DIRECTOR OF DEVELOPMENT AND ECONOMIC DON'T.
ROB ROSNER AND ALIS DRUMGO WILL PRESENT.
AND WE WILL GET IT TO YOU BEFORE YOU GO TO YOUR LUNCHTIME.
THANK YOU.
11:51:58AM >> GOOD MORNING, COUNCIL.
11:52:03AM >>LYNN HURTAK:
GOOD MORNING.
11:52:06AM >> THANK YOU.
11:52:06AM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
GOOD MORNING, THANK YOU.
11:52:08AM >>ALIS DRUMGO:
ALIS DRUMGO, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR FOR ECONOMIC
COMMUNITY.
AS ADMINISTRATOR TRAVIS DID A REPORT ON BENEFIT AGREEMENT.
IN JUNE YOU ASKED FOR THIS TO COME BEFORE YOU AND WE HAVE A
DRAFT OF THAT TODAY.
STAFF LOOKED AT DIFFERENT ORDINANCE FROM ST. PETE TO
DETROIT, MIAMI, AND ALSO CINCINNATI.
AND WE PUT THAT TOGETHER TO SEE HOW IT WOULD BE APPLICABLE
HERE IN TAMPA.
WHAT YOU WILL HEAR IS A PRESENTATION PROGRAMMABILITY ON WHAT
THE COMMUNITY I AGREEMENT COULD LOOK LIKE.
ROB ROSNER WILL PRESENT THAT TO YOU AND AFTER THAT OUR
ASSISTANT CITY ATTORNEY SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ WILL PRESENT
THREE THINGS.
THE ORDINANCE THAT ESTABLISHES THE CDA.
SHE HAS THE RESOLUTION THAT WILL CREATE THE COMMUNITY
BENEFIT ADVISORY COUNCIL TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE COMPLIANCE
WITH THE CDA.
OPINIONED THE THIRD ITEM OF APPROVING THE CDA AN INFORMATION
SHEET WHICH IS SET OF GUIDELINES THAT WILL GUIDE THE
COMMUNITY AND DEVELOPERS IN COLLABORATING THROUGHOUT THE
PROCESS.
AT THE END OF THE PRESENTATION, OUR GOAL WILL BE TO PROVIDE
YOU WITH DATES TO SET IT FOR PUBLIC COMMENT, THAT WAY WE CAN
MOVE IT FORWARD WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT YOU ALL HAVE ASKED
FOR.
I WILL TAKE A SEAT AND BE TAKING A BUNCH OF NOTES THROUGHOUT
THE PRESENTATION AND SHOULD YOU HAVE ANY FEEDBACK THAT WE
NEED TO INCORPORATE BEFORE WE MOVE THAT FORWARD.
WITH THAT I WILL TURN IT OVER TO ROB.
AND HE WILL KICK IT TO SUSAN.
11:53:39AM >> THANK YOU.
CAN WE PULL THE PRESENTATION UP, PLEASE?
GOOD MORNING, CHAIR CITRO AND COUNCILMEMBERS.
I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT ON THE COMMUNITY
BENEFITS ORDINANCE.
JUST TO GO OVER THIS.
WE JUST WANTED TO REITERATE THE PROCESS THAT WE TOOK THROUGH
HOLDING PUBLIC MEETINGS IN MAY.
AND WE HELD TWO OF THOSE PUBLIC ENGAGEMENTS.
AND WE HELD A SURVEY AS WELL.
AND THE SURVEY RESULTS AND JUST SHARING THIS TO REFRESH
WHERE WE HAVE BEEN OVER THE PAST YEAR THROUGH JUNE AND
THROUGH OUR DIFFERENT PROCESSES OVER MAY AND THOSE TIMES.
THE PURPOSE OF THE ORDINANCE IS TO CREATE A MECHANISM TO GET
THE CBA ITEMS INTO A CBA AGREEMENT.
AND OUR GOAL IS TO PROVIDE MORE TRANSPARENCY BEFORE PROJECTS
HIT THE GROUND -- COME OUT OF THE GROUND AND HAVE MORE INPUT
FROM THE COMMUNITY ON THAT.
SO WITH THAT, THE APPLICATION OF THE ORDINANCE IS TO --
APPLIES TO EVERYTHING THAT IS A P-3, A PUBLIC-PRIVATE
PARTNERSHIP.
TO -- APOLOGIZE HERE.
MY NOTES HAVE MOVED AROUND.
TO MAKE THOSE -- IF WE ARE PROVIDING AN INCENTIVE TO MAKE IT
FEASIBLE.
AND SO WITH THAT, THE PROGRAM ONLY APPLIES TO
CONSTRUCTION-RELATED ACTIVITIES AND THAT WOULD INCLUDE
REHABILITATION, RENOVATION, REDEVELOPMENT AND CONSTRUCTION.
IT WILL BE ON THE CONSTRUCTION VALUE.
WITH THAT -- AND IT DOESN'T -- IF A PROGRAM APPLIES TO TOE
STALL CONSTRUCTION VALUE OF THE OVERALL REGARDLESS OF THE
PHASING.
WE COULDN'T PHASE IT JUST TO GET IT OUT OF IT.
ONE OF THE REASONS TO PUT IT IN THERE.
WOULD NOT APPLY TO CITY LED PROJECTS WHICH IS ALREADY UNDER
A DIFFERENT SET OF ORDINANCES FOR PROCUREMENT AND
CONSTRUCTION POLICIES.
SO MUCH IT GETS INITIATED BASED ON PROJECTS THAT ARE $2
MILLION OR MORE.
AND IF THE CITY IS PROVIDING -- PROVIDING A BENEFIT OF 25%
OF THAT WHICH IS ABOUT $500,000.
AND WE GO THROUGH A TIERED PROCESS.
SO WITH THAT IT WOULD AUTOMATICALLY APPLY IF IT IS $10
MILLION OR MORE AND THOSE CAN GO THROUGH EXAMPLES OF THAT.
PARTICIPATION MAY BE MONITORING INCENTIVES, AD VALOREM TAX
EXEMPTIONS, REDUCTION OF PARKING REQUIREMENTS, UPGRADES AND
TRANSFER OF PROPERTY AT LOWER THAN APPRAISED VALUE.
AND THAT COULD BE WHAT THE CITY'S WARNINGS MIGHT BE.
WITH THAT WE DEVELOP THE -- REQUIRE THE DEVELOPER TO DO
PREWORK.
TELL US OF YOUR PROJECT BEFORE WE BRING IT TO THE PUBLIC AND
THEY HAVE TO HAVE A CONSTRUCTION PLANNING WORKSHEET, A
COMMUNITY IMPACT REPORT AND HOLDS TWO COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT
MEETINGS PRIOR TO ANY WRITTEN CBA DOCUMENT.
THE FIRST ONE IS CITY INPUT WHERE THEY PRESENT THE PROJECT
AND THE SECOND ONE WILL BE THE TERMS THAT CAME OUT OF THAT
PROCESS AND REPRESENT IT TO THE BROADER COMMUNITY.
WITH THAT I BELIEVE THAT A TIERED PARTICIPATION IS WHAT
NEEDS TO HAPPEN.
SO ON SMALLER PROJECTS, YOU WILL BE IN TIER 1 AND STEP UP
EACH ONE.
AS YOU SEE, THE REQUIREMENTS ARE PROGRESSIVE.
TIER 2 WILL HAVE TO DO EVERYTHING WITH TIER 1.
YOU GET TO TIER 3, DO TIER 1, 2 AND A BUNCH OF OTHER THINGS.
THE BENEFIT HAVING A ANY I DON'T REMEMBER THE AND MALL
BUSINESS INCENTIVE NOT REQUIRED BY A DEVELOPER NOW.
PUTS IT ON THEM AND INCREASES AT EACH LEVEL.
WITH THAT WE ALSO HAVE SOME OTHER, YOU KNOW SUSTAINABILITY
STANDARDS THAT ARE ON HERE THAT ARE MENTIONED THAT ARE
TALKING ABOUT HIGH ENERGY -- HIGH ENERGY REINVESTMENT.
AND SO ANYWAY, THERE IS A LIST.
AND MR. JOHNSON WILL TALK MORE WHAT IS IN THAT LIST IN THAT
GUIDING DOCUMENT OF WHAT THESE LISTS ARE.
SO WITH THAT, WE LOOK TO HAVE AN ADVISORY COMMITTEE.
AND THAT WOULD BE SEVEN MEMBERS.
AND THERE WILL BE TWO IN A STANDING FORMAT.
A TWO-YEAR TERM.
AND THEN FOUR THAT COME FROM THE COMMUNITY BASED ON THAT
AREA AND A HALF-MILE RADIUS WHERE THE PROJECT IS BEING DONE
AT.
WE WANT TO HEAR FROM THE NEIGHBORS AND WE WILL TALK ABOUT
THAT PROCESS IN A MOMENT AND ONE STAFF MEMBER FROM EYE
OFFICE OR ADMINISTRATOR TRAVIS' OFFICE WILL BE APPOINTED TO
THAT TO ADMINISTER TAMPA AND ALL APPOINTMENTS WILL FOLLOW
THE STANDARD APPLICATION PROCESS.
WITH THAT I WOULD LIKE TO DESCRIBE WHAT THAT PROCESS WILL
BE.
SO IS THE DEVELOP WILL DO THEIR PREWORK DOCUMENTATION.
SUBMIT THAT TO US.
SET THE FIRST COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT MEETING.
PRESENT THE PROJECT USING THE DOCUMENTATION THAT THEY
PROVIDED.
GATHER THE INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY AND PREPARE A TERM SHEET
FROM THAT INPUT.
WE HEARD YOU SAY THIS.
COMING BACK TO.
WE WOULD HOLD A CABC MEETING AND GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS
THERE.
LISTEN TO IT.
AND IMPROVE THOSE THINGS BECAUSE SOME THINGS MAY BE MORE
PLIABLE, APPLICABLE.
AND HAVE MORE WEIGHT.
ONCE THAT HAPPENS THAT THE CITY OF TAMPA AND DEVELOPER WRITE
THE CBA DOCUMENTS PACED ON INPUT.
GO TO ANOTHER MEETING AND PRESENT WHAT THE CBA DOCUMENT IS
AND GATHER ANY MORE INPUT OF BEING EGREGIOUS, MISSED OR
CLARIFIED.
ONCE THAT IS DONE, WE FINALIZE AND BRING IT TO YOU FOR
CONSIDERATION.
I WOULD LIKE TO STOP HERE AND INVITE SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ TO
TALK OF THE ORDINANCE AND DOCUMENTS THAT SUPPORT THAT.
11:59:43AM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
MR. CHAIRMAN, BEFORE SHE GETS TO THE
ORDINANCE, I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS OF IT RELATES TO THE
ORDINANCE.
AS IT CURRENTLY RELATES, ROB, WE HAVE A CRA CBA AGREEMENT
ALREADY, CORRECT?
11:59:59AM >> IF YOU WANT TO COME UP AND SPEAK WITH ME ON THIS AS WELL.
WE DO HAVE A CBA ORDINANCE.
12:00:05PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WHO WILL THAT RELATE TO THE CURRENT WE HAVE
IN THE CRA AND NOW WE WILL HAVE A COLLECTIVE CRA.
WILL THIS SUPERSEDE THE CRA TO HAVE A BLANKET CITY CRA
AGREEMENT.

12:00:18PM >> THIS ACTUALLY EXCEEDS THAT.
OBVIOUSLY, WE WANT THE'S CRAS INPUT ON ANY OF THIS AND THE
MEMBERS COULD BE SELECTED FROM THAT, BUT IT WAS INTENDED TO
BE GLOBAL, EVERYBODY TREATED THE SAME.
OBVIOUSLY, I WOULD LIKE ALIS TO SPEAK ON THAT, IF YOU LIKE.
12:00:33PM >>ALIS DRUMGO:
I'LL SPEAK TO IT BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT WE
HAVE A SEPARATE POLICY, COMPLETELY SEPARATE CDA POLICY FOR
CRA.
I KNOW THAT IN THIS CASE WE DO WANT TO HAVE A BLANKET
POLICY.
WE WANT THIS TO BE AN UMBRELLA POLICY THAT WE NEED
THROUGHOUT THE CITY, CRA INCLUDED.
12:00:50PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
AND I KNOW WE HAVE SOMETHING CRA, ON THIS
AND THAT ONE, SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, THAT WAY THE CRAs
KNOW THAT THIS WOULD BE REGARDLESS OF THE CRA ZONE OR NOT,
MAYBE NOT PUT INTO THE ORDINANCE, BUT YOU CAN SEE THAT CRA,
THEIR MONEY IS UTILIZED AS WELL, IT'S A PART OF THE PROCESS.
WOULD YOU NOT AGREE?

12:01:21PM >> SO IT LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE A SEPARATE THRESHOLD HERE,
COUNCILMAN, FOR CRA.
SO LET ME LOOK AT IT FOR A SECOND.
12:01:35PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I WANT TO MAKE SURE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW,
FIRST WE WERE TOLD WE COULD NEVER ADD MORE.
NOW IT'S WE CAN HAVE ONE.
BUT I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE DON'T -- PUT IT ALL IN ONE
BLANKET, THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE THE CASE.
12:01:51PM >>NICOLE TRAVIS:
I ALSO THINK OF IT WITH OUR CRA HATS ON,
WHEN YOU HAVE CRA INVESTMENTS IN BLIGHTED AREAS, WHAT THAT
THRESHHOLD MAY BE SOMETHING THAT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.
YOU KNOW, EVERYONE LIKES TO SAY A RISING TIDE FLOATS ALL
BOATS. WELL, NOT IF YOUR BOAT HAS A HOLE IN IT, OKAY?
SO LET US LOOK AT THAT AND MAKE SURE THAT IT'S ONE POLICY,
AND AGAIN, THIS IS ALL THE FEEDBACK THAT WE NEED.
12:02:19PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THANK YOU, SIR.
12:02:21PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
LEGAL DEPARTMENT.
SO I AM GOING TO WALK YOU THROUGH THE NEXT THREE DOCUMENTS
THAT YOU HAVE IN THE PACKAGE THAT MS. TRAVIS DISTRIBUTED
EARLIER THIS MORNING.
THE FIRST DOCUMENT IS THE DRAFT ORDINANCE THAT WOULD
ESTABLISH THE COMMUNITY BENEFITS PROGRAM HERE IN THE CITY.
THE SECOND DOCUMENT IS A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE FORM OF A
CBA INFORMATION SHEET THAT MR. ROSNER REFERENCED.
AND THEN THE THIRD DOCUMENT IS A RESOLUTION ESTABLISHING A

COMMUNITY BENEFITS ADVISORY COUNCIL.
SO ALL OF THESE DOCUMENTS REALLY ARE KIND OF THE NUTS AND
BOLTS OF ESTABLISHING THIS PROGRAM AS DESCRIBED BY MR.
ROSNER IN HIS PRESENTATION JUST A FEW MOMENTS AGO.
SO IF WE CAN TAKE THE FIRST DOCUMENT, THE DRAFT ORDINANCE.
AND YOU CAN JUST WALK YOU THROUGH IT.
IT HAS SOME WHEREAS CLAUSES ON THE FIRST PAGE.
ON THE SECOND PAGE THERE'S A STATEMENT OF COUNCIL'S
FINDINGS, PURPOSE AND INTENT.
AND REALLY THERE, JUST THE FACT THAT FINDING BEST AMENITIES
AND PRACTICES THAT ARE PROVIDED BY CERTAIN LEVEL OF PROJECTS
WITHIN THE CITY CAN MITIGATE AND EACH CREATE POSITIVE
BENEFITS FOR NEIGHBORHOOD AND THE SURROUNDING COMMUNITY THAT
MAY BE IMPACTED BY THOSE PROJECTS.
THE SECOND SECTION IS THE DEFINITION SECTION, THAT DOES
PROVIDE DEFINITIONS FOR THIS ORDINANCE, AND YOU WILL SEE IF
YOU FLIP TO PAGE 3, THERE ARE SPECIFIC DEFINITIONS FOR EACH
TIER OF PROJECTS.
THERE ARE THREE TIER LEVELS OF PROJECTS, AND THEY ARE BASED
ON THE AMOUNT OF TOTAL CONSTRUCTION STARTING AT THE LOW END
AT $2 MILLION OF TOTAL CONSTRUCTION COST, AND THE CITY
PARTICIPATION VALUE EQUAL TO OR GREATER THAN $500,000.
THE SECOND TIER WOULD BE PROJECTS WITH A TOTAL CONSTRUCTION
COST OF $4 MILLION AND CDB PARTICIPATION VALUE OF A MILLION
DOLLARS OR GREATER AND THEN THAT THIRD STIR OF PROJECT WOULD

BE TO THE CONGRESS INSTRUCTION COST OF $8 MILLION, AND $2
MILLION OR GREATER CITY PARTICIPATION VALUE SO ROUGHLY ABOUT
A QUARTER OF THE PARTICIPATION VALUE FOR THE PROJECT WOULD
BE COMING FROM THE CITY.
AND SO THOSE TIER LEVELS ARE SIMILAR AGAIN TO THE WAY THE
ST. PETE ORDINANCE, WHICH WE STUDIED VERY CAREFULLY, IS
STRUCTURED.
AND SO THAT ESTABLISHES AGAIN THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE
DIFFERENT TIER LEVELS.
AND THEN JUST BELOW THAT IN THE NEXT SECTION, REQUIRED
COMMUNITY BENEFITS FOR COVERED PROJECTS DESCRIBES AGAIN EACH
OF THESE TIER LEVELS, THE REQUIREMENTS THE DEVELOPER HAS TO
DO.
SO YOU FLIP TO THE NEXT PAGE FOR TIER 1, FOR EXAMPLE, STARTS
OFF WITH THE FILING OF A CONSTRUCTION PLANNING WORK SHEET
OUTLINING THE CONSTRUCTION, COMMUNICATION PLAN FOR THE
PROJECT, REQUIRES THE DEVELOPER TO HOLD TWO PUBLIC MEETINGS
WITHIN THE COMMUNITY, REQUIRES THE DEVELOPER TO SUBMIT A
COMMUNITY BENEFIT IMPACT REPORT WHICH AGAIN ROB MENTIONED IN
HIS PRESENTATION.
BUT THIS DETAILS WHAT NEEDS TO BE INCLUDED IN THAT COMMUNITY
BENEFIT IMPACT REPORT, THINGS LIKE THE PROJECTS FISCAL
IMPACT, IT'S EMPLOYMENT IMPACT, THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT,
ANY TYPE OF SUSTAINABILITY AND RESILIENCY IMPACTS THAT NEED
TO BE INCLUDED IN THAT REPORT.

IT DOES REQUIRE THE DEVELOPER TO COMPLY WITH THE CITY'S LAND
DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS, AND OTHER LISTS OF THINGS SUCH AS
CONSTRUCTING A STREETSCAPE AND PUBLIC REALM IMPROVEMENTS,
REQUIRING THE DEVELOPER TO ACHIEVE LEED CERTIFICATION FOR
CERTAIN LEVELS OF PROJECTS AND SO FORTH.
AND YOU WILL SEE AS WE GO THROUGH HERE THAT THE DIFFERENT
TIERS KIND OF BUILD ON EACH OTHER, SO WHEN YOU GET TO THE
SECOND TIER THE DEVELOPER HAS TO COMPLETE ALL OF THE TIER 1
REQUIREMENTS, AND THEN ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS ARE ADDED ON
TOP OF THAT.
AGAIN, IN ORDER TO HELP JUSTIFY OR CREATE ADDITIONAL
BENEFITS WHERE THERE IS GREATER CITY PARTICIPATION.
SO, FOR EXAMPLE, IN ADDITION TO THE TIER 1 REQUIREMENTS FOR
TIER 2 PROJECTS, THE DEVELOPER HAS TO ESTABLISH UTILIZE AN
APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAM, AND THEN THERE ARE ADDITIONAL
CITY-APPROVED ITEMS IN THE GUIDANCE DOCUMENTS WHICH WE WILL
GET TO IN JUST A MOMENT THAT THE DEVELOPER MUST ALSO CHOOSE
FROM IN ORDER TO COMPLY WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE
ORDINANCE.
AND THEN FINALLY WHEN WE GET TO TIER 33rd PROJECTS
AGAIN, THE IDEA OF BUILDING ON EACH OTHER, SO THE DEVELOPER
WOULD HAVE TO COMPLETE TIER 1 AND TIER 2 REQUIREMENTS, AND
THERE WOULD BE ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS SUCH AS ACHIEVING A
GREATER HIGHER LEVEL OF LEED CERTIFICATION FOR AGAIN THE
HIGHEST TIER OF PROJECTS.

AND FINALLY, GUIDANCE FOR THE REQUIREMENTS ARE GOING TO BE
ESTABLISHED IN CITY COUNCIL RESOLUTION, WHICH I WILL GO OVER
IN JUST ONE MOMENT.
AND THEN THE ORDINANCE, THE NEXT SECTION PROVIDES PROCEDURES
FOR EVALUATING THE COMMUNITY BENEFITS OF THE COVERED
PROJECT.
AND SO THIS KIND OF SETS OUT AND THE ORDER IN WHICH IT
HAPPENS.
SO YOU WILL SEE THERE UNDER SUBSECTION B, PRIOR TO THE
DRAFTING OF A TERM SHEET THE DEVELOPER HAS TO CONDUCT THAT
FIRST PUBLIC MEETING IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, AND THEN BASED ON
THE INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY, THE CITY AND DEVELOPER WOULD
THEN NEGOTIATE AND GENERATE A NON-BINDING TERM SHEET, AND
THEN IT PROVIDES A LAUNDRY LIST OF FIVE ITEMS THAT MUST BE
INCLUDED IN THAT TERM SHEET AT A MINIMUM.
IT CAN INCLUDE, AGAIN, ADDITIONAL THINGS, BUT, FOR EXAMPLE,
AS ROB MENTIONED IN THE DESCRIPTION OF THE PROJECT, A
CALCULATION OF HOW MUCH THE CITY IS GOING TO BE CONTRIBUTING
TO THE PROJECT, THE SPECIFIC COMMUNITY BENEFITS THAT ARE
PROPOSED BUILT DEVELOPER, AND IF THE DEVELOPER IS SEEKING
ANY EXEMPTIONS TO THE ORDINANCE.
THE REMAINING TALKS ABOUT THE CDAC WHICH I WILL TALK ABOUT
IN MORE DETAIL IN THE NEXT DOCUMENT.
THERE IS A SECTION ON THE NEXT PAGE THAT ALLOWS FOR
EXEMPTIONS TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF THIS ORDINANCE.

FOR EXAMPLE, IF THE COVERED PROJECT IS GOING TO INVOLVE
MULTIPLE DWELLING UNITS AND AT LEAST 30% OF THE DWELLING
UNITS ARE DESIGNATED AS AFFORDABLE OR WORKFORCE HOUSING.
THE NEXT EXEMPTION POSSIBLE IS SINGLE HISTORICALLY
DESIGNATED PROPERTY INVOLVED WITHIN THE COVERED PROJECT.
AND THEN THERE'S A CATCH-ALL THAT ALLOWS THE DEVELOPER TO
MAKE A CASE FOR BEING GRANTED AN EXEMPTION BASED ON THEIR
DEMONSTRATION TO THE CITY SATISFACTION THAT THERE IS AN
ALTERNATIVE BENEFITS TO THE ONES THAT ARE PROVIDED FOR IN
THE ORDINANCE THAT THEY ARE ABLE TO PROVIDE THROUGH THEIR
PROJECT OR THEY CAN PROPOSE OTHER IDEAS, BUT ULTIMATELY IT
WOULD BE UP TO THE CITY TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT -- WHAT
THE DEVELOPER IS PROPOSING KIND OF SATISFIES THE INTENT OF
THESE REQUIREMENTS.
SO IT DOES ALLOW A LITTLE BIT OF FLEXIBILITY IN HERE AS WELL
OF THE
AND THEN FINALLY, COUNCIL MAY RECALL, OUR FIRST STEPS,
INITIAL RESPONSE TO THE REQUEST TO REVIEW THE ST. PETE
ORDINANCE, I PROVIDED A MEMO TO CITY COUNCIL BACK IN JANUARY
THAT KIND OF DETAILED THE CRA COMMUNITY BENEFITS POLICY AS
WELL AS HOUR SUMMARY OF OUR REVIEW OF THE ST. PETE
ORDINANCE, AND AT THE TAIL END OF THAT MEMO, I DID NOTE
THAT -- IT'S DID CAUTION CITY COUNCIL ABOUT KIND OF
CONNECTING A COMMUNITY BENEFITS REQUIREMENT TO ISSUANCE OF
ANY DEVELOPMENT PERMITS SUCH AS WE DO WITH THE REZONING

APPLICATIONS AND THAT CITY COUNCIL SHOULD AVOID DOING THAT,
IF YOU DECIDE TO PROCEED WITH THIS.
SO ON THE LAST PAGE OF THE ORDINANCE, UNDER THE SECTION
ENTITLED INAPPLICABLE PROJECTS, AS ROB MENTIONED, THIS WOULD
NOT APPLY TO CITY-OWNED PROJECTS FOR CITY-OWNED FACILITIES
OR CITY-WIDE PROJECTS, AND THEN THAT SECOND SENTENCE STATES
THAT THE ARTICLE IS NOT INTENDED AND SHALL NOT APPLY TO THE
REVIEWING ISSUANCE OF ANY DEVELOPMENT ORDER BY THE CITY
INCLUDING ANY REZONING APPROVALS OR ANY QUASI-JUDICIAL
APPROVES ASSOCIATED WITH THE PROJECT.
SO THAT AGAIN KIND OF HIGHLIGHTS THE NEED TO KIND OF KEEP
THESE TWO ITEMS SEPARATE.
SO THAT IS THE ORDINANCE IN A NUTSHELL.
I'M HAPPY TO TAKE ANY QUESTIONS.
BUT IF WE COULD MOVE ONTO THE NEXT DOCUMENT, WHICH IS THE
RESOLUTION APPROVING A FORM OF THE PROPOSED COMMUNITY
BENEFIT AGREEMENT INFORMATION SHEET, AND AGAIN THE
ATTACHMENT, ATTACHMENT A, IS JUST YOU WILL SEE AN
INFORMATION SHEET THAT COULD BE FILLED OUT BY THE DEVELOPER
IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE CITY, BUT IT REALLY IS KIND OF A
NAME, RANK AND SERIAL NUMBER, WHO THE DEVELOPER IS, WHERE
THE PROJECT IS LOCATED, WHAT NEIGHBORHOODS ARE IMPACTED,
JUST ALL OF THE NUTS AND BOLTS OF THINGS THAT ARE REQUIRED
TO BE INCLUDED.
AND THEN IT JUST PROVIDES KIND OF IN A CHECKLIST FORM,

ALLOWS THE DEVELOPER TO GO THROUGH AND CHECK OFF WHAT THEY
ARE GOING TO BE INCLUDING WITHIN THEIR PROJECT.
IT DOES PROVIDE FOR ALL OF THE DIFFERENT REQUIREMENTS AND
POSSIBILITIES.
THE LIST OF THINGS A DEVELOPER CAN CHOOSE FROM, AND IT
ALLOWS FOR KIND OF AN ACCOUNTING OF WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN
AND KIND OF BE THE FOUNDATION FOR A TERM SHEET AND THEN
ULTIMATELY THE NEGOTIATION AND DRAFTING OF THE COMMUNITY
BENEFITS AGREEMENT THAT WILL COME BACK TO CITY COUNCIL.
AND THEN THE FINAL DOCUMENT IS A RESOLUTION THAT
ESTABLISHING THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT ADVISORY COUNCIL THAT WE
HAVE REFERRED TO THIS MORNING.
AS ROB MENTIONED, THE CBA MEMBERSHIP WILL BE SEVEN PEOPLE.
THERE WILL BE TWO MEMBERS, TWO STANDING MEMBERS, ONE
MEMBER -- ONE STANDING MEMBER APPOINTED BY THE MAYOR, ONE
STANDING MEMBER APPOINTED BY CITY COUNCIL.
THERE WILL BE TWO-YEAR TERMS.
AND THEN THERE WOULD BE FOUR MEMBERS THAT WOULD BE BASED ON
A PROJECT-BY-PROJECT BASIS.
SO THOSE ARE GOING TO BE ROLLING MEMBERS.
YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE DIFFERENT VARIATIONS OF THE CBAC
DEPENDING ON THE PROJECT.
SO THE MEMBERSHIP WILL CHANGE.
THE TWO STANDING MEMBERS WILL REMAIN THE SAME FOR TWO-YEAR
TERMS, AND THEN THE FOUR MEMBERS WILL COME FROM THE IMPACTED

NEIGHBORHOOD.
SO TWO MEMBERS, THOSE AD HOC MEMBERS WILL BE APPOINTED BY
CITY COUNCIL.
TWO MEMBERS WILL BE APPOINTED BY THE ADMINISTRATION.
SO THAT WOULD BE SIX MEMBERS.
AND THEN THE FINAL MEMBER WOULD BE A DESIGNEE OF THE DEO
DEPARTMENT OR ADMINISTRATOR AS ROB MENTIONED.
SO THAT FINAL RESOLUTION JUST KIND OF ESTABLISHING THAT
PROCESS AND HOW THE MEMBERS WILL BE APPOINTED, AND HOW LONG
THEY WILL SERVE, AND THEN ALSO SETS OUT, AS YOU CAN SEE ON
THE SECOND PAGE OF THE RESOLUTION, THE CHARGES AND
RESPONSIBILITIES AND WHAT THE RESPONSIBILITIES AND DUTIES OF
THE CBAC WILL BE.
THAT CONCLUDES MY KIND OF SUMMARY AND WALK-THROUGH OF THE
DOCUMENT.
IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I OR ROB OR ALIS WILL BE HAPPY.
12:13:09PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
12:13:11PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE DIDN'T HAVE A
BLANKET VOID AND THEN NOT REPRESENTING COMMUNITIES, SO IN
THE LITTLE TWEAKS THAT'S COMING FROM THE AD HOC MEETING.
I THINK THAT'S ONE AREA.
TWO, AGAIN, WHEN WE LOOK AT -- I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN OR NOT
WITH THE CRA, I KNOW WE HAVE A PERSON ON THE DOE, BUT IF
IT'S IN A CRA ZONE, I THINK CRA DIRECTOR, ROB, SHOULD BE A
PART OF THAT, IF IT IS EFFECTIVE IN THE CRA ZONE, BECAUSE

THEY WOULD KNOW EXACTLY WHAT'S GOING ON.
12:13:44PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
AND THAT PERSON COULD CAN BE THE
DESIGNEE AND MS. TRAVIS CAN SPEAK TO.
THAT IT COULD BE DEO, IT COULD BE SOMEBODY ON STAFF OR SOME
OTHER PERSON WHO IS APPOINTED BY MS. TRAVIS.
12:14:01PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YOU KNOW, I THINK DETROIT WAS THE FIRST
ONE TO COME OUT WITH IT, SO THAT'S WHY I TALKED TO SOME
FOLKS THERE IN 2019, AND I THINK ST. PETE, AND WE DID LOOK
AT OTHER AREAS AS WELL, BUT LOOK AT WHAT ST. PETE IS DOING.
BUT ALL TOGETHER IN THE POT.
RIGHT NOW, YOU KNOW, UNTIL WE PUT IN THE WORK WE DON'T KNOW,
BUT WE CAN TWEAK IT FROM THERE, I BELIEVE.
BUT I'M SATISFIED TODAY, LOOKING AT THAT AD HOC SITUATION,
AND SEE HOW THAT CRA COMPONENT, THE BLANKET CRA, STAND
ALONE, OR INCORPORATED AND HAVE IT IN THE CRA IN THE EXACT
ORDINANCE.
12:14:45PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
WE CAN CERTAINLY DO THAT.
AND COUNCILMEMBER, TO YOUR POINT, DETROIT WAS ONE OF THE
FIRST ONES AND THEY HAVE SINCE, JUST RECENTLY, ADOPTED
AMENDMENTS TO THEIRS, SO IT WILL TAKE SOME TWEAKING.
AND I GUESS I WILL ASK ALIS TO COME BACK UP WITH A TIMELINE.
12:15:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
12:15:06PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THAT
PRESENTATION.
I WAS WATCHING IT IN THE BACK AND I THINK ONE OF THE MOST

IMPORTANT ASPECTS OF THIS, AND COUNCILMAN MEMBER GUDES JUST
TOUCHED UPON IT, WAS THERE'S FOUR MEMBERS THAT ARE SELECTED
WITHIN THAT AREA, WHEREVER THE PROJECT IS, TWO BY COUNCIL I
THINK IS ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL BECAUSE PEOPLE THAT ARE
AFFECTED BY AND LIVE WITHIN THAT ZONE WILL HAVE THEIR VOICE
HEARD AND BE ABLE TO PARTICIPATE, BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO
BENEFIT OR IMPACT THEIR COMMUNITY, AND I THINK THAT'S THE
MOST IMPORTANT PART OF CITIZEN INVOLVEMENT, WHERE THERE'S
THE MOST TRANSPARENCY, AS WELL AS A BALANCE OF 4 AND 2, SO
THANK YOU FOR THAT PRESENTATION.
I RECEIVED IN THE PAPER WHEN I WAS LOOKING OVER THIS, AND I
THINK THIS IS VERY GOOD TO BEGIN WITH AND MOVE FORWARD.
THANK YOU.
12:16:00PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
12:16:02PM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE NUMBERS ON
TIER 1 AND TIER 2 ARE TOO LOW.
THE FIRST PART IS TIER 1, $2 MILLION OF THE CITY
PARTICIPATION, 25%.
THE SECOND ONE, 4 MILLION, 25%.
AND THEN IT SAYS 10 MILLION AND 15 MILLION.
ON THE TWO AND FOUR MILLION IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD BE
UNNECESSARILY BURDENSOME FOR SOME OF THE SMALLER NONPROFITS
AND SMALLER DEVELOPERS.
I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S BASED ON THE CDD ONE BUT WITH ALL THE
INFLATION THAT'S HAPPENED IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, THOSE LOWER

NUMBERS SEEM LIKE REALLY LOW NUMBERS.
THESE MAY NOT GO IN SOUTH TAMPA, BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT'S
DIFFICULT TO BUY A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME IN SOUTH TAMPA FOR
LESS THAN A MILLION, AND MOST CONDOS ARE GOING FOR MORE THAN
THAT.
SO AS INFLATION CONTINUES TO GO UP, 2 MILLION IS LIKE TWO
LOTS IN SOUTH TAMPA.
THE SECOND THING IS THAT I THINK FOR THE MAKEUP OF THE
BOARD, I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT WE ADD ONE REPRESENTATIVE FROM
EACH CITY COUNCIL MEMBER, BECAUSE THE DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT
THROUGHOUT THE CITY, DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT FROM THE PEOPLE
THAT WE MIGHT APPOINT, BUT DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT FROM
REPRESENTATION THROUGHOUT THE CITY.
I LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING FOUR PEOPLE FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD
BUT IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WE SHOULD HAVE A BROADER VIEW OF
THESE THINGS AS WELL.
THANK YOU.
12:17:32PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
DID YOU SAY ONE APPOINTEE FROM EACH
CITY COUNCIL MEMBER?
12:17:40PM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES, IN ADDITION TO WHAT'S THERE, THE TWO
AND THE FOUR, ONE FOR EACH CITY COUNCIL MEMBER SO WE HAVE
DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT THROUGHOUT THE CITY, DIVERSE
PERSPECTIVES.
12:17:50PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
SO THAT WOULD BE A TOTAL OF 14, 13
OR 14?

15?
12:17:56PM >>BILL CARLSON:
13, YES.
12:17:59PM >> IF I MAY SPEAK TO THAT, COUNCILMAN, YOU MENTIONED THAT
THE NUMBERS ON TIERS 1 AND 2, SOME OF THE NONPROFITS MAY NOT
BE ABLE TO MEET THOSE NUMBERS, OR MEET SOME OF THE CRITERIA
LISTED.
BUT WE DO HAVE SOME -- I THINK THE NONPROFITS FIT INTO THAT
CATEGORY IN WHICH THEY MAY BE EXEMPT FROM HAVING A YBA BUT
IF YOU HAVE RECOMMENDS ON WHAT THOSE NUMBERS YOU WOULD LIKE
TO BE, IT'S CERTAINLY THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL TO ADJUST
THOSE NUMBERS.
12:18:29PM >>BILL CARLSON:
IT SEEMS LIKE TIER 1 IS 10 MILLION OVERALL,
BUT MAYBE IT SHOULD BE 5 MILLION THAT THE CITY PARTICIPATING
25%, BUT THAT GIVES YOU 5 MILLION THESE DAYS IS NOT A VERY
BIG PROJECT.
IT SOUND LIKE A BIG NUMBER.
I WAS JUST IN RALEIGH ON MONDAY AND PEOPLE ACTUALLY WANT
MORE MILLION DOLLARS HOMES, AND A MILLION DOLLARS SOUNDS
LIKE A LOT OF MONEY BUT IN SOUTH TAMPA, IT'S SPREADING
THROUGHOUT THE CITY, PROBABLY IN YOUR DISTRICT, TOO, THE
PRICES ARE SO HIGH ALMOST NOBODY CAN AFFORD THEM. IF WE SET
THIS TOO LOW IT'S GOING TO UNREASONABLY RAISE THE COST EVEN
MORE FOR PEOPLE TRYING TO GET IN.
IT'S NOT JUST NONPROFITS.
IT'S SMALL DEVELOPERS, TOO.

THERE ARE INDIVIDUALS THAT 2022 BUILD A DUPLEX OR QUAD OR
WHATEVER, AND THEY COULD BE AFFECTED.
12:19:22PM >> UNDERSTOOD.
WE'LL MODIFY THOSE NUMBERS AND FOLLOW UP WITH YOU.
THEN AS IT RELATES TO JUST THE MEMBERSHIP MAKEUP OF THAT
COMMITTEE, I THINK PART OF THIS IS THE FOCUS ON THE
COMMUNITY OF WHERE THE PROJECT IS TAKING PLACE, AND SO OUR
COMMITTEE, WITH RESPECT TO THE COUNCIL AND HAVING EACH
MEMBER HAVE MULTIPLE OR INDIVIDUAL SELECTIONS, TYPICALLY THE
MAKEUP OF THAT SMALL GROUP IS WITHIN A HALF MILE OF THE
PROJECT ITSELF.
AND SO IF THERE IS SOME ADDITIONAL FEEDBACK WE MIGHT BE ABLE
TO TAKE YOU FROM YOU ON HOW TO KEEP THOSE NUMBERS, I WON'T
SAY LOW, IN ORDER TO LIMIT FEEDBACK, BUT PLEASE KEEP IN MIND
THIS IS A VOLUNTEER COMMITTEE AS WELL, SO IT'S VERY
DIFFICULT TO GET PEOPLE TO PARTICIPATE IN THESE COMMITTEES,
AND WE JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE DON'T HAVE ISSUES WITH
QUORUMS OR GETTING PEOPLE TO SHOW UP TO BE A PART OF THIS
PROCESS.
12:20:14PM >>BILL CARLSON:
AND MY COLLEAGUES MAY DISAGREE.
BUT IF YOU HAVE ONE FOR EACH PLUS THE FOUR FROM THE
NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATIONS THAT WOULD PROVIDE BALANCE, BUT
ALSO PROVIDE SOME CONSISTENCY THROUGHOUT THE CITY.
AND JUST MY THOUGHTS.
ANYTIME WE ARE GOING TO CREATE A COMMITTEE OF ANY KIND, I

THINK THAT THERE SHOULD BE ONE FROM EACH CITY COUNCIL
MEMBER, BECAUSE IT REFLECTS THE DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT, HOW WE
GOT ELECTED, AND REFLECTS THE DIVERSITY OF THOUGHT OF THE
DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CITY.
AND WHATEVER THE MAYOR WANTS ON TOP OF THAT IS FINE, BUT I
UNDERSTAND THIS IS A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT ONE, BUT THAT'S MY
PHILOSOPHY IN GENERAL THAT WE SHOULD HAVE REPRESENTATION,
DIVERSE REPRESENTATION BY THE CITY.
THANK YOU.
12:20:53PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
12:20:57PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I HAVE BEEN LISTENING, BUT 4, 5, 6 AND
7, AND IN EVERY DISTRICT NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE AT -- SO,
THEREFORE, IF YOU DO THAT, ONE APPOINTED BY COUNCIL MEMBERS,
EVEN WITHIN THAT DISTRICT, SOMETHING THAT MAY BE TOMORROW
GERMANE TO THIS PART OF THE DISTRICT MAY NOT BE GERMANE TO
THAT PART OF THE DISTRICT.
SO I AM IN AWE HOW MANY PEOPLE WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT
IN MR. ROBINSON IS SHAKING HIS HEAD.
AND HE'S RIGHT.
AND IF HE'S RIGHT, THEN I'M RIGHT.
[ LAUGHTER ]
SO WHAT I AM SAYING, YOU ARE LOOKING FOR SOMETHING, AND THE
MORE YOU MAKE IT THE MORE DIFFICULT, YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE,
BECAUSE EVERY DISTRICT IS ALIGNED WITH POPULATION, WITH
INTENT, AND THOSE FOUR DISTRICTS ARE THE TOTAL DISTRICTS OF

THE CITY, AND WITHIN THOSE FOUR DISTRICTS, EVERY TIME YOU
ARE GOING TO MAKE -- THAT'S WHAT MAKES THE CITY OF TAMPA SO
UNIQUE.
YOU HAVE THE HIGH-END INCOME TO LESSER INCOME.
YOU HAVE HIGH EDUCATION TO SOME EDUCATION.
YOU HAVE EVERYTHING THAT GOES INTO IT.
SO IT WOULD BE ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE IN MY MIND TO REPRESENT THE
TOTAL DISTRICT WHEN ITSELF IT IS VERY UNIQUE.
THAT'S IT.
12:22:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
12:22:27PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
IN THEORY, I LIKE THAT WE EACH GET
REPRESENTATION, BUT THEN I WOULD FEEL THAT WE WOULD STILL
NEED MORE FROM THE COMMUNITY.
I FEEL LIKE THE COMMUNITY WHERE THE PROJECT IS HAPPENING
SHOULD HAVE MORE SAY.
JUST OVERALL.
BECAUSE THE PROJECT IS IMPACTING THEM.
THAT'S MY CONCERN.
WITH EXPANDING.
THE MAKEUP.
12:22:55PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
12:23:02PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
IN DETROIT AND OVER THE AREAS, THEY CAME
FROM THAT COMMUNITY, THAT MAKEUP, CORRECT?
12:23:09PM >> THAT'S CORRECT.
12:23:11PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THE EFFECTED AREA.

12:23:13PM >> CORRECT.
12:23:15PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE?
IF YOU WOULD, PLEASE, TIER 1, SECTION 7.
TWO, I SEE THE WORD "SHALL" ALL OVER THIS ORDINANCE, EXCEPT
WHEN IT COMES TO ALTERNATIVE GREEN BUILDING CERTIFICATIONS
AND RESILIENCY NUMBERS MEASURES, "MAY."
CAN WE USE STRONGER LANGUAGE?
SHOULD?
SHALL?
IF WE ARE GOING TO BE A RESILIENT CITY, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE
CITY IS INVOLVED.
12:23:59PM >>SUSAN JOHNSON-VELEZ:
PARAGRAPH 7?
I SEE WHERE YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.
12:24:06PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
LEED BUILDING CERTIFICATIONS AND RESILIENCY.
USE A LITTLE STRONGER LANGUAGE, SHALL OR SHOULD.
12:24:14PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
MAKES A LOT OF DIFFERENCE.
12:24:22PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IT DOES, IF WE ARE GOING TO BE THAT
RESILIENT CITY.
PLEASE AND THANK YOU.
I'M ASKING FOR SOMETHING STRONGER.
I'M SURE LEGAL WILL LOOK AT IT AND COME BACK.
BECAUSE WE ARE JUST LISTENING TO THIS TODAY, AREN'T WE?
WE AREN'T GOING TO TAKE ANY ACTION.
12:24:44PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:


12:24:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AND I CAN ALWAYS CALL THEM ON THE PHONE AND
TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT.
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
12:24:52PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WE ARE COMING BACK WITH SOME OF THE
SUGGESTED CORRECTIONS TO COME IN AND MOVE FOR A HEARING,
CORRECT?
12:24:59PM >> SO WE CAN FOLLOW UP WITH THEM INDIVIDUALLY TO TAKE
FEEDBACK THAT YOU HAVE TODAY AND WE HEAR SOME OF THE
FEEDBACK THAT YOU SHARED WITH US, AND WE CAN MAKE THOSE
PROPOSED CHANGES.
IDEALLY, WE HAVE NOVEMBER 17th AS A PROPOSED HEARING
THAT WE WILL BE OPENING IT UP FOR PUBLIC COMMENT AND TAKE
THAT COMMENT AS WELL SO WE DON'T DELAY THIS PROCESS.
12:25:16PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THANK YOU, SIR.
12:25:21PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
NOW WE STILL HAVE TO GO TO PUBLIC COMMENT
FOR THIS.
MR. ROBINSON.
12:25:25PM >> JOE ROBINSON:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
THIS IS DEAR TO MY HEART.
CHARLIE, YOU ARE RIGHT.
LET MET EXPLAIN THIS TO YOU.
FIRST OF ALL, NONE OF THESE DOCUMENTS WAS ONLINE FOR THE
PUBLIC TO LOOK AT.
ZERO.
I CAN'T EVEN FOLLOW IT.

PUBLIC NEVER GOT THESE DOCUMENTS.
THEY SAY THEY WANT YOU TO APPROVE THESE DOCUMENTS.
SO PUT THE DOCUMENT, BECAUSE I CAN'T GO ALONG WITH SOMETHING
I CAN'T SEE.
NEXT THING IS, IF HANNA AVENUE WAS THE AREA, IT'S A PUBLIC
PROPERTY BEEN DONE BY THE CITY, I GUESS THAT DON'T APPLY.
IT DON'T APPLY TO THIS CBA.
BECAUSE THE DEVELOPERS DEVELOP A CITY PROPERTY.
AND THAT PROPERTY IS WORTH SEVERAL MILLION DOLLARS.
COUNCILMAN, I CAN'T BELIEVE IT.
LISTEN, YOU ARE RIGHT, THE VALUES, YOU GOT A SMALL CONTRACT
THAT COMES IN HERE AND DOES A MILLION DOLLAR, YOU GOT TO GO
THROUGH A CBA?
I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THAT.
I THINK WE GOT -- AND THEN CHARLIE, YOU ARE RIGHT, WE ARE
ALL OVER -- YOU MAY HAVE TEN OF THESE PROJECTS GOING.
YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TEN OF THESE COMMITTEES GOING ON?
YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TEN OF THESE PROJECTS ARE GOING ON IN
THE CITY, ALL THE WAY FROM NEW TAMPA, ALL THE WAY TO SOUTH
TAMPA, WEST TAMPA, EAST TAMPA, AND IN THE MIDDLE?
HOW ARE YOU GOING TO HAVE -- YOU GOING TO HAVE TWO
COMMITTEES FOR EVERY ONE OF THESE, YOU SAY YOU WANT SOMEONE
FROM ALL THE NEIGHBORHOODS.
THAT NEEDS TO BE THOUGHT OUT, MAN.
BECAUSE YOU ALL GOT TO SIT IN A CORNER, GOT TO MAKE OUT AN

APPLICATION, HAVE BACKGROUND CHECKS, SO BUT WE GOT TO DO ALL
OF THAT BY THE TIME, YOU ALL ARE TALKING ABOUT TOO MUCH
STUFF ON THE AGENDA SO YOU NEED TO APPOINT PEOPLE FROM THE
PUBLIC AND YOU KNOW -- WE NEED TO LOOK AT THIS THRESHOLD.
WE NEED TO HAVE MAYBE ONE THING, AND PICK SOME PEOPLE LIKE
ONE FROM EACH OF THE SINGLE-MEMBER DISTRICTS, AND THEN ADD
THAT.
THIS IS GOING TO BE HOCUS-POCUS.
GET THE PEOPLE ON THE CRA.
AND THEN PEOPLE THAT OWN BUSINESS IN THE CRA IS NOT GOING TO
BE SITTING ON THAT.
THAT'S AN ISSUE THAT I AM DEALING WITH THAT.
BUT LIKE I SAID, THOSE NUMBERS IS AN ISSUE.
THIS WAS NOT -- THESE DOCUMENTS ARE NOT UP FOR PUBLIC
REVIEW.
I KNOW HOWEVER YOU DO, LET'S MOVE IT, DON'T STOP IT, BUT WE
WILL DIG INTO IT ONCE WE HAVE SOMETHING TO LOOK AT IN
WRITING, OKAY.
RIGHT NOW SAY LET'S MOVE.
HOWEVER, THERE'S SOME WORK AROUND WITH THIS COMMITTEE, HOW
IT'S GOING TO BE, AND THE REPRESENTATION, AND THE EXAMPLE I
GIVE WHERE THIS WOULD APPLY, WRONG GUY AND YOU ARE RIGHT,
MR. GUDES, HOW DOES THE CRA COMMUNITY BENEFIT, AND I KNOW
SOMEWHERE EXISTS, TIE INTO THIS SO-CALLED GLOBAL FOR THE
CITY OF TAMPA?

YOU ARE ON THE RIGHT TRACK BUT WE AIN'T GOT THAT TRACK
STRAIGHT YET.
SO LET'S JUST TRY -- I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS GRANT.
12:28:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
MR. CHAIRMAN, MAY I MAKE A SUGGESTION?
CAN WE TAKE ITEM 13?
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN HERE FOR A LONG TIME, AND WE GOT ABOUT TEN
MINUTES SO THEY CAN EXPLAIN WHAT WE GOT HERE.
12:29:05PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
LET'S GET THROUGH THIS ONE FIRST.
WE STILL HAVE PUBLIC COMMENTS ONLINE.
12:29:09PM >> ALISON HEWITT, EAST TAMPA RESIDENT AND BUSINESS OWNER.
I AM THRILLED THAT IT HAS COME OUT.
I JUST HAVE SEVERAL COMMENTS FOR THREE OF THE ITEMS THAT
WERE DISCUSSED, AND MY COMMENTS ARE IN THE BODY HIGHLIGHTED
IN YELLOW.
I WILL START WITH THE ORDINANCE, THE ORDINANCE DOCUMENT.
ONE ON THE DEFINITIONS.
THANK YOU, COUNCILMAN GUDES, FOR BRINGING UP HOW THIS WILL
RELATE TO THE CRA.
I'M ALSO LOOKING AT THIS VERY SPECIFICALLY AS ECONOMIC
DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE OF THE EAST TAMPA CRA.
SO THE PROVISION OF LAND BELOW THE BAYOU, DOES THAT MEAN
THAT LAND WILL NOT BE CONTRIBUTION TO SOME PROJECTS, TO BE
ABLE TO DO A LOT OF THE PROJECTS AND DEVELOPMENT IN EAST
TAMPA AND IN HISTORICALLY UNDERSERVED AREAS?
THERE'S NOT A LOT OF MONEY FOR THE PEOPLE WHO ARE DEVELOPING

THIS.
AND THAT HELPS THEM HAVE EQUITY IN THE PROJECT.
THE SECOND ONE IS, WOULD THIS ALSO INCLUDE BORROWING AGAINST
INCREASING TIF?
THIS IS ALSO GOING TO BE A BLANKET FOR THE CRA.
COULD WE ALSO, IN THE CITY PARTICIPATION, INCLUDE WHAT THEIR
DEFINITION OF THE CRA PARTICIPATION WOULD BE?
TWO PAGES OVER, ALL OF THESE ARE NUMB NUMBERED AS WELL.
NUMBER 3, IS THERE A MINIMUM NUMBER OF PARTICIPANTS TO
QUALIFY AS AN ACCEPTABLE OUTREACH AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE
PRESENTATION PRESENTED? THEY HAVE PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT ON MAY
9th AND MAY 16th, WITH APPROXIMATELY 30 TO 40 PEOPLE
AND 1292 RESPONSES.
WHAT WILL BE -- WHAT YOU ACCEPT AS PUBLIC PARTICIPATION?
IF THEY HAVE THE PROJECT AND THEY PUT IT OUT IN THESE PAPERS
THAT ARE NOT READ AND CIRCULATIONS THAT ARE NOT READ, AND
THEY ARE ONLY ONE OR TWO PEOPLE ATTEND, WILL YOU ACCEPT
THAT?
I DON'T KNOW WHO WILL BE THE PERSON THAT ACCEPTS IT OR NOT.
BUT WOO WILL BE THE MINIMUM NUMBER OF PARTICIPANTS FOR THE
COMMUNITY OUTREACH?
NUMBER 4, THANK YOU.
THE LEED CERTIFICATIONS, MAKING IT MAY OR SHALL.
JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WITH THE SUPPLY CHAIN ISSUES, AND
ACCESSIBILITY TO THESE TYPES OF MATERIALS AND SUPPLIES,

WONDERING IF STAFF HAS ASCERTAINED IF THE CITY OF TAMPA,
HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, IF DEVELOPERS CAN ACTUALLY MAINTAIN
THAT LEVEL OF LEED CERTIFICATION BASED ON AVAILABILITY.
NUMBER 6 IS ALTERNATIVE TO THE APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAM.
THIS IS FOR EXEMPTIONS.
NUMBER 7, WHO DECIDES THE PROCESS?
THERE MIGHT BE NOT ENOUGH IN TAMPA TO PARTICIPATE BUT MAYBE
AT A LOWER RESPONSIBILITY LEVEL, BECAUSE THINK OF A
COMMUNITY BENEFITS AGREEMENT FOR A NONPROFIT WILL BE GOOD
FOR THE COMMUNITY.
[BELL SOUNDS]
12:32:21PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
30 SECONDS MORE, PLEASE.
12:32:23PM >> OKAY.
THE CBAC, WHAT ARE THE RESPONSIBILITIES OTHER THAN ON
SECTION 4 FOR THE STANDING MEMBERS, AND ALSO FOR THE AD HOC
MEMBERS?
IF WE ARE WILL GO AT EAST TAMPA CRA, AND THESE PROJECTS ARE
WITHIN ONE MILE, WILL THOSE AD HOC MEMBERS BE ABLE TO GET
SOME TYPE OF TRAINING OR INFORMATION TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY
ARE BEING ABLE TO REPRESENT THEIR COMMUNITY IN A DEVELOPMENT
PROJECT?
WE HAVE NOT HA HAD A DEVELOPMENT IN EAST TAMPA.
WE HAVE INCREDIBLE OPPORTUNITIES ABOUT TO HAPPEN.
WILL THEY BE PROVIDED SOME TYPE OF INFORMATION TO MAKE SURE
THAT THEY CAN ACTIVELY PARTICIPATE?

AND ONE LAST ONE ON EXHIBIT A, AS THE EAST TAMPA CRA TO
ATTRACT SIGNIFICANT AND DEVELOPMENTS, THE COST OF FINANCING
IS OFTEN A CHALLENGE.
IF THE TIERS CAN BE MAYBE HAVE SOME FLEXIBILITY IN THE CRA
AREAS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE AREAS -- WE ARE TRYING TO HAVE
THE SMALLER AFRICAN AMERICAN DEVELOPERS TO BE ABLE TO
DEVELOP OUR COMMUNITIES, AND COULD THOSE TIERS -- AGAIN, I
APPRECIATE THE TIERS. I THINK THE TIERS NEED TO BE THERE.
BUT MAYBE ALLOW FOR WHOEVER MAKES THESE DECISIONS TO HAVE
THOSE TIERS HAVE SOME FLEXIBILITY TO ALLOW SOME MINORITY
DEVELOPERS TO BE ABLE TO DEVELOP IN OUR COMMUNITY.
12:33:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
MS. POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE?
MS. POYNOR?
MS. BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE?
12:33:53PM >> HERE.
I'M HERE.
CAN YOU HEAR ME?
12:33:57PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. POYNOR.
12:33:59PM >> YES, SIR.
MY CONCERN IS, YOU ARE SITTING ON A BOARD OF SIX.
12:34:07PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SEVEN.
12:34:07PM >> TWO AND THEN FOUR, RIGHT?
12:34:14PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SEVEN.
12:34:15PM >> NEVER MIND, OKAY.

THE OTHER THING IS, WHERE IN THE WORLD ARE YOU GOING TO FIND
THE TWO PEOPLE?
THEY ARE GOING TO BE STAYING ON COUNCIL ALL THE TIME.
I THINK EVERYBODY IN THAT ROOM KNOWS, YOU COULD PROBABLY
HAVE NO MORE THAN THAT ARE IN THAT ROOM RIGHT NOW THAT ARE
CAPABLE OF SITTING ON THAT BOARD WHO ARE NOT ALREADY IN THE
DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY THAT WOULD BE TRUSTED BY THE
NEIGHBORHOOD.
SO WE HAVE GOT TO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION.
I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S NECESSARILY A GREAT THING TO EXPAND
IT.
A SMALLER GROUP CAN GET MORE DONE, IF THERE'S SEVEN.
OKAY.
BUT I THINK YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE A LOT OF THE TIME PLACING
THOSE PEOPLE WITH THE MAYOR AND CITY COUNCIL THAN ANYTHING,
BECAUSE THERE'S JUST NOT ENOUGH WHO REALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT
HAS HAPPENED, AND WE HAVE SEEN THIS EVEN RECENTLY, AND
ALISON AND I WERE IN A MEETING LAST WEEK AND SOMEBODY GOT ON
A TANGENT WITH THE DEVELOPER AND SAID THAT'S GOING AWAY, WE
DON'T NEED TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
SO I AM IN AGREEMENT WITH ALISON THAT WE MUST HAVE TRAINING
FOR THIS BOARD, AS YOU PROBABLY DO VIDEOS, AND PEOPLE SHOULD
BE REQUIRED TO WATCH IT, AND THINGS LINING THAT.
BUT MY BIGGEST CONCERN IS FINDING SOMEBODY OUTSIDE THE
DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY TO SERVE ON THAT BOARD.

THANK YOU.
12:35:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU, MS. BENNETT.
ARE YOU THERE?
12:35:53PM >> I'M SORRY.
I DON'T HAVE A COMMENT.
SO THANK YOU FOR ASKING.
12:35:56PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THIS IS 15, CORRECT?
OKAY.
THANK YOU, MRS. BENNETT.
ANY OTHER PERSON WISHING TO SPEAK TO THIS IN CHAMBERS?
THANK YOU.
WHAT'S THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL?
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
12:36:12PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
AGAIN, GREAT JOB OF WAITING INFORM THIS
AND FINALLY GOT IT DONE FOR US.
THERE ARE A FEW THINGS, AND YOU HEARD THEM ALL.
I THINK MS. HEWITT HAS SOME GREAT POINTS.
MR. ROBINSON, HOW DO WE MAKE SURE WE HAVE COPIES OF THAT
COMMUNITY? I DON'T WANT OUTSIDE PEOPLE THAT MAKE AN OPINION
ABOUT THAT, THEY DON'T LIVE THERE, THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND
THAT, BUT I DON'T PUT ANYBODY ON ANY BOARD WHO DON'T KNOW
THE SUBJECT MATTER.
SO I THINK IT'S -- WHEN YOU HAVE PEOPLE THAT DO KNOW THE
COMMUNITY, THEY DO KNOW DEVELOPMENT, THE IMPACTS, AND NOT
JUST PUT PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM 90 YEARS ON A BOARD THAT PEOPLE

DON'T KNOW, AND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT ECONOMIC IMPACT, PUT
PEOPLE ON A BOARD THAT KNOW THE SUBJECT MATTER.
I LOVE THE VOLUNTEERS, AND THEY SERVE ON CERTAIN BOARDS.
ON CERTAIN BOARDS YOU HAVE TO HAVE PEOPLE THAT KNOW THE
SUBJECT MATTER TO MAKE THINGS RUN.
SO AGAIN, IN MY MIND, YOU HAVE GOT TO HAVE PEOPLE FROM THAT
COMMUNITY.
12:37:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
12:37:40PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THE ONLY THING I REQUEST IN COMING FORWARD
IS THAT YOU ADJUST MS. HEWITT'S QUESTIONS WHICH I THOUGHT
WERE REALLY GOOD, AND BETWEEN THE CRA VERSUS THIS UMBRELLA
ORGANIZATION AND HOW WE BALANCE ALL OF THAT OUT.
, ABOUT THE DIFFICULTY OF FINDING APPROPRIATE PEOPLE TO
SERVE ON THESE BOARDS.
12:38:05PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WHAT ACTION SHOULD THIS COUNCIL TAKE?
WHAT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL?
12:38:16PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
CAN WE LISTEN TO 13?
THE MAN HAS TO BE IN TALLAHASSEE.
12:38:19PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
COULD WE HAVE SOME ACTION ON THIS ONE FIRST?
12:38:25PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
MAY I INQUIRE?
HOW MUCH TIME DOES COUNCIL WISH TO HAVE TO LOOK AT IT AND
REVIEW IT BEFORE IT COMES BACK?
THEY HAVE TALKED ABOUT NOVEMBER.
I WONDER IF THAT'S SUFFICIENT TIME FOR COUNCIL TO DO THAT.

I WOULD LIKE MR. GUDES TO CONSIDER THE NEW BUSINESS ITEM.
12:38:40PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS DECEMBER SOON ENOUGH?
HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE?
WE ARE GOOD.
HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE?
12:38:54PM >> WE WOULD LIKE TO SET IT FOR NOVEMBER 17th AND THAT
WAY WE CAN MAKE THE APPROPRIATE CHANGES, MR. CHAIR.
12:39:00PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
NOVEMBER 17th.
12:39:04PM >> THAT WILL BE FOR FIRST READING, MR. CHAIR.
12:39:08PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
FOR FIRST READING.
MOTION BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
IS THERE ANY OPPOSED?
THANK YOU.
WITHOUT OBJECTION, WE WILL HEAR 13.
WITHOUT OBJECTION?
THANK YOU.
12:39:33PM >>SAL RUGGIERO:
DEPUTY ADMINISTRATOR, WE ARE ON ITEM NUMBER
13.
WE HAVE A VIDEO THAT WE WANT TO PLAY THAT GIVES AN OVERALL
VIEW OF WHAT WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT TODAY.
AND THEN WE WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE MOTION.
AND THEN WE HAVE EXPERTS HERE FOR THE TEAM FOR QUESTIONS.

SO I KNOW MOST OF YOU DID A TOUR OF THE FACILITY.
THIS WILL BE LIKE A REFRESHER BUT SHOW THE PUBLIC EXACTLY
WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.
SO WITHOUT ANY FURTHER ADO, CTTV, PLEASE PLAY THAT VIDEO.
12:40:33PM >> THIS IS THE MACKAY BAY WASTE TO ENERGY FACILITY, A SOLID
WASTE MANAGEMENT, IT PROVIDES A RELIABLE, MORE
ENVIRONMENTALLY CONSCIOUS METHOD OF MANAGING RACE.
WASTE TO ENERGY PROCESS TAKES NONHAZARDOUS WASTES AND
COMBUSTS IT TO ELECTRICITY.
EACH DAY, MACKAY BAY CONVERTS MORE THAN 2 MILLION POUNDS OF
HOUSEHOLD AND COMMERCIAL WASTE INTO ELECTRICAL ENERGY,
ENOUGH TO POWER APPROXIMATELY 15,000 HOMES MONTHLY.
THE ASH LEFT OVER IS THEN PROCESSED TO RECOVER METAL FOR
RECYCLING.
NOW ALL GASES ARE PUT THROUGH A MULTI-STEP POLLUTION CONTROL
SYSTEM.
MAINTAINING A FACILITY CAN LEAD TO BE EXCEED INDUSTRY
STANDARDS WILL KEEP THE FACILITY FUNCTIONING FOR GENERATIONS
TO COME AND HELP US INVEST IN A BRIGHTER FUTURE FOR OUR
CITY.
INVESTING IN OUR FUTURE MEANS INVESTING IN THE FACILITY.
OVERALL, 12 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS ARE NEEDED TO
MAINTAIN OUR WASTE TO ENERGY FACILITY.
HERE IS A CLOSER LOOK AT FIVE OF THEM.
THE ASH SCALPER BUILDING REQUIRES MAJOR REPAIRS.

THIS BUILDING IS FOR ASH AND EQUIPMENT ARE STORED LOCATED
AND CONTAINED, AND IS REQUIRED FOR SAFE OPERATIONS OF THE
FACILITY.
AFTER MORE THAN 30 YEARS OF USE, THIS BUILDING IS IN DIRE
NEED OF REFURBISHMENT TO AVOID ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT, SAFETY
HAZARDS, AND TO STAY WITHIN THE REGULATIONS OF THE
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY.
THESE COOLING TOWERS ARE USED TO COOL DOWN THE STEAM USED
FOR ELECTRICITY GENERATION.
ONCE COOL, WATER IS THEN RECIRCULATED THROUGH THE SYSTEM TO
BEGIN THE PROCESS AGAIN.
THESE COOLING TOWERS ARE ORIGINAL TO THE FACILITY, AND AFTER
37 YEARS, THE SUPPORT STRUCTURE IS IN JEOPARDY OF FAILURE IF
NOT REMEDIED SOON.
IF A FAILURE OCCURS, IT WOULD BE CATASTROPHIC TO FACILITY
OPERATIONS.
THE UPGRADES NEEDED INCLUDE THE REPLACEMENT OF THE STRUCTURE
FOR THE COOLING TOWERS, THE FIRE RESISTANT DECK AND THE
REPLACEMENT OF CORRODING PIPES ARE NEEDED.
WASTE COMBUSTION NEVER STOPS AT MacKAY BAY WHICH MEANS THE
TURBINE GENERATOR OPERATES AROUND THE CLOCK, PRESSURIZED
STEAM FROM COMBUSTION, PUSHES FAN BLADES TO TURN THE TURBINE
AT SPEEDS OF 3600 REVOLUTIONS PER MINUTE.
THE RECOMMENDED LIFE SPAN OF A TURBINE GENERATOR IS FIVE TO
SEVEN YEARS.

AFTER NINE YEARS OF USE, THIS EQUIPMENT NEEDS A COMPLETE
OVERHAUL.
WITHOUT THE TURBINE, ELECTRICITY CANNOT BE GENERATED.
TO CONTINUE GENERATING ELECTRICAL ENERGY EFFICIENTLY, A NEW
TRANSFORMER IS ALSO REQUIRED.
THE MAIN TRANSFORMER SHOWN HERE STEPS UP THE VOLTAGE
PRODUCED BY THE GENERATOR, THAT SUPPLIES POURER TO THE CITY
OF TAMPA.
THESE CRANES ARE ORIGINAL THROUGHOUT THE FACILITY AND HAVE
BEEN IN USE SINCE THE OPENING IN 1984.
TO KEEP THE COMBUSTION PROCESS GOING, THESE CRANES MUST
CONTINUALLY FEED WASTE FROM THE STORAGE PIT TO THE BOILERS.
THEY CAN GRAB UP TO 5,000 POUNDS OF WASTE AND ENDURE USE
24/7.
MAINTENANCE AND UPKEEP OF THE CRANES ARE CHALLENGING AND
COSTLY, ESPECIALLY AS REQUIRED PARTS BECOME OBSOLETE.
BOTH CRANES NEED REPLACEMENT.
OTHER CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS FOR MacKAY BAY WASTE TO
ENERGY FACILITY INCLUDE UPGRADES TO THE SOFTWARE AND
HARDWARE USED TO OPERATE AND CONTROL THE FACILITY, AS WELL
AS REPLACEMENT AND REPAIR OF STACK, BUMPER, BURNER AND
EXPELLER.
WITHOUT THESE MAJOR IMPROVEMENTS, THE CITY OF TAMPA WILL NOT
BE ABLE TO PROCESS THE THOUSANDS OF POUNDS OF WASTE THAT
CITY RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES GENERATE DAILY.

A STEP IN THE WRONG DIRECTION TOWARDS TRANSFORMING TAMPA'S
TOMORROW.
WITHOUT THIS FACILITY, OUR WASTE WOULD NEED TO BE SENT TO A
LANDFILL OR TRANSPORTED TO A SURROUNDING COUNTY'S WASTE TO
ENERGY FACILITY.
FINALLY, LAND IS NOT AVAILABLE WITHIN THE CITY OF TAMPA
LIMITS FOR LANDFILL.
ACCORDING TO THE ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY, THIS IS
THE LEAST PREFERRED METHOD TO DISPOSE OF WASTE.
THIS PROCESS REQUIRES WASTE TO BE BURIED AND OVER TIME
BACTERIA WILL BREAK DOWN, GENERATING METHANE AND CARBON
DIOXIDE.
THESE GREENHOUSE GASES ARE 84 TIMES MORE POTENT AS A CLIMATE
CHANGING GAS THAN CO2.
TRANSPORTING AND PROCESSING CITY OF TAMPA'S WASTE TO
SURROUNDING COUNTY WASTE FACILITIES IS NOT AN EFFECTIVE OR
EFFICIENT METHOD OF DISPOSAL.
THIS PROCESS WOULD GREATLY INCREASE OUR COSTS AND DECREASE
OUR VEHICLE LIFE SPAN AS WELL AS HARM THE OVERALL OPERATIONS
OF THE CITY OF TAMPA SOLID WASTE AND ENVIRONMENTAL PROGRAM
MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT.
IN THE EVENT OF AN EMERGENCY, NEARBY WASTE PROCESSING AND
MANAGEMENT SITES ARE WILLING TO COME TO THE RESCUE OF CITY
OF TAMPA, BUT ARE UNABLE TO DO SO FOR A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT
OF TIME.

BY USE ALTERNATIVE SITES, THE CITY OF TAMPA WOULD PUT
OPERATIONS OF OTHER MUNICIPALITIES AT RISK AND LOWER THE
LIFE EXPECTANCY OF THEIR FACILITIES, A COST THEY AREN'T
WILLING TO PAY.
INVESTING IN THE MACKAY BAY WASTE TO ENERGY FACILITY IS
INVESTIGATION IN THE HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE OF THE CITY
OF TAMPA AND ITS FUTURE.
12:46:21PM >> THANK YOU FOR THAT VIDEO, COUNCIL.
I WANT TO MAKE A FEW BRIEF COMMENTS.
I KNOW YOUR TIME MANAGEMENT IMPORTANT.
AND THEN WE'LL HAVE WHATEVER QUESTIONS YOU WOULD LIKE
ANSWERED.
WE HAVE SOME CITY AND OUTSIDE FOLKS HERE.
JUST A QUICK REMINDER OF SOMEONE YOU SOMETHING LAST WEEK BY
THE COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF OF STAFF.
WHEN WE START TO GET INTO A FLOW OF DOING THESE UPDATES FOR
YOU ON A SEMIANNUAL BASIS, WE WILL BE FOLLOWING WHAT THE
STAFF MENTIONED.
WE HAVE BEEN DOING THIS ALL ALONG.
IT'S JUST IN A LITTLE MORE ORGANIZED FASHION, AND SO JUST
WANTED TO REITERATE, THAT IS GOING TO BE OUR CONSISTENT
FORMAT GOING FORWARD.
SO JUST BRIEFLY AGAIN, I WANT TO MAKE A FEW COMMENTS ABOUT
THE MOTION TODAY.
WE HAVE A FRAMEWORK, AND THAT IS OUR 2040 COMPREHENSIVE

PLAN, AND IT'S ACTUALLY VERY IMPRESS WIFE BECAUSE IT GIVES
US A CHANCE TO LOOK AT IT, STARTS ON PAGE 219, BY THE WAY.
AND ALL THE ELEMENTS THAT COVER THE CITY'S MISSION AND
SERVICES.
THE PLAN ALSO OUTLINES OUR GOALS, OUR OBJECTIVES AND POLICY
FOR WASTE MANAGEMENT IN THE CONTEXT OF THE LARGER CITY
VISION.
JUST WANT TO MENTION A COUPLE OF GOALS THAT ARE MENTIONED IN
THIS PLAN.
GOAL ONE, PROVIDE A LONG-TERM COST EFFECTIVE INTEGRATED
SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT SYSTEM DESIGNED TO PROVIDE A SAFE AND
EFFICIENT SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL FOR THE CITY'S
DESIGNATED SERVICE AREA.
JUST ONE KEY GOAL, GOAL NUMBER TWO, REDUCE THE VOLUME OF
SOLID WASTE SENT TO THE LANDFILL IN ORDER TO MAINTAIN PUBLIC
HEALTH, QUALITY, AND LAND USE COMPATIBILITY.
AND WITH THAT, ONE OF THE OTHER OBJECTIVES THAT I WILL
MENTION, MAINTAIN, MONITOR AND MAXIMIZE THE USE OF
FACILITIES AND EQUIPMENT TO ENSURE ADEQUATE PROVISION OF
SOLID WASTE SERVICES.
SO YOU CAN SEE FROM THE VIDEO FROM OUR POLICIES OF OUR COMP
PLAN COMMITTED TO THIS PLAN, WE ARE COMMITTED TO THE
ENVIRONMENTAL BENEFITS IT PROVIDES, WE ARE COMMITTED TO
RECEIVING THE REVENUE AND REDUCING OUR COSTS FOR WASTE
MANAGEMENT.

I ALSO WANT TO MENTION THAT UNDER THE FRAMEWORK OF THAT
BIGGER COMP PLAN, WE HAVE THE FIVE-YEAR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT
PROGRAM.
IN FACT, APPROVED BY CITY COUNCIL A COUPLE WEEKS AGO.
ANOTHER LAYER OF PLANNING OVER THAT PLAN IS A MORE FLUENT
TEN-YEAR CIP PROJECTION.
SO WE HAVE THE REHABILITATION, WE HAVE THE PRO TECH TOUGH
NEEDS AND COSTS, THEN WE HAVE THE FRAMEWORK OF THE POLICY
AND GOALS AND OBJECTIVES THAT WE ARE FOLLOWING IN TERMS OF
THIS ASSET AND EVERY OTHER ASSET WE HAVE FOR ALL OF OUR
OTHER DEPARTMENTS.
SO I FEEL WE HAVE GREAT PLANNING STRUCTURE, PLANNING
DECISION MAKING OPPORTUNITY.
I WILL MENTION SOME OF THE COMPONENTS THAT NEED TO BE
UPGRADED.
SOME OF YOU WERE ABLE TO JOIN US ON A TOUR AND SAW FIRSTHAND
SOME OF THE NEEDS THAT WE HAVE.
SO WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO MAKING THOSE IMPROVEMENTS WITH
THE RECENT CONTRACT THAT WAS ISSUED WITH CPPI INCORPORATE.
SO WITH THAT, I WILL JUST PAUSE HERE AND GIVE YOU A CHANCE
TO ASK SOME QUESTIONS. I WANTED TO BE BRIEF CONSIDERING THE
TIME.
AND WE ARE HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE.
12:49:49PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
12:49:51PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THAT WAS A VERY SOOTHING AND INFORMATIVE VIDEO.
BUT I WILL SAY, I APPRECIATE CHUCK AND EVERYBODY ELSE FOR
GIVING ME AND OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS THE TOUR OF THE ENTIRE
FACILITY.
IT'S ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING.
I KNOW TRASH ISN'T GLAMOROUS, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW A
CITY NEEDS TO BE RUN AND MANAGED, THIS IS ABSOLUTELY
CRITICAL.
WE OFTEN SAY THERE ARE WANTS AND NEEDS, AND THIS IS A NEED
AND NECESSITY BECAUSE IF WE HAVE A TURBINE FAILURE, ANY KIND
OF FAILURE, WE TALK ABOUT 30 YEARS, AND THEN I HEARD ABOUT
EQUIPMENT FROM 1984.
WAUGH THROUGH THAT BUILDING AN THERE ARE PLAQUES ON THE WALL
FROM 1967 AND ALL THE FACILITIES THAT NO LONGER EXIST BUT WE
HAVE DOING THIS FOR OVER HALF A CENTURY. IF THERE IS A
MAJOR DISRUPTION IN SERVICE, NOT ONLY DO WE LOSE REVENUE
FROM THE ENERGY ASPECT OF IT, BUT I DON'T WANT TO IMAGINE
WHAT WOULD HAPPEN TO OUR CITY WHEN WE HAVE THESE SERVICES
COME TO BASICALLY A HALT, AND WE HAVE TO OUTSOURCE AND USE
OTHER MUNICIPALITIES SERVICES.
WHICH ARE GOING TO BE VERY INTENSIVE. IT'S GOING TO CAUSE A
TREMENDOUS BACKLOG.
WE ARE GOING TO HAVE PEOPLE HERE WITH PITCHFORKS BECAUSE
AGAIN TRASH PICKUP AND MANAGEMENT, SOLID WASTE PICKUP AND
MANAGEMENT ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL.

WHEN WE LOOK AT THESE KIND OF INVESTMENTS, AND LOOKING OUT
DECADES, WE HAVE THE -- WE REACHED THE 30-YEAR LIFE SPAN
NOW, AND WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO THE FUTURE BUT THIS IS
SOMETHING THAT'S AN ABSOLUTE NECESSITY.
AGAIN, AFTER TAKING A TOUR OF THE FACILITY, IT'S VERY EYE
OPENING.
YOU SEE WHAT NEEDS MAINTENANCE, YOU SEE PATCHWORK.
WE DO OUR BEST TO KEEP THINGS GOING WITHOUT SPENDING HUGE
AMOUNTS OF MONEY BUT I THINK WE REACHED A POINT WHERE THE
NEED TO MAKE AFTERNOON INVESTMENT IN THE FUTURE IS NOW AND
IT'S ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL AND NECESSARY.
12:51:59PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
12:52:02PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I AM GOING TO ECHO WHAT COUNCILMAN
MANISCALCO SAID SO ELOQUENTLY. IF YOU SEE IT, IT'S 100%
NEEDED.
BUT OVERALL, INCLUDED IN THIS, OR MAYBE EVEN A LITTLE BIT
SEPARATE, IS A DISCUSSION OF HOW MUCH TRASH THIS
MUNICIPALITY CREATES.
TO GO ALONG WITH THIS, AND WITH THE LITTER PICKUP PROGRAM,
HOW DO YOU DECREASE THE AMOUNT OF TRASH THAT'S COMING IN
FROM RESIDENTS?
AND JUST HOW DO WE INCENTIVIZE THAT?
I HAVE TALKED TO PROBABLY EACH OF YOU AD NAUSEAM ABOUT MY
PERSONAL OPINIONS BECAUSE I FEEL VERY STRONGLY ABOUT IT, BUT
ALSO THE IDEA OF IF WE CREATE LESS TRASH OURSELVES, THEN WE

HAVE MORE SPACE TO CHARGE MORE PEOPLE COMING FROM OUTSIDE
THE CITY AND CREATING MORE REVENUE.
SO THAT'S MY OTHER POINT, IS WE CAN ACTUALLY INCREASE THE
REVENUE IF WE DECREASE THE AMOUNT OF TRASH THAT WE PRODUCE.
WHICH SOUND COUNTERINTUITIVE BUT I THINK IT WOULD BE
AWESOME, AND AGAIN, TO CONTINUE THAT TRASH -- THANK YOU.
12:53:18PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I THINK WE OUGHT TO CONTINUE THIS.
ALL OF THIS DISCUSSION DOESN'T ANSWER THE QUESTION OF THE
MOTION THAT WAS MADE IN THE ITEM THAT WAS PUT ON THERE.
THIS ITEM WAS ABOUT THE 30-YEAR PLAN AND POLICIES OF THE
INCINERATOR, NOT WHETHER WE SHOULD HAVE THE INCINERATOR OR
NOT.
I HAVE NOT YET HAD A CHANCE TO PERSONALLY TOUR THE
INCINERATOR BUT I AM GOING TO, IF I CAN, BECAUSE I AM
FASCINATED IT WITH.
AND I HAVE NEVER BEEN AGAINST THE INCINERATOR.
MY PROBLEM IS WHEN WE HAD STAFF BEFORE US TALKING ABOUT THE
265 MILLION THAT WAS THE FIVE-YEAR PLAN, AND I ASKED VERY
BASIC QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT'S THE 30-YEAR PLAN?
AND THE VIDEO IS INTERESTING FOR THE PUBLIC TO BE ABLE TO
SEE WHAT'S GOING ON, BUT THERE WERE SEVERAL PROJECTS THAT
WERE HINTED AT IN THE VIDEO THAT I AM NOT SURE WE ARE UNDER
THE 265 MILLION, AND THE QUESTION WAS, WHAT'S THE 30-YEAR
PLAN?
AND I CONSIDER FOR THE CAN SITE HERE FOR THE NEXT 30, 45

MINUTES AND ASK QUESTIONS, BUT I WOULD RATHER RESCHEDULE
THIS, AND IT'S NOT ABOUT JUST GIVING US DOCUMENTS AND HAVING
US READ IT EITHER.
IT'S ABOUT THE PUBLIC UNDERSTANDING IT.
AND THE VIDEO IT WAS REFERRED TO THAT IT'S MORE MONEY AND IT
WOULD BE WASTEFUL TO GO TO A LANDFILL.
I TALK TO ENVIRONMENTALISTS.
IF WE ARE GOING TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION, THEN LET'S DO IT
WITH DATA TO SHOW US WHAT THE ACTUAL COST DIFFERENCE IS.
THAT'S THE THING. I WAS NOT ASKING THE QUESTION SO WE COULD
ARGUE THAT WE SEND TRUCKS UP TO PASCO COUNTY.
I WAS ASKING THE QUESTION SO WE COULD SHOW THE PUBLIC THIS
IS A BETTER DECISION.
AND ON THE 30 YEAR PLAN IF THIS THING IS GOING TO COST $265
MILLION FOR FIVE YEARS AND IF THAT'S PRIMARILY PAYING FOR
TURBINES, WHAT ABOUT ALL THE OTHER THINGS THAT ARE THERE?
IT SOUNDS LIKE THE WHOLE THING NEEDS TO BE PRETTY MUCH
REBUILT BECAUSE IT'S 37 YEARS OLD OR WHATEVER.
I JUST WANT TO KNOW WHAT THE NUMBERS ARE.
THAT'S THE SIMPLE QUESTION.
WHAT'S THE 30-YEAR PLAN?
YOU PRESENTED GOALS LAST TIME, I ASKED ABOUT GOALS, AND
NOBODY HAD ANY THAT THEY COULD TALK ABOUT, SO AT LEAST WE
GOT THAT.
BUT THERE SHOULD BE A LIST OF ALL THE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE

REPLACED OVER A 30-YEAR PERIOD, AND AT LEAST A ROUGH
ESTIMATE OF HOW THAT'S GOING TO BE. TEN YEARS IS JUST NOT
ENOUGH BECAUSE IT'S NOT A FULL PROJECT.
I CAN ASK SOME OF THOSE QUESTIONS NOW BUT WE ARE RUNNING OUT
OF TIME.
I WOULD RATHER CONTINUE THIS UNTIL JANUARY 26th
WORKSHOP.
AND I WOULD ASK MS. DUNCAN TO HAVE A LONGER CONVERSATION
ABOUT PRESENTING THIS IMPORTANT INFORMATION TO THE PUBLIC.
12:55:46PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
12:55:49PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT GOVERNMENT OR YOU LOOK AT A PRIVATE
ENTERPRISE, THEY BOTH HAVE THE SAME STRUCTURE IN A WAY.
WHEN YOU LEASE A CAR OR BUY A CAR, WHAT HAPPENS?
YOU BUY A CAR.
YOU HAVE IT FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME.
YOU LEASE A CAR, USUALLY YOU LEASE IT FOR A YEAR.
AT THE END OF 20 YEARS YOU HAVE LEASED 20 CARS AND YOU STILL
DON'T OWN THE CAR.
AND YOU HAVE GOT TO PROVIDE THE INSURANCE AND SO FORTH AND
SO ON.
WHEN YOU BUY A CAR, IT'S YOURS.
IT USED TO BE, WHEN I WAS A TEENAGER, 18 MONTHS AND THEN IT
WENT TO 24 MONTHS AND THEN WENT TO FIVE YEARS.
NOW YOU BUY A CAR IT GOES TO EIGHT YEARS BECAUSE THEY HAVE

BECOME SO EXPENSIVE SOMETIMES.
SO I'M A FIRM BELIEVER IN OWNING YOUR OWN ASSETS.
I'M A FIRM BELIEVER IN OWNING YOUR OWN ASSETS.
ALL RIGHT.
FIRST OF ALL, YOU CONTROL THE PRICE OF THE COMMODITY.
THAT OPERATION WAS LEASED OUT TO BE WHEELABRATOR, IF I
REMEMBER, YEARS BACK.
SO WHEN WE FIND OUT WHAT THE ITEMS ARE, AND THEY SHOULD BE,
AND COME UP WITH AN OPERATIONAL, AND THEN DO -- AND I
UNDERSTAND THIS IS PART OF THE SOLID WASTE DEPARTMENT, AM I
CORRECT?
SO WE CAN EXTRAPOLATE -- AND I DON'T KNOW WHERE I GOT THE
WORD EXTRAPOLATE BECAUSE I'M A CUBAN -- BUT WHEN YOU TAKE IT
OUT OF THE SOLID WASTE DIVISION, YOU CAN TELL BY THE
ACCOUNTING OPERATION WHAT IT GENERATES AND WHAT IT COSTS TO
GENERATE.
IN OTHER WORDS, ALL OF THE EMPLOYEES, ALL OF THE BENEFITS.
BUT WHEN YOU PUT THAT NUMBER ASIDE, AND YOU COMPARE IT WHERE
I AM NOT GOING, IS TO RELEASE TO THE ANOTHER COMPANY SO THEY
CAN MAKE MILLIONS OFF THE TAXPAYERS' BACK, I AM NOT GOING TO
GO FOR THAT.
I'LL TELL YOU RIGHT NOW.
SO I DON'T NOT ABOUT THE OTHER SIX BUT THIS CUBAN AIN'T
GOING FOR THAT.
PERIOD.

SO WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHEN WE TOOK THE OATH OF OFFICE TO
DO WHAT WE CAN TO MAKE IT THE BETTER PLACE.
AND I WANT TO SEE THIS THING WHETHER IT'S TODAY OR TOMORROW
OR NEXT WEEK, BUT I DON'T WANT TO GO ANOTHER YEAR, TALKING
ABOUT SOMETHING THAT EVERY DAY I AM TAKING A RISK.
DID WE KNOW IT WAS THERE?
YES.
THERE ARE OTHER NEEDS YOU HAD TO FIND IN THE CITY.
AND THE NEEDS ARE GOING TO GET TIGHTER AFTER 2026.
AND YOU THE WON'T HAVE THE CIP TAXES TO GIVE MILLIONS AWAY
TO A CERTAIN ENTITY.
I AM NOT GOING TO MENTION THE ENTITY.
EVERY TIME YOU HAVE AN EVENT THERE IT COSTS $250,000.
NOBODY GIVES A DAMN BECAUSE IT'S A GLAMOROUS THING.
THIS IS NOT GLAMOROUS BUT IT'S MORE IMPORTANT THAN ANYTHING
WE ARE GOING TO DO TO MAKE THE CITY WHOLE, THE PROJECT AND
THE PIPES.
NOW YOU HAVE THINGS FOR THE FUTURE FOR THE NEXT GENERATION
TO HAVE THE ABILITY FOR THIS CITY TO FUNCTION, TO BE
RECOGNIZED AS ONE OF THE BEST CITIES IN AMERICA.
ALTHOUGH I HEARD WE DON'T HAVE THIS, THAT AND THE OTHER, I
SAW SOMETHING ON TV WHERE I THINK TAMPA IS RANKED TOP 3 OR 4
IN RELOCATION OF TECH COMPANIES, AND I WANT TO VERIFY THAT
BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO SAY SEWING THAT'S NOT FACTUAL.
BUT THESE ARE THE THINGS I SEE AND NEED, THAT IF YOU TAKE

CARE OF YOURSELF, YOU TAKE CARE OF THE CITY.
IN OTHER WORDS, YOU ARE A HOMEOWNER, YOU DO WELL, THE CITY
DOES WELL.
WITHOUT HOMEOWNERS, WITHOUT THE PARTICIPATION OF CITIZENS,
WE CANNOT DO ANYTHING BECAUSE THOSE ARE THE CITIZENS THAT WE
REPRESENT THAT HAVE TO BURDEN THE COST.
BUT IN BURDENING THESE COSTS, IT ALSO RETURNS A REWARD
THROUGH SOLID WASTE.
AND IN 2026, YOU GIVE THE CIP TAX, AND WHAT'S GOING TO
HAPPEN IS THIS.
COINCIDENTALLY, THAT'S WHEN ANOTHER SPORTS TEAM FROM ACROSS
THE BAY WANTS TO COME TO TAMPA.
DOWNTOWN HEAR NOTHING MOVING, WHAT'S OUT BECAUSE THE STORM
IS COMING.
WE CAN'T EVEN FIND IT ON THE RADAR SCREEN.
BUT THIS IS ANOTHER ITEM, WE NEED TO BRING IN A BASEBALL
TEAM?
DON'T GO THERE BECAUSE WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN IS YOU WON'T
HAVE MONEY TO EAT.
THEY'LL TAKE IT ALL.
LIKE THE CRA.
LIKE DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS.
AND DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS ARE MET, COSTS THEM A DOLLAR FOR THE
NEXT 30 YEARS, IT'S ALL THERE.
THEY ARE GOING TO PAY FOR THE PROJECT WITH YOUR MONEY.

THEY ARE GOING TO PAY AND YOU PAY THE OTHER HALF.
IT'S ZERO.
WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THE CITY'S DEPARTMENT NEEDS.
AND AFTER 2046 THERE IS NO MORE CIP TAX.
AND THAT'S USED MAINLY FOR REPLACEMENT OF EQUIPMENT.
AUTOMOBILES, TRUCKS, THINGS OF THAT NATURE, FIRE ENGINES,
AND SO FORTH.
SO WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, WE HAVE TO FACE IT.
JUST LIKE WE FACE EVERYTHING ELSE.
YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF WHAT YOU HAVE.
YOU CANNOT LET IT GO PAST ANOTHER YEAR.
IF ONE OF THOSE TURBINES GO OR ANY OTHER PART OF THOSE GO,
IT TAKES ABOUT A YEAR TO GET AN ORDER TO GET IT DELIVERED
AND SO FORTH.
YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE A PROBLEM.
I AM NOT TRYING TO SCARE ANYONE.
I'M JUST TELLING YOU WHAT THE FACTS ARE.
WE HAVE TO BE VIGILANT OF THE FACT THAT WE HAVE TO PAY ON A
DAILY BASIS.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
1:01:29PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
1:01:31PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW GOVERNMENT
OPERATES.
I JUST WANT TO KNOW.
THE COUNCILMAN HAS ASKED FOR CERTAIN DOCUMENTS.

ALWAYS SAY IF I KNOW THE FACTS AND I HAVE THE INFORMATION, I
CAN DECIDE.
RIGHT WHAT WAY.
WHAT IS IT GOING TO COST?
30 YEARS.
AND YOU SEE SOMETHING TO THE NAKED EYE, YOU GET A CLEAR
UNDERSTANDING WHERE YOU HAVE GOT TO GO.
I WENT OUT THERE.
BUT I SAW THE GARBAGE.
I LOOKED AT THE AREA.
LOOKED AT A LOT OF EQUIPMENT THAT IS BEING REPLACED.
IT'S A NICE VIDEO, BUT THE PUBLIC -- YOU WANT MONEY BUT THE
PUBLIC IS SEEING THIS STUFF UP FRONT AND CLOSE, AND IF
SOMETHING FAILS OVER THERE, QUEER IN TROUBLE.
THAT MAKES NO SENSE TO ME.
I MEAN, I'M OH ALL FOR DOING WHAT WE NEED TO DO.
AND MR. MIRANDA SAID, OWNING THE ASSET.
IF I OWN THE ASSET, I CAN CONTROL IT.
IF I OWN THE ASSET, I CAN MAKE MONEY OFF MY AS SET.
WHY IN THE WORLD, OTHER THAN MAKING MONEY WHICH THE CITY
DOES ALL THE TIME, LET SOMEBODY ELSE MAKE THE MONEY, AND OUR
GENERAL FUND COUNTS, I JUST SAY, I THINK WE NEED TO GET ALL
THE FACTS, WHETHER IT'S 10 YEARS, 20 YEARS, 30 YEARS, AND
HAVE THIS INFORMATION.
WHAT IS THIS GOING TO COST?

IT'S A NECESSITY.
WE HAVE TO HAVE A PLACE TO BURN THE TRASH, MAYBE IT'S A
SECRET, I DON'T KNOW, BUT THE GARBAGE OUT THERE, PEOPLE WITH
GARBAGE.
THAT'S A NECESSITY, FOLKS.
I JUST SAY GIVE ALL THE FACT, GIVE WHAT WE ASK, AND I AM
SURE YOU ARE GOING TO GET WHAT YOU NEED AND THE PUBLIC CAN
BE AWARE AND I CAN JUSTIFY IT.
THAT'S A MEETING WE HAVE TO HAVE.
THINK ABOUT IT.
THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE TO HAVE.
I AM IN SUPPORT.
JUST BRING IT TO THE PUBLIC.
AS LONG AS YOU HAVE THE PLANS.
1:04:30PM >>BILL CARLSON:
THIS IS AN ISSUE ABOUT TRANSPARENCY AND
SHOWING THE PUBLIC WE ARE BEING GOOD STEWARDS OF THEIR
MONEY.
AND COUNCILMAN MEMBER MIRANDA BROUGHT UP A GREAT ANALOGY
THAT I WILL STEEL, TALKING ABOUT USED CARS OR LEASED CARS.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF THIS WILL BE A GOOD ANALOGY OR NOT BUT
LET'S IMAGINE YOU GO TO A USED CAR DEALER AND YOU SEE A CAR
AND YOU ASK THE DEALER, IS THERE ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT
CAR?
I DON'T KNOW.
WELL, DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA ABOUT REPLACING IT?

I DON'T KNOW.
AND THEN SHOULD YOU DO THAT OR NOT?
SHOULD YOU BUY THAT CAR STILL?
OR YOU GET, AND SINCE WE ARE CUSTODIANS OF OTHER PEOPLE'S
MONEY, NOT OUR OWN, WE WOULD GET A MECHANIC TO GO THERE AND
LOOK AT THE CAR AND THEN THE MECHANIC WOULD SAY, YOU HAVE
GOT 20,000 MAILS LEFT ON THAT TRANSMISSION, AND IN 20,000
MILES IT'S GOING TO COST YOU A THOUSAND DOLLARS OR WHATEVER.
YOU HAVE GOT ANOTHER 20, $30,000 ON THIS PIECE AND 40,000 ON
THIS, AND IT'S GOING TO COST YOU ALL OF THIS AND HERE IS THE
SCHEDULED MAINTENANCE YOU HAVE TO DO OVER TIME.
THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE BEING GOOD FISCAL STEWARDS WOULD DO.
IN THIS CASE, WE TOOK OVER A FACILITY THAT WAS RUN BY
SOMEBODY ELSE, THAT STAFF SAID THAT THEY DIDN'T THINK IT WAS
BEING RUN VERY WELL.
WE ALL AGREED, I THINK I VOTED FOR THAT, WE AGREED A COUPLE
YEARS AGO TO TAKE IT OVER AND WE WERE ALL EXCITED ABOUT
THAT.
WHEN THE STAFF CAME BACK THEY SAID, $265 MILLION FOR THE
TURBINE IN THIS FIRST PHASE, AND I ASKED A BASIC QUESTION,
HOW MUCH IS IT GOING TO COST AFTER THAT?
I DON'T KNOW.
WHEN YOU ASK THE QUESTION, LOOK AT THE VIDEO, WHEN YOU
BOUGHT DID IT YOU DO DUE DILIGENCE? DID YOU GET THE
MECHANIC TO GO LOOK UNDER THE HOOD AND SEE WHAT'S WRONG?

I DON'T KNOW.
DID YOU DETERMINE WHEN YOU BOUGHT 2002 YEARS AGO HOW MUCH IT
WAS GOING TO COST TO FIX IT?
I DON'T KNOW.
AND SO MY CONCERN WAS, HOW ARE WE BEING GOOD STEWARDS OF THE
PUBLIC'S MONEY?
IT'S NOT ABOUT THIS STUFF THAT'S IN THE VIDEO.
ARE WE BEING GOOD CUSTODIANS.
PUBLIC'S MONEY AND WE NEED TO SET EXPECTATIONS ABOUT WHAT TO
DO IN THE FUTURE.
IF IT'S GOING TO BE 5 BILLION DOLLARS, LET'S NOT BE SCARED
OF THE NUMBERS, LET'S JUST GET IT OUT THERE FOR THE PUBLIC
AND FINANCE WE DON'T KNOW WITH 100 PERCENT CERTAINTY THEN
SAY 50% CERTAINTY OR SOMETHING SO WE CAN SET EXPECTATIONS.
MY REQUEST, I MADE A MOTION, TO CONTINUE THIS UNTIL JANUARY
26th.
IF I MAY, AND I WON'T SPEAK NO MORE.
CAN I ASK A QUESTION, DOES ANYBODY KNOW WHAT IT'S GOING TO
COST?
1:07:08PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
WE ARE NOT HERE FOR A VOTE TODAY.
WE HAVE A $17 MILLION CONTRACT ALREADY IN PLACE THAT WE ARE
WORKING ON BUT WE DECIDED TO LOOKING TAKING OVER THIS
FACILITY, A COMPANY DID EXTENSIVE WORK WITH US, TO DO THAT,
ANTICIPATED EXPENDITURE, PLANNING, REVENUE COMPARISONS AND
SO FORTH.

WE HAVE ALL THE DOCUMENTATION THAT LED US TO THE DECISION
FOUR YEARS AGO TO CONTINUE TO BE COMMITTED TO THIS PLANT AND
MAKE THE APPROPRIATE UPGRADE.
OUR INDUSTRY STANDARD DOES NOT CALL FOR A 30-YEAR REVENUE
EQUIPMENT-LEVEL DETAILED PLAN.
OUR INDUSTRY STANDARD IS FOR A FIVE-YEAR CIP AND A TEN-YEAR
PROJECTION.
WE CANNOT AN ADVERTISE ANTICIPATE 30 YEARS THE TECHNOLOGY,
THE COST, THE WORLD DYNAMICS.
IT'S JUST NOT REASONABLE TO HAVE THAT FAR OF A PROJECTION.
WE STAND ON THE POLICIES, WE STAND ON THE PLANNING, WE STAND
ON THE RESEARCH AND THE DATA THAT HAS LED TO US THIS POINT.
WE ATTEMPTED TO SHARE THAT FRAMEWORK AND THOSE POLICIES
TODAY PER THE MOTION.
IT IS NOT A $265 MILLION PROJECT.
SO AGAIN WE HAVE AN APPROVED FIVE-YEAR CIP THAT HAS THE
TRANSFORMER NEXT FIVE YEARS OF COST IN IT.
IT WAS RECENTLY APPROVED.
WE HAVE A TEN YEAR PROJECTION THAT WE USE FOR PLANNING
PURPOSES.
EVERY YEAR WE ADD THE NEW FIFTH YEAR OR NEWER TENTH YEAR AS
WE CONTINUE TO BE LOOK AHEAD OF THE NEED, THE TECHNOLOGY,
THE USE AND ALL THOSE FACTORS SO WE ARE IN A GOOD PLACE WITH
THE PLANNING, WE HAVE ALL THE INTERNAL STAFF LOOKING AT IT
FROM DIFFERENT ANGLES, FINANCE, SUSTAINABILITY, RESILIENCY,

ENGINEERING, EVERYTHING.
AND I THINK THE PUBLIC WILL BE PLEASED TO SEE THE CONTINUED
GOOD SERVICE THAT WE ARE PROVIDING, THE GOOD RETURN ON
INVESTMENT, AND THE GOOD OF BENEFITS THAT COME OUT OF THIS
PLAN.
SO THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME MAKE THOSE COMMENTS.
1:09:06PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
1:09:10PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I CAN ASK QUESTIONS ALL DAY, BUT THERE WAS
A NUMBER THAT WAS PRESENTED TO US FOR FIVE YEARS, AND THEN
YOU SAID THERE'S TEN YEARS, BUT THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS IS
TO LET THE PUBLIC KNOW THE INFORMATION.
AS COUNCILMAN GUDES SAID, WHY CAN'T WE JUST TELL THE PUBLIC
THAT INFORMATION?
AND SO I WOULD ASK AGAIN, MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE THIS TO
JANUARY 26th, AND I WILL HAVE CONVERSATIONS, AS MANY
CONVERSATIONS WITH STAFF --
1:09:37PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
THE FIVE-YEAR CIP IS OUT THERE FOR THE
PUBLIC.
THAT'S A KNOWN COST TODAY.
WITH THOSE ASSETS THAT NEED TO BE UPGRADED.
BEYOND THAT IT'S PROJECTIONS OF ANTICIPATION, WHICH IS MORE
FLUID.
BUT THIS LIKE EVERY OTHER AGENCY, EVERY OTHER DEPARTMENT,
THE SNAPSHOT IN TIME WHICH IS WHAT THIS IS TODAY IS THAT

INFORMATION WHICH IS MADE PUBLIC, AT PUBLIC HEARINGS, AND
THE COUNCIL APPROVAL OF THE --
1:10:04PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I WANT YOU TO SAY THE NUMBER.
AND WE CAN CONTINUE OR WE CAN -- WE CAN CONTINUE THIS OR WE
CAN -- I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND.
THE PUBLIC JUST WANTS TO KNOW.
BUT I WOULD RATHER JUST CONTINUE THIS AND WE CAN HAVE
ANOTHER --
1:10:20PM >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON HAS A MOTION.
DO I HEAR A SECOND?
LET'S BRING THIS IN FOR A LANDING.
1:10:33PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WELL, I WANT TO BRING IT IN FOR A LANDING
BUT IF SHE CAN GET THE INFORMATION SOONER BACK THAN JANUARY
THEN WE CAN MOVE FORWARD, MOVE FORWARD.
MR. CHAIRMAN, MS. DUNCAN, IF YOU GET THIS INFORMATION BACK
TO US SOONER THAN JANUARY, WILL YOU ACCEPT THAT AS A
FRIENDLY AMENDMENT?
1:10:54PM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES, SIR.
I JUST PUT THAT THE WAY.
THERE'S NO WORKSHOP IN DECEMBER.
I CAN HAPPY TO DO A STAFF REPORT.
I MEAN, THE REQUEST SIMPLY IS TELL US -- I DISAGREE ABOUT
THE 30-YEAR THING, BUT WHATEVER IT IS, TELL US YOU PRESENTED
LIKE FIVE THINGS IN THE VIDEO THAT NEED TO BE DONE AND I
DON'T THINK ALL FIVE THINGS ARE UNDER THE MONEY THAT WE

APPROVED BEFORE SO WE JUST NEED TO KNOW WHAT NEEDS TO BE
DONE, OVER WHAT AMOUNT OF TIME.
THERE'S SOME BASIC MAINTENANCE AND SOME LIFE SPAN OF
DIFFERENT PIECES.
A IF JUST KNOW THAT AS FAR OUT, JUST BE TRANSPARENT WITH THE
PUBLIC ABOUT WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST, AND NOT -- I AM NOT
BUILDING UP A CASE TO ARGUE AGAINST IT.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE IT TRANSPARENT TO THE PUBLIC.
1:11:37PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
FIVE YEARS SPECIFIC ASSET NEEDS AND DOLLARS
IN OUR APPROVED BUDGET ALREADY WHICH IS AVAILABLE TO THE
PUBLIC ON OUR WEBSITE.
1:11:45PM >>BILL CARLSON:
THAT'S WHY I WANTED --
1:11:47PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
WE ARE AS TRANSPARENT AS WE POSSIBLY CAN BE.
1:11:50PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA, PLEASE.
1:11:52PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
AND WE PUT IT OUT THERE BUT I WANT TO
SATISFY EVERYONE.
WE PUT IT SOMEWHERE, LIKE AN ITEM TOMORROW MORNING, ON YOUR
WEBSITE, WHATEVER IT IS, AND EXPLAIN MAYBE TELL US EXACTLY
WHAT YOU ARE DOING, WHAT YOU ARE THINKING, WHAT THE TOTAL
COST IS, ANTICIPATED COST IN FIVE YEARS?
AFTER THAT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST BECAUSE
INFLATION KEEPS GOING UP.
IT'S MAY COST A DOLLAR AND IT MAY COST TWO DOLLARS.
BUT THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE DONE.
AND I THINK, IF I REMEMBER, AND WHEN I WENT DO VISIT THAT

PLACE, THE FACILITY IS GOING TO BE DOWN FOR QUITE SOME TIME
WITH EVERYTHING THAT'S GOT TO BE DONE.
AM I CORRECT OR NOT?
1:12:34PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
YES, SIR.
1:12:35PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
IS THAT GOING TO SATISFY THE --
1:12:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
IS THAT GOING TO BE FOR FIVE YEARS?
1:12:43PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
EVERYTHING IS OFFLINE BEFORE UPGRADES ARE
MADE THERE.
WILL BE OTHER UPGRADE IN THE FUTURE WHERE IT WILL PROBABLY
REQUIRE DOWN TIME OF CERTAIN ASSETS AS WELL.
1:12:55PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THANK YOU.
1:12:56PM >>BILL CARLSON:
MR. CHAIR.
YOU ALL DID A VIDEO.
YOU ALL PUT THE WORK INTO THE VIDEO BUT YOU DIDN'T ASK THE
QUESTION.
IF THE INFORMATION IS AVAILABLE, ALL WE HAD TO DO IS
PRESENT --
1:13:07PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
ALL OF THE INFORMATION --
1:13:11PM >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON, I AM GOING TO BRING THIS IN FOR A
LANDING.
YOU HAVE A MOTION TO BE MADE.
COUNCILMAN GUDES SECONDED IT.
COUNCILMAN VIERA?
1:13:24PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.
APPRECIATE THAT.

I HAVE A QUESTION.
AND AGAIN, IF A COUNCILMEMBER HAS A REPORT, WHATEVER, THEY
WANT TO HAVE IT CONTINUED, I THINK THERE'S ALWAYS A
PRESUMPTION THAT YOU WANT TO AGREE WITH THAT.
BUT IS THERE ANYBODY HERE THAT CAME IN FROM OUT OF TOWN TO
BE SPEAK TODAY?
1:13:46PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
WE HAVE ONE GENTLEMAN THAT UNFORTUNATELY HAD
TO LEAVE.
DID HE COME FROM TALLAHASSEE.
I'M SORRY.
I HAD HEARD YOU LEFT.
SO THIS GENTLEMAN, HIS BIRTHDAY, MAY I ADD, FOR SUPPORT,
ALONG WITH MANY TEAM MEMBERS.
WE HAVE A LOT OF EXPERT ON THIS PROJECT.
SO AGAIN WE FEEL CONFIDENT OF WHAT WE HAVE ALREADY GOTTEN
APPROVED AND WHAT WE ARE PLANNING TO DO TO IMPROVE THIS
FACILITY.
1:14:15PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR.
WE ALL HAVE QUESTIONS.
ONE VOTE.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO CLEAR THIS UP SO WE CAN MOVE ON.
1:14:25PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I ASKED FOR A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT, IF MS.
DUNCAN CAN GET DID INFORMATION THAT MR. CARLSON IS LOOKING
FOR, ALL OF US ARE LOOKING FOR FIVE, TEN, WHAT IS IT GOING
TO COST?

WE KNOW YOU HAVE A SHUTDOWN.
WHAT IS IT GOING TO COST TO SAY WHAT IS THIS GOING TO COST?
I KNOW INFLATION GOES BUT IF WE CAN GET A GENERAL COST,
REPLACE THIS, REPLACE THAT.
I HAVE BEEN OUT THERE.
YOU HAVE TO REPLACE A LOT OF STUFF.
1:14:52PM >>BILL CARLSON:
BUT THE REQUEST ISN'T PRESENTED TO THE
PUBLIC.
1:14:55PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. CARLSON, YOU ARE RECOGNIZED.
1:14:57PM >>BILL CARLSON:
NOT JUST PUT IT ON THE WEBSITE BUT
PRESENTED TO THE PUBLIC.
I THINK IF YOU ALL CAN PRESENT IT IN A STAFF REPORT SOONER
I'M OKAY IF IT'S TEN SLIDES OR 20 SLIDES, BUT ANSWERING ALL
THE OTHER QUESTIONS, IT'S ANSWERING A SPECIFIC QUESTION
ABOUT WHAT DO YOU NEED TO DO?
I HAVE THE STUDIED PROJECT MANAGERS AND WORKED ON PROJECTS,
MOST OF THEM ARE AT LEAST 20 YEARS AND MOSTLY 30 YEARS.
I DON'T AGREE WITH THE TEN YEARS.
BUT ANYWAY, WE DON'T EVEN HAVE A LIST THAT WAS PRESENTED TO
US ABOUT TEN YEARS.
SO --
1:15:27PM >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON, I THINK THAT WOULD ANSWER YOUR
QUESTION.
1:15:31PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
MR. CHAIRMAN.
IF WE CAN GET MS. DONE CAN --

1:15:39PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
IF I CAN UNDERSTAND WHAT THE REQUEST IS, SO
WE DO HAVE A FIVE-YEAR CIP THAT LISTS SPECIFIC ASSETS WITH
SPECIFIC COSTS ALREADY OUT IN THE PUBLIC REALM.
BEYOND THAT, IF YOU WANTED SOME DIFFERENT VERSION OF THAT
WITH A LISTING OF THE ASSETS AND THE COSTS, WE CAN PUT IN
THE SOME KIND OF DIFFERENT FORMAT.
BUT I AM STRUGGLING TO FIND OUT WHAT IS THAT THE WE ARE NOT
ANSWERING? WE ARE MAKING A SINCERE EFFORT TO ANSWER YOUR
QUESTIONS AS BEST WE CAN.
1:16:06PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I THINK WHAT COUNCIL IS ASKING, WE KNOW WE
HAVE AN ISSUE OUT THERE AT THE PLANT.
WE ARE SAYING, YOU KNOW YOU HAVE GOT TO DO A INCINERATOR.
SOME OTHER STUFF, WE ARE SAYING, WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO REPLACE
OVER A TIME SPAN, AND WHAT WILL THAT GENERAL COST FOR THE
WHOLE PLANT TO BE REFURBISHED?
1:16:27PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
WE HAVE THAT IN THE FIVE-YEAR CIP BUT IF
THAT FORMAT ISN'T TRANSLATING WELL, WE CAN REFORMAT THAT TO
PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION.
WE CERTAINLY HAVE THE INFORMATION.
1:16:36PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA.
THAT WOULD HELP --
1:16:49PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
HAPPY TO DO THAT.
THANK YOU.
1:16:51PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
TO BRING THAT CIP BACK IN AN
EASIER-TO-DIGEST FORMAT FOR PUBLIC AND THE COUNCIL.

THAT WILL WORK?
1:17:06PM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES, THE SIMPLE THING --
1:17:09PM >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
1:17:10PM >>BILL CARLSON:
TO MODIFY THE MOTION BASED ON WHAT THEY
JUST SAID, TO HAVE -- TO HAVE STAFF COME BACK AND SHOW US
THE ITEMS THAT NEED TO BE REPLACED OVER WHAT TIME AND HOW
MUCH THEY ARE GOING TO COST.
IN A FORMAT THAT CAN BE PRESENTED TO THE PUBLIC SO THE
PUBLIC UNDERSTANDS THE LONG-TERM IMPLICATIONS OF THIS.
NOT TO JUSTIFY IT BUT JUST SPRAIN IN A TRANSPARENT WAY TO
THE PUBLIC.
AND A DATE THAT YOU ARE READY SOMETIME BEFORE --
1:17:39PM >> IF WE DON'T JUSTIFY IT, THEN MRS. DUNCAN, ON SOCIAL
MEDIA, BLASTING IT OUT, AND MAKING SURE THAT THE PUBLIC GETS
EVERY FORM OF INFORMATION IF WE ARE NOT JUSTIFYING IT, THEN
WHY ARE WE -- I COULD SEE IT.
NOW, WE NEED TO HAVE EVERYBODY IN THE CITY OF TAMPA SEE THIS
BEFORE WE MAKE A DECISION.
YOU ARE SAYING IT'S NOT JUSTIFIED.
BUT WE ARE GOING ON.
WE HAVE A MOTION THAT WAS MADE BY COUNCILMAN CARLSON,
AMENDED BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
1:18:17PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
YES, MADAM CLERK?
1:18:20PM >>THE CLERK:
[OFF MICROPHONE]
1:18:31PM >>BILL CARLSON:
COULD YOU DO IT IN STAFF REPORTS ON

NOVEMBER 17th?
1:18:39PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
DECEMBER 15th?
1:18:45PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MOTION BY CARLSON.
AMENDED BY COUNCILMAN -- MR. SHELBY?
1:18:52PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
YES, THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE, MS. DUNCAN, DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT
IS BEING REQUESTED NOW, AND DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF THE
MAKER OF THE MOTION?
1:19:02PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
AS WE KNOW OF TODAY, THE ITEMS, THE TIME
FRAME FOR THE IMPROVEMENTS THAT NEED TO BE MADE AND THE
COSTS OF THOSE.
THAT'S WHAT I JUST WROTE DOWN FROM THE LAST COMMENT THAT WAS
MADE.
1:19:16PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
MR. CARLSON, DID YOU WANT THAT AS A
WRITTEN REPORT?
1:19:26PM >>BILL CARLSON:
NO, I SAID SEVERAL TIMES I WANT THEM TO
PRESENT.
1:19:30PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
UNDERSTOOD. I UNDERSTAND THAT.
THANK YOU.
1:19:31PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AND WE HAVE STILL NOT HAD PUBLIC COMMENT.
1:19:43PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
I WOULD BE HAPPY TO READ ALL OF THE ITEMS
RIGHT NOW AND THE COSTS.
BUT WE ARE HAPPY TO DO IT IN WRITING IF THAT'S WHAT YOU
PREFER.
1:19:51PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ARE YOU ASKING FOR THE -- GREAT.

LET'S HEAR FROM THE EXPERT.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
1:20:08PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M SORRY, BUT IT'S 1:20 AND WE HAVE NOT
EATEN.
1:20:12PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE BEEN DISCUSSING THIS NOW FOR 15
MINUTES.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK, PLEASE.
1:20:21PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M VERY HUNGRY.
CAN WE HAVE A TIME CERTAIN OF LIKE TEN MORE MINUTES?
1:20:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
TEN MORE MINUTES.
WHAT TIME IS IT NOW?
IT'S 20 AFTER.
SO AT 1:30, AFTER THAT 12:30 TIME CERTAIN THAT WE WERE
SUPPOSED TO GO.
SO LET'S TAKE UP COUNCILMAN CARLSON'S MOTION, SHALL WE?
LET'S DO A ROLL CALL ON THAT ONE.
COUNCILMAN GUDES LEFT.
1:21:09PM >>BILL CARLSON:
YES.
1:21:12PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
1:21:15PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:

1:21:16PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:

1:21:17PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
1:21:19PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
NO.
1:21:21PM >>THE CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY WITH COUNCILMAN
CITRO VOTING NO.

1:21:24PM >> IT WASN'T UNANIMOUS.
1:21:33PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
MR. CHAIRMAN.
THIS ITEM WAS MOVED UP BECAUSE THERE WAS SOMEBODY FROM
TALLAHASSEE WHO WAS GOING TO BE LEAVING.
THE QUESTION IS, IS THAT PERSON GOING TO BE PRESENTING TO
COUNCIL?
IS THAT PART OF THIS PROCESS?
HE WASN'T GOING TO BE?
1:21:52PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE ARE DONE WITH THAT MOTION.
I WILL JUST MAKE A COMMENT.
LET'S GO BACK TO THE CAR ANALOGY.
I GOT TIRES THAT ARE SUPPOSED TO LAST 30 THE THOUSAND MILES.
I HAVE TO CHANGE THEM AFTER 20.
WHY?
US WHAT BECAUSE I DIDN'T KEEP THEM BALANCED AND ROTATED.
I HAVE A TRANSMISSION THAT'S SUPPOSED TO LAST 70 THAN
THOUSAND MILES.
IT'S GONE.
WHY?
I DIDN'T CHANGE THE TRANSMISSION FLUID.
I GOT AN ENGINE THAT'S BLOWN, SUPPOSED TO LAST ME FOR
200,000 MILES.
WHY IS IT BLOWN?
I DIDN'T CHANGE THE OIL.
ALL RIGHT.

WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE BACK FROM LUNCH AT 2:00.
1:22:32PM >> TO MAKE A STATEMENT ON THIS ISSUE LIKE THE REST OF THEM.
1:22:42PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. ROBINSON?
1:22:46PM >> THANK YOU, CHAIR.
JOE ROBINSON.
THE RESIDENT EXPERT, THE MAN OUT OF TALLAHASSEE HAS BEEN
WORKING ON THIS PLANT SINCE 1998, KNOWS ALL ABOUT IT.
AND THE MILEAGE ON THE CAR IS WHAT YOU GOT.
THESE NUMBERS ARE ALREADY THERE.
WHEN YOU ALL COME BACK THESE NUMBERS ARE ALREADY THERE.
WE KNOW THAT $17 MILLION IS APPROVED, THIS PROJECT COULD GO
TO 60 MILLION BY THE TIME IT'S THERE.
IF YOU WAIT TOO LATE IT'S GOING TO BE ASTRONOMICAL BECAUSE
IF YOU LOSE THAT TURBINE, YOU LOSE THE TRANSFORMER, THIS IS
ALL MOOT.
YOU ARE IN BLACKOUT.
IT'S CALLED A FORCED OUTAGE.
YOU DIDN'T ASK BUT I AM VOLUNTEERING THIS.
SOLID WASTE IS AN ENTERPRISE FUND.
THE 265 MILLION IS NOT WHAT IT TAKES TO DO THIS PLANT.
THAT IS 35 MILLION FOR THE STATION, TO MOVE THE PEOPLE OUT
OF CARVER CITY, BUT A WHOLE BUNCH OF OTHER STUFF THEY ARE
DOING IN SOLID WASTE.
AND I SAW THAT 3 OR 4 WEEKS AGO.
BROKE DOWN, THERE'S A WHOLE BUNCH OF STUFF SOLID WASTE DOING

AND AIN'T GOING NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS PLANT TO MAKE THAT
270 MILLION.
NOW, I AM GOING TO SAY THIS.
THIS IS A COMPLEX SOLUTION, A COMPLEX PROBLEM, YOU HAVE
53rd MAINTAIN ANY WHICH MEANS NO MAINTENANCE AND GOT RAN
IN THE GROUND, THE CITY OF TAMPA WANT TO OPERATE IT.
YOU AIN'T EVEN PAYING THE PEOPLE ENOUGH MONEY.
GET HR TO PAY ENOUGH MONEY.
YOU AREN'T GOING TO GET QUALITY TEAM TO RUN THAT PLANT ONCE
YOU GET IT LIKE YOU WANT TO BE.
GIVE PEOPLE A RAISE.
THEY AIN'T GOING TO COME WORK FOR THAT.
AND ABRUPT PLAN FAILS.
IT FAILS RIGHT NOW.
WHAT ABOUT THE TREES WE GOT AROUND WEST TAMPA?
WHAT ABOUT WHEN THE HURRICANE HIT?
GOT GREAT STUFF IS THE TO BURN BECAUSE IT'S CLEAN.
I BEEN DEALING WITH THIS.
I AM A MECHANICAL ENGINEER.
THE ONLY PE IN THIS ROOM THAT WORKED ON THIS PROJECT, I
THINK.
CITY DON'T EVEN HAVE ONE ON STAFF.
I AM DOING THIS FREE.
I AM HUNGRY LIKE YOU, MS. HURTAK.
I AM GOING TO STAY FOR THIS AND I WON'T BE BACK.

I HAVE HAD ENOUGH.
BUT I AM HERE TO TELL YOU, I AGREE WITH CHARLIE.
CHARLIE IS RIGHT ON THIS ONE.
MR. CARLSON, THEY GOT WHAT YOU WANT.
YOU SEE EVERY DOCUMENT THERE IS AND THEY ARE GOING TO LAY IT
ON THE TABLE AND THEY ARE GOING TO BREAK IT OUT BUT IT'S
TIME TO MAKE IT REAL TRANSPARENT.
AND CHARLIE TOLD YOU, IT'S NOT THEIR PROPERTY.
YOU HAVE TO DO MAINTENANCE F.THIS TURBAN GENERATOR FAILS,
THIS IS A MOOT POINT.
YOU ARE PROBABLY TO NEED ANOTHER 100 MILLION TO GET ALL THE
DEFERRED TRASH, ALL THE DEFERRED LOCATIONS.
YOU BETTER GET THOSE CONTRACTS IN PLACE.
OKAY.
YOU NEED TO GET A BACKUP PLAN.
AND I AM GOING TO LEAVE IT AT THAT.
AND I GAVE YOU MY CIVIL SERVICE AND I DO REPRESENT THE
PUBLIC, MR. CARLSON.
1:25:58PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE IN THE PUBLIC THAT WOULD LIKE
TO SPEAK TO THIS?
WE DON'T HAVE ANYONE ONLINE?
WE ARE ADJOURNED UNTIL 2:30.
(RECESS)


[ SOUNDING GAVEL ]
2:31:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
CITY COUNCIL IS BACK IN SESSION.
ROLL CALL, PLEASE.
2:31:51PM >>BILL CARLSON:
HERE.
2:31:53PM >> VIERA?
MANISCALCO?
2:31:55PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
HERE.
2:31:57PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
HERE.
2:31:58PM >> GUDES?
MIRANDA?
2:32:03PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
HERE.
2:32:03PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
HERE.
THANK YOU.
AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7, FILE NUMBER E2022-8, CHAPTER 27.
2:32:16PM >>ERIC COTTON:
ERIC COTTON, LAND DEVELOPMENT COORDINATION.
CAN WE GET THE PRESENTATION UP FROM WHERE WE LEFT OFF?
AWESOME.
THIS IS, I THINK, THE MOMENT WE'VE ALL BEEN WAITING FOR,
WHICH IS ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS AND THE PROPOSED CHANGES
TO THE CODE.
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, QUICK BACKGROUND, THEY ARE ALLOWED
IN THE CITY IN TWO LOCATIONS.
ONE, LOWRY PARK CENTRAL, WHICH WAS A PRIVATELY INITIATED
TEXT AMENDMENT, 2003-2004 TIME FRAME.
AND, OF COURSE, IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS, WHICH WAS ADOPTED BY
COUNCIL, WHEN THE CITY ADOPTED SH DISTRICT.

WHAT WE DON'T HAVE IN THE CODE IS A DEFINITION OF WHAT AN
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT.
THE LANGUAGE THAT'S PROPOSED THAT YOU CAN SEE UP THERE, IS A
DWELLING UNIT THAT SERVES AS AN ACCESSORY USE FOR PRINCIPAL
USE.
THAT IS MIMICKED IN THE STATE LANGUAGE THAT'S IN FLORIDA
STATUTES.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WANT TO HAVE ANY QUESTIONS AS WE GO FROM
SLIDE TO SLIDE.
HOW WOULD COUNCIL LIKE TO HANDLE THAT?
2:33:23PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
2:33:25PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THERE ARE A LOT OF SECTIONS.
DO YOU WANT TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THEM OR DO YOU HAVE
QUESTIONS AND PAUSE?
2:33:30PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I'D LIKE TO.
AND IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS ALONG THE WAY OR TOWARD THE END OF
EACH SECTION, WE'LL HAVE QUESTIONS ASKED.
2:33:39PM >>ERIC COTTON:
OKAY.
SO ONE OF THE APPEALS THAT CITY COUNCIL HEARS ON A REGULAR
BASIS IS WHEN SOMEONE APPLIES FOR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT
IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS OR EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE ELSEWHERE
IN THE CITY, THEY ARE PUTTING IT INTO A DETACHED STRUCTURE
IN THE BACKYARD, INSTEAD OF THE REQUIRED THREE FEET, THREE
FEET IS AT TWO AND A HALF FEET.
ADMINISTRATIVELY, STAFF DENIES THAT REQUEST.

THEY APPEAL TO COUNCIL AND COUNCIL HEARS THE ARGUMENTS AND
PROBABLY 95% OF THE TIME HAS WAIVED THAT REQUIRED SETBACK
AND GRANTED A RELIEF TO THAT SECTION OF CHAPTER 27-132.
SO THE LANGUAGE THAT'S UP HERE IS FOR LANGUAGE FOR BOTH
EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES AND FOR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS
IS VERY SIMILAR.
FOR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, IT CANNOT BE LOCATED IN A
NONCONFORMING ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, STRUCTURE MADE CONFORMING
AS A RESULT OF VARIANCE.
SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE MIMICS THE SAME LANGUAGE.
WHAT THIS IS PROPOSING IS ALLOWING STAFF TO APPROVE THOSE
INSTANCES WHERE THE STRUCTURE IS NONCONFORMING.
INSTEAD OF HAVING TO COME TO COUNCIL FOR A PETITION FOR
REVIEW AND ADDING ANOTHER 45, 60 DAYS' WORTH OF TIME, THIS
WOULD ELIMINATE THAT.
WHAT HAPPENS NOW FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO CAME FROM THE VARIANCE
REVIEW BOARD, CHAIR CITRO AND COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK, WHEN A
VARIANCE IS GRANTED, THAT STRUCTURE NOW HAS STANDING, SO TO
SPEAK, TO STAY THERE.
IF THEY WERE TO REMODEL IN THE FUTURE, KNOCK IT DOWN, THEY
COULD GO BACK TO THAT TWO FOOT SETBACK.
WITH THIS LANGUAGE, IF IT'S APPROVED, THEY KNOCK DOWN THAT
STRUCTURE, CATCHES ON FIRE, WHATEVER, THEY HAVE TO BUILD IT
BACK TO THE REQUIRED SETBACKS FOR THE ZONING DISTRICT IT'S
IN.

THAT WOULDN'T MEET THAT REQUIREMENT.
2:35:27PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY COMMENTS?
ANY QUESTIONS?
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
2:35:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
WE'RE ON NUMBER 7, RIGHT, MR. CHAIRMAN?
2:35:34PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
2:35:35PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
AS I READ, AN ACCESSORY DWELLING,
SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH SEPARATE ENTRANCE.
IS THIS FOR A FAMILY MEMBER WE'RE TALKING ABOUT?
2:35:46PM >>ERIC COTTON:
EXTENDED FAMILY OR FOR THE FAMILY MEMBER WHEN
THEY GO THROUGH THE SPECIAL USE.
2:35:50PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I BELIEVE IN THE TRUST BUT VERIFY.
HOW DO WE KNOW THEY ARE A FAMILY MEMBER?
IN OTHER WORDS, WHEN YOU COME INTO THIS COUNTRY YOU HAVE TO
FILL OUT A BUNCH OF FORMS.
YOU HAVE TO BE PROCESSED AND SO FORTH AND SO ON.
YOU PUT A FAMILY MEMBER TO CHECK ALL THAT OUT.
DO WE REALLY CHECK THEM OUT OR TAKE THEIR WORD?
2:36:10PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THEY SIGN AN AFFIDAVIT AND NORMALLY PEOPLE
SUBMIT EITHER LIKE WEDDING LICENSE, THEY ARE MARRIED OR
SUBMIT THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHO THEIR MOM WAS OR FATHER.
THEY ARE REQUIRED TO SUBMIT --
2:36:26PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I'M NOT OPPOSED TO -- WHAT'S HAPPENING IN
THIS CITY IS THIS.
THERE ARE HOUSES THAT ARE BOUGHT.

THERE ARE HOUSES THAT HAVE BEEN THERE FOR 30 YEARS AND HAVE
HAD AN ACCESSORY DWELLING WITHOUT RESIDENCY, THE DWELLING OF
A MEMBER.
AND THOSE -- LET ME USE AN EXAMPLE LIKE I DID TODAY.
LET'S SAY MY HOUSE WHERE I LIVE AT $800 A YEAR TAXES BECAUSE
I LIVE -- BUT A HOUSE LIKE MINE THAT'S NOT HOMESTEADED, IT
IS ABOUT $3,000 A YEAR.
BECAUSE WHY?
IT'S NO LONGER A SINGLE-FAMILY USE AND NOT HOMESTEADED.
BEEN THERE 20, 30 YEARS, THEY'VE BEEN COLLECTED RENT AND I
CAN VERIFY EVERYTHING I'M SAYING TO YOU.
WHEN I SAY YOU, SIR, NOT YOU DIRECTLY.
JUST YOU SIMPLE.
THEY PAY NOTHING TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN INCOME BECAUSE
STILL UNDER THEIR NAME, WATER BILL IS UNDER THEIR WATER
BILL.
THE ELECTRIC BILL IS UNDER THEM.
BUT THEY ARE COLLECTING RENT BELIEVE ME WHEN I TELL YOU.
THERE WERE 232 OF THESE FOUND IN A SMALL SECTION OF WHERE I
LIVE.
NOTICE I'M NOT MENTIONING NAMES OF WHERE I LIVE.
THAT WAS ONLY A SMALL SECTION.
IT COULD BE A THOUSAND OF THEM WHERE I LIVE.
NOW, THE SCHOOL BOARD WAS LOOKING FOR MONEY.
I LOOKED AT MY BILL JUST LAST NIGHT, AND I'LL ROUND IT OFF

TO $2,000 INSTEAD SO I CAN EQUATE THE SYSTEM.
1,000 OF THAT 2,000 IN AD VALOREM TAXES GOES TO THE SCHOOL
BOARD.
THE OTHER 500 TO THE COUNTY AND 500 TO THE CITY OR
THEREABOUTS, A FEW DOLLARS APART.
YOU KNOW HOW MUCH REVENUE IS BEING LEFT ON THE TABLE?
MILLIONS, JUST BECAUSE IT'S BECAUSE.
I'M NOT BLAMING THIS ADMINISTRATION.
LET ME SAY THAT.
I'M NOT BLAMING THIS ADMINISTRATION.
THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR VARIOUS ADMINISTRATIONS.
NOW I'M SUPPOSED TO TAKE THIS AND SWALLOW THE PILL IN MY
SAME NEIGHBORHOOD AND ONE BLOCK THERE'S THREE OF THEM.
ONE VERY CLOSE TO WHERE I LIVE.
GOT AT LEAST THREE TO FOUR APARTMENTS.
HOW DO THEY DO IT?
WHEN YOU SEE THE OPENING OF A GATE, THAT THE OUTSIDE IS
WHERE YOU PUT THE KEY IN, YOU GOT A PROBLEM.
IT DOESN'T TAKE A KID FROM YBOR CITY TO UNDERSTAND THAT.
IN FACT, 10, 15 YEARS AGO, GUESS WHAT, AT MY OWN HOUSE WHERE
I LIVED, I GOT CITED.
I SAID HOW CAN I BE RENTING WHEN YOU CAN'T GET IN THE BACK
OR THE FRONT?
THE LOCKS ARE ON THE INSIDE AND NOT THE OUTSIDE. I SHOWED
TO THEM.

SOMEBODY MUST HAVE SAID HE'S DOING THAT BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T
LIKE WHAT I WAS DOING.
IT'S GOT TO BE STOPPED.
TAXPAYERS ARE SUBSIDIZING THOSE INDIVIDUALS.
THEY ARE NOT PAID THEIR FAIR SHARE OF AD VALOREM TAX AND
THEY ARE PAYING NO INCOME TAX ON THE EARNINGS.
AND THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE NEW AMERICANS.
THEY ARE MY KIND.
MY NATIONALITY AND I DON'T LIKE IT.
DO YOU KNOW OF ANYTHING WE'RE GOING TO DO ABOUT THAT?
ARE WE GOING TO DO THIS WITHOUT DOING THAT?
2:39:48PM >>ERIC COTTON:
WHAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING WOULD NOT BE LEGAL.
THIS DOES NOT ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES AT ALL.
THOSE ARE CODE ENFORCEMENT ISSUES AND CODE ENFORCEMENT --
YOU'RE AWARE THEY DID A SWEEP OF WEST TAMPA PROBABLY ABOUT
TEN YEARS AGO AND THEY CITED A NUMBER OF RESIDENTS THAT WERE
LIKE THAT.
THE ONES THAT ARE ILLEGAL GET CITED.
THE ONES THAT ARE NOT ILLEGAL WOULD NOT BE CITED.
THIS WOULDN'T ADDRESS THAT ANYWAY.
THIS IS FOR EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES WHICH IS STILL AN
ISSUE, ONE, EVEN IN THE CODE TODAY WOULD STILL REMAIN THAT.
2:40:17PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
GOING TO BE CITYWIDE OR JUST IN CERTAIN
AREAS OF THE CITY?
2:40:21PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THIS LANGUAGE -- WELL, THE LANGUAGE THAT WAS

ON THE SCREEN IS CITYWIDE.
2:40:25PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
CITYWIDE.
CAN BE ANY PART OF THE CITY.
2:40:28PM >>ERIC COTTON:
CORRECT.
EXTENDING FAMILY RESIDENCES.
THEY STILL REMAIN SPECIAL USES.
2:40:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.
WHAT I DO HAVE A PROBLEM, IN CASE WE SEGREGATE IN CERTAIN
PARTS OF THE CITY BECAUSE THEN WE'RE NOT APPLYING THE LAW
EQUAL.
WE'RE DIVIDING IT THE WAY WE WANT, ONLY CERTAIN PARTS OF THE
CITY RECEIVE THAT.
THE OTHER PART DOES NOT.
2:40:52PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THAT WILL COME -- THE ACCESSORY DWELLING
UNITS WHERE THEY ARE ALLOWED IS FURTHER IN THIS
PRESENTATION.
2:40:59PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS AT THIS TIME?
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
2:41:02PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WAS GOING TO SAVE THIS COMMENT FOR LATER,
BUT SINCE IT'S BEEN BROUGHT UP ABOUT EXTENDED FAMILY
RESIDENCES, I FIND THIS TOPIC, THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS AND EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE VERY
CONFUSING.
I REALLY THINK WE SHOULD DO AWAY WITH EXTENDED FAMILY
RESIDENCES AND FIND A WAY TO PUT IT ALL TOGETHER.

I'LL SAY THAT RIGHT NOW.
I WOULD REALLY LOVE TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ON THAT AT SOME
POINT BECAUSE THIS IS CONFUSING.
HE'S RIGHT.
WE SIMPLY DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TO
CHECK ON THESE THINGS.
AND, YES, I REALIZE THAT THAT MIGHT HAVE SOME TAX
IMPLICATIONS FOR SOME PEOPLE.
AGAIN, THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO DISCUSS IT, BUT IT IS TOO MUCH
OF A BURDEN ON THE CITY.
I TECHNICALLY HAVE AN EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE, AND IN
SEVEN YEARS, NO ONE HAS EVER COME TO INVESTIGATE.
THEY HAVE SENT LETTERS AND WE'VE SET UP TIMES AND THEN THEY
KEEP CANCELING.
YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE CHECKED ONCE A YEAR, AND IT'S JUST
NEVER HAPPENED FOR US.
SO IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT IF IT'S NOT HAPPENING FOR
ME, IT'S PROBABLY NOT HAPPENING FOR OTHER PEOPLE AND THEN
OTHER PEOPLE ARE TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THAT SYSTEM.
AND SO I SEE EXACTLY WHAT COUNCILMAN MIRANDA IS SAYING.
I THINK THAT WHEN WE'RE REDOING THIS, THIS IS THE PERFECT
TIME TO LOOK AT TAKING THESE AWAY AND FIGURING OUT JUST ONE
METHOD.
2:42:27PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
2:42:28PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WE TALKED THIS MORNING ABOUT THE PROCESS.

I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE WHAT IS OUR PROCESS?
SOMEONE GOES AND APPLY?
MY THING IS IF YOU'RE APPLYING, WE SHOULD HAVE A REGISTER, A
TALLY SO WE CAN TRUST AND VERIFY.
SO WHAT IS OUR PROCESS?
2:42:48PM >>ERIC COTTON:
CURRENTLY IN THE CODE FOR BOTH AN EXTENDED
FAMILY RESIDENCE AND AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, THEY ARE
BOTH SPECIAL USE 1s, WHICH IS THE ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS
REQUIRED, NOTICE SPECIFIC STANDARDS THAT THE APPLICANT HAS
TO MEET FOR EXTENDED FAMILY, ONE OF THOSE IT HAS TO BE A
RELATIVE, CAN'T BE SEPARATELY METERED, THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES
BUT THEY ARE BOTH SPECIAL USES REQUIRING NOTICE.
THEY SUBMIT A SITE PLAN, REVIEW THE SITE PLAN, PROVIDE
EVIDENCE OF WHO IS SUPPOSED TO BE LIVING THERE.
IF THEY MEET THE CRITERIA SET FORTH IN THE CODE WE CAN
APPROVE IT.
IF THEY CAN'T MEET THE CRITERIA, WE DENY IT AND FILE TO COME
BEFORE CITY COUNCIL.
2:43:28PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
REGARDLESS IF A FAMILY MEMBER, IT IS A BACK
DWELLER.
EVEN IN YOU DIDN'T HAVE A FAMILY MEMBER LIVING THERE,
SHOULDN'T THAT STILL BE REGISTERED OR CAN WE PUT THAT
REGARDLESS OF A FAMILY MEMBER?
THAT WAY WE'RE COLLECTING THE TAXES ON THAT?
2:43:44PM >>ERIC COTTON:
WELL, MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE PROPERTY

APPRAISER'S OFFICE, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES BECAUSE THEY
ARE NOT INCOME GENERATED ARE NOT TAX.
THERE IS NO ADDITIONAL TAX ON THEM.
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, WHICH IS WHAT WE'RE GOING TO BE
DISCUSSING LATER ON IN THIS PRESENTATION ARE TAXED.
THE PROPERTY APPRAISER DOES ASSIGN A VALUE AND THEY DO TAX
THOSE.
2:44:09PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I'M NOT TRYING TO TAKE OVER THE HEARING
OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
ANY BUILDING OTHER THAN YOUR FAMILY BUILDING, IF YOU PUT A
SHED IN THE BACK, GUESS WHAT, YOU PAY EXTRA FOR THE SHED.
2:44:20PM >>ERIC COTTON:
CORRECT.
2:44:20PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NOW WE'RE SAYING THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE --
AND I CAN SHOW YOU WHERE PEOPLE HAVE ENCLOSED THEIR CARPORT
AND CHARGING SIX OR SEVEN HUNDRED DOLLARS ON THE SIDE OF A
CARPORT, NO BIGGER THAN FROM HERE TO MISTER -- A SQUARE.
LET'S SAY 16 BY 10 AND THEY ARE GETTING $600 A MONTH.
THERE IS A TOILET, A LITTLE BED, AND A TV SET.
AND YOU TOOK ON A LITTLE COLEMAN GAS STOVE OR WHATEVER.
2:44:49PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
HOT PLATE.
2:44:51PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THAT'S RIGHT.
AND THEY CHARGE FOR THAT.
HERE, I'M NOT TRYING TO STAY AWAY FROM WHAT YOU GOT, BUT HOW
IN THE WORLD CAN SOMEBODY HAVE SOMEBODY THAT'S REAL PROPERTY
NOW AND NOT BE TAXED?

2:45:03PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THOSE UNITS LIKE THAT ARE ILLEGAL.
I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU, WHEN PEOPLE COME IN AND FILE FOR --
THEY GET CITED BY CODE ENFORCEMENT.
THEY GO THROUGH A PROCESS FORMAL DECISION OF THE ZONING
ADMINISTRATOR WHERE THEY TRY TO PRESENT EVIDENCE THAT THE
USE WAS LEGALLY ESTABLISHED EITHER, A, PRIOR TO ZONING.
A LOT OF TIMES THEY WERE ESTABLISHED THREE YEARS AGO.
DECISION IS DENIED.
CODE ENFORCEMENT THEN CONTINUES WITH THAT PROCESS OF CODE
ENFORCEMENT TO MAKE THEM -- TRY TO MAKE THEM REMOVE THE
SECOND UNIT.
WHEN PEOPLE COME IN AND THEY TALK TO ME AND SAY WE'RE GOING
TO PROVE, JUST SO YOU KNOW, IF IT'S FINDING IN YOUR FAVOR,
THE PROPERTY APPRAISER WILL ON OCCASION TRY TO GO BACK AND
COLLECT BACK TAXES ON PEOPLE.
IF THE UNITS WERE ILLEGALLY ESTABLISHED OR LEGALLY
ESTABLISHED, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO GO BACK AND SAY, HEY,
YOU OWE US FOR THE PAST SIX YEARS.
YOU COLLECTED THIS MUCH.
YOU HAD THE SECOND UNIT THAT WAS INCOME-GENERATING, YOU OWE
US MONEY.
IF THEY ARE SUCCESSFUL AT THAT, I DON'T KNOW.
THAT'S NOT US.
THAT'S THE PROPERTY APPRAISER'S OFFICE.
2:46:04PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IF I CAN JUST ADD, ABBYE FEELEY, THE

DISCUSSION TODAY, I SEE WHERE IT'S GOING IN RELATION TO THE
TAXES AND THAT, BUT WE'RE NOT THE TAXING AUTHORITY, YOU
KNOW, THE PROPERTY APPRAISER IS.
WHAT WE'RE HERE ON TODAY, I WANT TO PULL IT BACK TO THAT
FORWARD SECOND IS YOU'VE HAD SEVERAL APPEALS COME TO YOU
OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS RELATED TO NONCONFORMING
STRUCTURES, STRUCTURES THAT HAVE A TWO-FOOT SETBACK INSTEAD
OF A THREE FOR A DETACHED UNIT THAT'S ALREADY EXISTING ON A
PROPERTY AND THEY WANT TO PUT EITHER AN EXTENDED FAMILY
RESIDENCE IN THERE OR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT IN THERE.
AND THE CHANGE WE HAD PROPOSED WAS THE CODE CURRENTLY
DOESN'T ALLOW IT BECAUSE IT'S NONCONFORMING.
WHEN THEY COME TO YOU ON APPEAL, YOU'RE GRANTING IT AND
SAYING, OKAY, WE'LL LET THAT USE GO IN THERE, AND THAT MAKES
THAT STRUCTURE THEN CONFORMING BECAUSE YOU'RE GRANTING THAT
THIS SAYS WILL ALLOW THEM TO GO INTO THOSE NONCONFORMING
STRUCTURES THE WAY THEY ARE NOW AND IT LEAVES THOSE
STRUCTURES AS NONCONFORMING.
SO I KNOW THIS IS A MULTIFACETED DISCUSSION.
WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT ALL THOSE DIFFERENT ELEMENTS BUT I
WANT TO KIND OF KEEP THIS ON TRACK AS FAR AS WHAT IS
ENFORCEABLE FROM THE TAXING AUTHORITY OR FROM CODE
ENFORCEMENT VERSUS WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO WITH THE CODE
HERE TODAY.
2:47:28PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NO ONE SAID THAT WE'RE THE TAXING UNIT.

HOWEVER, WE ARE THE ONES LETTING IT HAPPEN.
WE'RE THE ONES THAT FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER, CODE
ENFORCEMENT MAYBE WORKS SATURDAYS, SUNDAYS, I DON'T REALLY
KNOW.
I KNOW THEY DO GO OUT IF THEY ARE CALLED.
WE DON'T HAVE THE PROPER TOOLS TO LET THEM DO THEIR JOB
FULLY.
THEY CAN CITE SOMEBODY AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENS.
IN FACT, THE OTHER DAY I WAS DRIVING AROUND AND I REMEMBER
THREE OF THEM ON ONE STREET.
I'LL GIVE YOU THE ADDRESSES BECAUSE ALL OF A SUDDEN WE HAD
IT ON THE AGENDA THREE OR FOUR YEARS AGO AND THEN WHEN I WAS
DRIVING AROUND, IT DISAPPEARED.
I NEVER HEARD WHAT HAPPENED.
IT WAS SUPPOSED TO COME TO COUNCIL.
IT WAS SET FOR ANOTHER DATE AND NEVER CAME BACK.
2:48:18PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IF YOU'D GIVE THOSE TO US I WOULD BE HAPPY
TO GET BACK WITH YOU ON THAT.
2:48:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I JUST WANT CLARITY THAT IT'S GOT TO
STOP.
THERE'S OVER A THOUSAND UNITS THAT I CAN POINT OUT TO YOU.
I KNOW 232 FOR SURE IN A SMALL AREA.
YOU MULTIPLY THAT BY TEN TIMES OF THE AREA, I'LL MAKE AN
ASSUMPTION, THERE'S GOT TO BE A THOUSAND.
THERE'S NOT ONE BLOCK WHERE I LIVE THAT DOESN'T HAVE AT

LEAST ONE OR TWO OF THEM AND NOBODY DOES ANYTHING.
2:48:44PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
UNDERSTOOD.
2:48:45PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
LET IT HAPPEN.
LET IT BE HAPPY.
NOBODY PAYS THE TAX.
MEANTIME, THEY ARE CRITICIZING THE GOVERNMENT.
2:48:52PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
UNDERSTOOD.
I JUST DON'T WANT US TO BLOCK PROGRESS ON LOOKING AT THIS IN
THE ZONING LIGHT VERSUS THE ENFORCEMENT LIGHT.
AND THE ENFORCEMENT NEEDS TO BE HANDLED SEPARATELY.
2:49:02PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
BUT IF WE PASS THE ZONING, IT CLEARS UP
EVERYTHING, WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE ENFORCEMENT.
2:49:07PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
NO, UNFORTUNATELY, IT DOES NOT.
IT DOESN'T MAKE THINGS ILLEGAL LEGAL JUST BECAUSE WE DO
THAT.
I WANT TO BE CLEAR ON THAT.
ENFORCEMENT IS STILL THE KEY TO BRINGING THAT ISSUE INTO
COMPLIANCE.
2:49:20PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
OUR PROBLEM IS THAT I NEVER SEE THE END
OF IT WHERE SOMETHING IS RESOLVED.
THAT'S IT.
2:49:30PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
2:49:31PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
TO BRING IT BACK TO THIS, I -- SO WHAT YOU'RE
SAYING HERE IS THAT IF SOMEONE HAS AN OLD GARAGE AND THEY
WANT TO TRANSFORM IT INTO AN ADU, THEY WILL BE ALLOWED TO DO

IT, BUT IF THAT GARAGE BURNS DOWN, THEY'LL HAVE TO REBUILD
IT TO THE NEW SETBACKS.
2:49:50PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
YES.
2:49:51PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THAT'S FINE.
AS LONG AS WE CAN USE THE STRUCTURES THAT ARE HABIT -- OR
THAT COULD POSSIBLY BE USE.
I KNOW THERE ARE A LOT OF HISTORIC GARAGES IN SOME PARTS OF
THE COMMUNITY THAT ACTUALLY ON THE VARIANCE REVIEW BOARD SAW
SEVERAL OF THOSE.
I WOULDN'T WANT THAT TO BE STOPPED.
THANK YOU.
THAT ANSWERS MY QUESTION.
2:50:11PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
BECAUSE THE CHALLENGE TODAY IS WHEN THEY
APPEAL IT AND YOU GRANT IT AND THE TWO AND TWO OR WHATEVER
THAT SETBACK IS, ZERO, THAT'S WHAT THEY GET IF IT BURNS
DOWN.
THEY GET TO GO BACK TO ZERO.
AND OUR GOAL WITH NONCONFORMITIES IN THE CITY IS TO
EVENTUALLY HAVE THOSE THINGS BECOME CONFORMING.
SO WE DON'T WANT TO CONTINUE TO PROLIFERATE THEM.
WE WANT TO IDENTIFY THEM, USE THEM, AND THEN WHEN THEY LIVED
THEIR LIVES, HAVE THINGS CONFORM TO THE CODE.
2:50:38PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THANK YOU.
2:50:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
IF I MAY, MS. FEELEY, ARE WE JUST TALKING SETBACK

CONFORMITIES?
OR ARE WE TALKING HEIGHT?
ARE WE TALKING PERMEABLE SPACES SINCE THEY ARE ALL
NONCONFORMING TO THOSE ALSO?
IF YOU HAVE AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IN YOUR BACKYARD AND IT
MEETS THE SETBACKS BUT IT'S 15-FOOT IS THE HEIGHT FOR
ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
IF IT'S 25 FEET, ARE WE CONFORMING THAT ALSO.
2:51:07PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THAT WOULD BE CORRECT.
2:51:09PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IF SOMEBODY'S BACKYARD IS TOTALLY PAVED AND
SOMEBODY BUILT THIS ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, THERE'S NO
PERMEABLE SPACE.
ARE WE CONFORMING THAT ALSO?
2:51:18PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
NO, BECAUSE THAT -- THE PERMEABLE HAS A
RESOLUTION.
WHEN YOU GO OVER 50%, YOU HAVE TO RETAIN HALF INCH ON YOUR
PROPERTY.
YOU HAVE TO PUT IN A PIPE SYSTEM AND OTHER THINGS.
THAT'S NOT A NONCONFORMING CHARACTERISTIC THAT YOU WOULD BE
ALLOWING AT THAT POINT.
THEY WOULD STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THAT ELEMENT.
IT IS THE DIMENSIONAL REGULATIONS.
2:51:38PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
THE CONFORMITY WILL BE THE SETBACKS, THE HEIGHT, AND THE
SIDES, THE SQUARE FOOT SIDES.

2:51:43PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
YES.
2:51:44PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
2:51:45PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
BUT TO FOLLOW THAT, YES, 15 FEET, BUT WHAT IF
IT'S A GARAGE APARTMENT?
2:51:54PM >>ERIC COTTON:
AGAIN --
2:51:55PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IT'S STILL A NONCONFORMITY.
2:51:57PM >>ERIC COTTON:
COULD STILL BE A NONCONFORMITY.
BULK, HEIGHT, SETBACKS, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING.
2:52:01PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
SO 15 FEET IS ENOUGH FOR A HEIGHT OF A GARAGE
AND A GARAGE APARTMENT?
2:52:09PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT AN EXISTING STRUCTURE?
2:52:10PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
NO, JUST -- SO, YES.
SAY YOU HAVE AN EXISTING STRUCTURE THAT'S TWO FEET AND IT
BURNS DOWN AND YOU HAVE AN APARTMENT AND A GARAGE UNDER IT,
AND THEN YOU WANT TO REBUILD IT BECAUSE IT BURNT DOWN, YOU
WOULD IN ESSENCE NOT BE ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE YOU WOULD
ONLY HAVE 15 FEET HEIGHT.
2:52:34PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
OR YOU MEET PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE SETBACKS.
IN ORDER TO GO ABOVE 15 FEET IN HEIGHT, YOU MEET PRINCIPAL
STRUCTURE SETBACKS.
BUT I DON'T WANT TO GET CAUGHT UP IN THE NEW ADU
CONSTRUCTION.
I WANT TO TRY TO HANDLE THESE -- IT'S A VERY MULTIFACETED

DISCUSSION.
BUT I DO WANT TO TRY TO HANDLE THESE ONE STEP AT A TIME.
THE FIRST WAS, HEY, LET'S GET A DEFINITION FOR THIS IN OUR
CODE.
THE SECOND WAS ALLOWING THEM IN NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES
WHICH CURRENTLY THEY ARE NOT ALLOWED.
THEY COME TO YOU ON APPEAL AND COUNCIL IS GRANTING THEM
BECAUSE IT IS APPROPRIATE TO TRY TO USE THAT HOUSING STOCK
OR THAT BUILDING STOCK. THAT WAS NUMBER TWO.
2:53:12PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
2:53:16PM >>BILL CARLSON:
A LOT OF PEOPLE ONLINE AND OTHER PLACES HAVE
BEEN ASKING ABOUT AirBnBs.
I KNOW WE'RE PREEMPTED BY STATE LAW.
DOES THIS ALLOW PEOPLE TO HAVE TWO PLACES FOR AirBnB OR IS
IT ALL ONE?
2:53:34PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I DON'T KNOW THAT US ALLOWING THIS IN
NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES IS GOING TO BE IMPACTING HOW
AirBnB.
IF YOU HAVE TWO UNITS ON YOUR PROPERTY TODAY IN HYDE PARK
AND YOU'RE ALLOWED TO AirBnB BOTH OF THEM.
YOU WOULD BE ALLOWED TO AirBnB.
WE'RE PREEMPTED BY THE STATE IN THE REGULATION OF AirBnB.
2:53:53PM >>BILL CARLSON:
IF PEOPLE WERE BUILDING NEW ONES, THAT WOULD
PROVIDE TWO UNITS FOR AirBnB ON THEIR PROPERTY.

2:53:59PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THEORETICALLY, YES.
2:54:01PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
JUST LIKE IF YOU'RE BUILDING TWO TOWNHOMES
AND THEY ARE NOT FOR SALE.
IT'S TWO UNITS.
BECAUSE ADU AND PRINCIPAL UNIT, IT'S TWO UNITS.
IF IT'S A HUNDRED CONDOS, IT'S A HUNDRED CONDOS.
YES.
2:54:18PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YOU CAN THANK TALLAHASSEE FOR THAT.
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
2:54:23PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU, SIR.
APPRECIATE THAT.
QUICK QUESTION.
I KNOW THIS WAS MENTIONED BEFORE.
FOR THIS, ADUs, ET CETERA, PLACES WITH DEED RESTRICTIONS,
ET CETERA, CDDs, WHATNOT, OBVIOUSLY THIS WOULD BE
INAPPLICABLE I WOULD ASSUME.
2:54:37PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
CORRECT.
2:54:38PM >>LUIS VIERA:
MUCH OF NEW TAMPA, FOR EXAMPLE, THIS WOULDN'T
BE APPLICABLE.
I THINK THAT IS OPEN AND OBVIOUS, BUT JUST SAY IT.
SOMETHING THAT COUNCILMAN CARLSON SAID WITH AirBnB, THAT
IS A CONCERN FOR A LOT OF FOLKS AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE
REALLY -- YOU KNOW, IF WE DO GO FORWARD WITH SOMETHING ON
ADUs, WHICH I SUPPORT.
I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS SMART, ESPECIALLY RIGHT NOW

WITH OUR HOUSING CRISIS, BUT WE OBVIOUSLY HAVE TO MEASURE
AND KEEP TAB OF ANY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES AND WHATNOT.
AND WE HAVE TO JUST KEEP ABREAST OF THAT.
2:55:10PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
2:55:11PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
ONLY THING I'M LEERY ABOUT, MR. VIERA
BROUGHT IT UP, GOOD POINT.
CERTAIN COMMUNITIES HAVE CDDs AND DEED-RESTRICTED AREAS.
I'M JUST CONCERNED THAT PUTTING THESE ALL OVER THE CITY,
ESPECIALLY IN SOME ALREADY BLIGHTED COMMUNITIES WILL BRING
ON MORE BLIGHT.
I'M KIND OF NERVOUS ABOUT THE CONSTRUCTION AND BUILDING OF
THESE.
PERMITTING AND THINGS.
I'M JUST CONCERNED.
2:55:38PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN THERE YET.
WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN THERE YET.
THESE ARE EXISTING NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES THAT ARE ON THE
GROUND TODAY AND COULD THEY BE ALLOWED TO USE THOSE FOR
EITHER EFR, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE OR ACCESSORY DWELLING
UNITS.
WE'RE STILL ON WHAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY TODAY.
WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO ANY OF THE NEW STUFF.
WE PROMISE YOU WHEN WE GET THERE WE'LL LET YOU KNOW.
WE'RE NOT THERE YET.
THAT'S WHERE WE ARE ON THIS ITEM.

ALL EXISTING EITHER DETACHED, THEY ARE DETACHED ACCESSORY
STRUCTURES THAT EITHER DON'T COMPLY WITH THE SETBACK OR A
HEIGHT REGULATION THAT WOULD NOW BE ALLOWED TO BE USED FOR
THIS.
2:56:22PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
2:56:23PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
JUST A THOUGHT, MAYBE WE SHOULD APPROVE THESE
AS WE GO BECAUSE THE FIRST ONE, APPROVING THE DEFINITION, I
THINK WE'RE ALL OKAY WITH THAT AT THIS POINT.
I THINK WE'RE ALL OKAY WITH THIS AT THIS POINT.
JUST SO WE DON'T GET CONFUSED DOWN THE ROAD BECAUSE
OBVIOUSLY WE'RE HAVING A LOT OF CONVERSATIONS AS WE GO.
HOW DOES EVERYBODY FEEL LIKE THAT?
SO I MOVE THE FIRST TWO.
2:56:51PM >> SECOND.
2:56:52PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
A MOTION MADE BY -- DO WE WANT TO TAKE THEM
SEPARATELY?
2:56:59PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
SO THE ACTION SUMMARY COMES UP CLEAN.
MADAM CLERK, ARE YOU OKAY WITH THAT?
2:57:05PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
CAN YOU GO BACK AND I CAN SAY WHAT THE OTHER
ONE IS?
2:57:10PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I HAD A TABLE IN THE FRONT.
DEFINITION.
ADDING A DEFINITION OF ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT TO THE CODE,
2743 IS THE FIRST ONE.
2:57:22PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
2743 AND THEN IF YOU HOP TO THE NEXT ONE,

27132, I MOVE BOTH OF THOSE.
2:57:30PM >> SECOND.
2:57:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
MR. CHAIRMAN, I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE
MOTION.
2:57:33PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
PUBLIC COMMENT.
2:57:36PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I CAN VOTE ON ONE PART BUT NOT ON THE
OTHER PART.
2:57:40PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE'LL TAKE THEM SEPARATELY.
2:57:42PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY.
DEFINITION.
2743.
2:57:47PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC COMMENT?
SEEING NONE, WE HAVE NO ONE ONLINE.
THANK YOU.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED --
2:58:05PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
CAN WE DEFINE FOR FAMILY USE AND THE
OTHER ONE IS NOT.
2:58:13PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I THINK WE'RE GETTING THERE LATER.
THIS IS JUST --
2:58:18PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NUMBER 7.
2:58:20PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION LATER.
I DON'T THINK THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE.
BUT I'M HAPPY TO MAKE THAT MOTION LATER ABOUT TAKING OUT
EXTENDED FAMILY OR AT LEAST DISCUSSING IT.

THIS IS THE LANGUAGE OF NONCONFORMING TO CONFORMING.
2:58:35PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THE SECOND PORTION OF THAT, CORRECT.
THIS IS STRICTLY THE STRUCTURE ITSELF, NOT THE USE.
IT'S ON THE DEFINITION.
OKAY.
2:58:46PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
JUST ON THE DEFINITION.
MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA.
ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
2:58:57PM >> AYE.
2:58:57PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OPPOSED?
2:59:02PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
MY SECOND MOTION IS MOVE 27-132.
YES.
I'M SORRY.
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES AND
NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES.
2:59:18PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SECOND.
2:59:19PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN
HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS?
2:59:32PM >> I'LL BE SPEAKING A FEW TIMES.
I'LL BE BRIEF.
SUMMARIZE WHY THIS IS IMPORTANT.
A PATH TO COMPLIANCE FOR ILLEGAL ADUs I THINK IS SOMETHING

EVERYONE AGREES WE SHOULD HAVE.
IF WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT AND SAY TEAR DOWN EVERY ILLEGAL ADU
IN THE CITY, THAT WOULD BE DESTROYING THOUSANDS OF
AFFORDABLE HOMES.
I'M ON THE FENCE.
TO THE ASSISTANT YOU BELIEVE HOMEOWNERS WOULD PROVIDE
AFFORDABLE HOUSING, BUT I WILL SAY THE SMALLER UNIT, THE
FAMILY ONE IS -- YOU KNOW, NOT PAYING TAXES ON IT AND IT
BEING SMALLER, MAKE THAT THE MOST AFFORDABLE TYPE OF HOUSING
WE HAVE IN THE CITY.
THAT'S ALL I'LL SAY ABOUT THAT.
3:00:18PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE DO NOT HAVE ANYONE ONLINE.
THANK YOU.
ANY FURTHER COMMENTS?
3:00:23PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
AGAIN, MAY I JUST SAY THAT I CAN'T VOTE
FOR THIS BECAUSE IT'S THE ACCESSORY DWELLINGS AND IT'S
NONCONFORMING, AND IT'S FOR BOTH, EXTENDED FAMILY AND
ACCESSORY DWELLING FOR ANYONE.
AND THEY ARE NOT GOING TO LET THEM HAVE IT FOR FREE.
THEY ARE GOING TO CHARGE AND THEY ARE NOT PAYING ANYBODY
ANYTHING AND THEY ARE JUST LIVING OFF THE FAT OF THE LAND.
3:00:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:00:49PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
JUST TO RESPOND TO COMMENT, I AGREE THAT
THOSE ARE CHEAP.
HOWEVER, MY CONCERN IS HABITABILITY.

SO JUST BECAUSE SOMETHING IS AFFORDABLE DOESN'T MEAN IT
SHOULD BE -- THAT IT IS HABITABLE, AND I THINK WHAT WE ARE
ALL TRYING TO DO IS MOVE FROM HOUSING THAT IS NOT LATELY
RIGHT NOW, AND I BELIEVE ALL OF US HAVE IT IN OUR GOALS TO
DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO MAKE THAT HABITABLE, TO BRING PEOPLE
INTO COMPLIANCE BECAUSE WE WANT PEOPLE TO DEFINITELY BE
LIVING SOMEWHERE THAT'S SAFE BUT ALSO AFFORDABLE.
I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO DECIDE ONE OR THE OTHER.
I THINK WE CAN HAVE BOTH.
3:01:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS?
I JUST HAVE TO MAKE THIS COMMENT.
I'M GOING TO VOTE YES FOR THIS BUT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT
THIS MUCH FURTHER.
IT GOES FURTHER THAN WHAT COUNCILMAN MIRANDA IS SAYING.
IF SOMEONE WALKS INTO AN ACCESSORY DWELLING USE, I WANT TO
RENT IT.
I'D LIKE TO SIGN A LEASE.
THE OWNER SAYS, NO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A LEASE,
MEANING THEY ARE NOT GOING TO REPORT THIS SO THEY DON'T HAVE
TO PAY TAXES ON IT.
IT'S AFFORDABLE NOW, BUT THAT RENT COULD BE INCREASED AT ANY
TIME THE PERSON WANTS TO.
SO I AM GOING TO VOTE YES, BUT WE NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT
THIS FURTHER.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.

SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA.
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ALL IN FAVOR AYE.
IS THERE ANY OPPOSED?
3:02:24PM >> AYE.
3:02:25PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
DID YOU GET THAT?
DO YOU WANT TO DO ROLL CALL?
ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE.
3:02:34PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
NO.
3:02:36PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
3:02:38PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
3:02:40PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NO.
3:02:42PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
3:02:45PM >>BILL CARLSON:
NO.
3:02:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ONLY WITH SOME INVESTIGATING LATER ON, YES.
3:02:54PM >>THE CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED WITH GUDES, MIRANDA, AND CARLSON
VOTING NO.
3:03:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. COTTON.
3:03:05PM >>ERIC COTTON:
CAN I HAVE THE PRESENTATION BACK?
THANK YOU.
NEXT UP IS ACTUALLY A CHANGE TO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT
STANDARDS.
RIGHT NOW, AS I SAID EARLIER, THEY ARE A SPECIAL USE IN TWO
SECTIONS OF THE CITY -- SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AND THE LOWRY PARK
CENTRAL AREA.

WHAT THIS IS PROPOSING IS TO REMOVE THEM FROM REQUIRING THE
SPECIAL USE APPROVAL AND ALLOWING THEM TO BE PERMITTED
ELSEWHERE IN THE CITY.
GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE REAL QUICK.
RIGHT NOW THE CODE WOULD PROPOSE THEM TO BE ALLOWED IN THE
CENTRAL TAMPA, WESTSHORE, AND UNIVERSITY PLANNING DISTRICTS
BY RIGHT.
SO ANYBODY WHO HAS -- COULD APPLY THROUGH PERMITTING AND
ESTABLISH AN ADU IN ANY OF THOSE AREAS THAT ARE SHOWN ON THE
SCREEN.
SO WE CREATED, OR PROPOSING SPECIFIC STANDARDS FOR THOSE
USES -- OR FOR THAT USE.
RIGHT NOW, SOME OF THIS CURRENTLY IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS WHICH
WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED BY COUNCIL WHICH IS MAXIMUM SIZE OF
950 SQUARE FEET.
THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT CAN ONLY BE ON A PIECE OF
PROPERTY THAT'S OWNER OCCUPIED IN THE FRONT TO THE MAIN
HOUSE, WOULD HAVE TO BE OWNER OCCUPIED.
YOU CAN DESIGN IT EITHER WITHIN THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME, LIKE
A USE, HAPPY DAYS WHERE LIKE THE ATTIC WAS ON TOP WHERE
FONZIE WOULD RENT OUT FROM THE CUNNINGHAMS OR IN A SEPARATE
ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, LIKE DETACHED DWELLING UNIT OR
WHATEVER.
NO MORE THAN TWO PEOPLE IN THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE ANY GIVEN
TIME AND YOU COULD SEPARATELY METER THE STRUCTURE ITSELF.

3:04:57PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:04:58PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH B.
ONLY BECAUSE, A, THEY ARE EVERYWHERE.
I CAN GIVE YOU A HUGE LIST RIGHT NOW WHERE THE FRONT AND
BACK ARE BEING RENTED IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND IT'S NOT A HUGE PROBLEM.
ALSO, WHAT I'VE HEARD FROM LANDLORDS IN THE PAST WEEK
KNOWING THIS IS COMING UP IS SAYING, HEY, WE ACTUALLY HAVE
THE CAPITAL TO PUT THESE IN AND WE WOULD DO IT WITH OUR
EXISTING RENTAL HOUSING.
SO I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO LOOK AT THAT FURTHER.
BUT THE OTHER ONE FOR ME IS D.
I THOUGHT THAT THAT HAD CHANGED TO TWO UNRELATED OCCUPANTS,
BUT I WAS THINKING LIKE A SMALL FAMILY.
3:05:48PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THEY WOULD NOT BE UNRELATED.
3:05:52PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY.
I'M SORRY.
SO NEVER MIND.
MY CONCERN IS B BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT I'M HEARING FROM
CONSTITUENTS THAT ARE LANDLORDS ARE SAYING THEY WOULD LIKE
TO USE THIS TO INCREASE THE HOUSING STOCK.
3:06:14PM >>ERIC COTTON:
WELL, THE BASIS FOR THAT REQUIREMENT, THAT'S
CURRENTLY WHAT IS IN THE CODE NOW FOR SEMINOLE HEIGHTS.
SOME OF THE BASIS, FOR THOSE THAT THINK COUNCILMAN MIRANDA
WAS ON COUNCIL MAYBE BACK WHEN THE ZONING FOR SULPHUR

SPRINGS WENT INTO EFFECT AND ZONING WENT FROM SINGLE-FAMILY
TO R-2.
AND PART OF THAT AND I WAS TALKING TO SUSAN SWIFT, WHO WAS
HERE THIS MORNING BECAUSE SHE WAS WITH THE CITY WHEN THAT
TOOK PLACE, THE LOGIC ON THOSE, YOU WOULD HAVE A DUPLEX,
OWNER-OCCUPIED RENTAL AND WHAT ENDED UP HAPPENING IS BOTH
ENDED UP BEING RENTAL UNITS AND THERE WAS NO OWNERSHIP TO
THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND THAT'S WHERE STAFF IS COMING FROM BASED ON THAT
EXPERIENCE.
THE CURRENT LANGUAGE IN THE CODE TO REQUIRE ONE TO BE OWNER
OCCUPIED BEFORE YOU COULD RENT OUT THE BACK.
THAT'S THE BASIS OF THAT REQUIREMENT.
3:06:59PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES, BUT I THINK IT HAMSTRINGS PEOPLE.
I MEAN, IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, ONE OF MY NEIGHBORS OWNS 12
DIFFERENT RENTAL PROPERTIES AT LEAST IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND HER HOUSES ARE IMPECCABLY MAINTAINED.
SHE HAS HIGH STANDARDS FOR HER TENANTS, BUT WE HAVE
INCREDIBLY DEEP LOTS IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS.
SHE WOULD LOVE TO BUILD ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS TO PROVIDE
MORE HOUSING.
BUT IF SHE DOESN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT, I MEAN,
THAT'S 12 MORE UNITS.
I HESITATE -- MAYBE ON SMALLER LOTS, BUT --
3:07:39PM >>ERIC COTTON:
IT'S A DECISION OF COUNCIL ON HOW YOU WANT TO

DIRECT THIS.
THIS IS STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION.
BUT IF COUNCIL WANTS TO -- DOESN'T WANT THAT REQUIREMENT, I
MEAN, THAT'S THE PURVIEW OF CITY COUNCIL ON THAT.
3:07:50PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IF I CAN FOR JUST A SECOND.
THESE CRITERIA CAME OUT OF THE PRELIMINARY DISCUSSION WE HAD
WITH YOU ALL IN JUNE.
AND WE DEVELOPED THESE FIVE AFTER COMPARING NOTES, WORKING
WITH STEVEN, YOU KNOW, AND COMING TOGETHER AND WRITING THIS
CODE TO SAY, OKAY, HERE'S WHERE WE'RE GOING TO START.
SO THAT'S WHAT IS BEFORE YOU TODAY.
HERE'S WHERE WE'RE STARTING.
IF YOU DON'T WANT A, B, C AND D AND YOU WANT THEM TO BE WHAT
-- I MEAN, IT'S AT THE PURVIEW OF COUNCIL.
THESE ARE STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS TO YOU.
AND AS A BOARD, YOU CAN TELL US THE DIRECTION YOU'D LIKE US
TO TAKE.
3:08:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
3:08:32PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU, SIR.
AGAIN, CONFIRMING -- AND I'M SUPPORTIVE OF THIS.
I THINK BY AND LARGE -- I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THERE COULD BE
UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES BUT GENERALLY SUPPORTIVE, BUT,
AGAIN, CONFIRMING THE RESTRICTED NEIGHBORHOODS, 33647,
ET CETERA, WOULDN'T BE AFFECTED BY THIS, CORRECT?

3:08:52PM >>ERIC COTTON:
CORRECT.
3:08:53PM >>LUIS VIERA:
BECAUSE I'M OCD.
ANOTHER THING THAT I WOULD RECOMMEND IS MAYBE, AGAIN,
UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES OF THIS IS MAYBE A MOTION, MAYBE
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WHO BROUGHT THIS UP, AND AGAIN VERY
SUPPORTIVE, MAYBE TO LOOK AT THIS RETURNING BACK TO US IN
NINE MONTHS, A YEAR, WHATEVER IT MAY BE, JUST TO SEE HOW
IT'S GOING AND WHAT ANY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES ARE, HOWEVER
WE MAY PULL THE NUMBERS TOGETHER.
SO JUST SOMETHING THAT I WOULD SUGGEST MAYBE BE DONE IF YOU
WOULD BE AMENABLE TO THAT.
OH, A MOTION TO MAYBE HAVE THIS COME BACK TO US MAYBE IN A
YEAR, WHATEVER, TO SEE HOW THIS IS GOING, ANY UNINTENDED
CONSEQUENCES.
3:09:37PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
ABSOLUTELY.
3:09:38PM >>LUIS VIERA:
I'M SUPPORTIVE.
EVERYTHING HAS GRAY IN IT, RIGHT?
3:09:41PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I THINK THAT IS A WONDERFUL IDEA BECAUSE WE
HAVE TO LOOK AT HOW THIS EXPANDS, BUT THE REALITY IS THESE
AREN'T CHEAP TO BUILD.
SO YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE PEOPLE -- THESE AREN'T GOING TO
END UP BEING PLACES WHERE WE HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE UPKEEP
GOING -- THAT'S PROBABLY FURTHER DOWN IN THE FUTURE, SEVERAL
YEARS IN.
BUT ABSOLUTELY, TO KEEP BRINGING THIS UP.

BUT WHAT WE'RE HEARING NOW AND LOUD AND CLEAR FROM
RESIDENTS, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE
AND LITERALLY ANYTHING ELSE WE CAN DO TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO
BUILD THESE WOULD BE WHAT I WOULD SUPPORT.
I WOULD ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT IT COMING BACK IN A YEAR OR SO
WITH MORE -- WITH MAYBE A CODE ENFORCEMENT LOOK OR SOMETHING
LIKE THAT.
3:10:44PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU, MADAM.
AND THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
I SALUTE YOU FOR THE "HAPPY DAYS" COMMENT.
THAT WAS WELL DONE.
3:10:50PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THANK YOU.
I AGE MYSELF.
WHAT CAN I SAY?
3:10:58PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
3:10:59PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I LOOK AT IT AND SOMETHING I HAVE TO
SINGLE OUT HERE.
AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY BE DESIGNATED -- DESIGNED TO BE
LOCATED WITHIN A SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH A SEPARATE
ENTRANCE, AND THAT'S HAPPENING ALL OVER NOW.
IF WE PASS THIS, ALL THOSE THAT HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR
YEARS, COLLECTING AND NOT PAYING, I DON'T WANT TO BE AN
ACCESSORY TO A CRIME AND THEN THAT C AND E, C AND E
CONTRADICT EACH OTHER.
AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY BE SEPARATELY METERED FOR

UTILITIES.
THEY ARE NOT.
I'LL TELL YOU WHY THEY ARE NOT, BECAUSE THEY GET A HOUSE.
THEY DIVIDE IT.
THEY CHANGE THE WALLS.
THEY ADD RESTROOMS.
THEY PUT MINOR KITCHENS IN THEM.
GUESS WHAT, NOW YOU HAVE THREE AND FOUR UNITS IN A HOUSE AND
YOU'RE COLLECTING.
WHAT HAPPENS, THE KEY TO THIS, THE FIRST THING THEY DO IS
FENCE IT OFF WITH A PLASTIC FENCE.
THE NEXT THING THEY DO, ONE UTILITY YOU CAN FOLLOW, THEY PUT
SOLAR SO YOUR ELECTRIC BILL IS LESS, SO THEY CAN'T PUT FOUR
METERS IN THE HOUSE.
THEY ONLY HAVE ONE METER.
AND THAT'S THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN VERIFY BY CHECKING THE
AVERAGE FLOW OF WATER WITHIN THAT BLOCK.
THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS, C AND E CONTRADICT EACH OTHER.
WITHIN A SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH A SEPARATE ENTRANCE OR
AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
I CAN SHOW YOU HOUSES NOW WHERE THEY HAVE FOUR DOORS ON THE
OUTSIDE.
THEY MARKED APARTMENT A, B, C AND D.
3:12:28PM >>ERIC COTTON:
MOST LIKELY NONE OF THOSE ARE PROBABLY LEGAL
UNITS.

3:12:32PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NONE OF THEM ARE LEGAL.
ONCE WE PASS THIS, THEY BECOME LEGAL TO SOME DEGREE.
3:12:37PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THIS IS ONLY ALLOWING FOR ONE ACCESSORY UNIT
ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY.
I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM, COUNCILMAN.
3:12:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THIS IS ONLY ONE DWELLING UNIT PROPERTY.
NOT DWELLING ON OUTSIDE.
THIS IS ONE DWELLING THAT'S BEEN CUT UP INSIDE AND MADE IT
TO WHATEVER THEY WANT.
3:12:52PM >>ERIC COTTON:
UNDER ZONING, WHAT YOU ARE DESCRIBING IS FOUR
DWELLING UNITS, NOT ONE ANYMORE.
THIS IS ALLOWING, AS COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WAS SAYING, PEOPLE
WHO HAVE A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME IN FRONT, THEY WOULD BE ABLE
-- AND THEY BUILD AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, THEY COULD
HAVE THAT SEPARATELY METERED AND NOT HAVE TO JUMP THE METER,
THE ELECTRIC FROM THE MAIN HOUSE BACK TO THE ACCESSORY
DWELLING UNIT.
THAT COULD HAVE IT OWN METER, RECEIVE ITS OWN BILL FROM
TECO.
CITY WATER WOULD HAVE ITS OWN WATER AND SANITARY SEWER
METER.
THAT'S WHAT THE LOGIC, THAT'S WHAT THE IMPETUS BEHIND THE
LANGUAGE IS BASICALLY GOING TO ALLOW.
WE'RE NOT -- NOTHING IN THIS IS ATTEMPTING TO MAKE WHAT
YOU'RE DESCRIBING LEGAL.

3:13:40PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:13:41PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M GOING TO MAKE -- WE DON'T REALLY QUITE
HAVE A MOTION FOR THIS YET.
I SORT OF DID, BUT I THINK THE BIGGER DISCUSSION THAT WE ALL
NEED TO HAVE IN ANOTHER MEETING IS HOW -- I'M GOING TO MAKE
A MOTION FOR STAFF TO BRING BACK A PLAN FOR BRINGING NON---
IS IT NONCOMPLIANCE STRUCTURES?
NONCONFORMING --
3:14:07PM >>ERIC COTTON:
NO.
ILLEGAL.
3:14:08PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
ILLEGAL.
THANK YOU.
FOR BRINGING ILLEGAL ACCESSORY DWELLINGS, ADUs, FAMILY, I
GUESS WE'LL USE BOTH LANGUAGE AT THIS POINT, ACCESSORY
DWELLINGS AND EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES OR JUST --
3:14:29PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WHAT ABOUT ILLEGAL RESIDENTIAL UNITS?
3:14:33PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THAT WORKS.
THANK YOU.
A MOTION FOR STAFF TO BRING BACK A PLAN FOR BRINGING ILLEGAL
RESIDENTIAL UNITS INTO COMPLIANCE.
ONE OF THE THINGS I WAS THINKING ABOUT IS MAYBE A YEAR OF
AMNESTY.
EAST TAMPA CRA IS TALKING ABOUT THE RENTAL ASSISTANCE
PROGRAM FOR MAKING RENTAL STRUCTURES HABITABLE, LIKE GOING
TO THE LANDLORDS AND SAYING, HEY, WE'LL HELP YOU PAY FOR

THIS AND WE'LL PUT A LIEN ON THE PROPERTY AND YOU HAVE TO
GUARANTEE YOU'LL KEEP IT AFFORDABLE.
I'VE TALKED TO STAFF ABOUT THIS BEFORE.
MAYBE A PROGRAM LIKE THAT.
BECAUSE HE IS RIGHT, WE ALL HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW DO WE
ENCOURAGE AND MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO BRING BACK, TO GET INTO
COMPLIANCE FOR HABITABILITY AND FOR JUST SO WE KNOW HOW MANY
WE HAVE.
3:15:25PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IF I CAN ASK, IN THAT MOTION, THAT WOULD BE
CODE ENFORCEMENT AND LAND DEVELOPMENT TO COME BACK WITH THAT
PLAN.
3:15:32PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY.
3:15:33PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I THINK THE FIRST THING ON THAT WOULD BE
UNDERSTANDING, BEFORE WE KNOW IF IT'S AMNESTY OR WHAT THE
SOLUTION IS, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE'RE GOING TO
ADDRESS FIRST THE PROBLEM AND WHAT IS GOING ON AND WHAT THAT
REALLY LOOKS LIKE IN TERMS OF QUANTITY OR NUMBER OF THESE
THROUGHOUT THE CITY.
THAT'S FINE.
JUST THAT WE ARE NOT THE ENFORCEMENT ARM.
I MEAN, SO WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE WORKING WITH OUR
PARTNERS ON THAT TO GET YOU THE BEST ANSWER POSSIBLE.
3:16:04PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY.
SO MAYBE MARCH WORKSHOP.
IS THAT ENOUGH TIME?

APRIL WORKSHOP?
3:16:15PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE HAVE ONE IN FEBRUARY THAT'S GETTING
PRETTY FULL.
I'LL ASK FOR TIME TO WORK WITH KEITH O'CONNOR AND THAT TEAM
TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEIR CURRENT PROCEDURES ARE WHEN THEY
ARE DEALING WITH THAT, HOW THAT LOOKS.
UNDERSTAND HOW MANY WE MIGHT HAVE UNDER CITATION RIGHT NOW
OR WITH LIENS.
APRIL WOULD BE FINE.
3:16:34PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
APRIL, PERFECT.
AND THAT WOULD BE APRIL -- IT LOOKS LIKE APRIL 27th.
3:16:47PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN
HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ALL IN FAVOR?
3:16:52PM >> AYE.
3:16:52PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THERE ANY OPPOSED?
THANK YOU.
3:17:00PM >>ERIC COTTON:
THERE STILL NEEDS TO BE -- ON THE ISSUE WE
WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT, THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS
STANDARDS, WAS THAT MOTION -- THE MOTION WAS FOR LAND
DEVELOPMENT TO WORK WITH CODE ENFORCEMENT, BUT WHAT ABOUT
THIS CASE RIGHT HERE?
YOU WANT TO TAKE ACTION ON THIS TODAY OR --
3:17:22PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THERE ANYONE IN THE PUBLIC THAT WISHES TO

SPEAK TO THIS PART OF AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7?
3:17:30PM >> I THINK THAT -- I THINK WE'RE ALL A LITTLE BIT CONFUSED
BY THE PROCESS RIGHT NOW.
THIS NEEDS TO CARRY ON THAT WAS SOMETHING VOTED ON NEXT
MONTH.
THAT'S MY POINT OF VIEW ON THIS.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU DON'T MAKE A MOTION,
WHETHER IT JUST DOESN'T COME BACK NEXT MONTH.
SO I WOULD REALLY APPRECIATE A MOTION TO MAKE SURE IT COMES
BACK NEXT MONTH.
SPECIFICALLY, I WANT TO POINT OUT WHY THIS ITEM IS
IMPORTANT.
WE'RE LOOKING FOR CHANGES THAT ARE GOING TO ACTUALLY CREATE
A USEFUL AMOUNT OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THE CITY OF TAMPA.
I HEARD A CITY LIKE OURS CAN EXPECT IF WE IMPLEMENT A REALLY
GOOD POLICY TO HAVE 300 PER YEAR.
IF WE COULD DO 300 ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS PER YEAR, THAT
WOULD BE AN INCREDIBLE ACHIEVEMENT.
IT WON'T CREATE 10,000.
IT WILL CREATE 300.
IF WE'RE MAKING RULES AND BEING PICKY AND RESULT IN 50 BEING
BUILT, THEN THIS DAY WOULD HAVE BEEN A WASTE OF OUR TIME.
50 HOMES IS NOT GOING TO MOVE THE NEEDLE.
WHEN WE LOOK AT B OR THE ONE COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WAS TALKING
ABOUT WITH THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE, I THINK THAT'S THE MOST

IMPACTFUL CHANGE THAT WE CAN MAKE TO WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED
HERE THAT WILL TAKE US FROM 50 TO 150 OR -- TAKE TO US THE
NEXT LEVEL IN TERMS OF HOW MANY OF THESE THINGS GET
PRODUCED.
I WOULD HATE FOR US TO GO THROUGH ALL THIS, AT THE END, DO
THE MEETING A YEAR FROM NOW AND WE FIND OUT THERE'S BEEN 50
APPLICATIONS BECAUSE WHY WOULD YOU DO IT WITH ALL THESE
RULES WE HAVE IN PLACE?
WE NEED TO HAVE THIS NEW RULE PASSED BUT I WOULD LOVE TO SEE
A CHANGE THAT SAYS HOMEOWNERS WHO CAN AFFORD TO BUILD THESE
WILL ACTUALLY BUILD THEM.
3:19:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ELSE WITHIN CHAMBERS WHO WOULD LIKE
TO SPEAK TO THIS?
MS. POYNOR, YOU'RE ONLINE?
3:19:21PM >> HEY.
GOOD AFTERNOON.
I DON'T THINK IT MAKES TWO FLIPS OF A DIFFERENCE WHETHER THE
LANDLORD LIVES ON THE PROPERTY OR NOT.
IF THEY ARE GOING TO BE A GOOD LANDLORD, THEY'LL BE A GOOD
LANDLORD WHETHER THEY LIVE THERE OR WHETHER THEY LIVE DOWN
THE STREET OR ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
IT REALLY DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE.
OH, CRAP, I LOST MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT.
BOTTOM LINE IS THAT IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE.
I JUST DON'T WANT TO SEE THESE IN THE CHHA.

SORRY, NOT SORRY.
AND 300 OF THEM, THAT IS NOT EVEN GOING TO TOUCH THE 3,000
THAT WE STILL HAVE COMING SOUTH OF GANDY, WEST OF DALE
MABRY.
THEY ARE ALREADY COMING.
THANK YOU.
3:20:10PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. BENNETT, YOU ARE ONLINE?
MS. BENNETT?
3:20:22PM >> CAN YOU HEAR ME?
OKAY.
MY NAME IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
I WANTED TO SPEAK ON THE LAST ITEM, AND I WASN'T GIVEN THE
OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO.
MY CONCERN IS THAT I DON'T FEEL LIKE THE PUBLIC HAS REALLY
HAD A CHANCE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON AND ASK
QUESTIONS.
THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING, I CAN ONLY STAY ON FOR AN
HOUR AND A HALF.
I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH LONGER IT WENT ON.
I BELIEVE MS. FEELEY SAID IT WENT FOUR HOURS.
A LOT OF PEOPLE DIDN'T GET TO HEAR WHAT WAS GOING ON AND ASK
QUESTIONS.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING THAT'S
DEDICATED TO NOTHING BUT ADUs.
I LOOK AT THIS AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS THE SETBACK?

IS IT THREE FEET?
WHAT'S THE HEIGHT?
THERE'S JUST A LOT OF QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND
WHAT THIS IS ACTUALLY GOING TO RESULT IN.
I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE LAND USE LIMIT.
IF YOU'RE GOING TO DOUBLE THE NUMBER OF UNITS ON A PARCEL,
HOW DOES THAT AFFECT THE LAND USE?
WHAT IF IT GOES OVER WHAT THE LAND USE ALLOWS FOR THAT AREA?
I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WORKS.
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE PERSON, OWNER OCCUPIED -- I'LL TELL
YOU WHY.
MOST OF THESE ADUs ARE GOING TO BECOME AirBnBs.
VIRGINIA PARK, WHICH YOU CAN'T -- WEBSITE, AND THE ONES THAT
WE DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH, THE ONES THAT NEIGHBORS DON'T
COMPLAIN ABOUT AND THE ONES CONCERNED ABOUT, THE ONES WHERE
THE OWNER LIVES IN THE PRINCIPAL DWELLING BECAUSE THEY ARE
RIGHT THERE AND IF THINGS GET LOUD, IF THINGS GET OUT OF
HAND, IF THERE'S BAD BEHAVIOR, THEY ARE RIGHT ON TOP OF IT
BECAUSE IT'S KEEPING THEIR CHILDREN AWAKE, TOO.
I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT, WHAT ABOUT ROOFTOP?
ARE THEY ALLOWED TO HAVE A ROOFTOP PARTY AREA?
WHAT ABOUT THE 950 SQUARE FEET?
DOES THAT INCLUDE THAT?
DOES THAT INCLUDE AN ENCLOSED PATIO?
I'M NOT AGAINST ADUs.

I NEED TO MAKE THAT CLEAR.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE CHANGES BEING MADE.
IF I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, THAT MEANS A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T
UNDERSTAND IT.
I WOULD LIKE MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO ASK
QUESTIONS AND GET ANSWERS.
I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IN PRINT A WRITTEN LIST OF QUESTIONS AND
ANSWERS THAT CAME OUT OF THE LAST PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING
AND ANY FUTURE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETINGS BECAUSE A LOT OF
PEOPLE JUST WANT TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON.
THANK YOU.
3:23:03PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
IS THERE ANYONE ELSE?
3:23:06PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
JUST VERY QUICKLY.
AS I READ THIS HERE AND WHAT THE LAST SPEAKER SPOKE ABOUT,
THE MAIN RESIDENCE IS GOING TO BE OWNER OCCUPIED.
IT MAY BE THE FIRST MONTH OR SO, IT MAY NOT BE.
AND THEN YOU LOOK AT C, THE ACCESSORY DWELLING, LOCATED
WITHIN THE SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH AN ENTRANCE ON THE
STRUCTURE ON THE OUTSIDE I GUESS.
YOU LOOK AT D, AT NO TIME, NUMBER OF UNRELATED OCCUPANTS OF
AN ACCESSORY DWELLING EXCEED TWO.
WE CAN'T EVEN FIND WHO RENTS AN AirBnB FOR FIVE DAYS OR
LESS INSTEAD OF FIVE DAYS OR MORE, AND YOU'RE TELLING ME
WE'RE GOING TO FIND THIS.

WE'RE TELLING THE PUBLIC WE'LL FIND THIS.
LET'S BE REALISTIC.
YOU GO TO E, AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY, NOT SHALL, BE
SEPARATELY METERED FOR UTILITIES.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT.
YOU'RE GETTING LIKE, SAY, YOU KNOW, IT USED TO BE IN A BANK
YOU WORE A HAT AND DARK GLASSES AND A SCARF, THEY ARREST
YOU.
NOW YOU DON'T HAVE IT ON THEY ARREST.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT.
WE'RE SCARING AN IRON DOG OFF THE PORCH.
3:24:22PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
3:24:25PM >>BILL CARLSON:
CARROLL ANN BENNETT DESCRIBED EXACTLY HOW I
FEEL ABOUT THESE ITEMS.
I CAME IN HERE PREPARED TO SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE IN CONCEPT I
SUPPORT ADUs, BUT EVEN THE INFORMATION I READ OR SAW
SUGGESTED THAT SOUTH TAMPA OR PARTS OF SOUTH TAMPA WOULD BE
EXCLUDED, AND THAT THERE WOULD BE VERY TIGHT DETAILS.
I DON'T SEE IT IN HERE.
3:24:49PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
ABBYE FEELEY.
WE'RE NOT THERE YET.
3:24:53PM >>BILL CARLSON:
LIKE NATHAN SAID, IT IS THE CONFUSING ABOUT
HOW THIS IS BEING PRESENTED.
NOT CRITICIZING YOU, BUT THE CONTEXT OF IT.
IT'S LIKE THERE ARE TWO ITEMS HERE.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY SUBDECISIONS WE HAVE TO MAKE HERE.
I THINK THE WHOLE THING IS CONFUSING AND I'M SURE THE PUBLIC
IS CONFUSED.
I'M GOING TO VOTE AGAINST ALL OF THESE JUST BECAUSE IT'S
CONFUSING THE WAY IT'S BEING PRESENTED.
AND IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO VOTE TO HAVE THEM COME BACK AS
ANOTHER WORKSHOP OR SOMETHING, I'M HAPPY TO SUPPORT THAT AND
MAYBE I WOULD SUPPORT THEM THE NEXT TIME.
RIGHT NOW AS IT STANDS WITH THE INFORMATION WE HAVE, I CAN'T
SUPPORT WITH TOO MANY QUESTIONS.
3:25:37PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WE WANT TO PROVIDE A WAY FOR LIVABLE MEANS,
AND WE CAME UP WITH THE IDEA OF THE ADUs.
WE KNOW SEMINOLE HEIGHTS HAS HAD THOSE FOR A LONG, LONG
TIME, BUT THAT WAS A LONG TIME AGO.
WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS.
SO I KNOW WE'RE TRYING TO PROVIDE HOUSING, SOME TYPE OF
HOUSING.
THIS COULD BE AN EXTRA WAY TO DO IT, BUT I DON'T THINK WE'VE
GOT THE WHOLE VOTE IN THERE JUST YET.
THERE ARE MISSING COMPONENTS.
FOR ME, IF WE'RE GOING TO DO IT, THIS WOULD BE FOR
EVERYBODY.
I HEAR SOUTH TAMPA WON'T HAVE TO DO.
YOU'LL HAVE SOME COMMUNITIES -- EAST SIDE OF TOWN, THEY MAY
NOT WANT THOSE IN THE COMMUNITY EVEN THOUGH IT'S NOT DEED

RESTRICTED.
I THINK WE'LL HAVE A LOT OF CONVERSATION.
I LOOK AT THE SPECIAL NEEDS SIDE OF TOWN.
I DON'T KNOW.
SOME OF THE STRUCTURES WE HAVE, WE PROBABLY COULD USE
FIXER-UPPERS.
BUT I LOOK AT GOUGING AGAIN.
PEOPLE START, WE TALK ABOUT THE BUILDING OF THESE THINGS, I
DON'T THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION YET.
I DON'T SEE ENOUGH INFORMATION.
3:26:57PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT INFORMATION YOU
WOULD LIKE.
THIS DISCUSSION STARTED BACK IN JUNE.
WE BROUGHT BEST PRACTICES TO YOU AS TO WHAT OTHER LOCAL
GOVERNMENTS HAD.
WE GOT DIRECTION FROM YOU AS TO WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE OURS TO
LOOK LIKE.
THIS LANGUAGE HERE IS WRITTEN BASED OFF OF THAT.
THESE ARE OUR RECOMMENDATIONS PURSUANT TO HOW YOU DIRECTED
US.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE ITEM B AND YOU WANT THAT STRICKEN, THAT'S
FINE.
IF YOU WANT IT TO SAY NOTHING IN THE CHHA, THAT'S FINE.
BUT WE CAME TO YOU IN JUNE.
WE HAD THAT DISCUSSION.

WE CAME BACK IN SEPTEMBER AND PROVIDED THE DRAFT LANGUAGE
FOR EVERYONE.
WE CONDUCTED A PUBLIC INFORMATION SESSION.
MS. BENNETT AND MS. POYNOR AND MS. ZOMMERMAN HAVE BEEN
E-MAILING AND E-MAILING I THINK THREE TIMES WHILE WE WERE AT
LUNCH ON SOME OF THESE ITEMS.
THEY KNOW HOW TO REACH US.
WE'RE OPEN TO ANY SUGGESTIONS OR ANY RECOMMENDATIONS OR ANY
COMPROMISES ON ANY OF THESE CRITERIA.
WE WERE STRICTLY TAKING THE DIRECTIVE THAT WAS PROVIDED BY
YOU TO COME BACK WITH ADUs, THAT WE NEEDED ADDITIONAL
HOUSING OPTIONS AND HERE WE ARE.
THAT WAS ALMOST SIX MONTHS AGO WHEN WE STARTED THIS.
IF WE'RE NOT ON TARGET TO WHERE WE NEED TO BE IN THIS
LANGUAGE, PLEASE TELL ME WHERE YOU BELIEVE THAT IS INSTEAD
OF CONTINUING TO HAVE CIRCULAR DISCUSSIONS ON TO WHERE WE
NEED TO BE.
WE'RE HAPPY TO GO BACK AND LOOK AGAIN AT OTHER CITIES AND
BRING THAT BACK, BUT I THINK WE'VE GOT A REALLY GOOD START
AS TO WHAT WE NEED.
WHICH DON'T WANT OWNER OCCUPIED, WE CAN TAKE OUT LETTER B.
THAT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THERE.
THIS IS THE CODE THAT WE'RE WORKING ON TOGETHER TODAY
THROUGH THIS WORKSHOP IN ORDER TO ENABLE THIS IN THE WAY WE
COLLECTIVELY WANT TO SEE IT HAPPEN TO PROVIDE ALTERNATIVE

HOUSING SOLUTIONS.
3:28:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:28:50PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
WE DESPERATELY NEED HOUSING.
WE DESPERATELY NEED HOUSING.
I UNDERSTAND THAT WE HAVE CONCERNS, BUT LITERALLY IN THE
NEXT SEVERAL SLIDES DEAL WITH SETBACKS, DEAL WITH HEIGHT
RESTRICTIONS.
I MEAN, ALL OF THIS IS ALREADY IN THIS.
THIS IS JUST TALKING ABOUT THE STANDARDS THAT ARE GOING TO
APPLY.
WE HAVEN'T EVEN DECIDED WHERE WE'RE GOING TO PUT THEM YET.
THIS IS JUST STANDARDS.
AND THIS IS INCREDIBLY FRUSTRATING.
THIS IS NOT -- WE'RE NOT DECIDING IT RIGHT NOW.
WE WILL HAVE A FIRST READING.
THE PUBLIC WILL HAVE A CHANCE TO TALK ABOUT EACH OF THESE
ITEMS THEN.
BUT THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED BY US.
THIS HAS HAD A PUBLIC MEETING.
THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE IN SEMINOLE
HEIGHTS. ANYONE WANTS TO COME, I WILL GIVE YOU A TOUR OF
SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AND WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE AND HOW THE
COMMUNITY DEALS WITH THEM.
I DON'T EVEN NOTICE THEM ANYMORE.
THERE'S NOT A NEW CONSTRUCTION IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD THAT DOES

NOT ALREADY HAVE ONE OF THESE BEING BUILT BECAUSE IT HELPS
WITH A MORTGAGE.
IT PROVIDES LIVING SITUATIONS FOR MAYBE A CHILD OR AN
ELDERLY FAMILY MEMBER.
BUT WE'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT HOUSING.
WE CANNOT KEEP KICKING THE CAN.
3:30:05PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
3:30:06PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I'M GOOD, SIR.
3:30:07PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
3:30:18PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I DON'T KNOW WHAT EVERYBODY IS PLANNING ON
DOING RIGHT NOW, BUT I WOULD LIKE FOR YOU TO GO THROUGH THE
SLIDES.
ORIGINALLY WE TALKED ABOUT MAYBE GOING THROUGH ALL OF THEM
AND COMING BACK.
ARE THERE SLIDES YOU HAVEN'T SHOWN YET?
3:30:30PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
YES.
3:30:31PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I THINK IF WE SAW ALL OF IT, MAYBE THAT
WOULD CHANGE THE DISCUSSION.
3:30:42PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
OKAY.
AND THEN I WILL FINISH MY STATEMENT.
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:30:47PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M JUST GOING TO GO AHEAD AND MAKE A MOTION
TO PASS SECTION 27-132 AND SECTION 27-282.30, ACCESSORY
DWELLING UNITS, SPECIFIED USES BY TAKING -- AND TAKING OUT
SECTION B.

LET'S JUST SEE WHERE WE ARE.
3:31:08PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SECOND.
3:31:09PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN
HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
3:31:17PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
YEAH, I'M GLAD TO VOTE YES.
I KNOW SOME FOLKS ARE TALKING ABOUT POTENTIAL IMPERFECTIONS
IN THIS.
I DON'T REALLY NECESSARILY SEE ANY, BUT WE CAN'T LET THE
IMPERFECT BE THE ENEMY OF THE PRETTY DAMN GOOD, ESPECIALLY
WITH A HOUSING CRISIS THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW.
SO I WOULD URGE A YES VOTE.
MY ONLY QUESTION IS COUNCILMAN CARLSON, DID YOU WANT TO SEE
ALL THE OTHER SLIDES BEFORE VOTING?
3:31:50PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
3:31:51PM >>BILL CARLSON:
LIKE I SAID, WITHOUT THE LARGER CONTEXT I'M
GOING TO VOTE AGAINST ALL OF THESE.
IT'S NOT THAT I'M AGAINST ADUs.
I CAN'T VOTE FOR IT WITH THIS PROCESS.
ALSO, I WOULD WANT TO KEEP IN B ON THIS ALSO.
3:32:05PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
FOR THE PURPOSES OF THE PUBLIC AT HOME WHO
DON'T SEE IT ON THE SCREEN, COULD YOU PLEASE TELL THE PUBLIC

WHAT B THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TAKING OUT IS AND HOW IT IS
REFERENCED.
3:32:13PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
B IS AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT MAY ONLY BE
APPROVED WHEN THE MAIN RESIDENCE IS OWNER OCCUPIED.
AGAIN, THE REASONING FOR THAT, LIKE MR. MIRANDA SAID, IT MAY
BE FOR ONE MONTH BUT YOU CAN'T REALLY CONTROL IT AFTER THAT.
3:32:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
3:32:26PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I UNDERSTAND THE NEED FOR AFFORDABLE
HOUSING.
THE CITY HAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO BUY LAND.
THERE'S LAND RIGHT NOW FOR SALE ON MacDILL AND CYPRESS,
BOTH SIDES OF THE CORNER, THEY CAN TEAR DOWN THAT AND BUILD
SOME REAL, FOUR, FIVE, SIX STORY HIGH BUILDINGS AND HAVE ALL
THEY WANT.
ALSO ANOTHER 1.5 ACRES ON NORTH ARMENIA THE OTHER SIDE OF
HILLSBOROUGH AVENUE ON THE EAST SIDE, OR THE WEST SIDE
FACING EAST.
YOU CAN PUT SMALL UNITS IN THERE AND DO ALL YOU WANT.
BUT WHEN YOU GO INTO A NEIGHBORHOOD AND ANYONE THAT'S HERE
WANTS ME TO GIVE AN IDEA OF WHAT'S HAPPENING, CALL ME AND
I'LL GIVE YOU A TOUR OF WHERE I LIVE.
AND IF THE MEDIA WANTS TO COME, I'LL SHOW YOU 7 AND 8 CARS
IN ONE LOT WHERE SITS ON THE GRASS.
BUILD THE SIDEWALKS AND ALL KINDS OF VEHICLES ON THE
SIDEWALKS.

I CAN SHOW YOU THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING.
AND THAT'S WHY I CAN'T SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT'S
GOING TO HAPPEN.
IS THIS CITYWIDE?
NO.
IT LEAVES CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY OUT.
I JUST CAN'T DO THAT.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
3:33:32PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I JUST WANT TO MAKE A STATEMENT THAT I DO
APPRECIATE THAT WE ARE BUILDING MULTIFAMILY ON MAJOR
CORRIDORS.
BUT YOU KNOW WHAT?
JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE A RENTER DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULD HAVE
TO LIVE ON A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE.
I THINK THAT EVERYONE, RENTERS AND PEOPLE WHO ARE LUCKY
ENOUGH TO BE HOMEOWNERS, BOTH OF THEM SHOULD HAVE THE
OPPORTUNITY TO LIVE IN A QUIETER NEIGHBORHOOD IF THAT'S WHAT
THEY SO CHOOSE.
AND THAT'S WHAT THIS HELPS ADD.
THIS IS ABOUT EQUITY TO ME.
AND EQUITY, IT'S JUST REALLY FRUSTRATING THAT WE'RE SAYING
THAT BECAUSE YOU'RE A RENTER YOU SHOULD REALLY ONLY BE ON
CORNERS OF MAJOR THOROUGHFARES.
AND THIS HELPS, IN MY OPINION, HELPS MAKE THAT MORE
EQUITABLE FOR PEOPLE TO HAVE OPTIONS.

AS WAS STATED EARLIER, WE'RE GOING TO BECOME A COMMUNITY OF
MORE THAN HALF RENTERS SOON.
AND WE REALLY NEED TO HAVE AN OPTION.
JUST BECAUSE YOU'RE A RENTER DOESN'T MEAN YOU DON'T HAVE
MONEY.
IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU DESERVE LESS.
I'M OFF MY HORSE.
3:34:41PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS?
3:34:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
ONE MORE.
I AGREE THAT IT'S ABOUT 50% OF THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN
TAMPA.
NOT QUITE 50, BUT IN THE HIGH 40s ARE RENTERS.
NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING A RENTER.
SOME OF THE PROPERTIES I JUST SPOKE ABOUT, ONE IS A
BEAUTIFUL LOT, IT IS ON ARMENIA AVENUE, BUT IT'S WAY BACK.
IT GOES BACK, I'D SAY A COUPLE OF HUNDRED FEET, 250 FEET OR
SO.
I DON'T OWN THE PROPERTY.
DON'T KNOW WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY.
I SAW IT WHEN I WAS DRIVING AROUND THE OTHER DAY.
THAT'S JUST MY FEELING.
YOU CANNOT HAVE THIS AND BE THE WAY IT IS NOW AND NOT
ATTACKING THOSE WHO HAVE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF THE SYSTEM.
3:35:21PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
3:35:23PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT TODAY.

I HAVE SOME CONCERNS BECAUSE I BELIEVE THIS WILL BRING ON A
LOT OF TRANSIENT BEHAVIOR IN SOME COMMUNITIES.
I KNOW SOME OF THE OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE IT, A LOT ARE
OWNER OCCUPIED THAT ARE ALREADY THERE.
THEY CAN CONTROL.
I FEEL LIKE WHEN YOU START PUTTING SOME OF THESE AND
ALLOWING SOME OF THESE IN CERTAIN COMMUNITIES, IT WILL BRING
ON MORE TRANSIT BEHAVIOR.
I WILL SUPPORT IT TODAY TO MOVE THE PROCESS FORWARD WITH
HOUSING.
WE HAVE TO TRY SOMETHING.
I'LL GIVE A TRY AND CIRCLE BACK IN A YEAR.
BUT I'LL GIVE IT A TRY TODAY.
3:35:57PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
3:35:59PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERNS OF ALL THE
DIFFERENT BOARD MEMBERS HERE.
WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS.
WE HAVE AN IMPENDING OR WE'RE IN THE RECESSION.
I DON'T KNOW HOW BAD THIS IS GOING TO GET IF WE GO TO
ANOTHER REPEAT OF WHAT 2008 TO 2012 AND BEYOND WAS.
RENTS ARE RISING.
WE DID NOT PASS ANY TYPE OF RENT CONTROL AND FOR WHATEVER
LEGAL REASONS, I GET IT.
I KNOW WE HAVE STATE PREEMPTIONS AND STUFF.
WE HAVE OFFERED DIRECT ASSISTANCE TO RENTERS, BUT THAT'S

TEMPORARY.
WE CAN'T BUILD HOUSING FAST ENOUGH, EVEN THOUGH WE HAVE
THOUSANDS OF UNITS THAT ARE PERMITTED, APPROVED, AND IN SOME
STAGE BUT EITHER WE DO SOMETHING, AND I'M GOING TO SUPPORT
THIS, OR WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN INFLUX OF HOMELESS PEOPLE ON
THE STREETS.
THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE I KNOW THAT ARE STRUGGLING
PAYCHECK TO PAYCHECK, NOT EVEN THAT.
THEY ARE STRUGGLING JUST TO MAKE ENOUGH TO PAY THE RENT AND
THEY ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING EXTRA BECAUSE THERE IS NO EXTRA.
AGAIN, WITH RISING RENTS AND THE DEMAND OF PEOPLE THAT ARE
MOVING TO TAMPA, WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING THAT IS MEANINGFUL.
I UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S NOT PERFECT.
I UNDERSTAND THERE'S A LOT OF CRITICISM ON THIS.
I UNDERSTAND A LOT OF THINGS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY,
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A BIGGER CRISIS IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING.
AND THAT'S GOING TO BE WITH PEOPLE ON THE STREETS.
THEY ARE NOT GOING TO MOVE OUT OF TAMPA BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT
GOING TO BE ABLE TO MOVE OUT OF TAMPA.
THEY LITERALLY WILL BE ON THE STREETS.
BE EVICTED.
GET THREE-DAY NOTICES, EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS.
I'M HEARING THESE STORIES.
SO I'M GOING TO SUPPORT THIS AND WE MOVE FORWARD AND THEN WE
START TWEAKING IT.

3:37:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:37:49PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I JUST WANT TO AMEND MY MOTION TO HAVE THIS
COME BACK DECEMBER 15th.
THAT WAY THE PUBLIC GETS A LITTLE BIT MORE KNOWLEDGE FOR
TIME.
3:37:59PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I WAS GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT FOR A MOMENT
BECAUSE THIS WILL -- PENDING ON ACTION ON THE MOTION HERE
TODAY, THIS WILL GO TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION ON MONDAY,
NOVEMBER 7.
WE DO COME BACK TO YOU FOR A FIRST READING ON DECEMBER 1st
WHERE WE WILL HAVE A WHOLE HEARING ON THE LANGUAGE, AND THEN
IF THERE ARE CHANGES IN BETWEEN FIRST AND SECOND READING,
JUST LIKE YOU DO WITH OTHER THINGS, YOU COULD MAKE CHANGES
THEN AGAIN.
THIS ISN'T THE END-ALL, BE-ALL BEFORE YOU TODAY.
AND WE HAVE TIME.
AND IF THE PUBLIC OR MS. BENNETT OR MS. ZOMMERMAN WOULD LIKE
TO MEET WITH OUR TEAM AGAIN BEFORE THAT AND BEFORE WE COME
BACK ON THAT DECEMBER 1st, WE ARE ALWAYS AVAILABLE TO HAVE
THOSE DISCUSSIONS.
3:38:40PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THE ONLY REASON I MENTION THAT IS BECAUSE
THIS IS WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE ON DECEMBER 1st.
I JUST THINK IF WE MOVED --
3:38:49PM >>ERIC COTTON:
DECEMBER 1st IS GOING TO BE A NIGHT
MEETING.

3:38:51PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
-- COGNIZANT OF WHAT WE PUT ON THE AGENDAS.
3:38:54PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IT IS AN EVENING HEARING ON THE 1st.
3:38:56PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
NO.
COUNCIL.
THIS IS DECEMBER 1st, OUR REGULAR SESSION.
3:38:59PM >>ERIC COTTON:
LAND DEVELOPMENT COORDINATION.
THE ACTUAL ADOPTION OF LANGUAGE, BECAUSE WE'RE CHANGING THE
USE TABLES, THAT BECOMES A NIGHTTIME MEETING.
3:39:07PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
APOLOGIES.
YEAH.
I THINK DECEMBER 1st IS FINE.
THANK YOU.
SORRY ABOUT THAT.
3:39:13PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER FURTHER DISCUSSION?
WHEN I FIRST MOVED -- ARE WE SAYING THAT THIS IS GOING TO
NOT BE IN SOUTH TAMPA?
3:39:21PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE HAVE NOT DISCUSSED WITH YOU THE AREAS
YET.
WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS WITH YOU NEXT.
WE'RE SAYING WHERE THESE WOULD BE ALLOWED, THESE WOULD BE
THE CRITERIA UNDER WHICH THEY WOULD BE ALLOWED.
3:39:30PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WHEN I FIRST MOVED TO SOUTH TAMPA BACK IN
THE '80s, THERE WAS ALL THESE -- ALL THE MULTIMILLION
DOLLAR HOMES IN SOUTH TAMPA WERE ALL CUT UP INTO FIVE OR SIX
DWELLINGS.

AND YOU HAD THE WORST SLUMLORDS IN THE WORLD.
BUT ON EACH ONE OF THESE MULTIMILLION DOLLAR NOW DWELLINGS,
YOU HAD A CARRIAGE HOUSE THAT HAD A UNIT UPSTAIRS.
FAST-FORWARD 30 YEARS, THOSE MULTIMILLION DOLLAR DWELLINGS
ARE NOW JUST ONE UNIT, BUT THOSE CARRIAGE HOUSES ARE STILL
BEING RENTED OUT AS ACCESSORY DWELLINGS.
I'M JUST SAYING THIS.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE B STRICKEN AND I WOULD LIKE TO SEE C
STRICKEN.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN -- NOT NOW, IN THE FUTURE.
3:40:35PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
OH, IN THE FUTURE.
3:40:38PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
NOT NOW.
IN THE FUTURE.
BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING, FIRST, SECOND READING, WE'LL
DISCUSS THAT LATER.
3:40:45PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
NO, SIR.
3:40:49PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I NEED TO KNOW NOW.
ON C, THIS IS SAYING HOW IT MAY BE DESIGNED TO BE EITHER
SEPARATE OR WITHIN.
3:41:02PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I JUST DON'T WANT TO SEE A UNIT DIVIDED UP,
A SINGLE-FAMILY UNIT.
3:41:08PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IT CAN ONLY BE LIKE IF YOU DID IT WITHIN AN
EXISTING GARAGE.
3:41:13PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
EXISTING GARAGE.

3:41:17PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THAT'S WHAT IT'S SPEAKING TO.
3:41:18PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
-- MAIN STRUCTURE.
MY BAD.
3:41:25PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
THE MOTION IS TO HAVE B STRICKEN.
THAT IS THE MOTION.
YOU WANT TO AMEND THE MOTION TO TAKE SOMETHING ELSE OUT,
SIR?
3:41:34PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ADD E TO IT.
THANK YOU.
3:41:37PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I WON'T TAKE THAT AMENDMENT BECAUSE OUR MIND
-- MINE IS SEPARATELY METERED RIGHT NOW.
AND IT SAYS "MAY" NOT "SHALL."
YOU COULD HAVE IT METERED BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE IT
METERED.
I DON'T THINK SEPARATELY METERED FOR UTILITIES REALLY MAKES
A DIFFERENCE.
I'M CURIOUS WHY.
WHAT'S YOUR RATIONALE?
3:42:00PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MOST TIMES WHEN CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT TO
INSPECT, IF THEY ARE ALLOWED TO GET -- IF THEY ARE ALLOWED
TO GET OVER THE FENCE AND SOMEONE SAYS, NO, NO, WE ONLY HAVE
ONE METER --
3:42:12PM >> THAT MEANS THEIR UNIT IS PROBABLY ILLEGAL.
SO THIS WOULD ALLOW THEM TO ACTUALLY LEGALLY ESTABLISH IT
WITH A SECOND METER.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR.
3:42:21PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
AND SHOULD HAVE A SEPARATE METER.
3:42:24PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
IT COULD HAVE EITHER IS WHAT THEY ARE
SAYING.
IF IT'S OWNER OCCUPIED AND YOU'RE DOING IT ACCESSORY AND YOU
WANT TO USE THE MAIN HOUSE METER AND YOU DON'T CARE, YOU
DON'T WANT TO CHARGE SOMEBODY SEPARATE FOR THE UTILITIES,
THEN YOU COULD USE THE SAME METER.
IF NOT, YOU MIGHT ELECT TO HAVE IT SEPARATELY METERED.
3:42:41PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IF YOU HAVE THE SAME METER BUT YOU HAVE AN
ACCESSORY DWELLING THAT'S BEING RENTED OUT.
THERE'S NO SEPARATION.
3:42:49PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THEY JUST ADD TO THE FEE.
3:42:51PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I UNDERSTAND THAT.
BUT IF CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT AND ACCESSORY DWELLING,
SOMEBODY SAYS, NO, NO ONE LIVES THERE, BY HAVING A SEPARATE
METER YOU'RE SAYING, YES, THERE IS ANOTHER PERSON.
3:43:02PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
NOT NECESSARILY.
3:43:03PM >>ERIC COTTON:
AGAIN, IF THESE ARE ALLOWED AS SPECIFIED
USES, THERE WOULDN'T BE A NEED FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT TO GO
OUT AND CHECK TO SEE IF THE UNIT IS ILLEGAL BECAUSE THEY
WOULD -- ASSUMING I HAVE A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.
I HAVE AN ACCESSORY UNIT RIGHT NOW, I'M RENTING THAT OUT
ILLEGALLY, THEORETICALLY, IF THIS WAS APPROVED AND I'M IN
THE RIGHT LOCATION WE'LL DISCUSS MOMENTARILY, THAT SECOND

UNIT COULD BECOME LEGAL.
SO THERE WOULD BE NO NEED FOR A CITATION TO BE ISSUED ON
THAT OUTSIDE OF WORK WITHOUT PERMITS, PERHAPS, BECAUSE THEY
MAY HAVE CONVERTED -- I MAY HAVE CONVERTED IT OVER, YOU
KNOW, WITHOUT A PERMIT OR WHATEVER, BUT THE ACTUAL USE WOULD
BECOME LEGAL AND THEY WOULD BE A SPECIFIED USE.
IT COULD BE A LEGAL UNIT.
THE ISSUE YOU'RE CONCERNED WITH, MR. CHAIR, WOULDN'T REALLY
AFFECT IT.
3:43:54PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I WILL WITHDRAW WHAT I'M SAYING.
BUT WE'RE GOING TO RUN INTO PROBLEMS DOWN THE LINE.
WE'RE GOING TO RUN INTO PROBLEMS DOWN THE LINE.
CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT AND SUSPECTS SOMEBODY OF HAVING AN
ACCESSORY DWELLING -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- DOWN THE LINE.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO WITHOUT MY AMENDMENT.
ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
3:44:26PM >> AYE.
3:44:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OPPOSED?
ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE.
3:44:32PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
3:44:35PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
3:44:36PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NO.
3:44:39PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
3:44:41PM >>BILL CARLSON:
NO.

3:44:43PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
3:44:46PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
3:44:46PM >>THE CLERK:
MOTION CARRIED WITH MIRANDA AND CARLSON VOTING
NO.
3:44:52PM >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON.
3:44:54PM >>BILL CARLSON:
I THINK THE CONVERSATION YOU ALL JUST HAD
WITH THE CHAIR IS AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT I TALKED ABOUT A MINUTE
AGO.
THIS IS SO COMPLICATED AND SO CONFUSING.
MAYBE COUNCIL MEMBER HURTAK COMPLETELY UNDERSTANDS IT, BUT
IT'S SO COMPLICATED, WE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE HAD A SEPARATE
WORKSHOP JUST FOR THIS.
I WISH WE COULD HAVE A SEPARATE WORKSHOP JUST FOR THIS.
WE'RE RUNNING OUT OF TIME AND THERE'S NO WAY THAT, WE HAVE
THIS LONG OF CONVERSATION ON ONE SLIDE AND YOU HAVE A BUNCH
OF OTHER SLIDES.
3:45:25PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
WE HAVE TWO LEFT.
AND BEFORE WE GO ON TO THOSE TWO, IF I MIGHT, DURING THE
PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING, THERE WAS SOME INFORMATION
SHARED ABOUT HEIGHTS AND SETBACKS FOR THE ACCESSORY
STRUCTURES.
A LOT OF CONFUSION BECAUSE WE WEREN'T TALKING ABOUT THAT AT
THE BEGINNING.
SO THAT WAS PULLED.
IT IS STILL GOING TO MEET ACCESSORY -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] --

WE'D LIKE TO TAKE THESE SMALL STEPS WITH YOU TODAY.
SO THE LAST TWO ITEMS WE HAVE ARE THE ALLOWABLE AREAS AND
THEN THE PARKING FOR THE ADUs.
BECAUSE THESE ARE ALL HOUSED IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CODE,
THAT'S WHY WE'RE TAKING THEM THE WAY THAT WE ARE.
BUT WE'RE GOING TO TURN OVER TO STEVEN TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT
THE ALLOWABLE AREAS AND THEN THE PARKING, WHICH WAS A
DISCUSSION IN JUNE ABOUT IF THERE ARE CERTAIN SIZE NO
PARKING, CERTAIN SIZE ONE SPACE.
THAT'S WHERE WE ARE TODAY.
AGAIN, THIS WILL ALL COME BACK AT THE DECEMBER 1st WHERE
IF WE WANT TO MAKE TWEAKS OR OTHER MODIFICATIONS WE CAN, AND
WE'RE HAPPY TO HAVE OTHER DISCUSSIONS IF NECESSARY.
3:46:32PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO MAKE A POINT.
SOMETIMES YOU UNDERSTAND BUT YOU JUST HAVE TO MAKE A POINT.
3:46:42PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
ON THE SCREEN, I'M SHOWING YOU THE AREAS
OF THE CITY WHERE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS ARE ALLOWED,
EITHER THROUGH THE GENERAL USE TABLE, WHICH SHOWS THE RS 50
AND THE RS 60 LOTS OVER IN THE LOWRY PARK AREA WHERE IT'S
PERMITTED.
IT WAS DONE THROUGH A PRIVATELY INITIATED AMENDMENT SOME
TIME AGO.
THE SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AREA HERE IN PURPLE.
AGAIN, THE SH ZONING DISTRICTS, WHICH IS WHERE ADUs ARE
PERMITTED NOW.

AND THEN DOWN HERE, NMU DISTRICTS WHICH WERE CREATED FOR THE
WEST RIVER AS PART OF THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS, COMBINED ALL
OF THESE AREAS, ACCOUNT FOR ABOUT 4% OF THE CITY.
AND THEN I THINK IT'S FAIR TO SAY FROM A PLANNING
STANDPOINT, THE SELECTION OF THESE AREAS RELATIVE TO
EVERYWHERE ELSE AROUND IT IS RELATIVELY ARBITRARY.
WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE THE ALLOWABLE AREAS MORE
EQUITABLE AND EXPAND THEM TO AS MANY PLACES AS POSSIBLE
WHERE IT MAKES SENSE TO DO SO.
SO IN LOOKING AT THE COMP PLAN --
3:47:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I HAVE A QUESTION.
IF WHAT I'M LOOKING AT -- PURPLE -- ALLOWED, RIGHT?
3:47:50PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
YES.
3:47:51PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
MLK, MARTIN LUTHER KING BOULEVARD NORTH,
THAT WOULD BE ALL OF WELLS WOOD, AM I CORRECT?
3:47:59PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
NO.
THAT'S A GOOD POINT.
LET ME KIND OF EXPLAIN THE AREAS.
THIS IS ANYWHERE --
3:48:04PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
EXCUSE ME.
WELLSWOOD BE ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE RIVER, NOT THE EAST
SIDE.
3:48:09PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
YES.
SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AREA, EAST OF THE RIVER AND SOUTH OF THE
RIVER BUT NORTH OF MARTIN LUTHER KING, EAST OVER TO 15th

STREET, UP 15th STREET AND THEN EAST ON HILLSBOROUGH
AVENUE AND NORTH ON 22nd.
ANYWHERE THAT'S OFFICIALLY A SEMINOLE HEIGHTS NEIGHBORHOOD,
THERE'S SOUTHEAST SEMINOLE HEIGHTS, OLD SEMINOLE HEIGHTS,
IT'S INCLUDED -- IT'S ALREADY ALLOWED IN THAT DISTRICT.
THAT'S WHAT COUNCILMAN WAS REFERRING TO.
SO LOOKING AT WHERE THE AREAS THAT WE'VE PROPOSED, THERE
HAVE BEEN SEVERAL POLICY-RELATED AMENDMENTS TO YOUR
COMPREHENSIVE PLAN RECENTLY THAT DEALT WITH WHERE GROWTH IS
ENCOURAGED IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
3:48:46PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
CAN YOU PUSH IT UP JUST A LITTLE BIT?
LITTLE FURTHER.
3:48:50PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
I'M TRYING TO KEEP THE LEGEND THERE.
THE PURPLE AREAS ARE, AGAIN, REALLY THE FOCUS.
BUT SPECIFICALLY THE PLANNING DISTRICTS IDENTIFIED THERE IN
DARK PURPLE, AND THEN THE ALLOWABLE ZONING DISTRICTS WITHIN
THEM ARE WHAT ARE SHADED PURPLE.
THAT'S WHERE THEY ACTUALLY WILL BE ALLOWED.
THESE DISTRICTS WERE SELECTED BECAUSE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN
SPEAKS TO THE ESTABLISHMENT OF PLANNING DISTRICTS.
SOUTH TAMPA, WESTSHORE, CENTRAL, UNIVERSITY DISTRICT, AND
THEN THE NEW TAMPA DISTRICT.
AND THEN WHAT THE FUTURE IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE WITHIN
THOSE DISTRICTS.
IT SPEAKS TO DIRECTING GROWTH AND NEW DEVELOPMENT AND

REDEVELOPMENT INTO THE WESTSHORE DISTRICT, THE CENTRAL
DISTRICT, AND THE UNIVERSITY DISTRICT.
IT SPEAKS TO DISCOURAGING GROWTH IN THE SOUTH TAMPA DISTRICT
AS BEING NOT SUITABLE FOR AS MUCH GROWTH AS THE CENTRAL
THREE DISTRICTS.
IT SPEAKS THE SAME WAY ABOUT NEW TAMPA, WHICH IS WHY NEW
TAMPA ISN'T INCLUDED ON THIS MAP AT ALL.
WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO TOUCH EITHER OF THOSE AREAS.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, SPEAKING TO THE NEW TAMPA DISTRICT
SPECIFICALLY, WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO INCLUDE THAT AREA AS
PART OF THIS BECAUSE OF THE ISSUE WAS BROUGHT UP EARLIER.
MAKING A CHANGE FOR NEW TAMPA RIGHT NOW WON'T AFFECT WHETHER
YOU'RE ALLOWED TO DO IT BECAUSE OTHER MECHANISMS IN PLACE
PREVENTING THAT.
SOUTH TAMPA, FALLING BACK ON THE LANGUAGE IN THE
COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, SPEAKING TO WHERE GROWTH SHOULD BE
ENCOURAGED, SOUTH TAMPA IS NOT ONE OF THOSE AREAS.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, YOU CAN SEE WE PUT HERE ON THE MAP THAT
MAJORITY OF SOUTH TAMPA IS INCLUDED IN THE COASTAL HIGH
HAZARD AREA, AND IT DOES HAVE A UNIQUE GEOGRAPHY COMPARED TO
THE REST OF THE CITY AND THERE ARE IMPLICATIONS WITH THAT.
SO THIS IS WHERE OUR RECOMMENDATION WAS.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE ARE RECOMMENDING AGAINST INCLUDING
IT IN OTHER AREAS.
IT JUST MEANS AS THIS NEXT STEP GOES FORWARD, THIS IS A GOOD

NEXT STEP THAT STAFF WAS COMFORTABLE PUTTING BEFORE YOU
TODAY.
3:50:40PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
3:50:41PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SO THIS IS NOT A CITYWIDE INITIATIVE.
AS YOU EXPLAINED, IT IS RESTRICTED TO THOSE BOUNDARIES THAT
ARE COLORED IN THAT LIGHT PURPLE, CORRECT?
3:50:51PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
YES, SIR.
3:50:52PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, IN MY OPINION,
PEOPLE IN MY DISTRICT OR IN WEST TAMPA OR PEOPLE THAT ARE
AGAINST THIS ARE GOING TO SAY, WHY IS SOUTH TAMPA EXCLUDED?
WHY ARE THEY BETTER THAN WE ARE?
WHATEVER THEY SAY, THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE HAPPY AND THEY
ARE GOING TO SAY -- THEY MAY SAY -- WHY CAN'T IT BE EQUALLY
ASSESSED ACROSS THE CITY?
I UNDERSTAND YOUR ANALYSIS AND WHY YOU CAME TO THIS
CONCLUSION AND WHY YOUR TEAM CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION.
BUT I KNOW -- I MEAN, I CAN HEAR MY FATHER SAYING IT.
YOU KNOW, WHY IS IT -- IT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR HERE BUT
GOOD ENOUGH FOR THERE.
YOU KNOW, DO IT OR DON'T DO IT AT ALL.
RIGHT THERE I HAVE PAUSE WITH THAT BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT I'M
GOING TO HEAR FROM OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS.
AND I UNDERSTAND WHY, WHETHER COASTAL HIGH HAZARD, WHETHER
THE DENSITY IS ALREADY THERE IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY
WHERE WE'RE NOT HAVING TO ENCOURAGE THIS KIND OF GROWTH, BUT

THE ISSUE WITH RENT IS A CITYWIDE ISSUE.
IT'S NOT -- OH, SOUTH TAMPA, NOT ALL OF SOUTH TAMPA IS RICH.
NOT ALL OF WEST TAMPA IS RICH.
IT'S MIXED AND DIVERSE.
I'M JUST SAYING WHAT FEEDBACK I'M MOST LIKELY GOING TO HEAR
BECAUSE OF THIS.
THANK YOU.
3:52:09PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
YOU KNOW WHAT I'D SAY FOR THE SOUTH TAMPA AND NEW TAMPA
AREAS THAT WE EXPLAIN BECAUSE THERE IS A VERY RATIONAL BASIS
FOR THE EXCLUSION.
SOUTH TAMPA, LIKE YOU SAID, THE HIGH COASTAL HAZARD AREA,
33647 BECAUSE OF DEED RESTRICTIONS, ET CETERA, IS THAT WE
VERY SIMPLY EXPLAIN IT.
I'VE ACTUALLY DONE THE REVERSE FOR PARTS OF MY DISTRICT.
REMEMBER WHEN I WAS RUNNING FOR OFFICE IN '16 AND I
SUPPORTED THE STORMWATER TAX ASSESSMENT, WHATEVER, AND A LOT
OF FOLKS IN MY DISTRICT WERE SAYING, WELL, WE DON'T GET A
LOT OF STORMWATER AND WHATNOT.
WELL, WE'RE ONE CITY, RIGHT?
AND JUST THE PIPES PROGRAM.
A LOT OF FOLKS, HEY, WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS?
IN NEW TAMPA, OUR PIPES ARE NEW.
NEWER, 35, 25, WHATEVER YEARS IT MAY BE.
AGAIN, WE'RE ONE CITY, AND THERE IS A RATIONAL EXPLANATION

FOR THAT.
SO I THINK FOR THAT, SO LONG AS WE EXPLAIN IT, I DON'T THINK
IT'S THAT DIFFICULT TO EXPLAIN, IN MY OPINION.
BUT TRUST ME, IT'S FUNNY WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT YOUR FATHER.
I SOMETIMES THINK MY FATHER WOULD SAY THAT.
I OFTEN DO THAT.
THANK YOU.
3:53:14PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
3:53:15PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
ONE OF MY TWO DAUGHTERS OR ANY OF MY FAMILY MEMBERS LIVED IN
SOUTH TAMPA AND WANTED TO BUILD SOMETHING FOR ME, I COULDN'T
DO IT, RIGHT?
SO I COULDN'T LIVE AT MY DAUGHTER'S HOUSE?
3:53:30PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
YOU WOULD STILL BE ABLE TO UTILIZE THE
EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE USE BECAUSE THAT USE IS STILL
PERMITTED CITYWIDE.
THIS IS ONLY CHANGING THE ADU USE, WHICH DOESN'T HAVE THE
FAMILY MEMBER REQUIREMENT TO IT.
3:53:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
THAT GETS A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED WHAT
YOU SAID BECAUSE THE PUBLIC WON'T UNDERSTAND THAT ONE
EITHER.
YOU TELL ME IF THEY BUILD AN 8 BY 10 ROOM, THEY CAN DO IT?
3:53:53PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
YES, IN THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT.
3:53:56PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE?
3:53:58PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
THE DIFFERENCE IN THE TWO USES?

3:54:00PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NOT PUTTING INTO LAW THAT THEY ARE
OMITTED FROM THAT.
3:54:04PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
BECAUSE THE EFRs ARE WHAT CURRENTLY
EXIST.
THOSE ARE THE EXISTING ALLOWABLE AREAS.
WE DIDN'T PROPOSE MODIFYING THOSE.
THAT'S JUST SITTING IN THE BACKGROUND.
3:54:16PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
3:54:18PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I DON'T KNOW IF I MADE THAT MOTION TO TALK
ABOUT GETTING RID OF EXTENDED FAMILY DWELLINGS, BUT I'M
GOING TO DO THAT RIGHT NOW.
I WOULD LOVE TO COME BACK AND TALK ABOUT THAT MAYBE IN
JANUARY OR IF WE HAVE APRIL.
I DON'T KNOW, THROW OUT A DATE.
BUT I STILL THINK, BECAUSE I AGREE, THERE IS CONFUSION, AND
I THINK WE JUST NEED A CLEAN SLATE.
SO I WOULD LOVE TO MAKE A MOTION TO COME BACK TO DISCUSS
THAT AT A FUTURE TIME, NOT NOW, BUT AT A FUTURE TIME.
I CAN ALSO WORK WITH YOU ON THAT AND COME BACK LATER WITH A
DATE.
MY QUESTION IS, I SEE A BIT FURTHER SOUTH IN CENTRAL TAMPA
THAT LOOKS LIKE IT'S PURPLE BUT ALSO COASTAL HIGH HAZARD
AREA.
LIKE, EXPLAIN, WOULD THEY BE ALLOWED THERE?
3:55:12PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE

PLANNING DISTRICTS ARE VERY SPECIFIC.
SO THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT DOES INCLUDE SOME AREAS
THAT PEOPLE REFER TO AS SOUTH TAMPA.
JUST TO BE CLEAR, DAVIS ISLAND WOULD BE INCLUDED AS AN
ALLOWABLE AREA.
HYDE PARK WOULD BE INCLUDED AS AN ALLOWABLE AREA.
THAT'S BECAUSE OF HOW THE PLANNING DISTRICT LINES ARE DRAWN.
IT'S NOT -- EVERYTHING SOUTH OF KENNEDY NECESSARILY PART OF
THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT.
THAT'S WHY THE MAP IS VERY IMPORTANT.
3:55:43PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
JUST TO EXPAND ON THAT BECAUSE IT'S THE SAME
QUESTION, THINKING ABOUT WHAT JUST HAPPENED IN FORT MYERS,
THINKING ABOUT FUTURE LAND USE, FUTURE USE ON IN COASTAL
HIGH HAZARD AREA, THAT IS AN AREA WHERE THE PUBLIC HAS MADE
COMMENTS ABOUT NOT ALLOWING CERTAIN GROWTH IN COASTAL HIGH
HAZARD AREAS, BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT DEPENDING UPON THE
NEIGHBORHOOD YOU'RE IN, THEY WANT MORE DEVELOPMENT.
SO WHAT'S THE BALANCE THERE?
MILLION-DOLLAR QUESTION.
3:56:21PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
THIS WAS OUR ATTEMPT AT TRYING TO STRIKE
THAT BALANCE.
IF YOU WISH TO ADD TO THIS CRITERIA IN SOME WAY AND SAY IN
ADDITION TO THESE THREE DISTRICTS, PLEASE ALSO OMIT ANY
PARCEL THAT'S WITHIN THE CHHA.
WE CAN ADD THAT TO THE LANGUAGE AND MAKE IT EVEN SMALLER, IF

THAT'S THE DIRECTION YOU'RE GOING IN.
3:56:38PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M JUST ASKING BECAUSE I WAS TRYING TO
FIGURE THAT OUT.
THANK YOU.
3:56:42PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
3:56:46PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I'LL YIELD BACK, SIR.
3:56:50PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE THAT WISHES
TO SPEAK TO THIS PART OF AGENDA NUMBER 7?
3:57:03PM >> NATHAN HAGEN.
LAST YEAR, THE PLANNING COMMISSION ADOPTED AN EQUITY REPORT
WHICH INCLUDED A PHENOMENAL PRESENTATION ABOUT THE HISTORY
OF RACISM AND DISCRIMINATION AND PAINTED A PICTURE ABOUT HOW
WE HAVE DELIBERATELY CONCENTRATED POVERTY IN EAST TAMPA AND
PARTS OF WEST TAMPA OVER THE LAST 80 YEARS WITH OUR ZONING
CODE.
IT'S VERY CONSPICUOUS TO ME -- WELL, I'LL ALSO ADD THIS,
LAST WEEK THERE WAS AN ARTICLE ABOUT ADUs IN CREATIVE
LOAFING THAT SAID THAT THEY WERE A FORCE FOR GENTRIFICATION.
THAT IS A COMPLEX ISSUE THAT I CAN'T TRY TO WALK US THROUGH
HERE IN THREE MINUTES.
BUT IT'S CONSPICUOUS, I THINK, AND COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO
ALLUDED TO THIS, IS THAT IF YOU'RE SOMEBODY WHO IS IN A
COMMUNITY THAT HAS SUFFERED FROM OUR INEQUITABLE ZONING CODE
FOR THE LAST 80 YEARS, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE THAT SOME
NEIGHBORHOODS GET SPECIAL TREATMENT.

AGAIN, AS THEY HAVE FOR 80 YEARS.
SO I UNDERSTAND THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA.
DEED RESTRICTIONS, I DON'T HAVE A POLICY SOLUTION TO THAT,
BUT I DO KNOW THAT SAYING WE CAN'T HAVE ADUs, OCCASIONALLY
IN THE WEALTHIEST PARTS OF TAMPA FOR THIS REASON, WHICH, BY
THE WAY, SHOULD BE A SAFETY BUILDING CODE ISSUE, NOT A
ZONING CODE ISSUE, PER SE, TO ME, I THINK EVERYONE CAN SEE
THROUGH THAT.
ANYBODY WHO IS ON THESE ISSUES IN EAST TAMPA AND WEST TAMPA
WILL SEE IF THEY ARE INFORMED ABOUT THIS ISSUE, THAT SOUTH
TAMPA ONCE AGAIN IS GETTING SPECIAL TREATMENT.
I THINK THEY SHOULD BE CITYWIDE.
I THINK IT IS AN IMPORTANT QUESTION YOU HAD ABOUT
DEVELOPMENT IN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA.
THAT INCLUDES PARTS OF DOWNTOWN, HARBOUR ISLAND, DAVIS
ISLAND AND ALL THESE PLACES THAT WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT A BIG
COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
I KNOW THAT WE'RE DOING THAT.
I THINK THAT CONVERSATION CAN HAPPEN THEN.
JUST TALKING ABOUT ADUs, WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT THE EQUITY
COMPONENT AND THAT INCLUDES ALLOWING THESE IN THOSE
NEIGHBORHOODS.
3:59:01PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
3:59:04PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YOU KNOW, KIND OF LIKE THIS RED PEN.
IT'S JUST RED-LINED ON YOUR MAP.

WE COULD TALK ABOUT THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS, WHICH WE
KNOW WE HAVE SOME ISSUES THERE, BUT WHEN YOU SAY YOU'RE
GOING TO HAVE A PROGRAM FOR THE CITY, IT SHOULD BE
INCLUSIVE.
YOU MAY HAVE SOME DEED-RESTRICTED AREAS, BUT SOME OF THOSE
AREAS DEED RESTRICTED, MAY BE RIGHT OUTSIDE OF IT AND MAY
NOT BE.
AGAIN, IT LOOKS TO ME, AGAIN, ANOTHER CLASSIC WAY OF
RED-LINING, JUST DOING IT IN A NICER WAY, BUT TO ME IT'S
RED-LINING.
WE TALK ABOUT EQUALITY, IT'S A PART OF EQUITY AS WELL.
WE HAVE TO SPREAD THE WEALTH AROUND.
YOU'RE RIGHT, NATHAN.
WE'RE NOT SPREADING THE WEALTH AROUND.
THANK YOU.
4:00:00PM >> JUSTIN WILLITS, 3203 NORTH BAILEY STREET, TAMPA HEIGHTS.
I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD JUST MOVE AHEAD ON THIS.
IF SOUTH TAMPA WANTS TO COME BACK AND CAMPAIGN FOR THIS,
THEN BY ALL MEANS.
I THINK IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE BASED ON WHAT STEPHEN BENSON
SAID.
WE SHOULD BE PROMOTING GROWTH IN THE PLACES THAT MAKE SENSE.
SOUTH TAMPA HAS DEMONSTRATED SKEPTICISM TOWARDS GROWTH.
THERE ARE SOME TRAFFIC ISSUES THERE.
WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH TRANSIT.

THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN, AND IT
DOESN'T MEAN WE SHOULDN'T MOVE FORWARD IN THE REST OF THE
CITY.
AND SOME OTHER ITEMS THAT I WANT TO JUST ADD IN, YOU KNOW,
WE DON'T HAVE MONEY FOR TRANSPORTATION OR HOUSING.
WE MAY NOT GET IT VERY SOON.
WE CAN'T EXPECT THE CITY TO BUILD ENOUGH TRANSPORTATION OR
HOUSING.
WE NEED TO LEAN ON PRIVATE PROPERTY OWNERS TO BUILD SOME
MORE OF THE HOUSING AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT
TODAY.
I BOUGHT MY FIRST HOUSE IN TAMPA HEIGHTS SEVEN YEARS AGO AND
THOUGHT I PROBABLY ALREADY HAVE AN ADU BY NOW AND WE'RE
STILL TALKING ABOUT IT.
THERE ARE REALLY A LOT OF BENEFITS THAT THIS HOUSING WOULD
PROVIDE, INCLUDING AFFORDABILITY, AGING IN PLACE, REDUCING
DISPLACEMENT WITH SOARING COSTS.
THE SPECIFIC TRANSPORTATION-RELATED IMPACTS AS A TRANSIT
PLANNER MYSELF, FORMER HART EMPLOYEE, THE PROBLEM WITH
TRANSIT HERE IS WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PEOPLE NEAR IT.
THIS IS HOW WE GET MORE PEOPLE NEAR IT.
WE HAVE CORRIDORS LINED WITH CAR SHOPS, NOT DENSE HOUSING.
WE CAN ADDRESS THAT AS WELL.
THERE ARE 10, 20, 30, 50 THINGS WE SHOULD DO AS A COMMUNITY
TO GET MORE HOUSING.

THIS IS ONE PIECE.
IT IS ONE OF THE EASIER PIECES.
LET'S MOVE IT AHEAD AND DO THE RIGHT THING.
LIKE I SAID, COME BACK LATER FOR SOUTH TAMPA.
I THINK THE PLANNER, THE CITY PLANNER MADE A GOOD CASE FOR
WHY.
IT DOESN'T MAKE A TON OF SENSE AND BASED ON WHAT I'VE
PERSONALLY HEARD FROM THE SOUTH OF GANDY FOLKS, I DON'T
THINK THEY WANT ANY DEVELOPMENT.
THIS JUST IS PART OF THAT THING.
I THINK I'VE NAILED ALL MY POINTS HERE.
I'M SURPRISED I'M NOT AT THREE MINUTES.
I JUST THINK WE NEED TO MOVE THIS AHEAD.
YOU HAVE TIME TO PUT MORE EFFORT INTO THIS.
THE BEST TRANSIT SERVICE WE HAVE IN THE CITY AND THE COUNTY
IS IN THE AREAS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING THIS ON THAT
MAP YOU'VE GOT 15 AND 20 MINUTE SERVICE ALL DAY ON FLORIDA,
NEBRASKA, FLORIBRASKA, 56th STREET AND HILLSBOROUGH
AVENUE.
THOSE ARE THE FOUR BEST ROUTES IN THE WHOLE HART SYSTEM.
THEY CARRY ABOUT 25% OF THE DAILY RIDERSHIP.
AND THIS IS GOING TO PUT MORE HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES ALONG
THOSE TRANSIT ROUTES.
IT'S LIKE THIS IS GOOD FOR TRANSIT.
THAT'S THE BIG TAKEAWAY.

THANKS.
4:02:51PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE?
MS. POYNOR?
MS. BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE?
4:03:04PM >> HELLO?
4:03:07PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. POYNOR?
4:03:08PM >> HELLO.
CAN YOU HEAR ME?
4:03:10PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES, MS. POYNOR.
4:03:12PM >> FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO ADDRESS MR. HAGEN IMPLYING THAT
THERE IS NO POVERTY SOUTH OF GANDY, THAT THERE IS A -- WE
ARE BEARING THE BRUNT IN THE FOUR SQUARE MILES THAT I LIVE
IN, WE'VE GOT 3,000 MORE APARTMENTS COMING.
THAT DOESN'T SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES.
THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE CONDOMINIUMS.
THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE TOWNHOMES.
THAT'S ONLY APARTMENTS.
WE HAVE BEEN WORKING OUR BUTT OFF TO STAVE THAT.
HURRICANE -- IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, YOU SHOULD GOOGLE
IT AND WATCH THE VIDEOS ON IT.
ALSO, IAN, HAD IT HIT HERE, EVERYTHING DOWN HERE WOULD HAVE
BEEN UNDERWATER.
SO, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY PEOPLE DO YOU WANT TO DROWN?
THAT'S REALLY WHAT IT'S ABOUT.
IT'S NOT ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THIS PARTICULAR

SITUATION.
WE HAVE TAKEN ON THE BRUNT OF THE HOUSING DOWN HERE, AND
THEY HAVEN'T EVEN BUILT WHAT IS NEEDED FOR THE 22,000 PEOPLE
WHO DRIVE THROUGH OUR COMMUNITY EVERY SINGLE DAY TO GET TO
WORK.
SO LET'S JUST MAKE SURE WE'VE GOT IT STRAIGHT.
I'M NOT AGAINST ADUs.
IF I DIDN'T LIVE ON A DEAD END, I WOULD BE ALL ON IT.
IF I DIDN'T LIVE IN A COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA, I WOULD
TOTALLY BE ON IT.
I WOULD THINK IT WOULD BE A GREAT IDEA.
I HAVE A COUPLE OF PROPERTIES THAT ARE LARGE ENOUGH TO HAVE
ADUs.
BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS, NOT EVERY AREA OF THE CITY NEEDS TO
HAVE IT BECAUSE WE ARE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD.
ALL IT TOOK WAS IAN TO HIT A COUPLE OF HOURS NORTH AND YOU
GUYS WOULD HAVE A TOTALLY DIFFERENT CONVERSATION TODAY.
AND IS THAT THE CONVERSATION YOU WANT TO HAVE WITH YOUR
CONSTITUENTS FIVE YEARS FROM NOW, TEN YEARS FROM NOW WHEN
ALL THE FOLKS ARE STUCK SOUTH OF GANDY AND CAN'T GET OUT.
WE ARE A FOOD DESERT.
YOU CAN'T BE A FOOD DESERT WITHOUT HAVING PEOPLE
IMPOVERISHED.
ALL OF OUR ELEMENTARY SCHOOLS SOUTH OF GANDY ARE FREE AND
REDUCED LUNCH.

BOTH OF OUR MIDDLE SCHOOLS FOR SOUTH OF GANDY ARE FREE AND
REDUCED LUNCH.
SO MAYBE IT'S TIME FOR FOLKS TO DO THE MATH ABOUT WHAT
POVERTY MEANS VERSUS US BEING SMART ABOUT WHAT WE'RE DOING
FOR OUR CITY.
THANK YOU.
4:05:40PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. BENNETT.
MS. BENNETT?
4:05:52PM >> HI.
THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
IN THE TAMPA COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, IT SAYS THERE ARE SIX
LEVELS OF INTENSITY TO INDICATE WHERE DEVELOPMENT SHOULD BE
FOCUSED.
THE LOWEST LEVEL, LEVEL ONE, IS SOUTH TAMPA.
EVERY DEPARTMENT HEAD IN THE CITY HAS COME BEFORE YOU AT ONE
TIME OR ANOTHER AND TALKED ABOUT WHERE THE GROWTH NEEDS TO
BE.
A LOT OF IT HAS TO DO WITH TRANSIT CORRIDORS.
AND EVERY TIME THEY DO, THEY EXCLUDE SOUTH TAMPA AND NEW
TAMPA.
IT IS THE THREE CENTRAL PLANNING DISTRICTS WHERE THEY THINK
THE GROWTH SHOULD BE CONCENTRATED.
ONE OF THE REASONS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SAYS THAT YOU
SHOULDN'T HAVE THE GROWTH IN SOUTH TAMPA IS BECAUSE OF THE
LACK OF TRANSIT SERVICES AND NO PLANS TO INCREASE THEM.

THE FLOOD-PRONE LAND AND STEPHANIE IS CORRECT.
THERE'S PLENTY OF PEOPLE IN SOUTH TAMPA WHO ARE NOT RICH.
A LOT OF OUR SCHOOLS QUALIFY FOR FREE AND REDUCED LUNCHES
FOR ALL OF THEM.
I'D ALSO LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT SOUTH TAMPA HAS DONE MORE
THAN IT'S FAIR SHARE OF ADDING TO THE DWELLING UNITS IN THIS
CITY.
THERE'S NO COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA IN THE CITY THAT HAS HAD
MORE GROWTH THAN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA IN SOUTH
TAMPA.
WE HAVE A SPREADSHEET THAT SHOWS THE ADDITIONAL DWELLING
UNITS AND WE GOT THIS INFORMATION FROM THE PROPERTY
APPRAISER.
SOUTH TAMPA HAS ADDED -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- BUILT ALMOST
9300 ADDITIONAL DWELLING UNITS.
SO TO SAY THAT WE HAVEN'T DONE OUR FAIR SHARE TO ADD TO THE
HOUSING -- COMPLETELY INACCURATE.
AND THIS IS HAPPENING IN AN AREA WHERE THERE SHOULD NOT BE
THE GROWTH.
A LOT OF THOSE UNITS SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN OTHER AREAS THAT
NEED THEM AND WHERE THEY ARE MORE APPROPRIATE.
I AM NOT AGAINST ADUs.
I APOLOGIZE IF I HAVEN'T DONE ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND ALL THE
COMPLEXITIES OF IT.
I SUPPORT ADUs, BUT I NEED TO UNDERSTAND THEM COMPLETELY.

AND I'M GOING TO REACH OUT.
I'M GOING TO TRY TO DO THAT SO I'M NOT SITTING HERE SAYING I
DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS MEANS.
BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THESE TWO AREAS NEED TO BE
EXCLUDED FOR SPECIFIC REASONS.
THEY ARE VALID REASONS.
IT IS RECKLESS AND IRRESPONSIBLE TO CONTINUE TO INCREASE THE
POPULATION IN EVACUATION ZONES A AND B AND IN THE COASTAL
HIGH HAZARD AREA.
THANK YOU.
4:08:14PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
ANY FURTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS FROM COUNCIL?
WHAT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL?
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
4:08:29PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YOU KNOW, COUNCILMAN GUDES SAID
SOMETHING.
HE HELD UP THE RED PEN.
RED-LINING.
AGAIN, I'M ALWAYS READING ABOUT HISTORY AND THERE'S A LOT OF
RACISM IN THAT HISTORY.
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT REDLINING, THE GENTRIFICATION, WHATEVER
YOU WANT TO CALL IT OVER THE LAST CENTURY OR HALF A CENTURY.
I GET IT.
BUT IN THIS CASE, REGARDING HOW CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY
FLOOD, THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS, WHERE THE GROWTH IS

CONCENTRATED, STEPHANIE POYNOR SAID IT REGARDING SOUTH OF
GANDY, 3,000 APARTMENT UNITS.
THEIR DENSITY IS COMING IN RAPIDLY.
AND THAT'S, AGAIN, NOT COUNTING SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AND
EVERYTHING ELSE.
BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WHY THE
BORDERS.
AND YOU MENTIONED IN THERE HYDE PARK AND OTHER PARTS OF THE
CITY.
IT'S NOT JUST EAST TAMPA, WEST TAMPA.
BUT I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT MOVING FORWARD.
CAN WE FURTHER EXPAND THOSE BOUNDARIES IN THE FUTURE?
WILL YOU LOOK AT THAT FOR FURTHER EXPANSION?
THIS IS JUST PHASE ONE, ESSENTIALLY?
4:09:32PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO COME BACK WITH A
REPORT AND TELL YOU HOW WE'RE DOING IN THE YEAR.
ADDITIONAL TWEAKS.
4:09:38PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADVANCE THIS AS
PRESENTED AND GO --
4:09:43PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
SECOND.
4:09:44PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
THANK YOU.
4:09:45PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN GUDES.
SECONDED BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?
COUNCILMAN GUDES.

4:09:53PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I THINK COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO MADE THE
MOTION WITH MS. HURTAK SECONDING IT.
4:09:57PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THAT'S WHAT I MEANT TO SAY.
4:09:59PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
ALL RIGHT.
LET ME SAY THIS.
A PERSON WHO WORKED EVERY INCH OF THE CITY, FROM NEW TAMPA
TO PORT TAMPA, AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT SOUTH TAMPA, THERE IS A
DIVIDE.
A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T KNOW THAT.
I WORKED AT ROBINSON HIGH SCHOOL, AND THE LADIES ARE RIGHT.
THERE ARE UNDERACHIEVING SCHOOLS DOWN IN THAT AREA.
AND THERE WAS A SEPARATION WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT SOUTH TAMPA.
BECAUSE WHEN I WAS THERE, YOU HAD THE BORDERLINE.
DIDN'T MIX AND MINGLE TOO MUCH.
THAT'S KIND OF CHANGED A LITTLE BIT NOW THROUGH THE YEARS.
AND I CAN REMEMBER WHEN THERE WERE NO APARTMENTS ON THAT
SIDE.
MANHATTAN, THOSE AREAS DOWN THERE.
THEY ARE RIGHT AS FAR AS THE GROWTH IS CONCERNED AND THE
AMOUNT OF APARTMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN BUILT UP THERE.
THE AREA HAS TOTALLY CHANGED, EVEN THE BACK AREA, YOU HAVE
NOW HOUSES BACK THERE, WASN'T ANYTHING BACK THERE BEFORE,
BACK IN THE EARLY 2000s.
I CAN CONCUR WITH WHAT THEY ARE SAYING IN REFERENCE TO THAT.
I CAN SEE HOW WE'RE TRYING TO SAY WE WANT TO LOOK AT THE

GROWTH PATTERN.
THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT.
THEY JUST SEE WHAT I JUST SAID BEFORE, A SEPARATION.
AND I DON'T LIKE SEPARATIONS.
I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT TODAY.
LIKE MR. MANISCALCO SAID, WE JUST HAVE TO BE MINDFUL AND
KEEP OUR EYE ON THE PRIZE AND MAKE SURE THAT THE
DISTRIBUTION IS GOING -- EVEN WITH THE NEW TAMPA FOLKS,
THERE ARE SOME AREAS UNDEVELOPED THAT PROBABLY WILL BE
DEVELOPED AND WE CAN'T LEAVE THEM OUT IN THE FUTURE.
SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KEEP AN EYE ON EVERYBODY
SO IT'S FAIR.
4:11:44PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
WE DO HAVE THE SOUTH OF GANDY STUDY THAT
IS ONGOING AND ADUs WILL BE A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION AS PART
OF THAT.
ADDITIONALLY WITH NEW TAMPA, IF THERE ARE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT
WANT THIS, WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO MEET WITH THEM AND TALK
ABOUT THE IMPLICATIONS.
THEY JUST DON'T ALLOW IT ALREADY.
AS FAR AS IMMEDIATE FIRST STEP, WE JUST DIDN'T FEEL LIKE
THAT WAS WORTH GOING INTO YET.
4:12:08PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
4:12:09PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU, SIR.
I APPRECIATE THAT.
AND, AGAIN, WHAT I HAD MENTIONED -- AND I THINK EVERYBODY

HAS MENTIONED THIS -- IS MAYBE COMING BACK AND LOOKING AT
THIS IN THE FUTURE, EITHER FOR EXPANSION, EITHER TO LOOK AT,
AGAIN, UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES.
THERE ARE TWO DISTINCT ISSUES, AS YOU INDICATED WITH NEW
TAMPA.
IT'S MORE OF A CONTRACTUAL ISSUE WHERE YOU HAVE SEPARATE
GOVERNMENT ENTITIES LIKE CDDs, ET CETERA.
IT'S FUNNY, WHEN I FIRST HEARD OF CDDs, I KEPT CALLING IT
CCD, IF YOU ARE CATHOLIC, YOU KNOW WHAT CCD.
THERE ARE CDDs AND DIFFERENT TYPES OF ISSUES LIKE THAT
THAT PRECLUDE US LEGALLY FROM DOING THAT.
SO IT'S REALLY NOT A POLICY ISSUE.
IT'S MORE OF OUR HANDS ARE TIED ISSUE.
WITH SOUTH TAMPA, IT'S A POLICY ISSUE AND WHATNOT.
BUT, AGAIN, I STRONGLY SUPPORT THIS.
AND WHEREVER WE CAN DO IT THROUGHOUT THE CITY OF TAMPA, I
SUPPORT THIS.
I'VE ALWAYS BEEN A SUPPORTER OF EXPANDING OUR HOUSING STOCK.
I REMEMBER, GOSH, MAYBE A YEAR AND A HALF AGO, I THINK ABBYE
WAS THERE WITH ME, AS I RECALL, TALKING IN A PART OF MY
DISTRICT ABOUT APARTMENTS THAT WERE COMING.
THEY WERE ALREADY APPROVED YEARS AGO BY CITY COUNCIL.
THEY WERE COMING AND PEOPLE WERE REALLY ANGRY AND I WAS
MEETING WITH THEM OR ONE GUY.
THE STUFF THAT PEOPLE SAID BECAUSE THE IMPLICATIONS THAT

PEOPLE HAVE DUE TO THEIR OWN FEAR AND LACK OF CONNECTION
WITH THE REAL WORLD ON THINGS LIKE APARTMENTS IS STUNNING.
AND THIS IS POLITICAL, BUT I REMEMBER IN THE 2020 ELECTION
SOME OF THE THINGS SAID BY ONE CANDIDATE WHO HAPPENED TO BE
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES AT THE TIME ABOUT LOWER
INCOME HOUSING, SOUNDED LIKE THEY WOULD HAVE COME OUT OF THE
MOUTH OF GEORGE WALLACE IN HIS 1968 CAMPAIGN SAYING WE'RE
GOING TO SAVE THE SUBURBS FROM LOW-INCOME HOUSING AND A LOT
OF PEOPLE FELL FOR THAT AND THAT'S SHAMEFUL.
SO WE ALL HAVE TO STAND UP FOR THE IDEA OF IT THROUGHOUT ALL
OF OUR CITY OF TAMPA THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE A CITY WHERE THE
MIDDLE-CLASS CAN LIVE, THE WORKING CLASS CAN LIVE AND FOLKS
WHO ARE STRUGGLING AND WORKING HARD TO MAKE IT TO THE MIDDLE
CLASS AND WORKING CLASS HAVE A PLACE AT THE TABLE.
I THINK WE ALL SUPPORT THAT 110%.
LET'S MOVE THIS THING FORWARD.
GET IT DONE BECAUSE I THINK IT'S GOOD POLICY.
THANK YOU.
4:14:21PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
4:14:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
I'M NOT GOING TO SUPPORT THIS.
IT TALKS ABOUT EXTENDED FAMILY.
VERY DIFFICULT UNLESS THEY GET AN ANCESTRY CERTIFIED COPIES
AND SHOW YOU.
TRUST BUT VERIFY.
ALSO THE ACCESSORY DWELLING.

YOU MAY BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND IT'S ACCESSORY DWELLING.
THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE MOST NECESSARY ONES ARE GOING TO
GET IT, THE ONES THAT PAY THE HIGHER RENT ARE THE ONES GOING
TO GET IT.
THERE'S NOTHING HERE ABOUT AFFORDABILITY.
NOTHING HERE TO HELP SOMEBODY OUT.
IT'S JUST PLAIN WHOEVER GETS IT GETS IT.
REALLY MAY NOT HELP ANYONE BUT WHOEVER CAN AFFORD TO RENT.
4:14:55PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M SUPPORTING THIS AS IS BUT I AGREE WITH
OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT NOT ONLY SHOULD WE COME BACK AND
LOOK AT ADDING OTHER DISTRICTS, BUT ALSO TO REALLY -- WE
REALLY NEED TO START GRAPPLING WITH THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD
AREA AND WHAT WE WANT TO SEE.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT TO THE DISCUSSION OF EXPANDING
WHERE WE ALLOW THESE, BUT ALSO REALLY TALKING ABOUT WHAT WE
WANT AS A COMMUNITY IN OUR COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS.
4:15:28PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYTHING ELSE?
SOUTH TAMPA HAS ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS ALREADY.
IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, AT THE CORNER OF PALMIRA AND HIMES,
WHICH IS GOING EVEN FURTHER SOUTH, THERE WAS A NEW
CONSTRUCTION THAT HAD -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT]
MANISCALCO, SECONDED BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
4:15:56PM >>THE CLERK:
[INAUDIBLE]
4:16:02PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THERE IS A CERTAIN NUMBER INVOLVED.
4:16:11PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
CAN WE GET THE PRESENTATION BACK UP,

PLEASE?
27- 132.
IT'S THE CODE SECTION.
4:16:33PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
I THINK YOU HAVE TO ADVANCE THE SLIDE ONE
MORE.
27-132.
4:16:42PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
27-156.
THE CODE SECTION IS NOT IN THE SLIDE.
4:16:49PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
REPEAT THAT ONE MORE TIME.
4:16:50PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
27-156.
4:16:54PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
27-156.
ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
ANY OPPOSED?
4:17:03PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
AYE.
4:17:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE.
4:17:12PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
4:17:12PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
NO.
4:17:14PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
YES.
4:17:22PM >> CARLSON?
GUDES?
4:17:23PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
4:17:24PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
4:17:25PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
4:17:28PM >>THE CLERK:
THE MOTION CARRIED WITH MIRANDA NO AND CARLSON
ABSENT.

4:17:39PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. BENSON.
4:17:40PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
WE HAVE ONE MORE ADU-RELATED CHANGE.
IF THE PRESENTATION COULD COME BACK UP, PLEASE.
THIS RELATES TO OFF-STREET PARKING REQUEST.
NOW ADUs REQUIRE ONE PARKING SPACE ON THE SITE.
EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES, WHICH ARE 600 SQUARE FEET AND
BELOW DO NOT.
THEY ARE ESSENTIALLY THE SAME TYPE OF USE.
WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO DO HERE, AGAIN, WITHIN THE AREAS
THAT WE'RE EXPANDING ADUs INTO.
BY SAYING IF THE 600 SQUARE FEET OR BELOW IS ADU, PARKING IS
WAIVED.
AND THIS WOULD APPLY TO THE SAME SECTION JUST APPROVED ALL
OF THOSE ALLOWABLE AREAS.
600 FEET OR BELOW, NO PARKING REQUIRED.
GREATER THAN 600 SQUARE FEET, PARKING WOULD BE REQUIRED AND
IT WOULD BE ONE SPACE PER UNIT.
4:18:26PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
4:18:28PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
WHEN YOU SAY ONE SPACE PER UNIT, IF THEY DECIDE TO JUST PARK
VEHICLES ON THEIR FRONT YARD AS THEY DO ON TAMPA BAY
BOULEVARD -- NOT THROWING ANYBODY UNDER THE BUS -- [AUDIO
CUTS OUT] --
4:18:46PM >>STEPHEN BENSON:
MEET THE CODE AND TECHNICAL REQUIREMENTS
FOR PARKING TO PARK ON THEIR SITE.

4:18:51PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
4:18:58PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
4:19:03PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M JUST GOING TO GO ON RECORD SAYING I DON'T
THINK WE SHOULD REQUIRE PARKING, BUT I KNOW I'M IN THE
MINORITY.
4:19:16PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
MOVE TO APPROVE.
4:19:24PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
IS THERE ANYONE IN CHAMBERS THAT WISHES TO
SPEAK TO THIS?
4:19:29PM >> NATHAN HAGEN.
I WANT TO EMPHASIZE, I THINK WE'VE ALL HEARD OVER AND OVER
AGAIN, REDUCED OUR PARKING MINIMUMS DOWNTOWN.
ORLANDO ELIMINATED THEM.
BY THE WAY, SOMEONE CAN MAKE A MOTION ABOUT ELIMINATING THEM
DOWNTOWN ANY TIME SOON.
BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ADUs HERE.
THE PEOPLE WHO -- ONE OF THE GREAT THINGS ABOUT ACCESSORY
DWELLING UNITS ARE THAT TODAY, AND I SAY THIS ALL THE TIME,
IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME, YOU'RE PROBABLY IN
CRISIS.
NOTHING SMALLER THAN A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME OR HIGH-END LUXURY
APARTMENT DOWNTOWN THAT IS AN OPTION FOR ANYBODY.
WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF HOUSING STOCK THAT IS GOOD
TRANSITIONAL HOUSING.
ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS FILL THAT NICHE.

I KNOW THERE IS A LOT OF FEAR THAT EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE
IS GOING TO BE AN AirBnB, AND SOME WILL, THAT EVERY SINGLE
ONE OF THESE WILL BE CHARGED AT ABOVE MARKET RATES, AND SOME
OF THEM WILL.
BUT MANY OF THEM WILL BE SOLD AT A REASONABLE PRICE PER
SQUARE FEET ON A 600-SQUARE-FOOT UNIT IS ACTUALLY RELATIVELY
AFFORDABLE.
I JUST WANT TO EMPHASIZE PARKING COSTS MONEY.
[AUDIO DROPS]
-- ACROSS THE CITY AND WE'RE SAYING THAT YOU HAVE TO NOW PAY
ALL THIS EXTRA MONEY OR HAVE THIS EXTRA LAND FOR PARKING,
YOU'RE PREVENTING THESE HOMES FROM BEING BUILT.
YOU'RE ACTUALLY SAYING WE WANT ADUs BUT DON'T WANT THE
ADUs FOR PEOPLE WHO CAN'T AFFORD PARKING.
I HAVE A FEELING WHERE THIS IS GOING.
I WANT TO BE CLEAR, THERE IS A POLICY REALITY FOR REQUIRING
PARKING, THAT THERE BE FEWER OPTIONS, FEWER ADUs CREATED
AND THOSE ADUs NOT CREATED WILL BE THE ONES THAT WOULD
HAVE BEEN THE MOST AFFORDABLE BECAUSE THERE IS A PRICE GAP
BETWEEN HOUSING THAT HAS PARKING AND DOESN'T HAVE PARKING.
IT IS A REAL MARKET PHENOMENA.
AND PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE CARS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T AFFORD
THEM SHOULD NOT BE PAYING FOR PARKING.
THANK YOU.
4:21:20PM >> JUSTIN WILLITS, AGAIN, JUST AGREEING MOSTLY WITH NATHAN

THAT WE SHOULD NOT REQUIRE PARKING EITHER.
WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE AFFORDABLE UNITS ESPECIALLY NEAR
TRANSIT.
THERE'S NO REASON TO INCLUDE IT.
THANKS.
4:21:35PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANYONE ONLINE?
MS. POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE?
4:21:42PM >> CAN YOU HEAR ME?
4:21:43PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES, MS. POYNOR.
4:21:45PM >> OKAY.
GOOD AFTERNOON, AGAIN.
HOPEFULLY THIS IS THE LAST TIME.
WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PARKING, ARE WE TALKING ABOUT, LIKE, REAL
CEMENT OR ASPHALT?
BECAUSE IN MUCH OF OUR CITY, IT'S OKAY TO PARK ON YOUR
GRASS.
IF THEY ARE DOING THAT, I'M NOT AGAINST IT.
PERMEABLE PARKING SHOULD CERTAINLY BE CONSIDERED FOR ALL OF
THIS, IF THAT'S GOING TO EVEN BE A THOUGHT PROCESS.
I WOULD LIKE TO NOTE THAT THIS IS, WHAT, FOUR ITEMS THAT YOU
GUYS HAVE DISCUSSED THIS AFTERNOON SINCE LUNCH, AND IT'S
TAKEN YOU THREE HOURS TO DISCUSS THOSE FOUR ITEMS.
AND EVERYBODY WHO IS PARTICIPATING IN THIS AT LEAST HAS A
CLUE WHAT'S GOING ON.
WE WERE EXPECTED IN OUR PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING TO

ADDRESS 12 ITEMS.
I THINK IT WAS ABOUT TWO AND A HALF HOURS LONG.
I STAYED FOR THE WHOLE THING BUT DON'T REMEMBER FOR SURE.
JUST IMAGINE DOING THAT WITH 58 PEOPLE OR MORE AND THEN, OF
COURSE, SOME OF THEM HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THEY ARE TALKING
ABOUT.
THE GUY WHO GETS ON AND TRIES TO SELL HIS 3D HOUSING AND ALL
THIS OTHER STUFF.
JUST REMEMBER HOW MUCH WE POSSIBLY GOT DONE DURING THAT
TIME.
12 ITEMS IN ANY PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING IS TOO MANY.
YOU ALL HAVE A GREAT DAY.
THANK YOU.
4:23:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MS. BENNETT, ARE YOU THERE.
4:23:07PM >> HI.
THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT.
I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS.
I URGE YOU TO GO AHEAD AND VOTE FOR IT.
WHEN I MADE COMMENTS ABOUT THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING IN
NO WAY WHATSOEVER WAS MY INTENTION TO DENIGRATE STAFF OR
ANYTHING THEY DID.
IT'S JUST AS STEPHANIE JUST SAID, IT'S A VERY COMPLEX ISSUE,
AND EVERYBODY IS HAVING A LITTLE TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING ALL
OF THE DETAILS.
AND IF I HAVE NOT MADE ENOUGH EFFORT TO UNDERSTAND THEM, I

APOLOGIZE.
BUT I WOULD LIKE PERHAPS TO HAVE ONE MORE PUBLIC INFORMATION
MEETING BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING THAT WOULD JUST COVER
THE ADUs.
I CAN MAKE AN EFFORT TO EDUCATE JUST MYSELF BUT IT'S HARD
FOR OTHER PEOPLE, TOO, AND THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THAT
MEETING.
I THINK THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE IN FAVOR OF IT.
THEY JUST WANT TO KNOW THE DETAILS.
THAT'S THE CATEGORY THAT I'M IN.
AND I ALSO THINK THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE IN FAVOR OF IT AND
THEY JUST WANT ONE OR TWO LITTLE THINGS TWEAKED THAT THEY
HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT.
SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE THAT WE HAVE ONE MORE PUBLIC
INFORMATION MEETING BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING.
THANK YOU.
4:24:17PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
SECONDED BY -- WHO SECONDED THAT?
COUNCILMAN HURTAK IS SAYING NO.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA.
ANY FINAL DISCUSSION?
4:24:40PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'M JUST GOING TO VOTE NO BECAUSE I DON'T
THINK WE SHOULD HAVE ONE SPACE PER UNIT.
4:24:47PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSIONS?

TO AVOID IT, LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE.
NOT THE ROLL CALL VOTE, THE VOICE VOTE.
4:25:00PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
YES.
4:25:01PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
NO.
4:25:04PM >> CARLSON?
GUDES?
4:25:06PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES.
4:25:07PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES.
4:25:09PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
YES.
4:25:11PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
YES.
4:25:12PM >>THE CLERK:
THE MOTION CARRIED WITH HURTAK VOTING NO AND
CARLSON ABSENT.
4:25:23PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU.
MS. FEELEY, YOU'RE RUNNING UP HERE.
4:25:25PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
I JUST WANT TO FINISH REAL QUICK.
I APPRECIATE YOUR INDULGENCE.
THIS IS A HUGE STEP FORWARD FOR US IN PLANNING FOR OUR CITY
AND FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO PROVIDE ALTERNATIVE HOUSING
SOLUTIONS AT A TIME WHEN WE ARE PRESSED AT THE SEAMS TO BE
FINDING THOSE OPPORTUNITIES.
I DID JUST WANT TO GO OVER THE SCHEDULE THAT WE WILL GO TO
THE PLANNING COMMISSION MONDAY BASED ON YOUR VOTES TODAY ON
THOSE ITEMS THAT YOU SELECTED TO MOVE FORWARD.
WE WILL BE BACK IN FRONT OF YOU THE EVENING OF DECEMBER
1st TO HAVE FIRST READING, INCLUDING ANY CHANGES THAT YOU

PRESCRIBE TODAY, THE REMOVAL OF CERTAIN ITEMS ON THOSE ITEMS
THAT DID NOT GET FAVORABLE, WE WILL PULL THOSE FROM
DISCUSSION AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR MONDAY AS WELL.
4:26:16PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
4:26:16PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
MS. FEELEY, THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION
TODAY.
I KNOW IT WAS A LOT OF WORK.
I'M NOT GREAT ON THE ADU SYSTEM RIGHT NOW.
IT HAS TO GROW ON ME BECAUSE I DON'T SEE THE ATTAINABILITY
OF THEM FOR A LOT OF FOLKS.
I SEE THIS AS A WAY OF CAPITALISM BECAUSE I DID ASK
MS. HURTAK WHAT THESE THINGS COST FOR SOMEBODY TO RENT.
I'M HOPING WITH US GOING FORWARD, WE WOULD WORK WITH OUR
HOUSING DEPARTMENT AND OUR CRA PEOPLE TO TALK ABOUT HOW WE
CAN HAVE SOME PROGRAMS IF WE DO THIS SO PEOPLE CAN BE
ATTAINABLE IN SOME OF THESE ADUs.
THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO, SEE HOW WE CAN TIE THOSE
IN TO GET FOLKS IN AND NOT CHARGING A LITTLE 500-SQUARE-FOOT
PLACE, 15, 16 HUNDRED BUCKS.
SO MAKE SURE WE KIND OF LOOK AT THAT AS WE'RE MOVING FORWARD
WITH SOME POLICIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT WOULD BE MOST
OUTSTANDING.
THANK YOU.
4:27:16PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THE OTHER THING I DID WANT TO MENTION WAS,
DEPENDING ON HOW THIS GOES AND WHEN WE GET TO SECOND

READING, I'VE TALKED WITH THE TEAM, AND WE WOULD LIKE TO
PROBABLY HAVE AN EFFECTIVE DATE ON THIS, UNLIKE YOUR TYPICAL
ORDINANCES THAT GO INTO EFFECT AS THEY ARE SIGNED, WE WOULD
HAVE AN EFFECTIVE DATE OF THIS LIKE APRIL 1st, OR
SOMETHING LIKE THAT, TO GIVE THE CODE A CHANCE TO CHANGE AND
TO GET THIS LINED UP IN A POSITION THAT IT WOULD THEN GO
INTO EFFECT.
UNLIKE WITH WEST TAMPA OVERLAY, CHANGE THAT DAY, WENT INTO
EFFECT, AND THEN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, ET CETERA.
SO TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE WHEELS ARE HEADED IN THE RIGHT
DIRECTION, WE'VE GOT THIS GOING, WE WOULD DO WITH THAT IN
THE ORDINANCE AS WELL.
4:27:56PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
4:27:57PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
MAYBE I'M WRONG, BUT I THOUGHT SOME OF THESE
WERE SLATED TO COME BACK NOVEMBER 17th.
4:28:06PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THERE IS ONE ITEM IN OUR PRESENTATION WE
ASKED TO COME BACK NOVEMBER 17.
IT WAS THE LAST SLIDE.
IT WAS THE CHANGE FOR THE WEST TAMPA ALLEYS.
WE DID NOT TALK ABOUT THAT TODAY, AND GIVEN THE TIME, I
DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT NOW.
IF WE COULD SET THAT FOR NOVEMBER 17, WE WOULD BRING THAT
BACK UNDER STAFF REPORTS AND STEPHEN WOULD PRESENT THAT TO
YOU.
AND IT IS A VERY SMALL CHANGE BACK DEALING WITH THE ALLEYS.

4:28:30PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
OKAY.
THANK YOU.
4:28:31PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
4:28:33PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
REAL QUICK.
I JUST WANTED TO SAY THANK YOU TO YOU AND MR. BENSON AND
MR. COTTON FOR ALL YOUR HARD WORK.
I THINK I KNOW HOW HARD YOU WORK, BUT I REALLY HAVE NO IDEA
BECAUSE THIS IS A HUGE TASK AND YOU ALWAYS GO ABOVE AND
BEYOND.
SO I WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT WE APPRECIATE YOU.
THIS IS A VERY LENGTHY DISCUSSION, BUT NECESSARY, AND
MEANINGFUL. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
4:28:57PM >>ABBYE FEELEY:
THANK YOU.
4:29:00PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCIL, WE HAVE TWO MORE AGENDA ITEMS TO
GET TO BEFORE OUR 5:01 MEETING.
I ASK THAT WE EITHER BE CAUTIOUS OF TIME OR WE TAKE A BREAK
AND GO HAVE SOMETHING TO EAT AND COME BACK.
THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING YOU, THE COUNCIL, IF WE CAN BE BRIEF
OR DO WE BREAK FOR SUPPER BEFORE 5:01?
THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING COUNCIL.
COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
4:29:35PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
I SEE JONATHAN MOORE IN THE AUDIENCE,
AND HE'S NODDING YES THAT WE CAN BE BRIEF.
I TRUST HIS NOD.
I'M SURE WE'LL BE GOOD.

I DON'T HAVE MUCH TO ADD.
4:29:48PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
MR. MOORE, WE'RE HOLDING IT ON YOU AND YOU
HAVE TO TAKE US TO DINNER.
AGENDA ITEM 16, FILE NUMBER CM22-76987.
4:30:08PM >> GOOD AFTERNOON, CITY COUNCIL.
JEAN DUNCAN, INFRASTRUCTURE MOBILITY.
I BELIEVE THOSE WERE MOTIONS 16 AND 17.
THANK YOU.
WE WILL BE VERY BRIEF.
WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME TODAY.
WE WANT TO ADDRESS THE TWO MOTIONS THAT WERE MADE.
THE FIRST MOTION HAS TO DO WITH ANSWERING SOME QUESTIONS
THAT THE PUBLIC PROVIDED.
AND WE E-MAILED THOSE RESPONSES A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO.
I DO HAVE PAPER COPIES IF THAT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT YOU
WERE ABLE TO SEE IN YOUR E-MAIL BOX.
THE OTHER ITEM WAS TO GIVE YOU AN UPDATE ON THE HANNA AVENUE
PROJECT AS WELL AS THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE.
JUST VERY QUICKLY, AGAIN, WE WANT TO TRY TO START TO GET
FAMILIARITY WITH OUR PROCESS.
WE'RE GOING TO BE FOLLOWING OUR GRADE A PROCESS THAT CHIEF
OF STAFF MENTIONED THAT WILL BE EMBEDDED IN EVERYTHING THAT
WE'RE DOING.
WE HAVE OUR TEAM HERE, IF YOU HAVE ANY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS.
WE'VE GOT DPR, STRATEGY PROJECT SUPPORT SERVICES, ARIAL

GROUP, AND INVISION MIJON WHO IS THE OWNER'S REPRESENTATIVE
OVERLOOKING THE EBO AND THE APPRENTICESHIP COMPONENTS OF OUR
PROJECT.
WE DID HAVE TWO VIDEOS TO SHARE, BUT IN THE INTEREST OF
TIME, I CAN SEND YOU THOSE LINKS IF YOU WOULD LIKE.
THEY ARE VERY GOOD STORIES ABOUT SUCCESSFUL EXPERIENCES THAT
SOME OF OUR PARTNERS HAVE HAD ON THE PROJECT.
SO I'LL DEFER TO THE NEXT PART OF THE CONSTRUCTION UPDATE.
VERY QUICKLY -- I'M SORRY.
4:31:35PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK.
4:31:39PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
ARE THOSE AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC ON YOUR
WEBSITE?
4:31:42PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS DONE BUT WE CAN
CERTAINLY DO THAT.
4:31:46PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I THINK THE PUBLIC WOULD LIKE THAT.
4:31:49PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
I THINK THE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR POINTED
IT OUT OR PUT IT ON SOCIAL MEDIA.
I CAN CONFIRM AND ALSO PUT THEM ON THE WEBSITE.
4:31:54PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
THAT WOULD BE GREAT.
THEN THE PUBLIC CAN FIND THEM.
THANK YOU.
4:31:57PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
YES.
VERY QUICKLY ON THE CONSTRUCTION PART OF THE MOTION, WE
BROKE GROUND IN JANUARY OF THIS YEAR ON THE HANNA AVENUE
MUNICIPAL BUILDING.

WE'VE GOT FOUR STRUCTURES TO BUILD, THE MAIN BUILDING, THE
PARKING GARAGE, THE FLEET BUILDING, AND THE FACILITIES
BUILDING.
THIS IS ALL PART OF OUR DECENTRALIZATION OF OUR FLEET AND
FACILITIES, WHICH EVERYONE IS EXCITED ABOUT, THOSE
DEPARTMENTS THAT DEPEND ON THOSE SERVICES.
OTHER WORK HAS TO DO WITH THE SITE.
THE SITE SOLAR REMEDIATION, UNDERGROUND PIPING, STORMWATER
CONSTRUCTION AND UTILITIES.
CURRENTLY THE PROJECT IS WHAT WE CALL 30% COMPLETE WITH THE
ENVELOPE OF THE MAIN BUILDING AND PARKING GARAGE COMPLETELY
UP.
NOT SURE IF YOU HAD A CHANCE TO DRIVE BY, YOU'LL SEE
VERTICAL STRUCTURES THERE P THIS WEEK, WE HAVE A ROOFING
CONTRACTOR WHO IS MOBILIZED AND GETTING THAT STARTED.
ELECTRICAL ON THE PARKING GARAGE IS STARTING.
WE HAVE DECK POURS IN THE MAIN BUILDING UNDERWAY.
THOSE WILL TAKE ABOUT SIX WEEKS.
AND THE MAIN BUILDING, WE EXPECT TO BEGIN THE CURTAIN WALL
INSTALLATION OF THAT IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS.
OUR FINAL CONSTRUCTION IS ANTICIPATED FOR FALL OF NEXT YEAR.
WE STILL HAVE A LOT OF TIME TO WORK ON THE APPRENTICESHIP
AND THE EBO AND OTHER ENGAGEMENTS WITH FOLKS IN THE
COMMUNITY AND WITH TRADES TO POSSIBLY PARTICIPATE IN THIS
PROJECT.

AGAIN, THE FIRST MOTION ABOUT THE QUESTIONS, WE DID PROVIDE
ANSWERS ON THOSE.
AGAIN, I CAN PROVIDE THOSE ON PAPER FORM, IF YOU'D LIKE.
THE OTHER PART OF THE MOTION ABOUT THE APPRENTICESHIP
ORDINANCE, I KNOW DPR HAS BEEN EXCITED TO PARTNER WITH FOUR
APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAMS.
THEY ARE CURRENTLY WORKING WITH APG, AND THAT FIRM IS DOING
ELECTRICAL, FIRE ALARM AND DATA COMMUNICATIONS WORK.
WE HAVE ACKERMAN PLUMBING, GMF STEEL AND DPR CONCRETE.
AND CURRENTLY ALL FOUR COMPANIES ARE TRACKING TO MEET THE
12% REQUIREMENT PER OUR ORDINANCE.
JUST A REMINDER THIS ORDINANCE CAME ALONG AFTER THIS
CONTRACT WAS ISSUED.
SO WE APPRECIATE THE COOPERATION OF DPR TO MAKE GOOD ON THAT
REQUIREMENT, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS POST-CONTRACT LETTING.
AND WE ALSO APPRECIATE INVISION MIJON FOR COMING ALONG AND
ADDING TO THE EYES OF THOMAS HUGGINS WHO IS OUR EBO OVERSEER
FOR DPR, THEY ARE ADDING AN EXTRA SET OF EYES ON THESE
THINGS TO MAKE SURE EVERYTHING IS DONE PER REQUIREMENT, PER
GOAL, PER ORDINANCE.
SO I DO HAVE OUR FOLKS HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
A COUPLE OF WONDERFUL STORIES, OT DeLANCEY FROM STRATEGY
PROJECT SUPPORT SERVICES.
IF YOU COULD WAVE YOUR HAND SO THEY COULD SEE WHO YOU ARE.
THOMAS HUGGINS WITH THE ARIEL GROUP IS HERE.

MANY OF YOU KNOW HIM.
I WAS GOING TO OFFER FOR THEM TO SPEAK IF WE HAD MORE TIME.
BUT IN THE INTEREST OF TIME, I'LL STOP THERE AND LET ANY
QUESTIONS COME ALONG THAT WE CAN TRY TO ANSWER FOR YOU.
4:35:01PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES.
4:35:02PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
WHAT I DIDN'T SEE, I THOUGHT IT WAS THE -- THE 11 QUESTIONS
THAT I SUBMITTED FOR YOUR REVIEW FOR YOUR STAFF, JEAN, AND
SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS I ALREADY HAD BUT SOME QUESTIONS I
GOT FROM OTHER FOLKS.
NOT JAMES RANSOM, JUST SO YOU KNOW.
4:35:23PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
YES, YES.
4:35:25PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
WHAT I DIDN'T SEE -- WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR
-- I DIDN'T SEE THE BREAKDOWN.
I WANTED TO SEE THE BREAKDOWN, WHEN I SAY MINORITY, AFRICAN
AMERICAN, FEMALE, HISPANIC, I DIDN'T SEE THAT BREAKDOWN.
I'M LOOKING FOR THAT BREAKDOWN.
4:35:39PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
OKAY.
4:35:40PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THEN I'M LOOKING FOR THE BREAKDOWN, IF I
HAVE A MINORITY, I WANT TO KNOW THE BREAKDOWN THERE.
BECAUSE I CAN HAVE A MINORITY BUT WHO THEY ARE HIRING AS
WELL.
I WANT TO KNOW THE BREAKDOWN OF BOTH.
I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE AT LEAST EVERY COUPLE OF MONTHS A
BRIEFING ON WHAT WE'RE DOING SO PEOPLE -- I DON'T HAVE TO

HEAR WHEN I DRIVE BY, BECAUSE MY MOTHER LIVES TWO BLOCKS
AWAY FROM THE PROJECT, I DON'T HAVE TO HEAR PEOPLE SAY,
WELL, I DON'T SEE ANYBODY WORKING THAT LOOK LIKE US.
I DON'T WANT TO HEAR THAT.
I WANT TO BE ABLE TO SEE WHAT THOSE BREAKDOWNS ARE, SO I CAN
SAY THESE ARE THE NUMBERS THEY ARE SHOWING ME SO I CAN TRUST
AND VERIFY WHAT PEOPLE ARE TELLING ME OR WHAT I'M SEEING.
DO HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS AS IT RELATES TO WHEN WE TALK
ABOUT THE MINORITY PARTNERS.
PROJECTED CONTRACT -- CONTRACTED.
HOW DOES THAT WORK.
MAKING SURE THAT -- WHAT WOULD PREVENT A MINORITY PARTNER
FROM GOING FROM A PROJECTED CONTRACT TO AN ACTUAL CONTRACTED
PERSON?
4:36:39PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
I THINK I MIGHT ASK BRIAN YARBOROUGH TO
ANSWER THAT SO I CAN MAKE SURE I GET YOU THE SPECIFIC
ANSWER.
I HAVE A CONTRACT ADMINISTRATION VERSION OF THAT ANSWER, BUT
I'LL LET HIM SPEAK DIRECTLY ABOUT THE PROJECT ON THAT.
4:36:56PM >> BRIAN YARBOROUGH, DPR CONSTRUCTION.
COUNCILMAN GUDES, IN RESPONSE TO YOUR QUESTION, WE HAD OUR
ORIGINAL ESTIMATE THAT FORMED THAT GMP AGREEMENT.
SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PROJECTED VALUES FOR STRATEGIST OR
DUCON, IT'S BASED ON THAT ESTIMATE.
THE TEAMS GO OUT TO MARKET, SOLICITED PROPOSALS AND PRICING

BACK FROM TRADE PARTNERS AND THEY GET A CONTRACT, THERE'S
SOME VARIANCE IN THAT FROM THAT ORIGINAL ESTIMATE.
THAT'S WHERE THAT IS PROJECTED, A, FINALIZING PROCUREMENT
AND EXECUTION AT CONTRACT, WE'RE GETTING CLOSER TO EXACTING
THAT NUMBER.
4:37:33PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
SINCE YOU ARE THE MAIN GUY, I THINK I DID
-- I KNOW YOU HAVE THE CDC THAT CONTRACTED WITH YOU, IS THAT
CORRECT?
4:37:51PM >> YES, SIR.
4:37:52PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THE PARTNERSHIP OUTLINED IN THE MOU, WILL
THERE BE ANY SERVICE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE CDC OF TAMPA, WITH
CONTRACT OR COMPENSATION FOR THOSE SERVICES?
4:38:01PM >> COMPENSATION TO THE CDC?
4:38:04PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
FOR THOSE SERVICES.
DO THEY HAVE A MAIN CONTRACT?
I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE CLEAR, THEIR ROLE WITH THE
ORGANIZATION.
ARE THEY CONTRACTING WITH YOU NOW, CDC DOING ANY WORK, ANY
TYPE OF MINORITY PARTNERSHIP?
4:38:21PM >> JUST EARLIER THIS WEEK, OUR PARTNERS, DUCON CONSTRUCTION
HELD A WORKFORCE AT CDC --
4:38:30PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I WAS THERE.
THE FIRST QUESTION THAT NUMBER BREAKDOWN, I WANT IN THE
FUTURE.
IF YOU'RE HIRING FOLKS TO SEE WHAT NUMBER OF PEOPLE ARE

ACTUALLY BEING HIRED FROM EAST TAMPA.
I THINK THAT'S CRITICAL TO THE PROJECTS THERE.
SO WHAT'S YOUR BREAKDOWN OF HERE TO YOUR MIDDLE
SUBCONTRACTOR -- YOUR SUBS DOWN HERE, I WANT TO KNOW HOW
MANY ARE COMING FROM EAST TAMPA.
I THINK THAT'S GOOD THAT WE KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE
APPLYING.
HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GETTING HIRED.
I THINK THAT'S CRITICAL TO THE PROJECT OVER THERE.
I DON'T WANT TO HEAR DIDN'T HIRE ANYBODY.
PEOPLE LIVE WEST TAMPA, TO ME, MINORITY GET HIRED BUT I
THINK FOR THE PEOPLE IN THOSE COMMUNITIES OVER THERE, THEY
WANT TO KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE OFFERED A JOB AND GOT ON THE
JOB SITE.
HOPING PROVIDE THOSE THREE THINGS IN THE FUTURE.
WELL, WE HIRED PEOPLE FROM EAST TAMPA.
WE HAVE NAMES OF PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY WORKED -- MR. MASSEY,
ARE YOU COMING UP?
4:39:38PM >>MORRIS MASSEY:
WE COULD ASK FOR THAT INFORMATION.
I WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR THEY HAVE NO LEGAL OBLIGATION TO
HIRE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF RESIDENTS FROM A SPECIFIC
GEOGRAPHIC AREA IN THE CITY OF TAMPA.
THEY HAVE COMMITTED TO CERTAIN GOALS IN THE CONTRACT FOR
ACHIEVING BOTH MINORITY BUSINESS AND SMALL LOCAL BUSINESS
ENTERPRISES.

AND THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT WE'VE HIRED, ENVISIONED TO
MAKE SURE THAT THEY DO MEET THOSE GOALS AND THEY ALSO MEET
THE APPRENTICESHIP REQUIREMENTS IN OUR CODE.
SO JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU UNDERSTAND.
YOU CAN CERTAINLY ASK FOR MORE INFORMATION BUT LEGALLY WHAT
THEY ARE REQUIRED TO DO IN ORDER TO MEET THE CONTRACT TERMS.
4:40:16PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
CLOSED MOUTH AIN'T EVER GET PEDESTRIAN.
I'M OPENING MY MOUTH TO GET FED.
I DON'T THINK THAT'S TOO HARD TO ASK.
IF I HIRE SOMEBODY, DO YOU LIVE IN THE AREA?
I DON'T THINK THAT IS A BIG DEAL.
OR I DO HIRE, HAVE THE CONTRACTOR THERE TO KNOW HOW MANY
MINORITY BUSINESSES WE HAVE AND A BREAKDOWN OF THAT SUB WHO
YOU HIRED, HOW MANY MINORITIES YOU DID HIRE AS WELL.
I DON'T THINK THAT SHOULD BE A BIG, BIG ISSUE CONTRACTUALLY
TO ASK --
4:40:42PM >>MORRIS MASSEY:
WELL, THE OTHER THING THAT JEAN DUNCAN
REMINDED ME, WE DO NEED TO BE CAREFUL.
THERE'S SOME PRIVACY ON WHAT THEY CAN REQUIRE FROM THE FOLKS
THAT THEY HIRE AND WHAT THEY HAVE TO REPORT OUT.
I JUST WANT TO WARN YOU, THERE MAY BE --
4:40:59PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
I GET YA.
I NEED TO KNOW WE HIRED SOMEBODY FROM EAST TAMPA.
HIRED ONE, FIVE.
ONLY FIVE PEOPLE APPLY.

ONLY FIVE HIRED.
I DON'T HAVE TO KNOW THE NAME, TELEPHONE, ADDRESS, BUT DID
WE DO OR WAS THERE AN EFFORT TO DO.
YOU FOLLOW ME?
YOU KNOW I'LL GET A SPANKIN' IF I DON'T ASK THE QUESTIONS.
OTHER THAN THAT, I THOUGHT THE REPORT WAS GOOD.
YOU DID ANSWER MY QUESTIONS.
I'M HOPING WE GET REGULAR UPDATES ON THE PROJECT, NOT WAY
DOWN THE LINE, EVERY COUPLE OF MONTHS, GIVE ME SOMETHING SO
I CAN TELL PEOPLE WE ARE DOING AS THESE THINGS GOING UP,
BEING ERECTED THAT WAY I DON'T HAVE PEOPLE IN MY EAR SAYING
I DON'T SEE NOBODY OVER THERE WORKING.
4:41:46PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
WE WILL BE COMING BACK IN JANUARY PER OUR
CHIEF OF STAFF'S OFFERING TO COME ON IS A SEMI ANNUAL BASIS.
WE'RE KIND OF GETTING THAT STARTED.
IT'S NOT EXACTLY A SIX-MONTH SEPARATION, BUT WE WILL BE BACK
IN JANUARY AND WE CAN CERTAINLY GIVE YOU SOME OF THE
INFORMATION BEFORE THEN, BUT WE'LL HAVE MORE OF A
COMPREHENSIVE PROJECT UPDATE IN JANUARY AS WELL.
4:42:07PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
THAT WOULD BE FINE.
THANK YOU.
4:42:09PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN VIERA.
4:42:11PM >>LUIS VIERA:
THANK YOU.
I'LL BE VERY, VERY BRIEF.
I KNOW WE'RE PRESSED.

NUMBER ONE, I KNOW THIS IS OBVIOUS.
THESE ARE STATE-CERTIFIED APPRENTICESHIPS, RIGHT?
4:42:20PM >> YES, SIR.
4:42:21PM >>LUIS VIERA:
I DIDN'T KNOW, MS. DUNCAN, I DIDN'T KNOW THIS,
THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE WENT INTO EFFECT -- IN OTHER
WORDS, THE DPR COULD HAVE HAD AN ARGUMENT THAT THE
APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE DIDN'T APPLY TO THIS PARTICULAR
CONTRACT, BUT THEY VOLUNTARILY DID IT.
IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE SAYING?
4:42:42PM >>JEAN DUNCAN:
THAT'S MY INTERPRETATION.
BRIAN, YOU CAN SAY, BUT VERY COOPERATIVE IN MY OPINION.
4:42:47PM >> YES, I THINK WHEN THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE PASSED, I
BELIEVE IT WAS MARCH OF '21, AND THE CITY PUT A LIST
TOGETHER OF KIND OF CONTRACTS THAT WERE UNDERWAY, THIS ONE
PREEXISTED THAT ORDINANCE.
SO A FIRM THAT HAS NEARLY 4,000 CRAFT EMPLOYEES NATIONWIDE,
WOMEN AND MEN PUTTING TOOL BELTS ON EVERY DAY, WORKFORCE
DEVELOPMENT IS IMPORTANT TO US SO OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE
CITY WERE THAT WE WERE COMMITTED TO THIS.
AND IT'S BEEN A STEEP LEARNING CURVE, CERTAINLY, THE FIRST
PROJECT BEING SUBJECT TO IT.
BUT I THINK WE'RE TRENDING VERY WELL WITH SEVERAL
APPRENTICES ON-SITE AND SOME FROM EAST TAMPA EVEN.
WE'RE CONTINUING TO GATHER THAT DATA AND LEARN AS WE GO BUT
WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK.

4:43:31PM >>LUIS VIERA:
WE ALL APPRECIATE THAT HUNDRED PERCENT.
WHAT'S GREAT ABOUT THAT ORDINANCE IS IT TAKES THE
CONTRACTING PROCESS AND HAS CONTRACTORS WHO MEET A CERTAIN
THRESHOLD TO INVEST IN OUR YOUNG PEOPLE IN THE CREATION OF
THE FUTURE OF OUR MIDDLE CLASS IN TAMPA.
SO THAT'S GREAT.
BUT WE APPRECIATE THAT A HUNDRED PERCENT.
BECAUSE I WAS UNAWARE OF THAT.
I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUT I WASN'T AWARE OF IT.
THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.
4:43:55PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
COUNCILMAN GUDES, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 16, YOU
WERE THE MAKER OF THE MOTION.
ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH THIS REPORT?
4:44:02PM >>ORLANDO GUDES:
YES, I'M SATISFIED.
4:44:04PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
ALL COUNCIL MEMBERS, ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH
THE REPORT?
AGENDA ITEM 17, COUNCILMAN VIERA, YOU WERE THE MAKER OF THIS
MOTION, ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH THIS REPORT?
4:44:13PM >>LUIS VIERA:
YES, I AM HEREBY SATISFIED.
4:44:14PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
COUNCIL MEMBERS, YOU ARE ALL SATISFIED AS WELL?
4:44:17PM >> YES.
4:44:18PM >> YES.
4:44:18PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH.
WE ARE IN RECESS UNTIL 5.

4:44:33PM >> THANK YOU, COUNCIL.
4:44:42PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
THE EAST TAMPA OVERLAY TO RETURN BACK UNDER
STAFF REPORTS ON NOVEMBER 17.
4:44:48PM >>LYNN HURTAK:
I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION.
4:44:50PM >>MARTIN SHELBY:
THANK YOU.
4:44:51PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
SECOND.
4:44:52PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN
HURTAK.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
ANY OPPOSED?
4:45:06PM >>GUIDO MANISCALCO:
ALL RIGHT.
ON SEPTEMBER 15, CITY COUNCIL RECEIVED AN E-MAIL FROM THE
CHIEF OF STAFF REQUESTING US TO SCHEDULE TWO PRIVATELY
INITIATED TEXT AMENDMENTS ON OCTOBER 27 CITY COUNCIL AGENDA.
UNFORTUNATELY, WE INADVERTENTLY FAILED TO MAKE THAT MOTION.
SO AT THIS TIME I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO SCHEDULE
THE TWO PROPOSED PITAs ON THE NOVEMBER 17th, 2022, CITY
COUNCIL MEETING AT 1:30 P.M.
ONE APPLICANT IS EAST TAMPA COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AREA AND
THE SECOND APPLICANT IS TYLER HUDSON.
4:45:34PM >>JOSEPH CITRO:
A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO.
SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA.
ALL IN FAVOR?
ANY OPPOSED?
WE'RE IN RECESS UNTIL 5:01.
[ SOUNDING GAVEL ]

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